Keenan Glover Gives Worst Job Interview Answer EVAH

Keenan Glover might have just killed his job prospects after graduation from pricy Howard University.

Would you hire this guy after this question?

Forget for a moment his entitlement mentality. (BTW if you wanted living proof Democrats want to enslave black people to government, you can get no better example but forget that for a moment)

Does this guy NOT KNOW that any future employer will google him and find this? Does he -really- not know this is his first job interview answer for the rest of his life?

He’s meeting a U.S. Senator and all he could find to wear was an undershirt? (Why not just wear a wife beater and get it over with?) And all he wants is free stuff from the government. (like everyone his age)

I ask again, would you hire Keenan Glover? — I’ve interviewed over 100 people for various positions and this guy wouldn’t make it into the first round much less through it.

Keenan, if you ever read this, and in the age of google, I assume you will, lemme talk to you like an old white guy for a moment… ‘Respect’ is a big thing today’s youth especially in today’s black youth.

You want respect? HAVE SOME FREAKING RESPECT FOR YOURSELF!

Is the best you can do in life is look for a hand-out? Really? Is that the sum total of your dreams, hopes and aspirations? Dude, when I was your age, I dreamed of being a millionaire by the time I was 25… I dreamed of hiring people, creating jobs and being a leader in the community… I dreamed of inventing new things that solving problems for millions of people… in short Keenan, I dreamed of success…

And you dream of a world where government takes care of you because you can’t take care of yourself?

And you want respect? Bitch Please.

But I’m old. I grew up in world where people took care of themselves, I grew up in a world where getting assistance from the government in a time of need was an embarrassment not badge of honor. I grew up in a world were we were taught to work hard for everything we had and bring as many people with you as possible down the road to success.

You grew up in a world being told what you couldn’t do. You grew up in a world being told to ask for everything. You grew up in a world expecting something for nothing. — So now you’re a grown man and YOU HAVE NO RESPECT FOR YOUR OWN ABILITY TO SUCCEED.

You can do better than that Keenan. The key to success is your own effort not some government handout. The key to your future is your brain, your back, your talents and your ability to bust your ass.

You say you want a life not measured by how many dead presidents in your pocket? I call Bull Shit Keenan Glover. You’re full of shit. Cuz all you’re doing is groveling before a member of government asking for Benjamins.

You want a more meaningful life? There are millions of opportunities for do both well and do good. In fact you do good just by doing well. (I don’t expect you to understand that at your age but I hope one day you will)

Keenan you can have anything you want in this life, if you ditch the entitlement mentality and rely on your own ability.

Words of wisdom from an old man that’s you’re free to ignore. I just figured since nobody else ever told you this, someone should.

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  • Hank_M

    No doubt Keenan will be at the next Occupy event.

    More seriously, My Glover is a great example of the failure of our educational institutions.

    • LiberalNightmare

      Are you kidding? Here we have a bright young man that has been absolutely convinced that he cannot succeed without help from gov’t.

      This insures a growing govt, empowered to think for its subjects and to care for them at its whim.

      The American education system has succeeded beyond its wildest dreams.

      • Hank_M

        Excellent point.

  • herddog505

    Aside from “I want a government that will give me stuff”, what the hell is this kid even talking about?

    As far as his job prospects, I wouldn’t worry: MSNBC, CNN, OFA, and all the other branches of the democrat party would be happy to snap this clown up.

    He’ll fit right in.

  • warnertoddhuston

    This kid was raised by our Democrat controlled mis-educational system as the good little anti-American, communist he is supposed to be.

  • jim_m

    I don’t need to have googled this to know that I would not hire this bozo. Anyone coming to an interview with this sort of entitlement attitude is going to find it hard to get a job offer. You need to want a job not expect one. Anyone with that sort of attitude interviewing at my fortune 50 company is going to never make it through the phone screening.

    • $4366460

      Fortune 50-500? We all know that’s not happening. This brainwashed kid has been molded and shaped to become exactly what his handlers wanted — a socialist government drone. His entitlement attitude is a career enhancement for government “workers”. He clearly isn’t capable of starting a business or being hired into the private sector where profits are the objective.

  • Rational Mind

    In the video, he actually only asked for a student loan. You are all making large assumptions and generalizations. Many people, even Presidents have gone to school via student loans. The second part of what he said was a question as to how the worship of the almighty dollar might by toned down a bit. Seems like a fair point.

    • herddog505

      That’s not what I heard. I heard him say that he wants a government that provides such things as student loans. Now, whether people have gone to school on them (I’m still paying mine off) is beside the point: he EXPECTS the government to do this and other things besides. That would be our federal government that is currently about $16.5T in the hole.

      As for his drivel about worship of the almighty dollar… I defer to you on that, as I really have no idea what the hell he’s talking about.

      • Stacy

        It is what I heard. Clearly you need to check your ear.

        • herddog505

          “You said that you want to provide a government that ‘leaves us alone’. Quite frankly, I don’t want that. I want a government that is going to help me. I want a government that will help me fund my college education.”

          He then went on to blather about being a dollar sign with a heartbeat or something like that.

          However, his words are pretty clear: he wants the government to “help” him. With money.

          Gimme. Gimme. Gimme.

    • 914

      “Rational Mind”

      Where? Where? lol

  • Stacy

    How dare any of you, especially this author, say that this young man doesn’t not want for Sucess. He said student loans not a damn hang out. This is the most ignorant and outrageous thing I have ever read in my life. He is a FRESHMAN in college not a damn grad student. Then to make a comment on his clothing. You have no life. It was 90 degrees outdoors and you expect him to wear what? Because I know for a fact that as a college freshman you were not walking around in a damn suit. Keenan is a very intelligent individual. Who you should be making a statement on is the hypocritical ignorance that exploded from the mouth of this so call senator. But clearly as we can see you are not as bright as yu make yourself out to be. Check up on your information before you try and make superficial assumptions on a young male that can probably teach you something. Everything is and does not revolve around your world. Don’t fix your mouth to make statements that you are not aware of. Thank you!

    • http://wizbangblog.com/author/rodney-graves/ Rodney G. Graves

      We dare because it is true, and don’t give a good God Damn if you approve or not.

    • jim_m

      Sorry Stacy,. Your friend is demanding that government (and therefore by extension everyone who pays taxes) pay for his education. He’s demanding a free ride.

      His statement that people are only thought of as dollars a cents is grossly ignorant. It is not Capitalism that considers people in such base terms, It is Socialism. Capitalism thinks of people in terms of abilities and how they can contribute. Socialism thinks of people in terms of cost. In Capitalism taxes are what people contribute to government,. In Socialism taxes are the government’s money and tax cuts are what people cost the government.

      Yours and your friend’s views are decidedly socialist and you are ignorant of the world around you.

      • herddog505

        jim_mIt is not Capitalism that considers people in such base terms, It is Socialism. Capitalism thinks of people in terms of abilities and how they can contribute. Socialism thinks of people in terms of cost. In Capitalism taxes are what people contribute to government,. In Socialism taxes are the government’s money and tax cuts are what people cost the government.

        AMEN, BROTHER!

      • Amadi

        There is nothing free about student loans. The millions of us paying up to 30% of our income monthly are testament that a student loan is as much a “free ride” as your mortgage or your financed automobile.

        BTW it’s rather hard to think of anything more capitalistic than loaning students money on the premise that they’re using it to pay for an education that will heighten their job prospects and earnings potential, especially in an economy like this. In actual socialist societies, university level education is significantly subsidized — that is, money given for free without expectation of repayment — by governments. We’re nowhere close.

        • jim_m

          it’s rather hard to think of anything more capitalistic than loaning students money on the premise that they’re using it to pay for an education that will heighten their job prospects and earnings potential

          Sorry again, but government does subsidize a significant part of higher ed. In fact as government grants and loans have grown, universities have increased tuition beyond that funding growth. So government funding has actually made getting a college degree more expensive and not less. Furthermore, colleges have not expanded opportunity for students but enrollment has remained relatively flat while administrative staff has grown enormously.

          Nor should we forget that government regs have made student loans non-dischargeable through bankruptcy so while government policy has increased the cost of education it has also made it impossible to get out from under that expense.

          If you want college education to be affordable the best solution would be to make college loans dischargeable through bankruptcy and to make colleges take the hit for non payment. Curtailing loan and grant programs would force universities to shed their bloated admin staff and have to compete for students based on the quality of the education they give. Currently there is little incentive to actually equip a student for post college work since the university is guaranteed their money.

          Government regs have screwed up higher ed funding not made it better. You want an education that will bring you a prosperous future? Then force upon the colleges a vested interest in your success. Make them live with the reality that if you cannot pay, you won’t and they will suffer for their failure to prepare you. When that happens, colleges will stop encouraging people to take useless degrees and steer students into programs that will actually give them a financially secure future.

          The current funding system for higher ed is not capitalism but a socialist mess where government encourages colleges to produce bloated bureaucracies that do nothing to add to educational value. Universities increase costs without increasing access to larger numbers of students. Universities are not incentivized to prepare students or actual productive work because they are guaranteed payment by government coercion.

          It is hard to see how a fully government run racket has anything to do with capitalism or free markets. This is socialism, where government runs the system and the system sucks for everyone that has to enter it.

          • herddog505

            It’s not just the admin staff. Have you BEEN to a college lately? A couple of years ago, my wife and I took her teenage cousin on a tour.

            Air conditioned dorms complete with minfridge and microwave. Restaurants – fast food and “dine in” – on campus. And the student rec center: I’ve been on holidays to resorts that didn’t have facilities half as nice. This was a STATE school.

            I don’t say that college should be four years of misery, but it’s clear that it’s a little bit too much like a post-high school vacation for too many kids.

          • jim_m

            it’s a little bit too much like a post-high school vacation for too many kids.

            In my wildest dreams I did not envision classes like the ones being offered today. Had my parents seen any of these classes on my schedule they would have wrung my neck. The list of courses in the link from the Boston Globe is insane.

            College has ceased to be about getting an education and the kids complaining the loudest are the ones who are most desirous of the free ride. This isn’t about making college affordable. This is about making 5 years of partying a free ride(because how many of these kids are going to get through in 4 years? Seriously, I’d be shocked if half of them made it out in 7. They probably couldn’t pass the puppet making requirements, or the rock wall).

          • herddog505

            Let’s look at this from an investment standpoint. From your list:

            Aesthetic and Interpretive Understanding 53 (formerly Japanese Literature 161). Anime as Global Popular Culture*

            Let’s say that this cowpat of a course (at HARVARD, fer cripes sake!) is a two-hour course. Assuming that the average undergrad takes 15 hr / semester, that’s 13% of his course load… or 13% of his cost.

            Harvard costs (including room, board, fees, etc.) $54,500 / year^, or $27,250 / semester.

            This course, therefore, costs the student about $3500.

            Anybody think it’s a good idea to borrow $3500 to learn about anime? Anybody want to pay that back? According to Uncle Sugar, that will cost $50 / mo for 87 months.** FOR THAT ONE COURSE.

            ONE YEAR at Harvard – of courses in anime and Star Trek and womyn’s studies and whatever other damned foolishness is being offered as “rigorous academic work” – will cost the borrower $627 / mo for ten flippin’ years. How much can the Harvard grad expect to make straight out of college?

            Now, I grant that this is a highly artificial example as many students at Harvard get financial aid. Further, let’s face it: most Harvard kids are on Mommy and Daddy’s dime. Finally, that Harvard degree is worth something.

            Nevertheless, I think that this illustrates just how f*cking idiotic our system is.

            And this Glover clown and millions like him want MORE of it????

            ====

            (*) http://www.registrar.fas.harvard.edu/courses-exams/course-catalog/aesthetic-and-interpretive-understanding-53-formerly-japanese

            (^) http://www.admissions.college.harvard.edu/financial_aid/cost.html

            (**) http://www2.ed.gov/offices/OSFAP/DirectLoan/RepayCalc/dlentry1.html

          • JWH

            I think it’s worth remembering a couple principles:

            First, some of these courses are not nearly as frou-frou as they seem at first glance. Take that MIT toy-design class for instance:

            Provides students with an overview of design for entertainment and play, as well as opportunities in creative product design and community service. Students develop ideas for new toys that serve clients in the community, and work in teams with local sponsors and with experienced mentors on a themed toy design project. Students enhance creativity and experience fundamental aspects of the product development process, including determining customer needs, brainstorming, estimation, sketching, sketch modeling, concept development, design aesthetics, detailed design, and prototyping. Includes written, visual, and oral communication. Enrollment limited; preference to freshmen.

            What do you think MIT’s budding engineers will do when they get out of school? They design things. The design process includes researching your audience, identifying a need, brainstorming an idea, estimating your budget, advocating your project to sometimes skeptical stakeholders, managing the egos on your team, producing models of your project … all things that they will do in the class.

            Third, classes within a discipline, especially advanced classes, can teach skills that are completely useless to somebody outside the discipline, but are nevertheless part of the rational toolbox for somebody with in the major. Take the puppetry class, for instance:

            The art of puppetry and the basic methods of construction, operation, manipulation, and performance of puppets are examined. Emphasis is on the use of puppets as an educational tool. Projects include creating examples of each of the four major types of puppets: shadow, hand, rod, and marionette—using a range of construction techniques and materials appropriate to an educational setting. The course culminates in the construction of puppets for in-class presentations.

            If you are in school to become an investment banker, you need to know precisely zilch about puppetmaking. But what if you’re majoring in theater? In that case, puppetry is as much a professional skill as acting, singing, dancing, or lighting design. Maybe not a necessary skill, but it’s a legitimate part of a theater professional’s toolbox. One could argue, I suppose, about the utility of a theater degree, but within theater, I see nothing wrong with four credit hours in puppetry.

            Third, some of these classes are just variations on classes students have always taken (and for rather decent reasons). That ropes and walls course reminds me of a one-hour volleyball class I took in college. Why did I spend a semester on volleyball? Because my college required that I take two semester-hours of physical education classes. For me, it was volleyball and weightlifting. For somebody else, maybe it’s rock-climbing and boxing.

            Not to mention that from their earliest days, colleges considered developing a student’s physical strength to be as important as developing a student’s mental strength.

            Fourth, the cultural classes are redresses of cultural-analysis classes students have always taken. Fifty or sixty years ago, you might have spent three credit-hours studying the themes of race in Shakespeare’s The Merchant of Venice and Othello. Today, you can study similar themes in HBO’s The Wire. I would argue — and argue quite strongly — that there is literary merit in certain modern media. We often don’t recognize that merit, though, because such things are new.

          • jim_m

            As Herddog points out it is what you are spending to learn this tripe. I do believe that the MIT classes are probably not as frivolous as they sound at first. However, the Emerson and Harvard and Tufts classes are all outrageous crap for a huge amount of money.

          • JWH

            Jim, have you seen Team America: World Police? Avenue Q? Sesame Street? All of them have made their creators and participants quite a pretty penny, and all of them use (say it with me) puppets.

            I got nothin’ on the anime class, but I stand by my larger point: that a lot of these courses don’t make sense for a general-studies student or for somebody outside the major, but that they are eminently sensible for somebody already pursuing a degree in, say, music or theater.

            (Incidentally, that piracy class: If I were teaching that thing, I’d start the first day with an extended clip from Pirates of the Caribbean, followed by extended discussion of Mister Jack Sparrow. End of class: “By the way, there’s some reading for next week. I look forward to seeing you again. I think you won’t look at piracy the same way again.” After the kids get comfortable and think it’s a gut class … they’ll spend the rest of the semester in a Hell Course about 16-17th century colonial economics.)

          • jim_m

            I suppose if you understood that Emerson is an extremely expensive private liberal arts college that is not funneling students into Hollywood, or the performing arts industry you would understand what a waste this particular class is.

            Emerson is literally around the corner from the Massachusetts College of Art and Design, where people who actually have artistic talent go. The point is not that such a class can be useful, it is that it is a waste where it is.

          • JWH

            That changes it … a little bit, but not much. Even schools that aren’t standouts in a particular discipline still have people majoring in it.

          • herddog505

            I like the way you think!

            And, truthfully, there’s nothing wrong with trying to make courses interesting. One of my complaints about modern American historiography is that there seems to be a determined effort to make it as dry as burnt toast, utterly without any style or flavor, completely uninteresting even to the student much less the casual reader. Personal opinion is that modern historiography, with its focus on “bottom up” history that pretty much mandates that EVERYTHING be told from the standpoint of “disenfranchised” (groups who generally do nothing in history but suffer through it), is so bare of actual meat that the prose MUST be stuffy and inaccesible to give it an air of gravitas that it really doesn’t deserve.

          • JWH

            Jim, have you seen Team America: World Police? Avenue Q? Sesame Street? All of them have made their creators and participants quite a pretty penny, and all of them use (say it with me) puppets.

            I got nothin’ on the anime class, but I stand by my larger point: that a lot of these courses don’t make sense for a general-studies student or for somebody outside the major, but that they are eminently sensible for somebody already pursuing a degree in, say, music or theater.

            (Incidentally, that piracy class: If I were teaching that thing, I’d start the first day with an extended clip from Pirates of the Caribbean, followed by extended discussion of Mister Jack Sparrow. End of class: “By the way, there’s some reading for next week. I look forward to seeing you again. I think you won’t look at piracy the same way again.” After the kids get comfortable and think it’s a gut class … they’ll spend the rest of the semester in a Hell Course about 16-17th century colonial economics.)

          • herddog505

            With regard to the toy design class, I see your point, but I suggest that people were – somehow – designing toys without having to take a specific class in it. Not being an engineer myself, it seems to me that a good grasp of the basic theories of design, materials, dynamics, etc. should allow the engineer to design just about anything from a Happy Meal toy to a spacecraft.

            I recall chatting with one of my professors: I groused about the lack of practical courses in the chemistry department at my university (a problem that I still think ought to be addressed). He told me that college is not intended to be a trade school. I don’t say that I agree, but there is that argument.

            This and your remarks about teaching “The Wire” bring us to the question of what college is FOR. Is it:

            — To teach a basic curriculum that every educated person ought to know, for example the canon of American and English literature, a foreign language, mathematics to some fairly high level, etc?

            — To teach the student, by whatever means the faculty think best, to research and think critically*?

            — To teach knowledge and skills that will fit the graduate for a profession?

            — Some combination?

            If we want to teach critical thinking to English majors, then “The Wire” or just about any work will do, but shouldn’t the educated American be familiar with “the classics” rather than whatever show / movie / novel is popular in a given year? Should it be The Adventures of Huckleberry Finn or Harry Potter and the Sorcerer’s Stone?

            I hasten to add that I regard some of the classics as bilge (Moby Dick, an utterly unreadable novel, leaps to mind) and think that some modern works are very good, and that many “classics” are classics because everybody just agrees that they are because… everybody says so.

            But anime???

            ===

            (*) Paul Mirengoff writes about the END of a “liberal” education at Vassar:

            The indispensable Stanley Kurtz is on top of both stories. At Vassar, the subject of this post, he reports on attempts to block a speech by Alex Epstein, a proponent and defender of America’s conventional energy industries. Epstein was invited to speak by Vassar’s Moderate, Independent, Conservative Alliance (MICA).

            The presentation of Epstein’s point of view was particularly important at Vassar. For, as Kurtz demonstrates, the college has attempted, in the context of an aggressive fossil-fuel divestment campaign, to brainwash its students on issues of climate change, energy, and the environment. As one student told Kurtz, “I don’t feel that [conservative students at Vassar] are able to freely express their views at all.”

            The reaction to Epstein’s appearance is consistent with that impression. Posters advertizing his lecture were promptly covered or ripped down. The head of MICA, whose room lock was broken, was ridiculed mercilessly and eventually came under pressure from leftist students to pay Epstein not to appear. One student threatened to inflict bodily injury on himself at Epstein’s lecture in order to disrupt it.

            http://www.powerlineblog.com/archives/2013/04/the-end-of-liberal-education-part-one-the-vassar-experience.php

            Bowdoin in Maine – home to one of the greatest soldiers in our history, Joshua Lawrence Chamberlain – has similar problems:

            Funded by [fleeced Bowdoin donor] Mr. Klingenstein, researchers from the National Association of Scholars studied speeches by Bowdoin presidents and deans, formal statements of the college’s principles, official faculty reports and notes of faculty meetings, academic course lists and syllabi, books and articles by professors, the archive of the Bowdoin Orient newspaper and more. They analyzed the school’s history back to its founding in 1794, focusing on the past 45 years—during which, they argue, Bowdoin’s character changed dramatically for the worse.

            Published Wednesday, the report demonstrates how Bowdoin has become an intellectual monoculture dedicated above all to identity politics.

            http://ace.mu.nu/archives/338915.php#338915

          • JWH

            You’re kind of hitting one of my pet peeves there, Herd. I am of the opinion that when literature departments ignore popular culture, they ignore a wide swath of very creative, and more importantly, very good artistry … and they manage to isolate themselves even further in their ivory towers. Yes, Mark Twain is a master of writing, and Shakespeare’s plays have merit. But The Sopranos offers trenchant commentary on family and hubris, and Buffy the Vampire Slayer took a hundred years of horror tropes and stood them on their head with a feminist twist.

            I daresay that majoring in “Buffy Studies” is stupid. But I also believe scholars of writing, cinema, and culture would be foolish to condemn it.

            (PS. For fun sometime, read Harold Blooms paeans against popular culture. He comes across as an arrogant, stuffy boor.)

            And oh, dear god, do NOT remind me of Moby Dick.

          • JWH

            But anime???

            As I said, I got nothin’ on that one. BTW, I chatted with a relative who was a theater major. Turns out that puppetry experts can actually do really, really well for themselves in Hollywood or working on Animatronics for Disney.

          • JWH

            I submit that the point of the design class isn’t to design toys, but to design. It’s a 200-level class for freshmen and sophomores. If I’m reading the description right, it’s basically a low-risk way for underclassmen to get the experience of designing something in a relatively low-risk environment.

            What is college? That really is a fundamental question here. Universities were once places of learning devoted primarily to academia, producing mainly professors and scientists on the one hand and such professionals as lawyers, doctors, and dentists on the other.

            Since World War II, college has morphed into what amounts to a very, very expensive vo-tech program for kids who didn’t master a trade in high school. Want to be a journalist? Take journalism courses. Want to be a manager? Take management courses. And so forth. But some college still pride themselves on being centers of learning, so they make their undergraduate students jump through a lot of unnecessary hoops.

            I think we ought to rethink college. Yes, academic learning is nice, but some kids are at college to get enough education to ply a trade or profession. IMO, we ought to do more to put those kids on the best track for them and let them graduate, perhaps in as little as three years, and let those students interested in a liberal-arts degree chase that degree as they choose.

          • herddog505

            JWHI think we ought to rethink college. Yes, academic learning is nice, but some kids are at college to get enough education to ply a trade or profession. IMO, we ought to do more to put those kids on the best track for them and let them graduate, perhaps in as little as three years, and let those students interested in a liberal-arts degree chase that degree as they choose.

            I tend to agree. I would also say that we ought to stop stigmatizing people who DON’T go to college (I’m guilty of this), either because they learn a trade or else just start in on whatever job they can find.

            My only problem with trade school is that, based on what I see from my German chemist colleagues (and, in an earlier job, Japanese), the education they get there is thorough but narrow. As much as I run down the American university system, it has much to recommend it, and I think that a “liberal” education, which exposes the student to a variety of subjects and encourages critical and independent thinking, is generally superior to a more “vocational” training model.

          • JWH

            Ummm … Herd. You do live in North Carolina, right? I have, too. And while air conditioning may not be properly classified as a necessity, I also wouldn’t call it a luxury.

          • herddog505

            In my first two years at college, my dorm didn’t have A/C (though I cast many a covetous eye at the newer dorms that DID have it). I survived.

            As I say, I don’t think that college should be a misery, but if we’re talking about skyrocketing costs, it seems to me reasonable to start wonder WHY they are going up so fast. I suggest that part of the reason is that colleges are trying to make themselves increasingly into resorts, not institutions of learning.

          • JWH

            That’s part of it, no doubt. When I went to college, I was without AC for my first couple years, too. (And I think that about a year after I graduated, they renovated the old dorm hall to add AC). I recall having one of those microfridge things the first year, and I paid an extra hundred bucks for the year for it before I got my own dorm fridge the following year.

            I think certain things at a college campus are pretty reasonable. It’s reasonable to have a student union with some decent amenities. It’s reasonable for dorm halls to include lounges for socializing, study, and such. And some of the bigger colleges need larger amenities to service larger populations of students. But there is something to your thesis.

            As an undergrad, I recall being incensed at being charged an activity fee for maintaining the weight room and sports complex when I NEVER USED THE WEIGHT ROOM IN THE FIRST PLACE. If colleges are going to keep up the amenity explosion, I think they ought to transition to a fee-for-service model … and let students who don’t want certain services to opt out.

          • herddog505

            Ditto on fees. I got charged a student health fee when I was an adult student with my own insurance. Why did I have to pay that???

            I agree that certain amenities are reasonable. But rec centers that make Club Med look like Average Joe’s gym in “Dodgeball”? Free movie theatres? High-end restaurants?

            No.

            I think that a theory I’ve read elsewhere is pretty spot-on: the colleges are simply competing for the kids’ (borrowed) money. Rather than entice the little darlings with offers of getting the best education – “Come to Pimento U, where you’ll earn a useful, respected degree… or die trying!” – the colleges are offering fluff and flash: “Come to Pimento U, where the dorms have A/C, the student union has free beer, and you can get a diploma with coursework so easy that Joe Biden could do it!”*

            Now, if kids want to do that, it’s not my problem… unless they expect me, through taxes or higher interest rates to make up for all the defaulted student loans, to pay for it. Then, it IS my problem.

            ====

            (*) In a 2009 report on grade inflation at UNC – considered a “Southern Ivy League” college – shows clear evidence of grade inflation. This is after a 2000 report that complained about the same thing. Of particular note:

            82 percent of the grades issued in fall 2007 to undergrads were As and Bs. That’s up from 77 percent in 2000.

            http://blogs.newsobserver.com/campusnotes/grade-inflation-at-unc-chapel-hill

            The 2009 report is here:

            http://blogs.newsobserver.com/campusnotes/grade-inflation-at-unc-chapel-hill

            Now, assuming that UNC really is a top-flight school and its reputation is not merely the result of a lot of smug UNC graduates putting on airs and making out that they are better than everybody else because they spent four or five years in a drunken stupor in Chapel Hill (don’t tell my Tarheel wife I wrote this!), we may assume that the situation is even worse in other, less-prestigious universities.

            To me, the cause is obvious: the colleges, desperate for money, are making it easier and easier for kids to get in and stay in. If they are reduced to penury when they get out and / or can’t find a job… oh, well. Sucks to be them.

          • JWH

            Herd, I attended UNC-Asheville. When your school is also known as “UNC-Hashville,” dorm ventilation is very, very important. And so are refrigerators, for when your neighbor comes over and asks for munchies.

            PS. Is Gary Birdsong still in business?

        • herddog505

          Where to start?

          1. If you people are paying that much of their income in student loan debt, it says to me that they might have chosen their college and major… poorly. “Hmmm… Lessee…. I can go to Private U to get a degree in Existentialist Romanian Poetry of the Middle Ages for $50k / year, or I can go to State U and get a degree in engineering for $10k / year. Decisions, decisions… I’ve got it! I’ll take what’s behind Door #1!”

          2. Student loans are highly subsidized. It might not be a free ride, but it’s at least a reduced cost;

          3. “the premise that they’re using it to pay for an education that will heighten their job prospects and earnings potential”. Here we may be in agreement. College has become something of a racket: “Come to Pimento U and earn your degree so you can get a good-paying job!”

          Left unsaid is WHAT the degree will be in. When colleges are offering courses in Star Trek*, for pity’s sake, it’s pretty clear that they only want the kids’ money and don’t give a damn about what happens to them five minutes after the diplomas are handed out.

          And we won’t even get into the problems with grade inflation and graduates who can barely write a coherent paragraph or do math above the sixth grade level…

          4. I also agree about the economy. It’s been sucking for years;

          5. As for what the world spends and gets for it, some comparative data**:

          COUNTRY – YEARS OF SCHOOL / LITERACY / EXPENDITURE (% of GDP)

          US – 16 years / 99% / 5.4% of GDP

          UK – 16 years / 99% / 5.6% of GDP

          GERMANY – 16 years / 99% / 5.1% of GDP

          FRANCE – 16 years / 99% / 5.9% of GDP

          JAPAN – 15 years / 99% / 3.8%

          AUSTRALIA – 21 years / 99% / 5.1%

          NORWAY – 17 years / 100% / 7.3%

          Hmmm… For a country that “isn’t even close” to spending what socialist countries do, we are… very close. Our outcomes are similar based on these data.

          Let’s look at college graduates**:

          US – 40.3%

          UK – 31.8%

          GERMANY – 24.3%

          FRANCE – 26.8%

          JAPAN – 41.0%

          AUSTRALIA – 33.7%

          NORWAY – 34.2%

          The only countries that lead the US in this regard are Russia (54%!), Canada, Israel, Japan and New Zealand.

          So: we are spending about what other industrialized countries do on education. We have a rather higher fraction of college graduates than almost all other countries.

          I think this rather explodes the idea that – somehow – we’re just not spending enough and hence putting our kids at a disadvantage.

          ===

          (*) http://courses.georgetown.edu/index.cfm?Action=View&CourseID=PHIL-180

          (^) https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/fields/2012.html

          (**) Percentage of 25- to 64-Year-Olds with an Associate Degree or Higher, 2007

          http://completionagenda.collegeboard.org/sites/default/files/reports_pdf/Progress_Report_2010.pdf

          • JWH

            “Hmmm… Lessee…. I can go to Private U to get a degree in Existentialist Romanian Poetry of the Middle Ages for $50k / year, or I can go to State U and get a degree in engineering for $10k / year. Decisions, decisions… I’ve got it! I’ll take what’s behind Door #1!”

            People aren’t completely fungible, Herd. Somebody might be pretty good at, say, writing fiction and completely horrid at engineering. Seems to me that if your choice is between success as an English major or failure as an engineering major … you ought to major in English.

            Student loans are highly subsidized. It might not be a free ride, but it’s at least a reduced cost;

            Disagree. Student-loan interest is certainly reduced cost, but I would argue that the easy availability of student loans has reduced downward pressure on tuition … and thus inflated the overall cost of a college education and, by extension, student loans.

            Left unsaid is WHAT the degree will be in. When colleges are offering courses in Star Trek*, for pity’s sake, it’s pretty clear that they only want the kids’ money and don’t give a damn about what happens to them five minutes after the diplomas are handed out.

            Funny story, Herd. Little personal project I’ve got. I’ve always wanted to publish a genre fiction novel. I haven’t written fiction in a long, long time. (Like, since creative-writing class in college). So I’m trying to reacquaint myself with it by reviewing examples of both good fiction writing and bad fiction writing. Would you believe Star Trek has examples of both?

            Edited to add: I gave it some more thought, and I actually think a class about Star Trek would be a very good college class IF it’s done right. If it’s a bunch of Trekkies sitting around fanwanking, it’s a waste of time. But I think it would actually be useful for a scriptwriting class. If you’re a writer, you hone your craft by taking great works (and not so great works) and analyzing them for what works and what doesn’t. Now what if a class spent a unit (not the whole damn class) taking some of the best Star Trek scripts and breaking them down scene by scene? Seems to me the kids could learn something.

    • SCSIwuzzy

      Indeed. How dare anyone exercise their free speech rights!

      As for his clothing, nobody said anything about a suit except you. He took the time to write, but not rehearse, his little speech and load it onto a smart phone.
      That is a clean, and from the looks of it pressed, t-shirt. He chose to wear that outfit, and either wanted to convey a certain image or didn’t realize how the image would perceived outside of his bubble.
      But, he’s a freshmen. They’re notoriously clueless. Nearly as insufferable as sophomores.
      Now, just curious, what was the hypocritical ignorance that came out of the so called senators mouth? Please explain your position, otherwise we cannot discuss its merits or those of any counter positions.

  • herddog505

    Wow. Talk about a timely coincidence:

    Combined private and federal student debt doubled since 2007 to $1.1 trillion,
    according to Consumer Financial Protection Bureau and New York Federal Reserve data, as parents became less able to fund educations in the years following the 2008 financial crash.

    http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2013-04-12/american-dream-eludes-with-student-debt-burden-mortgages.html

    And this:

    The unemployment rate for recent college grads between the ages of 21 to 24 has averaged 8.8% over the last year, according to Labor Department data.

    Once you* also include young grads who are working part-time for economic reasons, and those who have stopped looking for a job in the last year, the so-called “underemployment rate” is a whopping 18.3%.

    As of 2012, about 52% of employed college grads under age 25 were not working in jobs that require a college degree, said Andrew Sum, an economist at Northeastern University. That’s up from 47% in 2007 and 40% in 2000.

    http://money.cnn.com/2013/04/10/news/economy/college-grads-jobs/

    Is it just me, or does it feel like we’ve – inadvertently, to be sure – f*cked an entire generation of Americans?

    “Hey, go to college! You’ve got to, you know, to get a good job (you don’t REALLY want to be a (ick) PLUMBER, do you?) You can follow your dreams in college, earn a major in whatever interests you! Money? PFFT! Don’t you worry your little eighteen year-old head about that! Here’s a loan application! No worries about paying it back: with that degree in Womyn’s Studies, you’re SURE to get a good-paying job that will let you pay this pittance back and still have a big house in the ‘burbs, two cars, an a trip to Hawaii every year!”

    ===

    (*) Perhaps a minor quibble, but I was taught that, in formal writing, one doesn’t generally use “you” as though writing TO the reader. A slip of the pen, or a sign of a lousy education?

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