White House now accuses fellow Afghan vets of “swiftboating” Bergdahl

You knew it was coming, didn’t you?

“Every [White House] aide I’ve talked to said they expected there to be controversy involving the decision to release five members of the Taliban from Gitmo, and the fact that this would then escalate that debate, which has been simmering for a good five years, which is what to do with those detainees, how do you release them, where do you release them. They did not expect this backlash on Bergdahl himself. I’ve had a few aides describe it to me as, ‘we didn’t know that they were going to swift boat Bergdahl.’ And that’s a reference to that political fight back in 2004 over John Kerry’s military service, so there’s some fighting words there.”

That’s NBC correspondant Chuck Todd, describing the situation in the White House to Today’s Matt Lauer.

Republicans have (rightly) questioned President Obama, specifically his decision to ignore established law and order the release of the “Taliban Dream Team” from Gitmo without notifying Congress or providing a plan to ensure that these men will not be able to resume activities related to terrorism.  This deal has been on the table for over two years, and so far no one has offered an official explanation of why it was suddenly rushed through.

But it has been veterans who have voluntarily stepped up to the plate to denounce Bergdahl.  Story after story has now surfaced, and the overwhelming conclusion is that Bergdahl was a disillusioned misfit who willfully deserted his unit and sought to join Islamic militants.  We have known his whereabouts for over four years and, according to unofficial reports, had already decided forgo any further attempts to extricate him from either the Taliban or Haqqani members who were watching him.

However, we used a significant amount of manpower and resources to search for Bergdahl shortly after he disappeared.  This caused shortages in available backup and air cover in the area, which prompted the Taliban to attack an American ammunition dump near the town of Kamesh, which resulted in the deaths of 8 soldiers, with 22 more wounded.  An additional 6 soldiers died while on patrols whose mission included tracking and retrieving Bergdahl.

Some veterans have claimed that they were told by military superiors to not talk about what they knew about Bergdahl.  Although the Pentagon never officially classified him as a POW, he was listed as “missing/captured” and considered to be a hostage of militant Islamist forces in the area.  Many who believe that Bergdahl is a deserter also believe that the Pentagon is lying when it refers to Bergdahl as anything except a traitor.

All of this has snowballed into a massive backlash by veterans against military leadership that is seen as dishonest, and a White House that is seen as incompetent, dismissive of the sacrifices made by those killed and wounded in Afghanistan, and sympathetic to radical Islamists.

Military leaders balked at the idea of a prisoner exchange and openly expressed their concerns to the White House.  Obama Administration officials told them, effectively, to “suck it up and salute.”

It takes a special kind of ‘detatched’ and ‘stupid’ to not see that a huge backlash was coming in the wake of this very poorly thought-out plan.  Apparently, our leaders in the White House are very, very special people.

Shortlink:

Posted by on June 4, 2014.
Filed under Afghanistan, Barack Obama, Military, War On Terror.
Tagged with: .


You can leave a response or trackback to this entry
  • warnertoddhuston

    This deal stinks to high heaven.

  • karl_lembke

    Swiftboat — verb: swiftboated, swiftboating, swiftboats
    to report behavior that people in power wish to remain unreported (often used for reports made by people who were in a position to witness said behavior)

  • Walter_Cronanty

    I could see getting Bergdahl back and having him face desertion charges. But the way in which this was handled is breathtakingly inept.
    First we have Pashtun Pappy Bergdahl spouting pro-Islamic crap in the Rose Garden standing next to a smiling Obama [by the way, he made a nice, classy statement honoring those soldiers who were killed looking for his deserter son....oh, wait,...].
    Then they trotted out Susan Rice [Baghdad Bobbie?] to say Bowe “…served with honor and distinction.” How could anyone not see that this would enrage those in the military and their families – and anyone else who values the military?
    My questions: 1) Is the entire Obama administration this out of touch, or is this just a shiny squirrel to get attention away from that great socialist healthcare success story serving our veterans? 2) Is there a bigger, more overeducated, know-nothing boob than Obama?

  • jim_m

    Expect Chico to grab onto this bogus meme and blame the soldiers who died searching for this traitor for their own deaths in 3…2…1…

  • SteveCrickmore075

    Six months ago, the conservative trope was ‘Obama leaves American POW Sgt. Bowe Robert Bergdahl to Rot in Afghanistan – Provides Only Excuses’ Now they will be demanding the death penalty for Bergdahl.

    • jim_m

      That was before anyone knew about his desertion and probably treason. And no one knew about that because the obama admin put a gag order on the military.

      Until you can show that ANYONE knew about these facts when they were making the aforesaid complaint, you need to STFU. If people made wrong assumptions because obama lied (not the first time) then you cannot use that against them.

      • SteveCrickmore075
        • jim_m

          Fuck you steve. Pony up some doocumentation that people knew Bergdahl was a deserter and complained that we were not getting him back.

          You won’t because you can’t. You are too busy celebrating his treason and the deaths of good soldiers to bother.

          • SteveCrickmore075

            http://michellemalkin.com/2009/07/20/questions-about-the-reported-abduction-of-pfc-bowe-bergdahl/ Questions about the reported abduction of Pfc. Bowe Bergdahl; Update: Reports of desertion mounting.
            By Michelle Malkin • July 20, 2009

          • Walter_Cronanty

            Where is Michelle Malkin criticizing Obama for not bringing home Bergdahl? She says that everyone should pray for his release, but raises questions concerning if he was captured or deserted. Your premise is totally off base.

          • jim_m

            Steve is too busy celebrating the victory of the Taliban and using this as a childish gotcha with conservatives to be bothered with the fact that this will bolster terrorism and that it cost the lives of 14 US soldiers. I’ll wager that Steve is celebrating their deaths like Chico is.

          • Walter_Cronanty

            I won’t go that far – but his premise that those with knowledge of the facts criticized Obama for not bringing Bergdahl home, but now criticize him for bringing him home is nothing but hackery.
            The deal for letting the Taliban 5 go home is completely different, for the reasons cited above.

          • jim_m

            I believe that it is just a cheap political gotcha for Steve and he really sincerely does not care about what damage was done to the US or about the 14 soldiers who died as a result of Bergdahl’s actions.

            I believe that to Steve (and Chico) that the gotcha is more important than anything else.

          • Walter_Cronanty

            I think you’re right about that.

          • Walter_Cronanty

            I think you’re right about that.

          • http://www.rustedsky.net JLawson

            It’s all about the game to him – not what happens afterward.

          • jim_m

            I believe that it is just a cheap political gotcha for Steve and he really sincerely does not care about what damage was done to the US or about the 14 soldiers who died as a result of Bergdahl’s actions.

            I believe that to Steve (and Chico) that the gotcha is more important than anything else.

          • Brucehenry

            I believe Steve is showing Jim here that many people indeed suspected Bergdahl of desertion and that Jim’s assertion that nobody knew anything about those suspicions is in error.

          • jim_m

            He has not shown that ANYONE has both known that he was a deserter, known that he was a collaborator, AND still demanded his release much less that we trade him for terrorists.

            I think that He, and you are playing gotcha, refusing to say a word against what obama did because you are too focused on trying to score some cheap political point and don’t really give a damn about the cost.

            That is why I say what I do about Chico. His position on this reveals his repeated complaints about the loss of the military in the Iraq and Afghanistan wars to be nothing but a pose and yet another form of cheap gotcha. Chico doesn’t give a damn about military deaths unless he can make some political gain from them.

            The sames goes for you and Steve.

          • Brucehenry

            When American involvement in the war is over, international law demands those prisoners be released anyway. The Taliban was demanding 21 released and millions in ransom. By acting now we got Bergdahl back and we would have released these Taliban guys soon anyway.

            Those guys have been held for over a decade. They may have been “senior leaders” when they were captured but they’re not now.

          • jim_m

            No it does not. The Taliban were ruled as illegal combatants and therefore are not covered by the Geneva Convention and can be detained indefinitely.
            http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unlawful_combatant#Supreme_Court_ruling_on_Military_Commissions_Act_of_2006

          • Brucehenry

            “Were ruled” by what court? Certainly not an international one.

          • jim_m

            Ruled by us. There is nothing in the Geneva Convention that dictates any international court must rule on this issue.

            Also, since the evidence now suggests that Bergdahl was collaborating with the Taliban and helping to train the enemy to kill US soldiers that is treason. If the obama admin had retrieved him for the purpose of trying and executing him I would perhaps feel differently. Instead they are going to promote him and probably give him a medal.

          • jim_m

            Ruled by us. There is nothing in the Geneva Convention that dictates any international court must rule on this issue.

            Also, since the evidence now suggests that Bergdahl was collaborating with the Taliban and helping to train the enemy to kill US soldiers that is treason. If the obama admin had retrieved him for the purpose of trying and executing him I would perhaps feel differently. Instead they are going to promote him and probably give him a medal.

          • Retired military

            “”Were ruled” by what court? Certainly not an international one.”
            No thanks to most of those on the left.

          • Brucehenry

            “Were ruled” by what court? Certainly not an international one.

          • Commander_Chico

            You are wrong about the Geneva Conventions. “All persons” detained are required to be treated humanely and given review processes for an end to capivity, whether they are “prisoners of war” or not. Common Article 3.

            The propaganda about “illegal combatants” was started by Rumsfeld after it was discovered Americans were torturing people to death.

          • jim_m

            Liar. We were not torturing people to death. Just more evidence that you are full of crap.

            It’s also more evidence that you hate America.

          • Commander_Chico
          • jim_m

            I’m sorry. The picture didn’t say how he died. Nor is it an indication that what you say was common practice or official policy.

          • http://wizbangblog.com/author/rodney-graves/ Rodney G. Graves

            Common Article 3 begins:

            In the case of armed conflict not of an international character occurring in the territory of one of the High Contracting Parties

            Can you EVER be honest? The evidence of your posts here suggests you are unable or unwilling to be.

          • Commander_Chico

            You dolt, it’s settled law that detainees are subject to the provisions of Common Article 3. Hamdan v. Rumfeld, 548 U.S. 557 (2006)

            Just like with the torture law, you’re punked again.

          • http://wizbangblog.com/author/rodney-graves/ Rodney G. Graves

            You ass, the black letter of the treaty appears above.

          • Commander_Chico

            Take it up with the Supreme Court and the rest of the world.

          • http://wizbangblog.com/author/rodney-graves/ Rodney G. Graves

            Is what I posted the actual text of Common Article 3.

            Yes or No.

          • http://wizbangblog.com/author/rodney-graves/ Rodney G. Graves

            We will take your shamed silence as an answer of yes, that is indeed the black letter of the treaty.

          • jim_m

            Like all lefties Chico lies until called on it then disappears

          • Commander_Chico

            If the Supreme Court says I am right and Rodney and you are wrong, that is the end of the argument.

          • jim_m

            No/ You are arguing that the SCOTUS says that we cannot keep them indefinitely.. They did not rule that way. Once again you are shown to be full of shit.

            Also, no one said that we had the right to treat prisoners inhumanely. That is another piece of BS you are peddling.

          • Commander_Chico

            Your and Rodnick’s original assertion was that the detainees were not covered by the Geneva Conventions.

            Me and the Supreme Court said you’re wrong. What about the word “Supreme” do you not understand?

          • jim_m

            Nothing of what you said contradicts my position that as illegal combatants they can be held indefinitely. Your own claim is that they have to have some sort of review, not that they have to be released.

            And you seem to be claiming that I stated that they do not have to be treated humanely, I defy you to produce ay such claim on my part.

            Really, if you are going to argue it would be beneficial to speak English as a first language.

          • jim_m

            Idiot. Did I say that they could be treated inhumanely?

            NO I DID NOT. I said that they could be held indefinitely. There is a difference, but you are too much of an America hating ideologue to notice.

          • Retired military

            If only our enemies treated our personnel as well as we treat theirs. Chico wants us to follow line by line where as our enemies are cutting of people’s heads, blowing up buildings, and massacring folks.

          • jim_m

            No it does not. The Taliban were ruled as illegal combatants and therefore are not covered by the Geneva Convention and can be detained indefinitely.
            http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unlawful_combatant#Supreme_Court_ruling_on_Military_Commissions_Act_of_2006

          • Brucehenry

            When American involvement in the war is over, international law demands those prisoners be released anyway. The Taliban was demanding 21 released and millions in ransom. By acting now we got Bergdahl back and we would have released these Taliban guys soon anyway.

            Those guys have been held for over a decade. They may have been “senior leaders” when they were captured but they’re not now.

          • http://wizbangblog.com/author/rodney-graves/ Rodney G. Graves

            Every time a read a comment from our progressive troika the back of my hand itches…

          • jim_m

            He has not shown that ANYONE has both known that he was a deserter, known that he was a collaborator, AND still demanded his release much less that we trade him for terrorists.

            I think that He, and you are playing gotcha, refusing to say a word against what obama did because you are too focused on trying to score some cheap political point and don’t really give a damn about the cost.

            That is why I say what I do about Chico. His position on this reveals his repeated complaints about the loss of the military in the Iraq and Afghanistan wars to be nothing but a pose and yet another form of cheap gotcha. Chico doesn’t give a damn about military deaths unless he can make some political gain from them.

            The sames goes for you and Steve.

          • Walter_Cronanty

            No, Bruce. His statement is that conservatives berated Obama for not bringing Bergdahl home, but now berate him for bringing Bergdahl home.
            In my mind, bringing Bergdahl home is separate and distinct from the bumbling, typically anti-American way Obama handled this situation.
            If Bergdahl really wants to come home and not be a propaganda tool for Taliban – fine, I’m glad he’s home and he can face charges for desertion.
            Trading him for the Taliban 5 while breaking the law, because he knew Congress wouldn’t go along, while placing Americans in greater danger, is another matter.

          • Brucehenry

            Sure these guys can always find a way to pretend they wouldn’t damn Obama if he did and damn Obama if he didn’t.

          • jim_m

            You certainly wouldn’t damn him either way. Is that any worse? I would suggest that you are projecting.

          • jim_m

            You certainly wouldn’t damn him either way. Is that any worse? I would suggest that you are projecting.

          • Walter_Cronanty

            What guys?
            Hell, McCain has been consistent throughout, according to Steve’s article.

          • Brucehenry
          • Brucehenry
          • Walter_Cronanty

            Bruce, do you read what you cite? Palin is quoted from 2009 saying that she’s praying for Bergdahl’s release after he was captured. She’s then quoted from this month saying that desertion is not “honorable” service.
            One statement [from 2009 when she thought he was captured] is hoping he comes home – the other is saying Susan Rice lied, on Obama’s behalf, about Bergdahl’s service. They are not logically mutually exclusive.
            For a lefty, you have no nuance.

          • http://wizbangblog.com/author/rodney-graves/ Rodney G. Graves

            Nor any honesty, which we see a lot of in their comments.

          • SteveCrickmore075

            http://gawker.com/angry-conservatives-forgot-their-old-angry-tweets-suppo-1586150981 The only consistent thing angry conservatives have is their knee-jerk outrage, or authoritian mindset for not seeing the complexity of any issue. It is always black or white for them and for Obama black.

          • http://wizbangblog.com/author/rodney-graves/ Rodney G. Graves

            We certainly believe you think of all things in terms of black and white.

          • http://wizbangblog.com/author/rodney-graves/ Rodney G. Graves

            Whereas you will always find an apology for his lawless behavior and disdain for the Constitution he swore to defend and uphold.

          • Jwb10001

            And liberals can pretend that they didn’t do the same to Bush.

          • http://wizbangblog.com/author/rodney-graves/ Rodney G. Graves

            but not convincingly…

          • Brucehenry

            Sure these guys can always find a way to pretend they wouldn’t damn Obama if he did and damn Obama if he didn’t.

          • Walter_Cronanty

            No, Bruce. His statement is that conservatives berated Obama for not bringing Bergdahl home, but now berate him for bringing Bergdahl home.
            In my mind, bringing Bergdahl home is separate and distinct from the bumbling, typically anti-American way Obama handled this situation.
            If Bergdahl really wants to come home and not be a propaganda tool for Taliban – fine, I’m glad he’s home and he can face charges for desertion.
            Trading him for the Taliban 5 while breaking the law, because he knew Congress wouldn’t go along, while placing Americans in greater danger, is another matter.

          • http://wizbangblog.com/author/rodney-graves/ Rodney G. Graves

            You believe many things which just ain’t so.

            And you always will.

          • Brucehenry

            One of the things I believe is that you rock that fedora.

          • http://wizbangblog.com/author/rodney-graves/ Rodney G. Graves

            Another of the many things you believe which just ain’t so.

          • http://wizbangblog.com/author/rodney-graves/ Rodney G. Graves

            You believe many things which just ain’t so.

            And you always will.

          • Retired military

            Well Obama knew about it. Right after he read about it in the newspaper.

          • jim_m

            Aaaand that does not show that the other people you have cited knew about these allegations.

            Nor do you deny my accusation that you are reveling in the release of this traitor, the victory of the Taliban over the US and the death of US soldiers required to accomplish this.

          • SteveCrickmore075

            Ignorance is no excuse. Republican lawmakers were lobbying Obama last month to negotiate Bergdahl’s reléase. If Obama had said the circumstances of Bergdahl’s capture ‘were cloudy’ there would have been a firestorm ..by the right, on Obama’s head for betraying or slandering one soldier/our soldiers on the battlefront, without due process

          • jim_m

            Bullshit! You have excused obama using ignorance as an excuse. You have excused all the faults in obamacare despite the fact that no one knew what was in it because they didn’t read it.

            This is just you playing gotcha and demonstrating an unseemly amount of glee over the deaths of Americans.

          • http://wizbangblog.com/author/rodney-graves/ Rodney G. Graves

            Was she demanding Bergdahl be traded for?

            That’s a yes or no question which I predict you will not answer as it does not further your message.

          • http://wizbangblog.com/author/rodney-graves/ Rodney G. Graves

            Was she demanding Bergdahl be traded for?

            That’s a yes or no question which I predict you will not answer as it does not further your message.

      • Brucehenry

        According to Wikipedia, a 2010 Pentagon investigation concluded there was “incontrovertible evidence” that he walked away from his unit. Questions have been swirling since he disappeared. It was no secret that he may have deserted or gone AWOL.

        http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bowe_Bergdahl

        • jim_m

          The investigation report is classified and no one has seen it.

          And my demand was that for the people who Steve is saying supported his release that he show that they knew this. I would argue that the vast majority of the public knew nothing about it

          • Brucehenry

            So how does Wiki know what it concluded?

          • Brucehenry

            So how does Wiki know what it concluded?

          • jim_m

            Are they reporting from a position of knowledge or just from the rumors? No one has seen this report so I wager that it is the second.

          • jim_m

            Are they reporting from a position of knowledge or just from the rumors? No one has seen this report so I wager that it is the second.

      • jim_m

        As has been pointed out, all evidence of desertion to date has been confined to a classified report that has not been seen by anyone in Congress. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QWYYfCmZYdY

        I fault Congress for not looking further into this previously.

    • Walter_Cronanty

      Read your own article, Steve. I have no idea if the site is conservative, but it acknowledges that many people don’t know or forgot about Bergdahl, it criticizes McCain for not going along with the trade for Gitmo prisoners, and it repeatedly says that Bergdahl was “captured.” There’s nothing in the article about Bergdahl deserting.
      I have not heard anyone say he should be left there if he truly wants to come home – but he should face desertion charges.
      The deal for the Taliban 5 has been criticized for many reasons, including heightening the risk for additional hostage taking [if a deserter is worth 5 Taliban all-stars, what's a real soldier worth?], bargaining with terrorists, and breaking the law concerning notifying Congress 30 days in advance. Only a complete tool could defend this action by Obama. You apparently fill the bill.

      • SteveCrickmore075

        Former Bush administration official, John Bellinger the Legal Adviser for the U.S. Department of State and the National Security Council during Bush 43 administration supported President Obama’s decision to swap five Taliban prisoners for the lone U.S. POW. In a refreshing interview, he told Fox News’ Happening Now, that since the war was winding down and they couldn’t have tried the Afghanistan prisoners in US courts, their only option was to free them eventually so making the trade made sense and and that George Bush would have made the same decision.

        • jim_m

          So are you happy that we gave away 5 terrorists for a traitor? Or are you just playing gotcha? Or both?

          My bet is on the last.

          • SteveCrickmore075

            They are not Al´Queda, they are Taliban officials and they are going back to Afghanistan within a year anyway. The 12 year war will be over, is practically over now. We are
            negotiating with the Taliban more than fighting them now.

          • jim_m

            Dude, you need to read up on the Taliban if you think these two things are totally unrelated.

            And my point is that you don’t care what happens to the US or its people as long as you can make some cheap political gain from it. No limits to how many people can die to make your cheap gotcha work.

          • SteveCrickmore075

            Although some of the released prisoners posed a danger to the United States when they were captured in 2002, especially toward soldiers serving in Afghanistan, several of the detainees did not commit crimes against Americans. They were mostly mid- to high-level officials in the Taliban regime and had been detained early in the war in Afghanistan, because of their positions within the Taliban, not because of ties to al Qaeda. /though some had links.

          • jim_m

            That was essentially nonresponsive.

          • jim_m

            That was essentially nonresponsive.

          • SteveCrickmore075

            Although some of the released prisoners posed a danger to the United States when they were captured in 2002, especially toward soldiers serving in Afghanistan, several of the detainees did not commit crimes against Americans. They were mostly mid- to high-level officials in the Taliban regime and had been detained early in the war in Afghanistan, because of their positions within the Taliban, not because of ties to al Qaeda. /though some had links.

          • jim_m

            Dude, you need to read up on the Taliban if you think these two things are totally unrelated.

            And my point is that you don’t care what happens to the US or its people as long as you can make some cheap political gain from it. No limits to how many people can die to make your cheap gotcha work.

          • Walter_Cronanty

            I’ve read plenty of reports that the Taliban 5 pose a distinct danger. Please cite those you’ve read that indicate they will go home, live in peace and do nothing but play with their grandchildren.
            Really, Steve. You’re starting to sound like Susan Rice.

          • Walter_Cronanty

            I’ve read plenty of reports that the Taliban 5 pose a distinct danger. Please cite those you’ve read that indicate they will go home, live in peace and do nothing but play with their grandchildren.
            Really, Steve. You’re starting to sound like Susan Rice.

        • Walter_Cronanty

          So one person said Bush did it [or would have done it]? Holy shit, Steve, go find a shiny squirrel.

          • SteveCrickmore075

            Or Saint Ronnie who would have given them TOW missles in exchange for the POW.

          • jim_m

            Still cannot bring yourself to criticize Bergdahl can you. He really is a hero to you isn’t he.

          • jim_m

            Still cannot bring yourself to criticize Bergdahl can you. He really is a hero to you isn’t he.

          • Walter_Cronanty

            So, I assume TOW missiles are your shiny squirrel.
            Really, Steve, you think the way this was handled is just fine? Pappy Pashtun in the Rose Garden, Susan Rice saying Bergdahl served with honor and distinction?
            The way this was handled is a disgrace and a slap in the face of the military.
            Obama could have at least tried to divorce the Taliban 5 from Bergdahl. He could also have had the decency to acknowledge those who died trying to find Bergdahl. He could have also followed the law.
            But decency, honor and abiding by the law are foreign to Obama, just like the American ethos.

          • SteveCrickmore075

            Or Saint Ronnie who would have given them TOW missles in exchange for the POW.

          • westcoastwiser

            Steve is the disqus name for Bark Obama.

        • Walter_Cronanty

          So one person said Bush did it [or would have done it]? Holy shit, Steve, go find a shiny squirrel.

        • Retired military

          Gee Bush’s legal advisors said that waterboarding was legal as well. I am sure that you support them in that statement as well don’t you.

          • SteveCrickmore075

            The Bergdahl transfer may have fudged some legalties, but that is not why conservatives are opposing it, but not all http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2014/06/05/charles-krauthammer-bergdahl-deal_n_5452003.html or retired General Stanley McChrystal, who led the war in Afghanistan when Bergdahl was captured in 2009 said this week. ‘We don’t leave Americans behind. That’s unequivocal’.

          • Retired military

            Tell that to the guys who died waiting for the VA to see them. Or the POWs in Vietnam that Kerry pissed on.

    • http://wizbangblog.com/author/rodney-graves/ Rodney G. Graves

      FreedomOutPost (which I had never heard of before) was obviously unaware the Bergdahl was a deserter.

      What’s your excuse?

    • http://wizbangblog.com/author/rodney-graves/ Rodney G. Graves

      FreedomOutPost (which I had never heard of before) was obviously unaware the Bergdahl was a deserter.

      What’s your excuse?

      • jim_m

        He applauds the betrayal of the US.

      • jim_m

        He applauds the betrayal of the US.

      • Brucehenry

        I’m pretty sure Warner has quoted them, but I could be wrong.

        • jim_m

          I do not recall ever having seen the name before.

          I would suggest that since you believe that obama is a success you would believe just about anything.

        • jim_m

          I do not recall ever having seen the name before.

          I would suggest that since you believe that obama is a success you would believe just about anything.

      • Brucehenry

        I’m pretty sure Warner has quoted them, but I could be wrong.

      • westcoastwiser

        Steve has hemorrhoids!

    • westcoastwiser

      He only deserves that it happens really fast.

    • jim_m

      I take it that you do not consider it to be treason when Bergdahl was training Taliban in ambush tactics and bomb making so they can kill American soldiers (or so it is now alleged). I take it that you think that this was a noble act and that he should be praised.

      Since you believe that demanding a death penalty is unreasonable I can only conclude that you do not consider such acts to be treason.

      • Brucehenry

        You are slinging some pretty heavy accusations but I see no links. Who is the anti-American, one who wants to bring our POWs home, or one who sneers at the presumption of innocence?

        Maybe you can be shamed by FOX’s Shep Smith but I doubt it.

        http://mediamatters.org/blog/2014/06/04/watch-shep-smith-rebuts-fox-news-rush-to-judge/199600

        • jim_m

          The testimony of his peers is pretty convincing that he deserted.

          As to his collaboration, there are further reports that this was the case, that he converted to islam, that he trained with the Taliban. Now whether or not you say that this is the result of Stockholm Syndrome or not the point is that he did it and we should not be celebrating it.

          Even if you give him some tiny benefit of the doubt on those latter issues, he still deserted and the punishment for that can be severe. Given that soldiers died trying to find him after he willfully deserted I think he should get close to the max if not the max.

          He is not entitled to a presumption of innocence from me as will ever sit on the military tribunal that tries him. Idiots like you try to claim that no one can form an opinion on another person’s guilt or innocence, but that only ever seems to apply to lefties and never anyone else. So fuck you and your double standard.

          • Brucehenry

            “There are further reports” from whom? Linky linky.

            EDIT: The “testimony” of his peers hasn’t happened yet. Some of them, many, are giving interviews but haven’t been sworn. I do admit their reports are pretty persuasive, but Private Santiago in “A Few Good Men” didn’t have any defenders either among his peers.

          • jim_m

            Jeez, Bruce, if you are incapable of doing a google search just say so. http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2014/06/05/exclusive-bergdahl-declared-jihad-secret-documents-show/

            Of course it is FOX News saying that it might be Stockholm Syndrome so you might want to start arguing that he did it deliberately.

          • Brucehenry

            Is that it? Because that’s not enough, in my opinion, to support the kind of flat out accusations of treason you have been making.

            If there was anything in that FOX report about training Taliban in ambush tactics and bomb making I missed it.

          • jim_m

            There are other reports that refer to the classified investigation report that is alleged to claim that he helped train Taliban in ambush techniques and IED construction. You can also find the reports on the claims that soldiers from his unit claimed that after his capture attacks became worse and more dangerous after his capture leading them to conclude that he was giving the enemy help.

            Think for a moment what the people in his unit must have thought of him to come to that conclusion. Say what you want but this guy is no hero.

            And I am not interested in convincing you. You still think that obama is a super genius and that he isn’t a hard core socialist/communist.

          • jim_m

            Yesterday I posted a link with this information

            there is a major classified file associated with Sgt. Bergdahl that has been compiled by the intelligence community. And that many in that community harbor ongoing outstanding concerns that Sgt. Bergdahl may not have been just a deserter but that he may have been an active collaborator with the enemy… I can report accurately as I have that there are many in the intelligence community that harbor that concern. I am speaking presently with many people, in and out of the military, in and out of government and in and out of the national security apparatus who are detailing further allegations to me and I am trying to run underground. But this have been a major area of focus for some time now.”

          • Brucehenry

            Anyway there is certain to be a trial. We’ll all know eventually.

          • jim_m

            I actually doubt that obama will ever allow any trial to be held

          • Brucehenry

            I’m sure you do.

          • Commander_Chico

            No, there will be a Chapter 10 or 14 separation by agreement with an other-than-honorable or general discharge.

          • Retired military

            I doubt that that much will be done to him. Look for it all to quietly go away just before Obama leaves office amidst the other pardons. Don’t believe me? Nadal Hussein trial took over 4 years to get to a judgement.

          • Commander_Chico

            His status on active duty has to be resolved. Maybe they’ll just separate him based on the fact his ETS is past.

          • Retired military

            For once I agree with Chico.
            They will let him separate. Wont give his discharge status (personal information) and say that this is all over and in the past. Nothing to see here, just move along.

          • http://wizbangblog.com/author/rodney-graves/ Rodney G. Graves

            Well, RM…

            …I agree with Chico

            Is a firm sign of error and an indicator of deeper issues.

          • Retired military

            Rodney normally I would agree . However, in this case it would resolve an issue for Obama and the give the press cover to drop this.

          • http://wizbangblog.com/author/rodney-graves/ Rodney G. Graves

            This issue NEEDS to be resolved before a Court Martial Board. Obama is a temporary problem, the integrity of the Armed Forces is a much more serious and long lasting issue.

            Should Obama care to pardon what appears to be a deserter, he certainly has the legal authority to do so, and it is not subject to any form of legal review.

          • Brucehenry

            Did I claim he was a hero?

            And haha I know you’re not interested in convincing me or anyone else who disagrees. That’s why your internet home is here, where 98% of the readers and commenters agree with you.

            I’d love to see you engage with the commentariat at OTB but you won’t do it.

          • jim_m

            Look at the links I just posted for you Mr feeble minded. So not only do his unit members think he did these things but the enemy brags that he did.

          • Brucehenry

            I believe they think he did it.and I believe the enemy is bragging. Maybe he did do it. I don’t know for sure, though, and neither do you.

          • jim_m

            Of course I don’t. I also don’t go around calling our men in uniform liars like you do. (Chico doesn’t count as there is no proof that he ever served)

          • Brucehenry

            “I believe they think he did it.” Is that calling them liars?

          • jim_m

            Attacks got worse after Bergdahl deserted

            When asked if he believed, as his fellow soldiers have said, that attacks on U.S. troops got worse after Bergdahl abandoned his post,
            Gerleve replied, “Yes.”

            “As one of the soldiers have stated, the attacks did get more direct, the IEDs did get more pinpoint to our trucks rather than the side of the roads, and everything like that,” Gerleve added. “I can’t say for sure the leakage was from Bergdahl, but it’s kind of a suspicion that it
            did happen.”

            “Everything that we taught him, I mean, it was coming to — as far as direct attacks and indirect attacks,” he continued.

          • jim_m

            The taliban claimed that Bergdahl trained them in IED and ambush tactics http://dailycaller.com/2014/06/03/taliban-once-claimed-bergdahl-trained-members-of-the-taliban/

            The Taliban once claimed that recently released U.S. Army Sgt. Bowe Bergdahl was teaching terrorists how to build bombs.

            In 2010, a Taliban commander, Haji Nadeem, told The Daily Mail that Bergdahl spent time training members of the Taliban, showing them how to make bombs and conduct surprise attacks.

          • Brucehenry

            Muslims are all liars until you want to believe them, huh?

          • jim_m

            The Pentagon apparently finds them believable. http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2647569/Bowe-Bergdahls-conduct-investigated-U-S-Taliban-claimed-collaborator-changed-Abdullah-taught-bomb-making-skills.html

            I suggest that you just think that he is a hero and that he could never have done anything wrong.

          • Brucehenry

            Made that up out of whole cloth.

          • jim_m

            The link suggests that I did not

          • jim_m

            So what of those links Bruce. You suggested that I was making all of that up and had nothing to back it up. What say you now?

          • Brucehenry

            I’m suggesting your characterization of what I think of Bergdahl is made up, not your links.

            I’m perfectly willing to believe the worst about Bergdahl once the facts are known. It’s early days.

            I didn’t suggest you had nothing, I said you didn’t have enough to support your flat out assertions of treason. Or at least you hadn’t shown them. Your links may be credible but Bergdahl has his side too. That’s what we have trials for, to find out the truth. If every allegation was a conviction we’d be in a hell of a shape.

          • jim_m

            Actually, if you look at our justice system and the conviction rates I would suggest to you that if there is an allegation that leads to a charge there is almost always a conviction.

            And yes, we are in a hell of a shape.

          • jim_m

            Forgive me if I feel that the left will never believe anything derogatory about Bergdahl, just like they cannot accept that Mumia Abu Jamal is a cop killer. Just as they still believe that steel cannot be melted. There is a lot the left believes that simply ain’t so.

          • Brucehenry

            “The left” You’re a kook.

            I JUST SAID I’m willing to believe the worst about Bergdahl if the facts as they develop over the next months bear it out. I don’t know anyone who gives a shit about Mumia, and truthers come from both the left and the right, just like anti-vaxxers and other loonies.

            Your Strawman Left is a worn out joke.

          • Retired military

            Well the ones that are released from Gitmo and then say they are going to return to kill Americans seem pretty truthful to me.

          • Brucehenry

            Of course you are free to repeat unproven allegations, the more serious the better, and to act as if these allegations are Gospel. Others are free to point out that that’s what you are doing. Seems fair.

          • jim_m

            So you think that the rest of his company are a bunch of frauds and liars. I get it.

          • Brucehenry

            Not what I said you can’t-fucking-read tool. I have said they believe what they are alleging. They could be right, but they could be wrong.

          • jim_m

            But I am wrong for repeating their allegations so if I am wrong for repeating them how is it that they are not wrong for making them in the first place?

          • Brucehenry

            You are free to repeat them. They are free to make them. Where you are wrong is in believing every word as Gospel. There are lots of reasons these soldiers would feel betrayed and hurt by Bergdahl. That doesn’t mean they are right that the worsening attacks were because he trained Taliban — that’s conjecture on their part. I’m sure the ones who are saying that believe it — doesn’t make it so.

            Also, too:

            http://www.newrepublic.com/article/118006/bowe-bergdahl-perspective-marine-afghanistan

          • jim_m

            I didn’t ask if I was free to repeat them. It is clear from your comments that you think it is wrong to repeat them. My question above still remains unanswered.

          • Brucehenry

            I think you are wrong when you pretend that these reports are Gospel because they come from Bergdahl’s peers. They are almost surely right that he went AWOL or deserted. They are most likely engaging in conjecture if they are asserting with certainty that attacks worsened because Bergdahl was “training Taliban.” How would they know what he was doing?

            When you assert Bergdahl was collaborating, and base that claim on conjecture, you, in my opinion, are wrong.

            You’re free to be wrong, but still wrong. Can’t you get it? It’s not that hard.

          • jim_m

            It isn’t his peers that say he was training Taliban, it is the Taliban themselves and it is a still classified report that some people are leaking about.

            So I do not base that claim on conjecture, I base it on claims from two separate sources.

          • Brucehenry

            And again you are wrong for taking the word of Taliban as unvarnished truth when you know the Taliban would not hesitate to lie if it suits their purposes — which this would certainly do.

          • jim_m

            Yes, but when what the Taliban says lines up with what we know of Bergdahl and his demented father, there is reason to believe that on this occasion they are telling the truth.

          • Brucehenry

            Yes, there is reason to believe it. There is also reason to doubt it. That’s all I’m saying.

            I guess I’m just not as comfortable acting as judge and jury as you are, Jim.

            You’re free to keep doing it, lol. And I’m free to tell you I think it’s wrong.

          • jim_m

            If I were on a jury I would hold a different standard for weighing the evidence, but since no such demands are being made upon me I feel free to use a simpler standard.

            Were this a GOP scandal you would not be asking for a higher standard of judgement.

          • Brucehenry

            Fine.

          • http://wizbangblog.com/author/rodney-graves/ Rodney G. Graves

            brucehemorrhoid’s opinion and $25.00 will get you a second rate cup of coffee. The coffee would only be $0.25 without the opinion.

          • Retired military

            That is the same thing we have said for years about Bush believing that there were WMD in Iraq. so it wasn’t a lie. Funny how the left still doesn’t seem to go along with that.

          • http://wizbangblog.com/author/rodney-graves/ Rodney G. Graves

            One must wonder why the soi disant cognoscenti veteran is not in this pogue’s face…

          • Retired military

            Unproven allegations.
            Oh you mean like
            Bush was behind the levies going during Katrina
            Bush was behind 911
            Bush leaked Valerie Plame’s name
            Global warming is Bush’s fault
            If we get invaded by aliens it will be Bush’s fault
            Bush lied about WMD
            Bush was holding Osama bin Laden until it was politically expedient to “capture him”

            And the list goes on and on
            You mean like those unfounded allegations Bruce?

          • Brucehenry

            No not like those at all.

            There is a difference between “unproven” and “unfounded” allegations. The allegations of desertion seem to me to be pretty well-founded, but the evidence of “treason” and “collaboration” that Jim here asserts as verified, unvarnished, and unassailable truth not so much.

            I’m not trying to have a partisan fight here about what side is right about what issue. I’m trying to get ol’ Jimbob to see that one shouldn’t accept every allegation as a preordained conviction. It’s not right, and it’s unAmerican.

    • Ken in Camarillo

      In the internet universe you can find almost any example you could postulate. If you really have some truth to your point, you would give us a link to a Republican in Congress who expressed the “trope”.

  • http://wizbangblog.com/author/rodney-graves/ Rodney G. Graves

    Justice for Bergdahl.

    • jim_m

      comes at the end of a rope.

    • jim_m

      comes at the end of a rope.

  • http://wizbangblog.com/author/rodney-graves/ Rodney G. Graves

    Justice for Bergdahl.

  • SteveCrickmore075

    The Israeli government (which can’t be considered soft on terror) trades prisoners with Hamas and Hezbollah all the time. In the most dramatic case, Gilad Shalit, an Army private abducted by Hamas, was traded for 1,027 Palestinian and Arab prisoners, 280 of whom had been serving life sentences for terrorist attacks against Israel.

    • Jwb10001

      And that has exactly what to do with what the US does or doesn’t do? I never realized that you supported the actions of the Israeli government, can I assume you’re ok with the settlements too? I thought not.

  • LiberalNightmare

    Its important that we get the record straight on Bergdahl, or else the asshole could wind up as Secretary of State.

    • Walter_Cronanty

      Hell, he might even run for President.

  • SteveCrickmore075

    I am not incensed about this deal one way or another, but every Commander-in- Chief ´for example since Vietnam ,seems to have reluctantly traded pow’s for something, (and the other side aren’t sending nuns into battle.) Often it seems like a poor trade or one-sided. i.e with the Israelis and Palestianians, but normally it is a way of lessoning tensions or coexistence to an eventual more lasting peace or at least truce … and that may happen with the Taliban in the not so distant future.

    • LiberalNightmare

      What constitutes a truce with the taliban? What if they promise to only attack our embassies if there is a youtube video they dont like?

      You’re a fool if you think coexistence is an option. The kind of fool that the taliban is counting on.

      • SteveCrickmore075

        Your are probably right, just enough coexistence to allow us to get our ass out of Afghanistan. Hey, but it has being going on for over12 years. Don’t conflate the Taliban with Al-queda. I imagine once we leave they won’t have much more use for Al-queda if they ever did. It was a marriage of convenience´.

        • LiberalNightmare

          If the taliban wont have a use for al-queda once we leave, what use did the taliban have for al-queda before we got there?

          You have your cause and effect wrong – the taliban was sheltering al-queda long before all this shit started.

        • Retired military

          But but Afghanistan is the just war. Just look at what Hillary, Bill, Obama, Biden Kerry Gore and all the other talking head libs were saying back when Bush was President.

          • Walter_Cronanty

            Yeah, Obama said this was the good war, the one worth fighting. What a putz.

          • jim_m

            For obama all wars are worth losing and nothing more.

          • Walter_Cronanty

            Only if the US is losing.

        • jim_m

          You are a fool if you believe that the Taliban and al qaeda are fully independent and have no overlaps or congruences. They are born out of the same religious movement. It is like saying that the SS and the Gestapo are completely different and have nothing to do with each other. Or saying that the KGB and NKVD are completely unrelated.

          Your position is one of ignorance.

          • westcoastwiser

            Steve only gets a couple of hours a day when he’s not incarcerated.

          • Retired military

            and medicated.

      • Brucehenry

        Coexistence is the ONLY eventual option unless you’re suggesting genocide.

        • LiberalNightmare

          i believe that it is the taliban that is suggesting genocide.

          • Brucehenry

            And YOU said one would have to be a fool to think coexistence is an option. What is the alternative to coexistence?

          • LiberalNightmare

            Victory.

            If you want to “co-exist”, Im sure that Bowe Bergdahl can give you directions.

          • jim_m

            You then think that we should not have executed the Nazi’s after WWII because to do so would have been genocide.

          • jim_m

            Since the Taliban’s idea of coexistence is that we either convert or die, I would suggest that coexistence is not possible.

            Since the Taliban had demonstrated repeatedly that they will not tolerate anything that they deem to be contrary to their religious beliefs and that they are willing to destroy cultural monuments 100′s if not thousands of years old in pursuit of that objective…

            I would suggest that if they do not renounce this ideology that the only choice we have is to either incarcerate them for the remainder of their lives or to execute them.

            I for one am not willing to bow to their oppressive ideology. You obviously have no problem with doing so.

          • Commander_Chico

            If we didn’t send them Americans to kill, they’d have a hard time finding them in Afghanistan.

            And not too many countries are going to give them visas to go elsewhere.

            Plus, if we stopped bombing wedding parties with drones and killing innocent civilians, they’d have less recruits.

          • jim_m

            Most of the stuff that you complain about is policy that obama has made or expanded upon. Not to mention that 75% of all military deaths in Afghanistan have occurred on his watch. But then you only care about the ones you can blame on Bush. It has never been about the lives of soldiers, it has only ever been about your bullshit gotchas on conservatives.

            Also, they didn’t seem to have any difficulty getting into the US in order to do 9/11. Nor did they have any problem getting plane tickets for additional attacks that were foiled.

          • Commander_Chico

            There were no Afghans on the planes on 9/11. Most of them were Saudis. The Saudis apparently fled to Pakistan after 9/11.

          • Jwb10001

            They found 3000 in NY dumb ass.

          • Commander_Chico

            Again there were no Afghans/Taliban on the planes dumb ass.

          • jim_m

            The Taliban are by definition an internal Afghan force and have never expressed any desire to take that outside of their country. By contrast al qaeda, whom the Taliban shelters and has coordinated with, seeks to take islamist terrorism globally.

            Meanwhile the Taliban declared war on the US in Sept of 2001, declaring Jihad against the United States and telling the people of Afghanistan to prepare for war.

            By your reasoning, we should never have invaded Italy in WWII as 1) we had no fight with them and 2) they had no involvement in Pearl Harbor and 3) while they had declared war against the US, they had no reasonable possibility of threatening the US in any material way.

            By your reasoning our intervention in Italy was illegal and without any reason.

            So I say again, you are claiming that there was no legitimate cause for the US to engage in North Africa or in Italy during WWII. You believe that those nations should have been left alone and that our actions there were illegal.

            Exactly how many Jews would you have personally shoved into the ovens if given the chance?

          • Retired military

            Obama is the drone bombing master as I recall. So are you saying that Obama killed innocent civilians?
            I am sure that any response will be along the lines of “Well Obama is bad but XXXXX was worse”

          • Commander_Chico

            Yes, Obama sucks too.

        • jim_m

          Ridding the world of the Taliban would not be genocide, They are not an ethnic group or a race, they are a political/quasi-religious movement. I suppose you consider Nuremberg an act of genocide.

          • Brucehenry

            I’m not sure LN was only talking about the Taliban. If he was, sure, you’re right. If he was talking about all Muslims or all Afghans, he’s talking genocide.

          • LiberalNightmare

            Of course, if I was talking about muttin, it would be lambicide.

            And it seems odd to me that you are willing to ignore the talibans (and radical islams) stated intention to kill us all in order to score a cheap shot on me.

          • jim_m

            I understood it as the Taliban. There was nothing in his statement that said that he thought we needed to kill all Afghans. (they are pretty dogs anyway, I would hate to see them all killed)

        • westcoastwiser

          That’s BS! Teach them to play Scrabble or 21.

        • http://wizbangblog.com/author/rodney-graves/ Rodney G. Graves

          Islam is not a race.

        • Retired military

          Genocide is exactly what nations like Iran and Syria are talking about when they speak of Israel. They haven’t said the word coexistence yet. Instead they use words like annihilation.

      • westcoastwiser

        What do you think the Taliban would say if they were forced to spend a year on Miami Beach?

      • SteveCrickmore075

        Would that fool be Ronald Reagan

        • Brucehenry

          Good link I predict the commenters here will learn nothing from it

          • Hawk_TX

            Whats I learned from the link is that Reagan could use the Mujaheddin for our purposes. While Obama just gets used by the Taliban.

          • Brucehenry

            And the mujahedin used Reagan, genius. And there were unintended consequences beyond.

          • http://wizbangblog.com/author/rodney-graves/ Rodney G. Graves

            Another of those many things brucehemorrhoid knows…

          • jim_m

            Being used implies that the person being used does not gain anything from the relationship. How is it that Reagan gained nothing from the relationship that the US had with the Mujaheddin in the 1980′s?

          • Brucehenry

            No I don’t think it does imply that. For instance a guy can “use” a woman for sex and she can be “using” him as a sugar daddy.

            It’s always debatable as to who is getting the best of one of these relationships. Back in the 80s it seemed the US was getting a pretty sweet deal but once the mujahidin had what they wanted not so much.

            Also I don’t think you read Steve’s link.

          • jim_m

            But if two people are trying to use each other, each individual is not really being used. Being used implies a relationship that is asymmetrical in its rewards. What you describe is a form of mutualism where both parties are getting what they want. Neither comes away feeling used.

          • Brucehenry

            Semantics. Whatever.

            Read the link.

          • jim_m

            Words mean things. Why should I read anything you suggest if you are telling me that words are meaningless?

          • Brucehenry

            Fine. Don’t read it. Remain ignorant and keep typing words (which mean things lol) about something you know nothing about. And refuse to learn about.

          • jim_m

            For your information I had already looked at that article and it offered nothing that I had not already known about.

            The mistake you and Steve make in your feeble attempt at a gotcha, is that you cannot hold Reagan responsible for what the Mujaheddin would become in the future. Or do you believe that parents should be held responsible for what their children become?

            Of course you criticize Reagan for dealing with islamist organizations that would later become terrorist organizations, and you laud obama for dealing with and supporting terrorist organizations that have been and are committed to continuing to murder Americans and our allies.

          • Brucehenry

            Sure you had.

            It’s funny that when you point out inconsistency it’s because of the blazing hypocrisy but when others do it’s a feeble attempt at a gotcha.

            And also funny coming from the King of Imaginary Gotchas.

            Here’s what sane people know about your sources, Jim:

            http://bobcesca.thedailybanter.com/blog-archives/2014/06/credibility-problem.html

          • jim_m

            I don’t need some leftist bedwetter to tell me that the eclipse group is suspect as a source. I knew that as soon as I read thhe FOX story. I’m sorry that you are so dim witted that you had to have someone tell you.

            Now tell me how suspect the soldiers Bergdahl served with are. Come on Bruce, throw the military under the bus to advance your agenda.

          • Brucehenry

            Ha ha fucking priceless you claim the guy committed treason based on the Eclipse report and now walk it back saying you knew it was suspect immediately. If it is suspect why do you keep claiming he collaborated?

            http://tbo.com/list/military-news/mattis-no-evidence-of-bergdahl-collusion-20140606/

            Here’s a reasoned, non-bedwetting opinion piece that expresses a reasoned, non-bedwetting overview of this matter so far:

            http://www.outsidethebeltway.com/the-right-way-to-view-the-bowe-bergdahl-deal/

            EDIT: Note the links to your boy Krauthammer, noted liberal pussy and America-basher. And David Brooks, famous GOP “intellectual.”

            Read the comments too, genius. And again I dare you to interact with the commentariat there. Your idol and intellectual equal, Jay Tea, is routinely humiliated there. Let’s see if you can do any better.

          • jim_m

            The eclipse report was also where I got the part that he might have had Stockholm Syndrome, so I suppose that you are going to forsake that argument?

            Also, the Eclipse report is not the only source. There is the as yet still classified military investigation that reaches the same conclusions and there are the statements from the Taliban to the same effect. So there are potentially 3 separate sources detailing this. (I say potentially, because I acknowledge that the classified report may cite either the Eclipse report or the Taliban statements or both)

            Plus now we see in the NYT that Bergdahl left a note claiming that he was deserting. I think that puts that particular matter beyond reasonable debate.

            Further it appears tat obama also went against the advice of the military in giving away these 5 Taliban. We gave away significant, high ranking enemy officials and got a deserter and a traitor and it is unclear whether or not obama will allow him to be tried for his desertion, let alone anything else he might have done.

          • Brucehenry

            Another voice of reason. Expect more of them as more facts are known, along with more wild and reckless accusations of the sort you are engaging in.

            http://www.esquire.com/blogs/politics/The_Bergdahl_Chronicles:_Complaint_Department

          • jim_m

            What a load of dishonest tripe! No one has suggested that because he was disillusioned that expressing those feelings was treason. How dishonest does one have to be to claim that?

            When people (or at least I) have claimed that he committed treason it was for actions such as his alleged training of Taliban in ambush tactics and IED construction and deployment.

            When I said he should be hanged, that was completely in line with the UCMJ regarding desertion during time of war (he was in an active combat theater after all).

            Fuck you Bruce. If you can’t be honest about what has been said then just fuck off.

            The article you sight isn’t reasonable, it is just a lie.

          • Brucehenry

            More evidence you can’t fucking read.

          • jim_m

            I read it correctly. It is a bitter resentful anti-American tirade. The author hates the praise lavished on returning soldiers, and is offended that Bergdahl’s hatred of America is criticized. The author goes further to claim that anyone outside the military that thinks Bergdahl is a traitor is automatically a chickenhawk. He further conflates any argument from Bergdah’s actions with an argument stemming solely from criticism of Bergdahl’s words.

            The article is dishonest and anti-American. No wonder you love it.

          • Brucehenry

            Well I’ll leave it to any fair minded reader that may still be following this thread to read the link and your interpretation of it and judge whether you have “read it correctly.”

            Everything you read, everything anyone says to you, you run through this weird reinterpreting machine in your mind to reach the most bizarre, exaggerated, schizoid version of whatever it is you just read or heard. It’s like you’re permanently on acid, dude.

            Seek help. Stay away from the Brown Berkeley, and don’t touch the Windowpane, ya know?

            But no, seriously, seek help. I’m truly concerned. One day we’re gonna see you on CNN having gone round the bend and done something crazy.

          • jim_m

            Fear not. I am not going to join the democrat party.

          • jim_m

            And I do not have to post anywhere that I am not already inclined to do so, and certainly not at your demand.

            As for the linked article, my beliefs are the same as Krauthammer. We should have gotten him back and he should stand trial and he should receive the maximum penalty for desertion during time of war.

            I also believe that we paid too high a price to get him back and it appears that I have the agreement with the Joint Chiefs who advised against the swap (although apparently, the Joint Chiefs did have at least one dissenter in Chico).

          • Brucehenry

            Ha ha no you certainly don’t have to. Let it be known, though, that you declined my dare. And let’s make it a double-dog, nay a triple-dog dare lol.

          • jim_m

            Let it be known that I comment elsewhere that does not use Disqus and I am have none of the problems that you claim I would have.

          • Brucehenry

            I’m sure you comment frequently at batshit sites. What I am daring you to do is engage with liberals on a non-batshit site.

          • jim_m

            By that I take it you mean on a batshit liberal site.

          • Brucehenry

            By that I mean Outside the Beltway, neither liberal (except in the comment section) nor batshit.

            Even the dimwit superdestroyer, who sometimes appears here, is unafraid of the libs at OTB. I don’t understand why a genius like yourself would be unwilling to take on more worthy opponents than I at another site.

            Your reluctance speaks volumes. Why only comment on sites where your opinion is in the overwhelming majority unless you are afraid you will be out-argued?

          • jim_m

            My reluctance speaks to the fact that I don’t frequent the site and I am not the sort of person that goes out in search of a fight. I have been commenting at Wizbang for many years now. If I wanted to go elsewhere I would. I comment at places I frequent.

          • Brucehenry

            Yes and you frequent an echo chamber, which is your right. Forget I mentioned it lol.

          • http://wizbangblog.com/author/rodney-graves/ Rodney G. Graves

            Links from you fall into the TFBCDR category.

          • http://wizbangblog.com/author/rodney-graves/ Rodney G. Graves

            Again with what brucehemorrhoid thinks…

    • jim_m

      Exactly how do you coexist with someone who demands that you convert to their religion or that you deserve to die? Or do you believe that paying the Jizya is a fair accommodation to their religious beliefs? Do you honestly believe that coexistence is something that should be bought on an ongoing basis under threat of being murdered?

      • westcoastwiser

        Remember what your Daddy told you; trust your instincts.

  • http://proof-proofpositive.blogspot.com/ Proof

    The original “swift boaters” came forward in response to the web of fiction that presidential wannabee John Kerry was spinning about his less than illustrious military career. They told the truth about John Kerry.

    If his fellow soldiers are stepping up to tell the truth about Bowe Bergdahl, to correct the lies this administration is spreading about him, why does the Left say that like it’s a bad thing?

    • Walter_Cronanty

      Because they despise the military and everything it stands for. Only deserters are in the Left’s military hall of fame.

      • westcoastwiser

        John Kerry did serve in Vietnam, you know. He did award himself 3 Purple Hearts..

        • jim_m

          He has the hat to this day!

          • westcoastwiser

            His hat is used to collect his shit and nothing more!

          • http://wizbangblog.com/author/rodney-graves/ Rodney G. Graves

            Must be a very large hat…

          • Brucehenry

            Probably a fedora

  • westcoastwiser

    When wild fires are being fought, there is one fire commander to manage the resources, and the investigators start an investigation to determine if it’s arson.

    With the Obama administration, they are all arsonists!

  • Walter_Cronanty

    Jonathan Turley, liberal law professor at George Washington University, said this about Obama, our rogue President: “You know, I’ve said it before, Barack Obama is really the president Richard Nixon always wanted to be. You know, he’s been allowed to act unilaterally in a way that we’ve fought for decades.”

    http://www.realclearpolitics.com/video/2014/06/03/turley_obama_the_president_that_richard_nixon_always_wanted_to_be.html

  • Commander_Chico

    Bergdahl is just another Sad Sack private who got sick of the war, was smart enough to see it was not worth dying for, and decided to walk away from it. It was foolish of him to think he could walk to India, for sure. Privates in the US Army are doing stupid shit every day, this is but one incident of that.

    He should be punished to the extent of not getting an honorable discharge. It seems to me that for many of those calling for his head, it’s just another form of chickenhawkery, since these people have never been exposed to hostile fire and are in no position to judge him.

    • jim_m

      Yeah, you want to give him a medal. What about the allegations that he was teaching the Taliban ambush tactics and IED manufacture? What about the claims that after he deserted that attacks increased in frequency and severity?

      Chickenhawk? At least we aren’t traitors like you and your hero Bergdahl. You bitch and moan about soldiers dying and yet you come back here and say that the Army should go easy on Bergdahl after he lead to the deaths of over a dozen soldiers and possibly many more through his collaboration with the enemy.

      I am in a position to judge whether or not he betrayed his comrades in arms. That is a simple matter of the facts of his actions. His rationale for his actions is immaterial. Apparently you are not in a position to render any ration critique as you are blinded by anti-American hate and ideology.

      • Commander_Chico

        By the measure of causing the needless deaths of soldiers due to poor judgment, Bush and Rumsfeld should be stripped naked and dragged through the Bonneville Salt Flats behind a Formula One car.

        • jim_m

          Drop dead Chico. Your bullshit about caring about the military and their lives has been revealed as pure posing by your support for Bergdahl and you virtually declaring him a hero..

        • Retired military

          As I recall many more soldiers have died in Afghanistan under Obama than Bush. So I guess you are all for stripping Obama naked and dragging him behind a Formula one car. Correct chico?

          • Commander_Chico

            No, he can wear briefs because he didn’t start that war and at least ended Iraq.

          • Retired military

            So Obama was bad but Bush was worse right?

            TYpical Option B Chico Typical option b.

            Lets see what else you have said in the past Chico

            “As I said before, try answering what people say, and not try to put words in others’ mouths, debate goes better” – Chico, Famed Wizbangblog poster

            How about practising what you preach Chico.

            1 Oprah,the Lamestream media, Reid, Pelosi, and other major dems have called people racist simply because they oppose Obama’s
            policies. Yet when they oppose those same policies when espoused by Bill, Hillary. Reid, Pelos, Gore, Kerry, etc etc they weren’t considered racist then by Oprah, etc etc (I don’t know isn’t good enough)
            Do you feel that it is because the left is just playing the race card?

            2. People were called racist anarchist terrorists when they tried to delay Obamacare yet Al Franken who did the same thing wasn’t called Racist. Do you feel that it is because he is a democrat and the people doing the call just playing the race card because that is all they have?

            3. People were called racist anarchist terrorist when they called for the delay of all or part of Obamacare and Obama who is unconstitutionally doing the same thing is not called a racist anarchist terrorist. Do you feel that it is because he is a democrat and the people doing the calling are just playing the race card because that is all they have?

            4. Chico stated ” They (duck dynasty guys) were clean shaven before they pitched the TV show.” yet you provided zero proof of this statement. Please do so now.

            Examples of statements 1, 2, and 3 (since you reject the premise)

            Salon writer Joan Wals
            It’s simply stunning: Longtime Republican imagemaker Ailes figured out how to make sure that our twice-elected Democratic president, backed by a coalition that represents an emerging, multiracial America, must periodically be checked and hopefully shamed by a representative of the angry right-wing white male minority that barely considers him a legitimate leader…

            O’Reilly and Ailes and their viewers see this president as unqualified and ungrateful, an affirmative action baby who won’t thank us for all we’ve done for him and his cohort. The question was, of course, deeply condescending and borderline racist. Obama has been afforded “so much opportunity”? What about O’Reilly, who pretends he’s a working-class son of Levittown, Long Island, when he’s actually the kid of an accountant who grew up in Westbury and went to private high school and university

            ]——-
            Wall Street Journal’s Steve Moore: “This is still a pretty conservative country and people are upset about the policies in Washington and they don’t think the politicians are listening.”
            Host Chris Matthews: “Okay, I think, I think some of the people are upset because we have a black President.”
            Talking about the town hall protests against ObamaCare on MSNBC’s Hardball, August 11, 2009.

            If racism is not the whole of the Tea Party, it is in its heart, along with blind hatred, a total disinterest in the welfare of others, and a full-flowered, self-rationalizing refusal to accept the outcomes of elections, or the reality of democracy, or the narrowness of their minds and the equal narrowness of their public support.”
            — MSNBC’s Keith Olbermann on Countdown, March 22, 2010.

            “The Republican Party in this country has been running on hate and division for the last 50 years….What black person, gay guy or girl, immigrant or Muslim American in their right mind would vote for the Republican Party? They might as well hang a sign around their neck saying, ‘I hate myself.’”
            — Fill-in host Cenk Uygur on MSNBC’s The Ed Show, August 26, 2010

            Clip from RNC ad: “Stop Obama and his union bosses today. The Republican National Committee is responsible for the content of this advertising.”
            Host Lawrence O’Donnell: “The Republican Party is saying that the President of the United States has bosses, that the union bosses this President around, the unions boss him around. Does that sound to you like they are trying to consciously or subconsciously deliver the racist message that, of course, of course a black man can’t be the real boss?”
            Ex-Governor Jennifer Granholm (D-MI): “Wow, I hadn’t thought about the racial overtones….”
            — MSNBC’s The Last Word, February 25, 2011.

            “The interesting question is: what is it about this President that has stripped away the veneer of respect that normally accompanies the office of the President? Why do Republicans think this President is unpresidential — unpresidential, and shouldn’t dare to request this kind of thing? It strikes me that it could be the economic times, it could be that he won so big in 2008, or it could be, let’s face it, the color of his skin.”
            — MSNBC political analyst and ex-Newsweek reporter Richard Wolffe talking about the brief contretemps over scheduling Obama’s speech to Congress, The Last Word, August 31, 2011.

            “I get out of all of these things that many of these [Republican] candidates would rather take legislation to build a time machine and go back in time to where we had, you know, no women voting, slavery was cool. I mean, it’s just kind of ridiculous.”
            — Daytime anchor Thomas Roberts on MSNBC Live, September 23, 2011, talking about the previous night’s GOP debate.

            “Plus, what Mitt Romney has in common with the KKK. Details on a rare Romney campaign blunder ahead….So you might not hear Mitt Romney say ‘keep America American’ anymore. That’s because it was a central theme of the KKK in the 1920s. It was a rallying cry for the group’s campaign of violence and intimidation against blacks, gays and Jews.”
            — Anchor Thomas Roberts on MSNBC Live, December 14, 2011.

            Host Chris Matthews: “How does this guy [Mitt Romney] go from hard right, severely conservative, to this new regular mainstream character he’s portraying himself as?…He ran as a full mooner, Michael. You know, he was saying ‘There’s no such thing as science.’… How can he go from Flat Earth, ‘I don’t believe in evolution,’ to all of a sudden, ‘I’m teaching biology’?… It certainly was in the Grand Wizard crowd over there, okay?”
            Former RNC Chairman Michael Steele: “Wait, I resent that! No. Come on, what is this ‘Grand Wizard’ nonsense? Are you saying that we’re Ku Klux Klan?”
            Matthews: “Okay, I’m just saying, the far-right party.”
            Steele: “Give me a break! Don’t go there with me on that.”
            — MSNBC’s Hardball, April 23, 2012.

            You notice he [Romney] says ‘anger’ twice. He’s really trying to use racial coding and access some really deep stereotypes about the angry black man. This is part of the playbook against Obama. The other-ization, he’s not like us. I know it’s a heavy thing to say. I don’t say it lightly. But this is niggerization, ‘You are not one of us,’ and that ‘you are like the scary black man who we’ve been trained to fear.’”
            — Co-host Touré on MSNBC’s The Cycle, August 16, 2012.

            Host Martin Bashir: “Of Senate Minority Leader Mitch McConnell’s forthcoming oration, can I quote something [to] you? ‘For four years, Barack Obama has been running from the nation’s problems. He hasn’t been working to earn re-election. He’s been working to earn a spot on the PGA tour.’ How about that?”
            MSNBC’s Lawrence O’Donnell: “Well, we know exactly what he’s trying to do there….These people reach for every single possible racial double-entendre they can possibly find in every one of these speeches.”
            — MSNBC’s Martin Bashir, August 29, 2012, talking about McConnell’s speech at the Republican National Convention.

            They hate Obama. They want him out of the White House more than they want to destroy al Qaeda. Their number one enemy in the world right now, on the right, is their hatred — hatred for Obama. We can go into that about the white working class in the South, and looking at these numbers we’re getting in the last couple days about racial hatred in many cases. This isn’t about being a better president. They want to get rid of this president. That’s their number one goal and they’re willing to let Romney go to the hard center, even if it’s to the left on issues, as long as they get rid of this guy.”
            — Chris Matthews during MSNBC’s post-debate coverage, October 22, 2012

            “I look at Obama as a perfect American. I don’t mean politically. We can disagree left and right on him. You can argue about the drones. Argue about the fiscal policy, all that stuff. But as a citizen. The guy went to school, he never broke a law. He did everything right. He raised a wonderful family. He’s a good husband, a good father. My God I don’t think he’s ever gotten a speeding ticket. The guy does everything right and these right-wingers — and he’s really been pretty moderate on guns until the horror of Newtown — and I don’t know what they’re so afraid of, except that he happens to be black.”
            — Host Chris Matthews on MSNBC’s Hardball, March 6, 2013

            What does your study tell you about the nature of the racial piece here of the Tea Party?…Is it sort of a resumption of the Old South, of the way things were before the Civil War, for example? Is it like that old dreamy nostalgia you get in the old movies, Gone With the Wind? Is it that kind of America they want to bring back or what? When there were no gays, where blacks were slaves, Mexicans were in Mexico? I mean, is this what they want?”
            — Chris Matthews to author Christopher Parker on MSNBC’s Hardball, March 20, 2013

            The problem is there are people in this country — maybe 10 percent, I don’t know what the number, maybe 20 percent on a bad day — who want this President to have an asterisk next to his name in the history books, that he really wasn’t President….They can’t stand the idea that he is President, and a piece of it is racism. Not that somebody in one racial group doesn’t like somebody in another racial group. So what? It is the sense that the white race must rule. That’s what racism is. And they can’t stand the idea that a man who is not white is President.”
            — Chris Matthews appearing as a guest on MSNBC’s PoliticsNation, May 15, 2013

            “The IRS is being used in exactly the same way as they tried to use the President’s birth certificate…Despite the complete lack of any evidence linking the President to the targeting of Tea Party groups, Republicans are using it as their latest weapon in the war against the black man in the White House….This afternoon, we welcome the latest phrase in the lexicon of Republican attacks on this President — the IRS. Three letters that sound so innocent, but we know what you mean.”
            — MSNBC host Martin Bashir, June 5, 2013.

            ¦ “At least back in 1939, when Marian Anderson had to sing here, ‘My Country ‘Tis of Thee’ rather than at the Constitution Hall, because — they said the reason was she was black. At least they were honest back then….[Today] you’ve got people talking about nullification of the law of the land [ObamaCare]. You got people talking impeachment like [Senator Tom] Coburn. You got Ted Cruz out there. They never say their problem with Obama is that he’s black, but look at the pattern….At least the Daughters of the American Revolution knew what they were saying and they said it out loud: ‘He’s black, she’s black, she can’t sing here.’ These guys today use all the techniques of nullification and talking about illegitimacy and accusing the President of being a crook, basically, for even being president, because he’s here illegally. And then they talk about impeaching him on grounds they can’t even come up with. At least in the old days they were honest about it. Today, they’re not.”
            — Chris Matthews during MSNBC live coverage of the 50th anniversary of the March on Washington, August 28, 2013.

            ¦ “I want to talk today about a controversial word….A word that was originally intended as a derogatory term, meant to shame and divide and demean. The word was conceived of by a group of wealthy white men who needed a way to put themselves above and apart from a black man, to render him inferior and unequal and to diminish his accomplishments…. Y’all know the word that I’m talking about: ‘ObamaCare.’”
            — Host Melissa Harris-Perry on her MSNBC show, December 8, 2013.

            Host Ed Schultz compared Tea Party activists to Nazi brownshirts and said that the Republican Party stands for racism; and accused Texas Gov. Rick Perry of referring to Obama in racial terms when he described the national debt as a “big black cloud” hanging over the heads of the American people.

            Reporter Lawrence O’Donnell accused Republican U.S. Sen. Mitch McConnell of using a “racial double-entendre” when McConnell complained that Obama spends too much time golfing;

            Daytime anchor Thomas Roberts famously claimed that Republicans want to go back to a time when “slavery was cool;”

            Contributing analyst Toure – so self-important that he goes by only one name – accused Romney of participating in the “niggerization” of Obama;

            PRESS: I just think the whole thing is outrageous. I hate this apology, I think it was unnecessary and just, just played right into their hands. And, I mean, they won’t (laughs), they’re not going to let conservatives watch MSNBC, fine! You’re not even going to notice that. How many conservatives, seriously, are watching Ed Schultz or Rachel Maddow, you know, or Al Sharpton every night?

            JEREMY HOLDEN OF MEDIA MATTERS: Yeah, yeah, I don’t know, but, uh, I’m just …

            PRESS: It’s silly.

            HOLDEN: I want to see how this probation looks and when it ends. (Alluding to RNC chair Reince Priebus’s response to Cheerios ad tweet). And what, you know, is there going to be a soft landing from the probation? This is kind of silly at this point.

            PRESS: It is and, you know, first of all, good for Cheerios for bringing that spot back and not bowing into the pressure and as far as this tweet goes, again, “maybe the rightwing will hate it, but everybody else will go awww: the adorable new #Cheerios ad w/ biracial family,” that’s the truth. That is the truth! The right winger, the racist right winger will hate it. Everybody else will like it. It’s a beautiful spot.

            —————————–

            Hunter – Daily Kos
            MSNBC bending over themselves to apologize for someone in the network thinking the American right wing was made up of people who pore over the nation’s television commercials to find companies acting Not Bigoted Enough is, and there’s no other word for it, pathetic. As are, of course, the predictable reactions from the right wing themselves. You would think that people who get so very, very, very mad whenever someone suggests that they might be bigoted simpletons would be able to go at least one weekend without proving to be exactly that, but no. Never quite works out that way.

            ————
            Ron Fournier – Twitter

            The GOP argument on Obamacare has more than a whiff of Reagan-era racial “welfare queen” politics —>

            ————

            Ron Fournier – Twitter
            In light of today’s #Obamacare column, a little background: “How and Why Romney is Playing the Race Card.”

            —————-
            “There are certain elements of the party who go out of their way to demonize people who don’t look like the way they’d like them to look like or came from some other place,” Powell said. “I think
            the party has to deal with this.”

            ———–
            Markos MoulitsaS

            …[T]he GOP has a problem. It can’t win national elections without getting some support from immigrant demographics—Asians and Latinos, the fastest growing in the country. Yet conservatives hate brown and different-looking people. They speak foreign languages and eat weird stuff and play strange music and vote Democratic. Those are all unforgivable sins.

            ————–

            GERALDO
            “What we had here with you and President Obama was a culture class… It was the president of most of the white guys of America, that’s you. And, Barack Obama the president of almost everybody else. And the discussion was at that level… To watch it was some ways unsettling to me… What you did was strip him of his majesty…”

            ———
            ——————
            From An examiner story about congressman Cummings

            In fact, the authors of the very report cited by Cummings, Devin Burghart and Leonard Zeskind also “exposed” alleged links between “certain Tea Party factions and acknowledged racist hate groups,” for the NAACP in 2010, as reported by Jack Cashill at the American Thinker, who writes wryly that Zeskind “could find racists in each of the nine choirs of angels and feel comfortable designating at least three of those choirs as hate groups.”

            At the time, Burghart and Zeskind wrote in part that Tea Party members were


            “defending their special pale-skinned privileges and power.”

            ——————-

            HOWARD FINEMAN (on MSNBC): And as if that’s some kind of explanation, some kind of explanation for the weird phenomenon of the fact that the Republicans didn’t win. There was this extraterrestrial force out there of African-Americans and Hispanics.

            =========
            CHarlie Crist – ““Sadly I think another part of it was that he was a Democrat, but not just a Democrat, an African-American.””

            ———–
            MSNBC interview regarding rejection of union.

            WAGNER: – nails this a little bit. And he talks about the UAW has, or the idea of organized labor and finds, y’know, great welcome in NYU and in bastions of sort of liberal, progressive thought. But then when it comes down to it, here you have workers on an assembly line in Chattanooga, Tennessee, who have turned down the option. And he makes a point that, “As many unions have discovered, generally to their woe, the politics of race and culture often eclipse those of class in the United States.” [1]

            NOAH: Right.

            WAGNER: And these sort of cultural means around unions, um, distracted from the actual economic benefits of them. [2]

            NOAH: The South has always been hostile territory for union organizing. Y’know, as Harold said, the culture war in the South trumps the class war. [1] You already have in a number of Southern states right to work laws, which means that even if they had unionized the plants, those who benefitted from the presence of that union wouldn’t have had to pay union dues if they didn’t feel like it.

            So you’re in an overwhelmingly hostile climate. And the opposition I gather, through, portrayed this as a kind of northern invasion, a refighting of the Civil War. [3] Apparently there are not a lot of, uh, black employees in this particular plant. [4] And so, that kind of, uh, uh, uh, waving of the Confederate flag was an effective strategy. [5]

            WAGNER: That would explain also the sign, “United Obama Workers,” which speaks volumes [6] in terms of the, uh, cultural differences in certain parxts of the country. Author Timothy Noah, thank you as always for your time and thoughts.
            —————-

            In May 2010, he told guests at a private White House dinner that race was probably a key component in the rising opposition to his presidency from conservatives, especially right-wing activists in the anti-incumbent “Tea Party” movement that was then surging across the country. Many middle-class and working-class whites felt aggrieved and resentful that the federal government was helping other groups, including bankers, automakers, irresponsible people who had defaulted

            Harry reid – ““We’re not going to bow to tea party anarchists who deny
            the mere fact that Obamacare is the law. We will not bow to tea party anarchists who
            refuse to accept that the Supreme Court ruled that Obamacare is constitutional,”

            ============
            Former Wash Post Editor Robert Kaiser
            “The base consists principally of white evangelical Christians who, the pollsters tell us, fear that their America is disappearing. Of course they are right; it has probably disappeared already. Their America would not have elected a black president.

            ————
            From Wash times regarding Obama appointee

            A furious Mr. Reid hinted that Republicans’ opposition was based on racism, pointing to to several other black nominees that GOP senators had opposed earlier. But in the case of Mr. Adegbile, his defense of Abu-Jamal was too much for even some Democrats

            ===========

            Andrew O’Hehir Salon.com

            When you think of the face of white rage in America, it belongs to a red-faced Irish dude on Fox News.
            ===========

            Paul krugman NY Times

            Indeed, race is the Rosetta Stone that makes sense of many otherwise incomprehensible aspects of U.S. politics.

            We are told, for example, that conservatives are against big government and high spending. Yet even as Republican governors and state legislatures block the expansion of Medicaid, the G.O.P. angrily denounces modest cost-saving measures for Medicare. How can this contradiction be explained? Well, what do many Medicaid recipients look like – and I’m talking about the color of their skin, not the content of their character – and how does that compare with the typical Medicare beneficiary? Mystery solved.

            One odd consequence of our still-racialized politics is that conservatives are still, in effect, mobilizing against the bums on welfare even though both the bums and the welfare are long gone or never existed. Mr. Santelli’s fury was directed against mortgage relief that never actually happened. Right-wingers rage against tales of food stamp abuse that almost always turn out to be false or at least greatly exaggerated. And Mr. Ryan’s black-men-don’t-want-to-work theory of poverty is decades out of date.
            ======
            Huffington post 8 apr 2014
            There has been a long-simmering controversy about whether supporters of the Tea Party are more racially prejudiced than the average American, with some solid public opinion evidence suggesting that they are. However, well beyond the Tea Party hard core, there is evidence that race does play a role.

            Is the problem of relentless partisan animus in the Obama era one of lingering racism?
            ==========
            Candy Crowley: Do you think your Republican colleagues are racist?

            DCCC Chairl Steve Israel: Not all of them, no. Of course not. But to a significant extent, the Republican base does have elements that are animated by racism.

            ===================
            Pelosi : Racist GOP won’t deal with immigration.
            ===================
            WAPO article entitled “Democrats are talking about race and the Republican Party an awful lot lately. Is it a smart midterm strategy?”
            ======
            The New Republic – The Right’s Racial Blinders What really explains the politics of the Obama era
            =====
            Dana Milbank – “Let’s compare Holder to Kathleen Sebelius, who has presided over Obamacare, which is the thing that has most antagonized the Right and the Republicans over all these years. You’re not seeing calls for her impeachment, you’re not seeing the same level of personal vitriol.
            I think, that’s why, again, it’s fair to ask the question, and let every individual say why it is that they have that particular antipathy toward this attorney general, toward this president, and why not, say, toward Kathleen Sebelius, who they’re obviously much more at odds with.”

            ——-
            Salon: ABC News ‘Bending Over Backwards’ to Offer Laura Ingraham a Platform for ‘Vile Racism’
            ==========
            WAPO article

            “Baseball great Hank Aaron is catching hell for telling the truth. Actually, the Hall of Famer is catching hell from racists because he had the temerity to point out that racism still exists. Those who think otherwise are delusional and willfully ignorant of the racial state of play in the United States.

            Aaron’s alleged offense occurred in a USA Today interview with sports reporter Bob Nightengale. Aaron explained why he still has the racist hate mail he received as he closed in on breaking Babe Ruth’s all-time home run record 40 years ago last week.”
            ========
            Hank Aaron

            “Sure, this country has a black president, but when you look at a black president, President Obama is left with his foot stuck in the mud from all of the Republicans with the way he’s treated. We have moved in the right direction, and there have been improvements, but we still have a long ways to go. The bigger difference is back then they had hoods. Now they have neckties and starched shirts.””
            =========

            Yahoo news article by Matt Bai
            So now it’s out there. After five years of studied reticence (unless they were talking privately to one another or their supporters), Democratic leaders in Washington finally went public last week with what they really think is motivating Republican opposition to Barack Obama. As Steve Israel, one of the top Democrats in Congress, told CNN’s Candy Crowley, the Republican base, “to a significant extent,” is “animated by racism.”
            =========
            Leonard Pitts – Indy Star

            Race plays part in how Holder, Obama are treated

          • Retired military

            Part 2 since proof of Dems calling republicans racist have outstripped the capacity of a DISCUS reply.

            ==========
            Frank James NPR “Social scientists who have studied voters have found that voter participation rises when voters are emotionally engaged,” he noted. “For some voters, suggestions that some of the opposition to Obama and his policies is more than just honest disagreement – and is indeed racially based – could help do the trick.”
            ===
            Pelosi tweet – Over 50% of food stamp recipients are people of color. The GOP Budget takes food out their mouths
            =========

            Brent Terry, professor at Eastern Connecticut “If racist republicans win than colleges will start closing up”
            =========
            Jonathon Chait “”America’s unique brand of ideological anti-statism is historically inseparable…from the legacy of slavery,”
            —————-

            WAPO columnist Jonathan Capehart “republicans extolled the wonders and the virtues and the beauty of slavery,”
            ==================

            Dem Ill Gov Quinn “Black republicans are like Jews (who) collaborated with the Nazis during World War II, helping them to round up their own people in the hopes they’d be the last to go.”
            ===
            Ed Schultz MSNBC

            “So the president goes to the other side of the world and that’s what he gets asked about, racism. How sad is that? But you know what? When you’re the first, you always get picked on. And I have to tell you that this president, I think, is very bold, very strong, very well guided, and has a moral compass. And there’s absolutely no question about it that he has been picked on because of the color of his skin. And there’s no doubt that he has been called many names by conservative talkers in America, many names. He has been targeted, he has been obstructed. And I think that the way this president has been treated empowers jokers like this (alluding to Sterling), like, well, the government does it, we all see it. I guess we can say whatever the hell we want and act however we want. That’s my take on it. I, I, I think that this is a scab that’s been ripped off again and it’s a scab that really, undoubtedly is gonna happen again and again on America. But I believe, I pin this attitude that we have in society being inflamed by right-wing talkers who hate this president, that embolden people such as this guy to go on and act disrespectful against society.”
            ==========
            Dorian Warren, Columbia professor “There’s a distinction we should make between racist words and speech, and racist practices and policies. We should be focused on the policies and the racial impact of policies that those Republican leaders frankly stand for,”

            ———–
            MSNBC’s Touré “Some of these folks who own these NBA teams, and this is breaking news, Ari. Some of them are not the most savory folks. Some of them are bankrolling anti-gay marriage initiatives. Some of them got rich off of fracking. Some of them are Russian oligarchs.”

            =============
            Dem Rep. Bennie Thompson “Let’s face it, pretty much all criticism of Obama is racist”
            =========
            Eugene Robinson WAPO ” This worldview has found a home in the tea party movement, which harbors — let’s be honest — a racist strain.”

            ==========
            Democratic Congressman Bennie Thompson ” Justice Thomas is an Uncle Tom” “Sen. McConnell is a racist”
            =========
            “Voting Rights Erosion Is Greater Racist Outrage” Albert Hunt Bloomber

            ========
            New York magazine Jonathan Chait, “America’s unique brand of ideological anti-statism is historically inseparable…from the legacy of slavery.”
            ——–
            Theatlantic.com

            Dem Rep Bennie Thompson told a radio show. “That Mitch McConnell would have the audacity to tell the president of the United States … that ‘I don’t care what you come up with we’re going to be against it.’ Now if that’s not a racist statement I don’t know what is.”

            For good measure, Thompson added that Clarence Thomas “doesn’t like black people, he doesn’t like being black.”

            ———-

            “I think not raising the minimum wage is a racist policy,” stated Ed Schultz

            ======

            Charlie Crist “Crist: Race Motivates GOP Opposition to Obama”
            =======

            Speaker at Democrat sponsored White Privilege Conference
            “The longer you are in the Tea Party, the more racist you become.”

            ==============-

            New York Times columnist Bob Herbert “Republicans are hostile to the interests of African-Americans” a
            ============

            Ta-Nehisi Coates, “Racism–and sexism and homophobia–are about organizing power, not merely disliking the cut of one’s jib. And if Hillary Clinton becomes president, she will have to cope with being perceived as a woman representing the interests of black people and women of all ethnicities. Sexism will never be off the stage. Nor will racism.”
            the Atlantic

            =========
            NPR :
            For some Democrats, the explanation is simple: race. In recent weeks, West Virginia Sen. Jay Rockefeller, Mississippi Rep. Bennie Thompson and former Florida Gov. Charlie Crist have all said racism is the driving force behind Republican resistance to the president.

            Republicans, unsurprisingly, say their disdain for Obama is based not on the color of his skin, but on the content of his policies.

            “If any white Democrat had pushed through a billion-dollar stimulus plan and a takeover of the health care industry, he would have been equally detested by conservatives and Republicans,” says Whit Ayres, a GOP pollster and consultant.

            There’s no question we’re living in a time of divisive politics, when roughly half the country is likely to hate the president, no matter whom he or she might be.

            But race has been a factor in American politics since the very beginning. It’s certainly part of the mix in terms of responses to Obama.

            His status as the nation’s first African-American president exacerbates the concerns of those who feel the country is changing rapidly in ways that are not always comfortable.
            _____________

            Josh Marshall – “For years, we’ve had a running conversation about how much or whether the often vitriolic, seemingly gut level opposition to President Obama as opposed to simple partisanship, opposition to policies and more. It’s a tangled question since supporters and opponents each bring preconceptions and commitments to it. And it’s a question that is inherently over-determined since the same people who might bear a racial animus toward the President probably also oppose him intensely purely on policy grounds.
            … To whatever extent opposition to President Obama is racial, it’s not only because he’s black himself, it’s because he’s the leader of the party that is the institutional representative of black people. Indeed, in a way that wasn’t nearly so clear 22 years ago, the Democratic Party now disproportionately represents African-Americans, Hispanics, East Asians and South Asians. It’s the most visible force in American political life that stands for an America that looks a lot more like the current Democratic Party than the current Republican Party
            ————-
            Krystal Ball

            “And a necessary part of this delusion is the belief that young people, city dwellers and minorities aren’t part of real America so they don’t count or at least they shouldn’t count. Which is where disenfranchising voting laws come in. Unfortunately for conservatives, our votes still count the same as everyone else.”
            ========
            Chris Matthews on GA senate race “the GOP primary will likely head to a runoff and “the reason they have these runoffs is to make sure no black guy ever won a nomination down there.””
            ==========
            “I think it’s very important to take a long view at what’s going on,” Rockefeller said. “I’ll be able to dig up some emails that make part of the Affordable Care Act that doesn’t look good-especially from people who made up their mind that they don’t want it to work because they don’t like the president. Maybe he’s of the wrong color, something of that sort. I’ve seen a lot of that and I know a lot of that to be true.

            =======

            Rep CLyburn (dem representative) Benghazi Committee to Racist Democrats During Reconstruction Benghazi Committee to Racist Democrats During Reconstruction – “Bhenghazi committee is like racists during reconstruction”

            ===========
            LA Weekly cover cartoon shows Tea Party republican as a Klansman.

            Editor-in-chief Sarah Fenske explained the L.A. Weekly’s cover art to Breitbart News on Sunday.

            “The goal with any cover is to get people to pick up the paper and read the journalism within. They’re not a literal illustration of the story inside (otherwise you might have seen a very dull caricature of Kashkari and an equally bland one of Donnelly),” she said.

            Fenske allows that the goal of the cover was to mock the GOP: “Our creative director, Darrick Rainey, worked with the illustrator to incorporate some funny images of constituencies who might want to shape the future of a party that’s fallen on very hard times in California: fat-cat bankers, Minutemen, Tea Party activists, etc.”

            She told Breitbart News that the choice of a KKK figure was inspired by a claim by David Duke in 2011 that Tea Party activists had urged him to run for president. “David Duke claimed some activists urged him to run for president in 2012; it’s not inconceivable his ilk might want to be among them.”

            She provided no actual proof of Tea Party support for the KKK–an organization closely connected, historically, with the Democratic Party.

            ==============

          • Commander_Chico

            Yes, Obama is bad but Bush was far worse. A flaming fuck-up.

        • http://wizbangblog.com/author/rodney-graves/ Rodney G. Graves

          If I actually believed you were a veteran you would be a stain on the honor of the Armed Forces.

    • Jwb10001

      By your logic you can’t comment on the oligarchy having never been a member.

    • jim_m

      I think it is telling that you can justify this guy’s desertion and causing the deaths of his fellow soldiers. If anything spoke to the fact that you never served it is that you cannot feel the sense of betrayal that his comrades feel. You justify his actions and you discount theirs. You ignore their deaths as though they were nothing compared to the emotional distress of this coward and traitor.

    • Retired military

      As I seem to be seeing his fellow soldiers who served with him are his harshest critics. I haven’t seen one news report of a soldier who served with him sticking up for him and I am sure that the Obama team would be touting that person to high heaven if they existed.
      Also if the allegations are true then he deserted during a time of war. Which is a very grave offense.

    • SteveCrickmore075

      The chickenhawks are coming out of the woodwork now. This Rolling Stone article written two years ago, paints a good picture of what Bergdahl was personally going through in his company.

      • Retired military

        Yes these are the same soldiers suffering from PTSD by the thousands. They don’t care about running over kids right Steve. Why don’t you just call them baby killers Steve, spit on them at the airports, and join the John Kerry fan club too.
        Bruce isn’t it great that you say that we have to take what Bergdahl’s fellow soldiers say with a grain of salt but Steve here quotes verbatim from a Rolling stone magazine as if this is exactly what happened.

  • Par4Course

    Swiftboating means that service members with whom a man served step up and tell the truth about his military service. That’s what happened to John Kerry and what’s now happened to Bowe Bergdahl.

    What’s it called when someone lies about your service? Perhaps that should be called “Susan Ricing.”

    • jim_m

      She was just “Kerrying” the narrative.

    • westcoastwiser

      Lies about his service? Try Senator Richard Blumenthal (D) CT!

  • Walter_Cronanty

    Well, the Swiftboating meme wasn’t working, so now they’re floating the idea that Bergdahl’s unit was full of psychopaths: “Brandon Friedman, the deputy assistant secretary of public affairs at the Department of Housing and Urban Development, floated the possibility that Bergdahl’s squadmates are “smear[ing] him publicly” because he “grew disillusioned with what he saw, didn’t trust his leadership, and walked off.”

    “What if his platoon was long on psychopaths and short on leadership?” Friedman asked in the first of five tweets on the issue on Wednesday evening.”

    http://freebeacon.com/wp-/2014/06/obamaofficial_brandonfriedmantweets.jpg

    • jim_m

      Of course his unit was full of psychopaths. By the left’s definition anyone who believes in the US and supports our nation must be mentally ill. The fact that they all didn’t join forces with the Taliban is evidence of their mental illness.

      • westcoastwiser

        Funny how so many in the Obama administration have that same psychopathic condition, isn’t it? It’s like they’ve all joined the Taliban.

  • Walter_Cronanty

    Gosh, who could have seen this coming? “Taliban Commander: More Kidnappings to Come After Bergdahl Deal.”

    “A Taliban commander close to the negotiations over the release of U.S. Army Sgt. Bowe Bergdahl told TIME Thursday that the deal made to secure Bergdahl’s release has made it more appealing for fighters to capture American soldiers and other high-value targets.”

    http://time.com/2826442/taliban-kidnappings-bergdahl/

    • jim_m

      In related news obama told the nation to fuck off if we don’t like caving to terrorists to aid a traitor:

      Obama: “I make absolutely no apologies” for Bergdahl prisoner exchange
      .

      The 14 dead due to Bergdahl and obama were somebody’s children, husbands and fathers too you SOB.

      • westcoastwiser

        If only his mother was alive to apologize for creating this miscreant!

  • Walter_Cronanty

    Here’s someone else in the most awesome, brilliant, educated, sophisticated administration evah who will learn about it when he reads about it newspaper [or in this case Time]: “Lt. Col. Todd Breasseale, a Pentagon spokesman, said Thursday… he’s “totally unaware” of any intelligence analysis that concluded the Bergdahl Taliban swap would cause “a raised threat” to other U.S. personnel.”
    http://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2014/06/05/bergdahl-release-other-detainees/10014133/

  • westcoastwiser

    I’m waiting for Obama to grant them the Medal of Freedom!