HomeTerrorismNow it’s Brussels Now it’s Brussels Rick March 22, 2016 Terrorism 154 Comments Aftermath video is simply chilling: What should be done? What can be done? Anger is no longer enough. Father, grant the West wisdom. Amen. Crossposted at Brutally Honest. Wizbang Weekend Caption Contest™ Weekend Caption Contest™ Winners March 18, 2016 Share this:FacebookTwitterRedditEmailMoreLinkedInPinterestPrintTumblrPocketGoogle Related Posts Massive Protests In Iran May Be Harbinger Of Regime Change President John Quincy Adams: Koran is Filled With Hate Oklahoma Beheading Shows Authorities Are Putting Us In Danger About The Author Rick I blog more regularly at my own place where plain thoughts are delivered roughly. My about page gives you more on who I am. Hank_M Let’s start a hashtag campaign and pass a carbon tax. JLawson It’s the only way to be sure! Or… wait. Wasn’t that ‘Nuke them from orbit’? Walter_Cronanty Never fear, Brussels – John Kerry and James Taylor are on their way! Rick Obama in early December: Well, here’s what I want you to know: The threat from terrorism is real, but we will overcome it. We will destroy ISIL and any other organization that tries to harm us. Our success won’t depend on tough talk, or abandoning our values, or giving into fear. That’s what groups like ISIL are hoping for. Instead, we will prevail by being strong and smart, resilient and relentless, and by drawing upon every aspect of American power. Here’s how. First, our military will continue to hunt down terrorist plotters in any country where it is necessary. In Iraq and Syria, airstrikes are taking out ISIL leaders, heavy weapons, oil tankers, infrastructure. And since the attacks in Paris, our closest allies — including France, Germany, and the United Kingdom — have ramped up their contributions to our military campaign, which will help us accelerate our effort to destroy ISIL. Second, we will continue to provide training and equipment to tens of thousands of Iraqi and Syrian forces fighting ISIL on the ground so that we take away their safe havens. In both countries, we’re deploying Special Operations Forces who can accelerate that offensive. We’ve stepped up this effort since the attacks in Paris, and we’ll continue to invest more in approaches that are working on the ground. Third, we’re working with friends and allies to stop ISIL’s operations — to disrupt plots, cut off their financing, and prevent them from recruiting more fighters. Since the attacks in Paris, we’ve surged intelligence-sharing with our European allies. We’re working with Turkey to seal its border with Syria. And we are cooperating with Muslim-majority countries — and with our Muslim communities here at home — to counter the vicious ideology that ISIL promotes online. Fourth, with American leadership, the international community has begun to establish a process — and timeline — to pursue ceasefires and a political resolution to the Syrian war. Doing so will allow the Syrian people and every country, including our allies, but also countries like Russia, to focus on the common goal of destroying ISIL — a group that threatens us all. This is our strategy to destroy ISIL. It is designed and supported by our military commanders and counterterrorism experts, together with 65 countries that have joined an American-led coalition. And we constantly examine our strategy to determine when additional steps are needed to get the job done. How’s that strategy working out for us Mr. President? Brucehenry Let’s hear yours. Rick 1) I’m in agreement with the his first… how about a serious quantifiable progress report with details… from commanders on scene and not Obama. 2) Again, a progress report, from those involved in making decisions and not Obama who has zip, zero, nada credibility on any of this. 3) How about recruiting those friends and allies to have their commanders who are involved also give a progress report on their efforts? 4) What is that process? What is that timeline? What milestones have we hit? Where are we short? Again I ask, how has his strategy been going. The American people, and the world, should have details. Lots of them. But none will be forthcoming because his strategy is but a lie. Someone wrote this garbage and he read it from his teleprompter but there is no serious substance to any of it. It’s a disgusting display of leaderlessness. Brucehenry Actually, no, it’s what realistically can be done. I do agree that, on the second point, there aren’t many actors to give support and training to. in Syria, for instance, there are no “moderate rebels.” They all couch their opposition to Assad in terms of jihad, (except the Kurds, who come with their own geopolitical risks) but all the GOP candidates, including Cruz and your ex-boy Rubio, pretended that there were “moderate Syrian rebels” to give support and training to. And I don’t know why you cling so tightly to the “Obama has no credibility on this” trope. He has stepped up the drone war and killed far more terrorist leaders than Bush ever did. He authorized the raid that killed bin Laden. Hater talk is for haters, get real. Obama can’t and probably shouldn’t get allied countries to make a public “progress report.” That’s what Senate Intelligence committees are for. Ditto with your fourth bullet point. One hundred years ago and a little more, the Western world was under attack by anarchist terrorists. They blew up restaurants and other public venues, killing thousands of innocents,and assassinated many business tycoons and several heads of state, including the Czar, the King of Spain, the King of Italy, and the freaking President of the United States, McKinley. This anarchist terrorist menace was defeated by the same kind of strategy, on a much smaller and more primitive scale, as Obama enumerates in your excerpt. The main thing is, people didn’t lose their shit and go off half-cocked invading wrong countries and rounding up suspects and imprisoning them without trial, etc etc yada yada. http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B005GFBTK4/ref=dp-kindle-redirect?ie=UTF8&btkr=1 Also, here’s an Onion article that’s not really funny but kinda is in a wtf kinda way: http://www.theonion.com/article/world-makes-final-attempt-try-understand-shit-52613 Scalia … but all the GOP candidates, including Cruz and your ex-boy Rubio, pretended that there were “moderate Syrian rebels” to give support and training to. Why did you leave out Obama? Brucehenry LOL I thought it went without saying, given the context of the rest of my remarks. I’ll try to be more clear in future. I have said several times, I think, in the Wizbang comment section that there are no “moderate Syrian rebels” and that it is a mistake to pretend there are. If I haven’t I meant to, lol. Scalia Some people believe otherwise. Brucehenry Haven’t read the whole list but it looks like it proves my point — they’re all “Islamists.” Not moderates. Some appear to be simply banditos. Scalia I don’t mind “Islamists” who believe in democratic rule and protecting human rights (as the article attests). If they disavow terrorism, I couldn’t care less what their women dress like or what dietary laws they want to impose in their country. Brucehenry There are only a couple of small groups on that list that come anywhere close to that description — and that is by their own claims. The problem with actual “moderate fighters” is that they are moderates — they don’t fight with the same fanaticism as ummm fanatics. Scalia “Moderates,” when fighting for their lives and the lives of their families, can fight just as fanatically as anybody else. Survival is a rather potent motivator. Brucehenry I’m just saying that there is no “moderate” opposition that has a chance of prevailing. We will throw good money after bad supporting them, and chances are someone we support will, if they SHOULD gain power, turn on us like Saddam did. Scalia Well, that’s not what you said, but I accept your clarification. Brucehenry Like I said I’ll try to be more clear in future. Scalia Small or not, they are still there, so it is mistaken to say that there aren’t any. Now, unless you can prove that they are lying and aren’t really moderate, what’s the point of your continued insistence otherwise? Brucehenry Saying there “aren’t any” was a blanket statement. I suppose I could have said any worth mentioning. Commander_Chico There was an elected Islamist government in Egypt. It got overthrown with the help of the Gulf tyrants. Obama did nothing. Egypt is now a brutal dictatorship. Scalia Yep. Obama did nothing. Brucehenry Which is what conservatives wanted him to do — nothing to help preserve an elected government, nothing to prevent a return of the Mubarak regime under a new strongman. And then they can say, dismissively, “Yep, Obama did nothing.” Scalia Just agreeing with Chico, Bruce. Since you’re into asking people what they would have done, please tell us what YOU would have done. Would you have done exactly what Obama did or would you take a different course of action? Please elaborate. Brucehenry I honestly don’t know, but what I wouldn’t do is demand the president do nothing and then snark that he did nothing, what a sissy! On the one hand, the Islamist government was legally elected in an election everyone agreed was fairly held. On the other hand, the people had buyer’s remorse — or at least that’s what we’ve been sold er umm I mean told. I asked Rick what his plan was because of his sarcastic “How’s that strategy workin’ out for ya?” sneer. Reminds me of Palin screeching “How’s that hopey-changey thing workin’ out for ya?” a few years ago. When one says that, one implies that one has a better plan. Scalia Ok, so you have a beef with Rick, but I don’t recall him ever saying that we should do nothing in Egypt and then turning around to criticize Obama for doing just that. So, do you have somebody else in mind? Brucehenry I was kinda obliquely snarking at YOU, dude. Scalia I’d like to see the link where I recommended that Obama do nothing in Egypt. Brucehenry No of course I have nothing like that. I put words in your mouth because I assumed you, as a conservative, were on the same side as those who demanded that Obama stand aside (which is what he did) and let Sisi depose Morsi, the so-called “Muslim Brotherhood candidate” that conservatives were wetting the bed about in 2012. If you were not among those who thought that, then I have misrepresented you. Some of these, you see, are jokes. Scalia Nope, it wasn’t me. I’d like you to name me one prominent conservative who stated that we should do nothing and then criticized Obama for doing nothing. What some have done is severely criticize Obama for how he handled the situation. Scalia If you’ve said that several times, then surely you said it in reply to Obama’s insistence that there are moderate Syrian rebels. I’d like to see the link where you criticize him for saying so, including your criticism of the policy built upon what you consider a false assumption. Brucehenry I’m sure I probably said it in reply to Jim or someone insisting that I say where I differed with Obama on foreign policy. I’m not a master of digging through Wizbang archives, so either take my word for it or don’t, whatever. In any event I’m telling you, now, that I think Obama or any president or candidate who pretends that “giving support to a moderate Syrian opposition” is a good idea is either kidding himself or blowing smoke up our butts. Scalia I don’t want anybody blowing anything near my posterior. I’m, uh…not into that sort of thing. 🙂 Brucehenry LOL a figure of speech common in the South, where are you from? Scalia Sorry for the break. I went to grab a bite to eat. I knew what you meant. I’m just trying to end the discussion on a lighter note. Brucehenry NP Commander_Chico And why did you leave out Rodney? http://wizbangblog.com/2013/01/26/the-law-of-corollaries-and-the-iron-law-of-uninten/ Scalia We’re talking about politicians, not blog comments. Rodney G. Graves Where in the article of mine that you linked did I propose to attack or undermine the Assad regime in Syria? You shan’t be able to show such a proposal as I didn’t make it. You also (conveniently) overlook “We have no friends and no national interests in Syria.” Commander_Chico You advocated overthrowing Assad in 2012, when Obama was beginning aid to the rebels: http://wizbangblog.com/2012/03/19/despot-support-network-putin-sends-aid-to-assad/ Just because I know your pussy game of changing or deleting things you said in the past, here’s a screenshot: Brucehenry Ha! Ha! lol. Rodney G. Graves Daw, your brucehemorrhoid likes you… Commander_Chico Der Sturmbannführer! Retired military Ref Second. What did they train like 5 soldiers at the costs of how many million? Brett Buck God has long since graced us with the means to deal with this. It’s the cowards and those who believe, on some level, that we *deserve* this for our supposed collective guilt are the only things standing in the way. Commander_Chico “Deservin’s got nothing to do with this,” as Clint said in Unforgiven, but if you bomb their kids and break their governments, expect blowback. Rick Trump wants to bomb their kids as a matter of policy. Brucehenry As does Cruz. And Kasich, and as did Rubio. But not Bernie. Commander_Chico As does Hillary, too. She was all for bombing Libya and Syria. Brucehenry Yes that is so. It is for other reasons that I will probably — almost certainly — wind up voting for her rather than the GOP nominee, whether Cruz or Trump, or even Kasich. Brucehenry BTW Rick, you ask above, sarcastically, how Obama’s anti-terror strategy is working out. So I asked to hear what yours would be. So far, all we’ve seen is that you want a “progress report” from Obama. Not an answer. Rick I’m not the President and neither am I running for office… what I think should be done would be based on little actual information to go on and nothing more than an opinion coming from an IT Manager who blogs and is trying to be a faithful Catholic. Meaning… why in heck would you truly care what I think and in what particular way would that impact what Obama has done or failed to do? Brucehenry Your first paragraph after “minimally” is almost exactly what Obama lays out. Except that the weird sentence “Completely and totally turn the ISIS threat [‘into something’? — I assume that’s what you meant to type?] that is no longer threatening” means nothing, just vague non=specific tough talk. Are special forces not “boots on the ground”? The speech you’re so angry about was an attempt to do just that. Don’t know why you don’t get that. The “naysayers” in this case are not the peaceniks of the left so much — although there are some — but the jingo-shouting chickenhawks of the right, the ones whose only plan is to not do whatever Obama wants to do. The enemy is being “engaged and destroyed.” They control about 40% of the territory in Iraq and about 75% of the area in Syria they controlled at their peak. Hence the terrorist attacks OUTSIDE their so-called “state.” They are losing in the Middle East and so have opened a new front in Europe and may soon open one here. The objective IS measurable and it is territorial control. If they control territory their claim to be a legitimate state has credibility. Under the strategy pursued by Obama the territory under ISIS control has been vastly shrunk and their revenues — from taxation and from oil — are way down. But you want to change the strategy to — what? Indiscriminate bombing of the kind Cruz is calling for? Some vague plan to “knock the hell out of ISIS” which is the extent of Trump’s strategy? Terrorism will not be stopped by the Army and Navy and Air Force alone. Law enforcement techniques must be employed as well. Above all we need fortitude and patience for a long struggle. The Basque separatist terrorist group ETA of the 70s, 80s, and 90s is gone, pretty much, these days — it wasn’t defeated by the Spanish army bombing Bilbao to smithereens. The IRA has stopped terrorizing the UK, and that wasn’t accomplished by the Royal Air Force carpet-bombing Dublin or Londonderry. Those terrorist movements were ended by strategies similar to the one Obama enumerates above. Commander_Chico Trump’s basically a non- interventionist. Brucehenry Except when he says he’ll put boots on the ground in Iraq and “take the oil.” Commander_Chico You are taking throwaway comments vs. Trump’s long record of saying the war was a mistake. Jwb10001 All of Trumps pronouncements seem to be throwaway comments. How is anyone supposed to know what he really means? Does he really mean it when he repeatedly claims he’ll torture people? Does he really mean it when he repeatedly claims he’ll target women and children and force the military to execute illegal orders? Does he really mean it when he says he just loves him some imminent domain to enrich his buddies? You have to have a hell of a lot of “faith” that he doesn’t mean what he repeatedly says. No Thanks. Of course if you don’t like what he says today just hang in there he’ll contradict himself tomorrow. Commander_Chico He’s not the perfect candidate, but a hell of a lot better than Hillary or Cruz. Brucehenry You’re half right. Jwb10001 How do you know that? Have you checked today? He might be back on his kick to invade Iraq to steal their oil. NO WAR FOR OIL Baby!!!! Commander_Chico https://pbs.twimg.com/media/Cbed4VtXEAACzoa.png https://a.disquscdn.com/get?url=https%3A%2F%2Fpbs.twimg.com%2Fmedia%2FCWWIfmjWoAAvZaL.png Jwb10001 Is there any point to your non sense anymore? You’re confronted with something stupid that your butt buddy says and rather than address that you post some other stupid thing your butt buddy has said. Brett Buck So, just to be clear, you consider the fact that ISIS intentionally integrates itself into civilians (due to our moral compunctions) is completely OK, and therefore their “human shield” strategy is a trump card to win. And, by extension, it’s A-OK if we let them run wild for fear of making them mad and maybe want to blow us up. It’s also A-OK when they blow up *you* and *your families* because, unlike us, they *don’t care about civilian casualties*; in fact, *civilian casualties are their goal”. These are murdering psychopathic animals who go out of their way to randomly kill innocent people, and your solution is to *do absolutely nothing*. Genius. Commander_Chico Don’t create refugee problems. Don’t have free immigration. Jwb10001 And you seem to think electing a loose cannon, idiot of the first order is the solution….. Can’t make this shit up. Commander_Chico And you’re for Wall Street tool and dominionist Cruz. OK. Jwb10001 Where did you get that idea? Same place all your ideas come from I guess, must be a gaping hole where your sphincter used to be. Brucehenry The IRA and ETA also “intentionally integrated itself into civilians” and so operated under a “human shield” strategy. Both groups lived right there in the neighborhoods where the people they were supposedly “fighting for” lived. In many cases, lots of their neighbors KNEW there were IRA or ETA terrorists living among them, and were either too frightened to take action, or actually agreed with what these guys were doing but were unwilling or unable to do it themselves. Yet I’ll bet that you, and I KNOW that conservatives as a group, never demanded that anyone “bomb Bilbao back to the stone age” or advocated seeing whether the Catholic neighborhoods of Belfast could be turned into a sheet of glowing glass by carpet-bombing. Why do you reckon that is? Could it be that that kind of collateral damage would have been unacceptable if the damage was white and nominally Christian, but fine and dandy if brown and Muslim? Walter_Cronanty I don’t remember the IRA carrying out mass shootings/terrorist attacks against Americans in America. I don’t remember the ETA blowing up people in Brussels or France, or Basque immigrants carrying out mass rapes in Cologne and massive child abuse in England. But, I suppose, they might have red herrings. Brucehenry No, I guess not. Do you remember them blowing up innocent citizens of our allied countries? Do you remember that prominent members of Congress, of both parties, actually voiced support and raised money for the IRA? One, Rep Peter King, R-NY, is particularly loathsome in that respect. But I digress. Besides, I think you get my point. NO ONE called for reducing the Catholic neighborhoods of Belfast to rubble and said that that would just be too freaking bad, since the terrorists were using them as human shields. See, if white, nominally Christian terrorists are using human shields then that SHOULD be a trump card — those civilian deaths would have been unacceptable “collateral damage.” It’s easy, though, for some guys anyway — you know, the macho swingin’-dick tough-on-terrorism commenters we get around here — to say those human shields ARE acceptable as collateral damage if they’re brown and Muslim. Walter_Cronanty I would be against “collateral” damage if at all possible, no matter the color of the victim’s skin – but I also would have been harder on the IRA if I were the Brits. But that’s over, for the most part, and they’re not blowing up innocents anymore – unlike Muslims. Brucehenry I’ll bet at least some of ’em did. And the fact that the IRA story is over is evidence of my point — we don’t need to exacerbate the situation by using indiscriminate violence against non-combatants, in the wrong-headed belief that overwhelming military power is the answer. The IRA threat was eliminated by patience, clever law enforcement and espionage techniques and diplomacy, in conjunction with military action. Mostly it took patience and fortitude. Walter_Cronanty We’ll have to agree to disagree on whether the IRA/ETA analogy. I think the vast majority of the supporters of both groups were appalled when indiscriminate bombings took place. That isn’t the case with Muslims. The radical Muslims want to inflict terror on those of other countries so that they can take over those countries. They also have the Koran which calls for the killing of infidels. I think they are a much bigger threat and have succeeded in Western Europe. I would be rather ruthless in my attempts to send them back from whence they came. If they want to blow themselves up in their mother countries, so be it. Brucehenry And I agree they are a much bigger threat. The point is that they won’t be stopped by “bombing [fill in the blank] back to the stone age.” In fact that would be incredibly counter-productive. Guys like Brett Buck say that the human shield tactic can’t be a trump card and that is true. However it can’t be ignored either, which is why SWAT teams don’t just go in guns blazing whenever hostages are taken in a robbery or a domestic disturbance gone bad. If terrorists are fought the smart way rather than the feel-good swingin’ dick macho way they will be defeated. If we send the most powerful military in the world in to blow up everything in its path because “we can’t allow the human shield to be a trump card” we’ll be dealing with these problems forever. Rodney G. Graves The continuing poisonous fruits of Seven Deadly Errors. When a country enjoys tactical military success as consistently as the United States, responsibility for strategic success must rest primarily with those who make strategy. Commander_Chico Sez the guy who wanted to send aid to jihadis in Syria. Rodney G. Graves Ha, ha! Commander_Chico Stop bombing and invading their countries, don’t let them into ours. Pretty simple. Paul Hooson No, it’s much more complicated than that. In France, where 10% of the population is Muslim, 70% of prison inmates are Muslims, and most Muslims live in ghetto-type poverty conditions. France, Belgium, and other European countries need to do much better to integrate Muslims into jobs and living conditions more comparable to other persons. Poverty conditions only tend to leave many Muslim youth at risk for radicalism, unlike the U.S. where Muslims do much better financially and have little interest as a whole in terrorism. Sadly, some states such as Norway strip away any wealth and even jewelry that Muslim refugees or immigrants have, leaving them broke and angry and prone to crime or terrorism. Few Muslim immigrants into the U.S. will ever have any interest in terrorism because they are too well off financially, and do not feel like victims of the system they live in. I’m part Middle Eastern myself, but a Jew. Often Jews with have an exodus from some land, come to either Israel or the United States as an area of refuge. Unlike the Muslims who seek asylum in Europe, even the poorest of Jews who come to the U.S. or Israel have great hopes that with hard work they can work their way out of poverty, and reject crime or radicalism as any solution to only what hard work and effort can achieve. Many of the Muslims just don’t seem to share the same optimism and some seem far more probe to choose crime or radicalism as an answer to their problems. Walter_Cronanty If it’s so bad in France, Belgium, Norway, etc., why don’t the Muslims go back? Oh, that’s right, the entire Middle East [excepting Israel] is a shithole because the barbarians can’t govern themselves in a civilized manner – they would rather murder and bomb each other back to the 7th century. I feel sympathy for the good ones, but they’ve got to clean up their own house. Brucehenry Yeah, some, I assume, are good people. Paul Hooson Some countries like Norway take away all of the immigrants money and jewelry, while many others just arrive very poor. Sadly, some of the Muslim nations are a real mess, nothing like the wealthy kingdom in Kuwait. The Muslim population in the U.S. is even smaller than the Jewish population, and most Muslims live at a relatively good standard of living, so the U.S. will face far less of a terrorist threat overall than many European states. In France, the Muslims are 10% of the population, and 70% of the prison inmate population. Brucehenry Which moderates and liberals at Wizbang are running to the right? Few moderates and no liberals (except me) inhabit Wizbang. Oooops missed the word “Pop.” excuse me. Scalia Wizbang Pop isn’t the same as Wizbang. You may find several of Paul’s posts over there. They tend to be more focused on female biology, if you know what I mean. Paul Hooson Sorry, a typo there I just corrected. – I know what you mean, I’m not a gynecologist, but I’m always willing to take a look… Retired military You got 1 out of 3 right. No more invading or playing country builder. Bomb them to the stone age and stop the PC BS about nation building. Commander_Chico I’m ok with bombing Saudi Arabia, they fund jihadis, but USA usually bombs wrong people. Jwb10001 Does your butt buddy advocate bombing Saudi Arabia? No I didn’t think so, he wants to bomb the shit out of the same places you bitch about us bombing. You don’t make any sense just like your favorite candidate Donald Drumph. Commander_Chico https://img.washingtonpost.com/blogs/the-fix/files/2016/03/enhanced-mid-8139-1458581517-18.png Jwb10001 Idiot! Paul Hooson “Hi I’m Bill Clinton, and I’m asking you to vote for Hillary so I can get her out of the house and have girlfriends come over…”. Paid For By the C’mon Be A Sport And Let Bill Clinton Have His Fun Committee… Paul Hooson There’s some key sociological reasons why France and Belgium are at a high risk for terrorism. Muslim account for 10% of the population in France, but most suffer from extreme poverty and live in ghetto-type conditions with few jobs and little upward mobility compared to American Muslims. In France, 70% of prison inmates are also Muslims. This gives a prime recruiting grounds to terrorism organizers to work on at risk youth and persons in their 20’s compared to the U.S. where Muslims have so much more economic opportunity and the ability to achieve upward mobility. In today’s primary races, watch for both Donald Trump and Hillary Clinton to get some bounce from voters who think either one would stand up for forcefully to terrorist threats than their opponents. Retired military Here’s an idea. Bar all muslim immigrants and have them sort their own countries out without our assistance. And the countdown on the Rick thread concerning Trump / Epstein is at 5…4…3….2…. Rick Trump/Epstein? What have I missed? Retired military Trump apparantly had some good things to say about Epstein in like 2002. Epstein is the one that ran the private parties on his island or something that had underage girls. the same Epstein that had Clinton on his plane a few times. Sorry I was at the hospital ER with my wife for the last 7 hours or so. She is doing better. Just another bad UTI with significant pain. Scalia Sorry to hear about that. My wife had a UTI a couple of times. Definitely not fun. Rick I confess to not being in the loop to the Epstein stuff… I’ll have to play catch-up. Sorry to hear about your wife… my mom gets those as well, too frequently, and it can definitely be painful. Prayer flare in air for your wife. Retired military Thanks all LiberalNightmare Best thing to do is to let them continue to bomb everyone they don’t like until they collectively build up enough self esteem to join us on the world stage as we defeat global warming, the REAL enemy. LiberalNightmare https://scontent-lga3-1.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-xat1/v/t1.0-9/12108086_1139814276049419_2770206729996139335_n.jpg?oh=c0c77684f017411ced76c5b815a9e92b&oe=574F91CA Walter_Cronanty In the spirit of Rick bringing us an article written by the execrable David Brooks pillorying Trump, I bring you an article written by the execrable Piers Morgan praising Trump [surely the apocalypse is nigh]: ” PIERS MORGAN: When it comes to terror, isn’t it time we started listening seriously to Trump? How many more? That’s all I could think this morning as news broke of yet another ISIS terror attack, this time in Brussels. How many more innocent men, women and children are going to be blown to pieces by these murderous bastards? How many more airports, train stations, sports stadiums, restaurants or concert halls will be obliterated in a hail of suicide bombs and bullets? How many more world leaders will wring their hands on national television afterwards and spout pointless platitudes about the ‘poor brave victims’ and ‘heroic emergency services’? How many taunting, gleeful claims of responsibility will the despicable perpetrators of these evil crimes be able to issue? I’m sick of this, aren’t you? Sick of feeling sick about such endless, senseless barbarism. And the worst thing about it is that I see no end…. ” http://linkis.com/www.dailymail.co.uk/EiBz0 Walter_Cronanty Off Topic, but…”Obama Admin Engaged in Secret Talks to Pay Iran Nearly $2 Billion Officials admit delays in informing Congress, say more payments to come The Obama administration has spent three years engaged in secret talks with Iran that resulted in the payment of nearly $2 billion in taxpayer funds to the Islamic Republic, with more payouts likely to come in the future, according to a recent letter issued by the State Department and obtained exclusively by the Washington Free Beacon.” http://freebeacon.com/national-security/obama-admin-secret-talks-pay-iran-2-billion/ Commander_Chico Don’t expect a fair characterization from the Free Beacon, which is a hard-core neocon/Israel lobby propaganda organ. Chico’s been involved with international arbitration between formerly-hostile states. Before the relationship can go forward, claims have to be settled. It’s never true that one side is right all of the time. For example, from the article it looks like Iran paid for weapons and USA never delivered. They took hostages, we shot down their airliner, etc. This looks like a good thing. Iran is a natural ally against ISIS/salafi jihadism. Israel is against that, but USA national interests come first. Jwb10001 You are a messenger mass murderer. Shoot every messenger that doesn’t deliver the Trump line, whatever that happens to be today. Commander_Chico So you deny that there are propagandists and shills out there? Naive. Jwb10001 Are you trying to pretend you don’t call everyone that disagrees with you a neo con, chickenhawk, war monger regardless of what they say? Just because someone has a view point doesn’t mean everything they say is wrong. If a story doesn’t fit your world view (which is mostly the inside of Drumph’s ass) they are illegitimate doesn’t matter if they are writing opinion, or repeating Drump’s own words or stating facts. That makes you a complete hack. Edit: Please also point out where I deny that there are propagandists? You can put anything you want in your mouth, but don’t try to put words in mine. Commander_Chico The article that Walter posted was written by an Israeli citizen. Wake up! Jwb10001 Oh not an Israeli, my god what’s next are they going to let black people have opinions too? What is the world coming to. Commander_Chico He is an Israeli patriot, nothing wrong with that, but not the same as being an American patriot. Jwb10001 You of course miss the point entirely, but what else is new. Enjoy the rest of your day over at Stormfront. Commander_Chico You resort to the tired smear that everyone who questions Israeli influence on the USA is a Nazi, but ok, I am the one who resorts to characterizing messengers. Jwb10001 So you deny being a bigot? Odd your words here would suggest otherwise. But even that’s not the point keep trying you’ll eventually get it. Commander_Chico What have I ever said that indicates bigotry? Israel is a foreign country, same as Cuba, France, Qatar, or India. They have their own interests. I do not believe those interests align 100% with the USA’s, and the historical record indicates that is true. Walter_Cronanty Israel’s interests certain align more closely with ours than Iran’s. Yet you defend Iran as if it’s your mother country. Commander_Chico Are you sure? What have the Israelis ever done for the USA? I know we’ve invaded their enemies a couple of times for them. Versus Lavon Affair, USS Liberty, Pollard secrets going to the USSR. I am a realist. The Iranians were on our side in 2001-02 in Afghanistan and are fighting ISIS and Al Qaeda now. Walter_Cronanty Yeah, Iran really is a great ally in Iraq and Afghanistan: “Iran linked to deaths of 500 U.S. troops in Iraq, Afghanistan” http://www.militarytimes.com/story/military/capitol-hill/2015/07/14/iran-linked-to-deaths-of-500-us-troops-in-iraq-afghanistan/30131097/ Commander_Chico USA would not have been in Iraq but for Israel lobby. There were US threats to attack Iran next, too. I note you could not tell me what Israel does for the USA in return for the money and hassle. Walter_Cronanty Israel is the only stable, democratic government in the Middle East. It has been a reliable ally since its inception. We have many economic and military interests in common with Israel. https://www.quora.com/Why-does-the-US-support-Israel-What-benefit-does-the-US-get-out-of-this-alliance But you know all of this, you’re just being obtuse. Rodney G. Graves Obtusely dogmatic. Jwb10001 Yeah never mind that small invading their neighbor thing, or the attempted assignation of a US president, or the use of Chem weapons. It’s all the Jews, wonder where a person could get the idea your a bigot. Walter_Cronanty Yeah, Iran is just a wonderful ally: “At least 500 U.S. military deaths in Iraq and Afghanistan were directly linked to Iran and its support for anti-American militants — a newly disclosed statistic that offers grim context for the Obama administration’s diplomatic deal with the Iranian regime aimed at curtailing the rogue nation’s nuclear ambitions….Many of those estimated 500 deaths occurred during the so-called surge in Iraq, when President George W. Bush ordered an influx of tens of thousands of troops to confront what had devolved into a sectarian civil war. Scores of American personnel were killed or maimed by highly lethal bombs, known as explosively formed penetrators, or EFPs, that Iran manufactured and supplied to Shiite militias across the border in Iraq. Many EFPs were powerful enough to destroy U.S. Humvees and breach tank hulls.” http://www.militarytimes.com/story/military/capitol-hill/2015/07/14/iran-linked-to-deaths-of-500-us-troops-in-iraq-afghanistan/30131097/ Jwb10001 Well for one thing I never heard tell of Israel kidnapping and holding Americans hostage. Or calling for death to America, I guess that’s just more of that “throw away” talk. Jwb10001 Still missing the point so I guess you’ll never get it. Enjoy the rest of your day drinking up the Drumph kool aid, I’m sure there are a ton on nasty tweets for you to catch up on. Jwb10001 Maybe it’s the conspiracy knots you’ll tie yourself in to make everything the fault of Israel? When you have to resort to code words like neo con and moral equivalency (Iran’s cool because what has Israel ever done for us) to try to make the Israeli lobby the boogie man for everything a person might start to think you have a problem with Jews. Of course your gratuitous use of racial epithets helps that impression too. Walter_Cronanty What is the true “characterization?” Did the Obama Admin. secretly give almost $2b to Iran or not? Were these payments okayed by Congress? Exactly where did the Free Beacon get this report wrong? Jwb10001 Neo con, or is it chickenhawk, maybe war monger, oh wait I know Oligarch. DRUMPH baby! Commander_Chico How is it a “secret” if you know about it and it’s published? Nothing was marked “secret” or classified. The USA maintains a fund to settle foreign claims by executive action. No Congressional approval is necessary. Negotiations and diplomacy are conducted in private, not with reporters in the room. So the article is bullshit. Walter_Cronanty Then why did the Administration delay its response to Congress? Why are we giving Iran money? Why didn’t we just give it directly to Hezbollah, Hamas or the other terror groups Iran supports? Or, is it just to help Iran build its missiles? What country were you representing when you participated in “international arbitration between formerly-hostile states?” Commander_Chico Lots of things are delayed in government, have you ever noticed? I suppose we are giving Iran money to pay them back for keeping the ships and planes they ordered and paid for in the 1970s but were never delivered, and maybe for the airliner we shot down and the Iranians in it. The article did not mention that the Iran hostages were compensated as a part of the US – Iran negotiations. That would be balanced reporting though. http://edition.cnn.com/2015/12/24/us/american-iran-hostages-compensation/ You forget that peace begins with things like this – think Nixon to China, the deal we made (and broke) with Libya, what is happening in Cuba right now. My involvement in the international arbitration was as an observer/reporter, not representative. Walter_Cronanty The article you cite says nothing about a link between Iran/US negotiations and payment to hostages. In fact, like other reports, it says the payments, provided for in a US budget deal, will be financed through penalties paid by entities who violated sanctions against Iran: “They have waited for more than 36 years. Now the Americans who were held hostage at the U.S. Embassy in Iran and/or their families will receive financial compensation for their ordeal, because of a little-noticed part of a budget bill passed last week by Congress….The payments will come from penalties paid after some banks, including BN Paribas, were found violating American economic sanctions against Iran.” First you say these negotiations are private, now you say as a reporter you covered them. Who were you reporting for? Commander_Chico The progress and results are available unless bound by confidentiality agreement. I was working for a private sector company, not news reporting. Forgive me if I don’t tell you who. Walter_Cronanty My sympathy for Brussels is starting to ooze out onto the floor – two brothers involved, both of whom should still be in jail: “BRUSSELS — Two brothers were identified Wednesday as the suicide bombers behind the Brussels terror attacks as the search for an on-the-run suspect intensified. Authorities said Khalid El Bakraoui, 27, blew himself up in the subway in the Belgian capital’s subway system while his 30-year-old sibling Ibrahim detonated a bomb at the city’s airport. Both had been convicted of violent crimes in the past and had links to one of the Paris attackers…… In 2010, Ibrahim El Bakraoui was sentenced to 9 years in prison for shooting at police with an assault rifle during a robbery. Khalid El Bakraoui was arrested for possession of Kalashnikovs in 2011 and had been sentenced to 5 years in prison for “carjackings.” http://www.nbcnews.com/storyline/brussels-attacks/brussels-airport-suicide-bombers-were-brothers-sources-n543956 Commander_Chico Too easy on criminals in a lot of parts of Europe. Breivik will be out in 18 years. Walter_Cronanty You’re right. In addition to the many stories about Belgian officials being warned about the terrorists, there’s this story from the WSJ, via Powerline: “The Belgian police have also been hampered by bizarre rules. According to Belgian Justice Minister Koen Geens, just two days after the Paris attacks Abdeslam was “likely in a flat in Molenbeek.” But because of the country’s penal code, which prohibits raids between 9 p.m. and 5 a.m. unless a crime is in progress or in case of fire, police were ordered to wait until dawn to pursue him. By then, Abdeslam was nowhere to be seen.” http://www.powerlineblog.com/archives/2016/03/visit-brussels-youll-have-a-blast.php Commander_Chico Yah I read that, but why didn’t the police watch the house? Walter_Cronanty Unfortunately, Great Britain is also on its knees. Two stories to illustrate: ” A man who sparked an outcry on Twitter after tweeting about confronting a Muslim woman on a street in Croydon, south London, and challenging her to “explain Brussels” has been arrested by police. The Metropolitan police confirmed that a 46-year-old man had been arrested on Wednesday evening in Croydon on suspicion of inciting racial hatred via social media. He is understood to be Matthew Doyle, a partner at a south London-based talent and PR agency, who tweeted earlier in the day: “I confronted a Muslim women [sic] yesterday in croydon. I asked her to explain Brussels. She said “Nothing to do with me” a mealy mouthed reply.” http://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2016/mar/23/london-man-confronted-muslim-woman-explain-brussels-attacks-arrested A popular shopkeeper was stabbed to death by another Muslim in a “religiously prejudiced” attack hours after posting an Easter message on Facebook to “my beloved Christian nation”. Asad Shah, 40, a devout Muslim originally from the Pakistani city of Rabwah, had his head stamped on during a savage attack, according to one eyewitness. Around four hours earlier the victim wrote online: “Good Friday and a very Happy Easter, especially to my beloved Christian nation. “Let’s follow the real footstep of beloved holy Jesus Christ and get the real success in both worlds.” http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/crime/12204357/Muslim-shopkeeper-murdered-in-suspected-religiously-prejudiced-attack-after-posting-on-Facebook-of-love-for-Christians.html WHO’S THE BUSTER Does Cruz ever think before speaking? Patrol Muslim neighborhoods? I have business interests in the largest Muslim community in the U.S. (Dearborn, MI). What is unique about that area? Low crime rate, high number of children going to college and a steady increase in per capita income. Radical rhetoric? No. They are, as a group, an American success story. Started by opening convenience stores in high-crime neighborhoods and now own most regional convenience stores, the majority of gas stations, in addition to now owning the region’s largest supermarket chain as well as the preeminent wholesale grocery distributor. So Ted Cruz wants to increase the police presence in this area? Why? Commander_Chico But remember, Trump is the extremist!! Jwb10001 Nothing extreme about wanting to torture people, or force the military to execute illegal orders to intentionally kill women and children. Main stream if ever there was. WHO’S THE BUSTER I did see a gentleman from the military on one of the morning cable news shows that made it clear that killing the families of terrorists and waterboarding will have one definite outcome. The perpetrators will go to jail for a very long time while Trump will be playing golf. He respectfully suggested that Trump stop suggesting acts that will land them in jail. WHO’S THE BUSTER One problem: “According to a Bloomberg Politics poll released Wednesday, Clinton leads Trump 54 percent to 36 percent in a contest between the two front-runners.A separate poll released Wednesday by Fox News also gives Clinton an advantage over Trump, but by a smaller margin. She is beating Trump by 11 points, 49 to 38 percent, according to the Fox poll.” Scalia This is the only time I’ve agreed with you. A Trump nomination is a guaranteed loss in November for the GOP—unless Clinton gets indicted. Walter_Cronanty This whole Trump campaign is disastrous for the GOP. If nominated, he’ll get crushed, leading to losses down the ticket for national and local GOP candidates. If he gets ousted in a brokered convention, his backers will riot and never vote GOP, again leading to losses for the GOP. Only the Rs could do this to themselves. Oh, I live in the Cleveland area – I’m NOT looking forward to the convention. WHO’S THE BUSTER The same poll has Kasich winning against Hillary. If not for the 17 people initially running, in addition to the primary being reduced to name calling and sandbox tactics, he would have had a very good chance and may have even gained independents as well as Democrats that are less than thrilled with HIllary. As someone stated, with the demographic advantage the Democrats enjoy, they could have nominated a cardboard cutout and won the election yet they managed to select the most polarizing and vulnerable candidate in America. Her charisma couldn’t fill a thimble. Bill had it in buckets (it has somehow disappeared, he now sounds like he has had a lobotomy), but she can be reciting tomorrow’s winning lottery numbers and I stop listening to her “nails on a chalkboard” delivery within a minute. Doesn’t she have handlers? Why doesn’t someone tell her to quit yelling as every sentence comes off as haranguing. Kasich is gaining late momentum for refusing to engage in the sophomoric rhetoric that Trump initiated and Cruz seemed to easily embrace (while Rubio seemed to engage in it reluctantly, and was admittedly embarrassed, while realizing it may have a long term effect on his political career). Kasich has experience, served in the military and has practical solutions. I may even disagree with him on many things, but can understand and even consider his proposals. He also doesn’t have the obvious personality defect that afflicts Trump. Unfortunately he was branded a RINO, whatever that is, so half the electorate (or more considering it is a primary) won’t even consider him. Why aren’t people more concerned with Trump constantly using obscenities, his horrific treatment of Megyn Kelly, his criticism of John McCain’s military career, his loose relationship with the truth, his lack of anything resembling viable solutions, his inability to ever turn the other cheek (very troubling and juvenile) or utilizing a vocabulary that is on par with a ninth grader (perhaps Wharton isn’t what it is cracked up to be)? Perhaps that last element is on purpose, to complete the magic trick that is convincing “regular” people that a billionaire that was born with a silver spoon in his mouth and is a quintessential “rich kid” (we all know some and he is an extreme example of one) is “one of them”. Perhaps even more troubling is that Trump seems to suffer from the same shortcoming Newt Gingrich observed about Sarah Palin, “A lack of curiosity”. He has been at this for quite some time now and he still seems to lack any knowledge of policy, international politics, legislative procedure, etc. Is this just laziness or hubris? Heck, I even agree with him on some things, e.g., a hiatus on immigration from certain regions of the world and removing or limiting money in politics, but he simply does not have the personality or demeanor that is suited for the office and in no way is he “Presidential”. Jwb10001 I saw a election map this morning Trump manages to capture 164 electoral votes, he’s a complete utter disaster. If you care at all about the republican party (not sure why anyone would anymore) you should recognize that Trump is the angle of death for your party. Scalia You’re using “you” in the sense of others, not me, correct? 🙂 Jwb10001 Not you specifically, sorry. I’ve concluded that the only real explanation for people like Chico supporting Drumph isn’t anything to do with Drumph it has everything to do with the destruction of the republican party. I can find no other logical reason for his support of someone so opposite of everything he ever rants about here. I suppose since Drumph is so friendly to, let’s call them, people with interesting racial views, that might be an attraction for Chico but otherwise I don’t get it at all. Walter_Cronanty Maybe because of this: “FBI: Dearborn Hgts. man plotted ISIS attacks on church” http://www.freep.com/story/news/local/michigan/wayne/2016/02/05/fbi-dearborn-hts-man-plotted-isis-attacks-church/79894722/ or this: ‘The Twin Cities have an ISIS problem’ http://www.americanthinker.com/blog/2015/09/the_twin_cities_have_an_isis_problem.html Jwb10001 Of course you wouldn’t want to police the areas that might produce a terrorist just like you wouldn’t want to police the areas that spawn gangs and gang violence, or areas that are home base to drug dealers and hookers. No that wouldn’t make any sense at all. WHO’S THE BUSTER Isn’t most of the police presence in areas considered to be “high-crime?” Hey, if you guys think that patrolling a middle-class neighborhood made up of highly assimilated, mostly 2nd or 3rd generation immigrants, which is a good description of Dearborn, have at it. It might cost money, but oh well. I worked at the Chrysler plant (in Detroit, everyone on “my side of town” worked at Chrysler, Dodge or Plymouth) during my first years in school and they were hiring anyone, and everyone, that was applying for a job that had arrived from South Yemen (early seventies, as it no longer exists). Why? Because they showed up for work everyday (in a suit coat, no less), had little interest in unions and tried to work through their breaks. When a car came off the chain that ran the line everyone else took the opportunity to take a minute to relax, have a smoke, whatever. What did the people from South Yemen do? They lifted the car back on the line, much to the chagrin of the “lifers”. This is what is different from Europe and why the people that make up the largest Middle Eastern population in the United States will probably not mind that you choose to send a patrol car by the house every hour. Europe, on the other hand, has a HUGE problem and I have no idea how they can fix it. Ok, gotta go, I am going down the street to a very popular restaurant in the neighborhood to have some kibbe and tabouleh at a place that is run by Syrians (they took over from their uncle whom I also knew) that I have been going to for forty years. Sometimes it is hard to get a table, however, as it is popular among the police in this suburb of Detroit. LiberalNightmare Nope, no extremism in dearbornistan, twolaneflash Outlaw Islam in the West. Send Mohammedans to Saudi Arabia, Iran, Pakistan…then nuke those places from orbit and salt their earth for a thousand years. Walter_Cronanty I think the question has become: After years of reliance on the US and willful refusal to acknowledge what was obviously happening in their countries, does Western Europe have the wherewithal to save itself? This article seems to say “NO.” “Europe Is Again at War It’s time to admit the extent of Europe’s problem with Islamic radicalism. This isn’t mere terrorism any longer, this is guerrilla war.” http://observer.com/2016/03/europe-is-again-at-war/ Walter_Cronanty Another off-topic comment – IRS and DOJ lawyers handed their ass by Federal Court of Appeals: “A federal appeals court spanked the IRS Tuesday, saying it has taken laws designed to protect taxpayers from the government and turned them on their head, using them to try to protect the tax agency from the very tea party groups it targeted. The judges ordered the IRS to quickly turn over the full list of groups it targeted so that a class-action lawsuit, filed by the NorCal Tea Party Patriots, can proceed. The judges also accused the Justice Department lawyers, who are representing the IRS in the case, of acting in bad faith — compounding the initial targeting — by fighting the disclosure….“The lawyers in the Department of Justice have a long and storied tradition of defending the nation’s interests and enforcing its laws — all of them, not just selective ones — in a manner worthy of the Department’s name. The conduct of the IRS’s attorneys in the district court falls outside that tradition,” Judge Raymond Kethledge wrote in a unanimous opinion for a three-judge panel of the Sixth Circuit Court of Appeals. “We expect that the IRS will do better going forward.” http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2016/mar/22/irs-rebuked-tea-party-targeting-ordered-release-se/ For what it’s worth, I once had a case in front of District Court Judge Dlott. She’s a fairly liberal Clinton appointee – but she’s bright and tries to do the right thing under the law [what can I say, she ruled in our favor in that case]. Her husband, Stanley Chesley, is a pretty fair country lawyer: “Chesley won billions of dollars for his clients in other mass torts, representing clients suing Pan Am over the Lockerbie terrorist attack and clients suing Dow Corning in controversial breast implant litigation. Chesley was one of the “inner circle” of the plaintiffs’ bar that negotiated the controversial $246 billion tobacco settlement on behalf of state governments, and settlements against the Roman Catholic Archdiocese of Cincinnati for sexual abuse.” Wiki Constitution First Go to bed with dogs, wake up with fleas. So long as Europe uncondidtionaly embraces the Death Cult Religion they will continue to die. Belgium neither asked for, nor will accept our offer for intelligence help, so mote it be. #DeathByDems, European style.