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Katrina: The First Draft of History

(note this will be at the top for a few hours, check below for more content)

I don't have time to explain... but trust me... when the history of this thing is written, Gov Blanco will be near criminally liable.

From a Wapo article I didn't take time to link. (google is your friend)

Behind the scenes, a power struggle emerged, as federal officials tried to wrest authority from Louisiana Gov. Kathleen Babineaux Blanco (D). Shortly before midnight Friday, the Bush administration sent her a proposed legal memorandum asking her to request a federal takeover of the evacuation of New Orleans, a source within the state's emergency operations center said Saturday.

The administration sought unified control over all local police and state National Guard units reporting to the governor. Louisiana officials rejected the request after talks throughout the night, concerned that such a move would be comparable to a federal declaration of martial law. Some officials in the state suspected a political motive behind the request. "Quite frankly, if they'd been able to pull off taking it away from the locals, they then could have blamed everything on the locals," said the source, who does not have the authority to speak publicly.

A senior administration official said that Bush has clear legal authority to federalize National Guard units to quell civil disturbances under the Insurrection Act and will continue to try to unify the chains of command that are split among the president, the Louisiana governor and the New Orleans mayor.

Louisiana did not reach out to a multi-state mutual aid compact for assistance until Wednesday, three state and federal officials said. As of Saturday, Blanco still had not declared a state of emergency, the senior Bush official said.

UPDATE: Thanks to Anachronda, (who btw we still owe money to I think) the Wapo had a correction, she declared the SoE Monday- still fully 3 full days after Bush declared a Federal SoE. (end update)

Nagin is not without his warts... While he did save hundreds of thousands of lives, his abject stupidity should not and will not be ignored. He not only did not understand the strength of this hurricane but he failed to execute a long standing plan properly.

But when all is said and done, Kathleen Blanco killed thousands of people. When she met with Bush and Bush tried getting control of the situation she told him she needed "24 hours to think things through."

Blanco's lack of ability to think on her feet was evident in the debates she had during the election... now it cost lives... (More on this with video coming.)

I am too busy to post more right now but watch it play out... Blanco screwed up. (So did Nagin and I haven't decided on Bush, but we know Blanco blew it.)

AND BTW- I hate to disappoint the race baiters, but this is not racism... It was stupidity, pure and simple.


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» The Pink Flamingo Bar Grill linked with Mother in Law back behind friendly lines...

» Kerfuffles linked with Katrina Was Predicted

» Cummins Family Website - A Right of Center Family in South Florida. linked with Vampires and Accountability

» Dadmanly linked with Week's Best Rant #3: Katrina Edition

» Josh's Weblog linked with Blame Game

» Oblogatory Anecdotes linked with America's Pompeii

» Random Numbers linked with FEMA and The Blanco Wall

» Our Way of Life linked with Beyond Words

» Overtaken by Events linked with In which I rant...

» Josh's Weblog linked with Blame Game

» Macmind - Conservative Commentary and Common Sense linked with Where the Responsibility is Ultimately Going to Fa

» Mister Snitch! linked with The Politics of evacuation (part one)

» AlphaPatriot linked with Failure to Execute

Comments (85)

There's a correction on the... (Below threshold)
anachronda:

There's a correction on the WaPo story stating that Blanco declared a state of emergency on Aug. 27th.

Hope things are going OK...

Oops; my bad; August 26th, ... (Below threshold)
Anachronda:

Oops; my bad; August 26th, not 27th.

Paul, I think you're right ... (Below threshold)

Paul, I think you're right and it probably explains the enormous amount of vitriol that's been coming from both Mayor Nagin and Governor Blanco—they're making preemptive strikes.

Here is <a href="http://gov... (Below threshold)
Carrick:

Here is the actual proclamation of emergency, which was issued on August 26.

The handling of the evacuation and the failure to evacuate people will remain one of the legacies of Nagin and Blanco. Sadly, the order to use school buses came only on Sept 1. Similarly not calling up the LANG seven days in advance will be remembered as one of Blanco's great failures in my estimation.

>Similarly not calling up t... (Below threshold)
PJ the Great:

>Similarly not calling up the LANG seven days in advance will be remembered as one of Blanco's great failures in my estimation.

7 days in advance there was no storm yet knucklehead. She blew it but that's just a stupid thing to say.

Anachronda, thanks... ... (Below threshold)
Paul:

Anachronda, thanks...

btw, After you won, it took a week to get hold of you... then Kev was out of town for 2 weeks... then I bugged out. blah blah blah

Email your info to Kev if you have not already heard from him and we can get you that check.

P

Blanco has nothing to worry... (Below threshold)
CharlieDontSurf:

Blanco has nothing to worry about. Once the situation is stable and re-building has begun, the left will demand a "Katrina Comission" to white wash the record...just like 9/11.

Good info, PaulBut, ... (Below threshold)
Cloud Master:

Good info, Paul
But, "google is your friend?"
Maybe yours--not mine.
I use Mooter
http://www.mooter.com

I just commented on this at... (Below threshold)

I just commented on this at What the MSM is not telling us referring to a similar article I found at The Argus.

Has anyone else started to wonder if when President Bush said the response was "unacceptable" he wasn't referring to the federal response, but instead to Governor Blanco's response???????

I've been searching for a direct quote from Bush stating the "unacceptable" characterization applies to the federal response and haven't found one yet.

Are some in the media like the LA Times and others making the assumption that he was referring to the federal government instead of Governor Blanco?

"Some officials in th... (Below threshold)

"Some officials in the state suspected a political motive behind the request. "Quite frankly, if they'd been able to pull off taking it away from the locals, they then could have blamed everything on the locals," said the source, who does not have the authority to speak publicly."


Let's see...If everything was going to plan up to the point of the request for the federal takeover, why would anyone in the Louisiana State government be concerned about blame being assessed?

And blame for what at that point in time that the power struggle emerged?

Could it be blame for totally screwing up their responsibility as a first responder?

Well you guys sure like to ... (Below threshold)
Chris:

Well you guys sure like to pick and choose when the MSM is gospel and when it's a pack of lies, don't you? Here's a link to the press release where Blanco declares a state of emergency on the 26th:
http://gov.louisiana.gov/Press_Release_detail.asp?id=973

And here's a link to the press release where Bush declares a state of emergency on the 27th:

http://www.whitehouse.gov/news/releases/2005/08/20050827-1.html

I'm not saying Blanco is free from blame, but the last time I checked, August 26th is not "fully 3 full days after Bush declared a Federal SoE" I'm just saying, is all.

Chris:It appears t... (Below threshold)

Chris:

It appears that both SoE's were for August 26, 2005.

The fish rots from the top ... (Below threshold)
EddyJ:

The fish rots from the top and the response to tragedy at the federal level was appalling. Bush showed his ineptness and you can already see desperate neocons scrambling for damage control and already positioning Rudy Guiliani for leadership. Bush should really re-think taking vacation in August because he obviously can't multi-task and very bad things happen when he takes his 5 week French-style "working" vacations. The Vacationer-In-Chief has been a dismal failure and he's no better than the Guv and the Mayor. His cavalier, jokey attitude painfully showed his arrogance and attachment. The folks on the Gulf Coast didn't need to hear his stupid comment about sitting on Trent Lott's porch when his house is rebuilt or how he used to party in Houston during his drunken stupor days. The entire world is laughing at this Administration's third-world response and his appointment to head FEMA. Finally the layers have been peeled further revealing his incompetence in Homeland Security. Thanks to the Perfect Storms - two women Cindy Sheehan and wicked Katrina, folks are waking up - except the Kool-Aid gulpers like many of you in this forum. His approval rating is dropping by the day and his Presidency will never be the same. He will never be know as the 9-11 President, rather the most clueless President in history.

Paul,Is the Friday... (Below threshold)
rayabacus:

Paul,

Is the Friday we are talking about last Friday or the Friday before the storm? I couln't make that determination by reading the article.

Check out this it explains the response of the Gov as it relates to the LANG and clearly spells out the limitations that the President has as far as the militia v. the military.

Oh, it also states that over 2/3 of the NOPD have either quit, deserted or just failed to show up. It also explains the lapse in getting NG from other states. Excellent press briefing by a really fine officer.

According to<a href=... (Below threshold)

According to
this article, it wouldn't be a bad idea for the National Guard to be on patrol in New Orleans even on normal days.

EddyJ,Did you say ... (Below threshold)
rayabacus:

EddyJ,

Did you say anything of substance? Did you have any facts? Oh, I see, you just wanted to do your I hate Bush rant.

Well done. You did a good job. Go lay down in the corner now and lick your balls like a good doggie.

Instapundit.com has link to... (Below threshold)
shark:

Instapundit.com has link to a poll showing that the majority of the public (55%) not only DOESN'T blame Bush, but blame local and state ineptitude.

And that's after oh so much MSM vitrol.

HAHAHAHAHA

Again, just when you fuckwads on the HateBush Left think you have the winning hand.....*poof*! You get nothing! You lose! As usual...

Choke on those results lefties...

Ray, please take your homo-... (Below threshold)
EddyJ:

Ray, please take your homo-erotic fantasies elsewhere. You must be a Log Cabin Republican as you sound so sensitive and if you're looking for a mandate, I'm not your guy. Anyway, stop trying to cover up for Bush's lack of attention to his job. You neo-nuts get so angry whenever anyone criticizes Bush - he's a grown man not a boy so he needs to take his lumps. Sorry if the truth hurt but imagine if you were one of the citizens whose were not saved due to the President appointing folks who don't have a clue of how to protect the homeland. What a joke - the terrorists are surely gunning for us since we have a President who cares more about vacationing, fundraising and warmongering more than anything else. By and go masturbate or something and stop fantacizing about my balls. Eek!!

President Bush contacted LA... (Below threshold)
-S-:

President Bush contacted LA's governor and New Orleans' mayor and asked them to request evacuations, declare an emergency...and the two of them waited a full day to do so.

And yet, both these outrageous failures (Governor and Mayor) rant and rant and rant about race and the 'federal government' and anything else they can to try to blame "Bush" and whoever else they can...anyone but admit that they both were responsible and they both failed.

The mayor of N.O. even had dozens of school buses available prior to and during his "mandatory evacuation" order -- issued a day late no less, to make much of a difference to anyone who had no transportation options -- and yet allowed the buses to sit there in parked gear in a lot and become flooded rather than use school buses to save people. Instead, he was waiting (demanding) "greyhound buses,"...go figure that one out.

The mayor sent people to the Superdome that was ONLY intended/proven to provide shelter for hurricanes up to Category THREE. Katrina, as everyone knows (and knew then) was a Category FIVE hurricane.

The mayor pretty much refused to declare an evacuation and then when he did refused to provide any means to help HIS people...but he's sure had a lot to yell about as to everyone else failing to save him, solve his problems.

There was even a team of fully stocked, provisioned law enforcement who went there the DAY AFTER the storm -- took their own camping gear, supplies, everything, went at their own expense from ANOTHER STATE to help -- and yet the Mayor REFUSED THEM TO ENTER THE CITY, telling them he didn't have "anywhere" they could "stay." They didn't need anywhere to "stay," they just wanted to help out, having taken care of their own needs before offering to assist.

The looting and violence was certainly the cause of the prisoners who were set loose IN THE CITY by...by...THE MAYOR, at least with his permission.

And yet people have the audacity to blame 'the federal government' when the "federal government" could not act until and without the permission of the Mayor and the Governor. Who waited, and waited and yelled and waited...and who both remained housed and fed throughout the situation.

Democrats and some others have used this Mega Disaster to blame Bush just as the hurricane was used by criminals to loot. If there's anyone who IS at fault as to incompetentcy and unwillingness to act, it's the Mayor of New Orleans and the Governor of LA. Who are both Democrats, by the way.

I can't believe that some l... (Below threshold)
-S-:

I can't believe that some liberals are trying to engage homosexuality in this issue.

Actually, on second thought, no, I'm not surprised at that, not at all. I'm sure old Cindy Sheehan is pretty upset that the cameras are off her, too.

EddyJ,I guess you ... (Below threshold)
rayabacus:

EddyJ,

I guess you still didn't say anything substantive. Huh, imagine that. I guess that would be about right, since you didn't understand that I called you a dog.

If you want to make a point, OK. If you have some kind of um.....facts behind your rant than i guess it's time to put up or shut up.

Otherwise, put your tail between your legs and slink away.

S, It was Ray whom mentione... (Below threshold)
Eddy:

S, It was Ray whom mentioned 'balls', so he needed to be called out. Stop being so sensitive and chiding folks for stating their opinion. Thank God for Cindy disrupting GW's vacation and it's too bad he had to cut it short by 2 days to attend to folks in dire need. I know he wishes this wasn't a part of his job duties but it is what it is. The Vacationer-In-Chief needs to act Presidential like he did 4 yrs ago! Polls say 46% approve of his handling of the recent events and 47% disapprove. The Independents overwhelmingly don't approve - I guess this offends you too. No wonder George won't grow up, you neo-nuts are enabling fools!

How long until Hillary or s... (Below threshold)
LouDawg:

How long until Hillary or some other windbag grandstands and says "This shows the appalling need for more federal funding to assist first responders, blah, blah, blah."?

Eddy,Strike three,... (Below threshold)
rayabacus:

Eddy,

Strike three, yerrrr OUT! You still didn't say any thing substantial. And yes it was me that mentioned balls. I told you to go lie down in the corner and lick you balls like a good doggie.

If that doesn't suit you, you could lick you ass. Obviously you can reach it, since your head is inside it.

Tata!

Declaring a State of Emerge... (Below threshold)
jpm100:

Declaring a State of Emergency doesn't inherently empower the federal authorities unless that Declaration explicitly says so.

Ray, you're the dog who see... (Below threshold)
EddyJ:

Ray, you're the dog who seems to love barking orders. You don't tell me how to respond or think and I can hang with you nutcases for as long as I want. If I want to bash, complain about or rant about Bush I have that right. This is America afterall and not Iraq. You can't handle the truth and refuse to hear facts about George Bush's failed Presidency anyway, so why present them. Start thinking for yourself, will you, or is that too difficult since you have Fox News, Rush and the conservative media to do it for you.

"...you can already see des... (Below threshold)
Gizmo:

"...you can already see desperate neocons scrambling for damage control..."

No, you see conservatives being forced to react to a steady series of baseless musket volleys from the Left.

First it was "Bush caused the flooding because he cut funding for levee work". Wrong... The Army Corps of Engineers is on record saying that the levies that broke were considered "fit" and weren't part of the cut funding.

Then there was the whole "Where are they?" accusation. The impression has been given by the administration's critics (including hizz'onor Nagin) that the Federal cavalry was supposed to ride in full force on Day 1. But in 2004 50 state and local Louisiana government and private organizations held a "Hurricane Pam" excercise that dealt with a scenario just like what we face in NO today. The various agencies shook hands on a plan that called for state and local agencies to be the first responders and were to run things for 3-5 days before the feds would be in a position to take things over for the long hual. It appears that FEMA had to rush into the vacuum created by the local and state agencies' implosion. Thus the "Where in the hell are they?" cries.

Now the latest tactic is to blame the "failure" on FEMA being part of the DHS. Clinton's head of FEMA is leading this bayonet charge against Bush. Funny, FEMA was widely praised in their efforts after last year's hurricane's that dealt Florida a series of body blows. So we're asked to believe that in the last 12 months FEMA "forgot" how to handle hurricane relief. Also, I don't recall Mr. Witt being asked to handle an area of destruction the size of Great Britain.

"Some officials in the stat... (Below threshold)
Barry Dauphin:

"Some officials in the state suspected a political motive behind the request. "Quite frankly, if they'd been able to pull off taking it away from the locals, they then could have blamed everything on the locals," said the source, who does not have the authority to speak publicly."

Read that carefully. If they had pulled off taking it away from the locals, they could have blamed everything on the locals??? What was the source smoking? Blame falls to those with the responsibility. If the Feds took control, they would have the blame. The state and city had control, therefore they had responsibility. So how does Blanco avoid accepting much resposibility and blame by refusing the Adminstration's memorandum? But the source's logic is making its way into Nagin's talking points, as he tries to blame everything on the Feds. We will need a full accounting of this, as Michael Brown is not looking to swift in addition to Blanco and Nagin. But it's interesting that Blanco was so worried about blame. That would be making a fetish out of appearances. They were worried about how it would "look."

You can't handle the tr... (Below threshold)
rayabacus:

You can't handle the truth and refuse to hear facts

How do you know Eddy? You haven't presented any. Hell, you've had three swings and haven't even come close to making contact.

Just be a good boy, and go lay down somewhere.

"So how does Blanco avoid a... (Below threshold)
Gizmo:

"So how does Blanco avoid accepting much resposibility and blame by refusing the Adminstration's memorandum?"

Simple, if they had ceded control and the Fed efforts then went well... the state and local governments could be left open to accusations that they had "failed" in their duties and the Feds had to bail them out. The question above would only make sense if the Gov knew the PR crap storm this thing was going to generate.

Eddy, knock of YOUR sexual ... (Below threshold)
-S-:

Eddy, knock of YOUR sexual obsessions and presumptions you can monitor the content of other people's thoughts and opinions.

I was wondering how many days we'd go before the homsexual card and issue was again thrown into the mix.

I can read the thread, I know who wrote what and when. And because someone else refers to "balls" is not a call to arms for homosexuals to ridicule others. Not everyone thinks about homosexuality when they read, see or hear the word. I bet you don't know that.

Gizmo: the levies that did... (Below threshold)
-S-:

Gizmo: the levies that did break were those that were, also, recently repaired. The ones that were cited as being in need of repairs remained in tact, or at least, have through now.

-S-,Correct... In ... (Below threshold)
Gizmo:

-S-,

Correct... In fact the 17th(?) St Canal Levee is/was a modern concrete levee and not one of the older style earthen ones. From what I read, it was a real shocker at the ACE that this one gave way.

Ray, Facts for You... (Below threshold)
EddyJ:

Ray,

Facts for You:

Bush=Dismal Failure, Inept Leader. Is that factual enough for you? Ok, perhaps you are waiting on the final death count to determine just how incompetent he, his FEMA & HOMELAND SECURITY DIRECTOR ARE before you believe the facts about the Vacationer-In-Chief. Until then, I guess you can keep listening to the spin (you must be so dizzy) and being in denial. George Bush will continue to live up to the soft bigotry of low expectations until you neo-con dimwits start demanding more. His Presidency has been a disaster - the War on Error and neglect of the Homeland (more facts) are proof of that.

Since Nagin was not eligibl... (Below threshold)
-S-:

Since Nagin was not eligible for another term in office, this is what he was thinkin' on August 31 and that is what the conditions in New Orleans were even without a Category Five Hurricane affecting the place -- excessive violence in the City, excessive crime.

Everyone should keep in mind that it takes SEVENTY-TWO HOURS to evacuate New Orleans (by their own emergency information). Nagin relented and ordered a "mandatory evacuation" on Sunday, around noon. Storm hit in the early Monday.


Here are the facts:

It takes 72 hours to evacuate New Orleans.

-- The state of emergency was declared on Friday. Katrina was forecast to make landfall in Louisiana as a Category 4 storm as of Friday at 7:00 PM CDT. (And President Bush advised an evacuation and emergency order at that time -- Louisiana's Governor and New Orleans' Mayor Nagin said they needed to think it over before issuing those/either or both -- meaning, federal "interruptions" to their authority were not allowed at that time.)

-- The voluntary evacuation notice was given Saturday afternoon at 2:30 PM CDT. Hurricane Katrina was officially identified as a Category Five storm a day earlier (night before this evac. notice was given).

-- The mandatory evacuation order was given Sunday at 9:30 AM CDT.

-- The storm hit the Louisiana coast on Monday morning at 6:00 AM CDT.

== "People who are unable to evacuate were told to immediately report to a designated shelter."

And Nagin left all those buses to sit there, refused anyone to use them, offered no arrangements otherwise for anyone who was not able to leave the City at that time on their own initiative.

It was a complete failure by local and state authority.

Bush=Dismal Failure, Ine... (Below threshold)
rayabacus:

Bush=Dismal Failure, Inept Leader. Is that factual enough for you?

Gee, that's a fact. Damn, you need to go to work at the LA Times. The like people that can insert opinion as fact. Hey, maybe they need a newsroom doggiel. You know, something they could pet and you could wag your tail and lick their hands.

...the War on Error and neglect of the Homeland (more facts) are proof of that.

There you go again....confused are you? Addled, maybe? You know, Eddy, you really ought to invest in a dictionary. That way youc would know what a fact is and know how it differs from your meaningless little opinion.

I was really serious about you becoming a newsroom puppy, though. I think you're perfect for it.

Gov. Kathleen Blanco, st... (Below threshold)
-S-:

Gov. Kathleen Blanco, standing beside the mayor at a news conference, said President Bush called and personally appealed for a mandatory evacuation for the low-lying city, which is prone to flooding."

KATC News Aug 28, 2005

EVACUATION ORDERED FOR N.O.
Aug 30, 2005, 02:17 AM

===========================================

WWL: "What do you need right now to get control of this situation?"

NAGIN: "I need reinforcements, I need troops, man. I need 500 buses, man. We ain't talking about -- you know, one of the briefings we had, they were talking about getting public school bus drivers to come down here and bus people out here.

"I'm like, 'You got to be kidding me. This is a national disaster. Get every doggone Greyhound bus line in the country and get their asses moving to New Orleans.'"


-S-I would have li... (Below threshold)
rayabacus:

-S-

I would have liked to have been a fly on the wall when Bush was having his little tete tete with Hizzoner.

I bet that was a real interesting conversation.

The pictures of the 250 NO ... (Below threshold)
Al:

The pictures of the 250 NO schoolbuses parked, driverless & flooded combined with that quote is EXTREMELY irritating.

Ray,Although I don't... (Below threshold)
EddyJ:

Ray,
Although I don't know what a "youc" is, I'll try to respond to your drivel. I gave you facts about the most incompetent President in history, but as with most neocons in denial, the truth is painful to hear. Fox News has really indoctrinated a lot of gullible folks like you. As Bush's ship is tanking and more lies unfolding, within the weeks to come you will probably realize that the days of covering up Bush's failures are long gone. The swiftboat tactics are no longer working. You have my deepest sympathy. I must be so painful having to defend the indefensible.

The picture of Bush strummi... (Below threshold)
EddyJ:

The picture of Bush strumming his guitar on Mondy with the country star and clueless to the destruction on the Gulf Coast has me irritated! His jovial nature in the face of death and despair also got on my last good nerve. What a galling display of fake sincerity. When is going to take those 2 days of vacation he had to give up. Cindy Sheehan and Katrina sure did a number on ol' Bushie and even his brain (slimeball Karl Rove) couldn't protect him. We need someone at the helm who knows how to be Presidential and doesn't have to be told what to do and stumbles over his words when trying to convey empathy and reading from the same ol' tired script.

Wow. Finally, a buncha folk... (Below threshold)

Wow. Finally, a buncha folks who get it. The failures here lie on the local and state level. I've been blogging about this for the last few days.

The libby-loons have no concept of the federal system, in which the states retain control of their lands, and the feds assist when asked.

Blanco not only had her own resources she failed to utilize, she had everything you see on the news at her disposal, she was just too inept to know what she needed.

Nagin? He's an illiterate buffoon.

You've gotta be kidding - R... (Below threshold)
EddyJ:

You've gotta be kidding - Ray is far more articulate than Bush who stumbles over every word that comes out of his mouth unless he has a TelePrompter. He's the one whose illiterate and incompetent and I seriously doubt that he actually got thru Yale. Oops, I forgot he was the benefactor of Affirmative Action. Nagin's failing pale in comparison to Bush's delayed reaction. The goodwill he got for 9-11 has all but vanished and we now see that he is not prepared to defend the homeland and has made a mess of Iraq. Death by GWB or Sadaam - pick your poison. Stop aiding and abetting the worst Pres in the history of our great democracy. Mission Unaccomplished!!

Head of FEMA, fired from pr... (Below threshold)
EddyJ:

Head of FEMA, fired from previous job and due to cronyism (roommate of his predecessor) he got the job. Isn't this the worst type of Affirmative Action you've ever seen. I guess he'll get a Medal of Honor for his heroism in helping coordinate the rescue efforts. Has Bush relapsed? His recent actions are scary and he has this spaced out look on his face all the time. All he seems to get excited about is tax cuts, exercising, chopping brush and bike riding (has fallen a few times and perhaps bumped his head?) He seems so detached and unconcerned as if he doesn't want the job that he bought but as we have found out was unqualified for. We need a real President, someone who knows how to take charge and work without a script.

Rove had better be cooking up some good shit to bail him, otherwise he's history.

"Rove had better be cooking... (Below threshold)
Gizmo:

"Rove had better be cooking up some good shit to bail him, otherwise he's history."

Apparently you haven't been talking to your fellow moonbat buddies lately.... The word is that Rove bumped off Rehnquist to take the heat off of him!

Eddy(J),Still wait... (Below threshold)
AnonymousDrivel:

Eddy(J),

Still waiting for facts from you over rambling, scattershot opinion self-described as fact. Apart from some posts from this site, might I suggest you peruse the following to see how thoughts and opinion are bolstered by fact (as the term is defined in any dictionary):

Protein Wisdom's 'Piecing together post-flood reaction'
Captain's Quarter's 'Katrina: Dry Run Taught New Orleans Nothing'
Captain's Quarter's 'Katrina: Why Didn't Nagin Follow His Own Plan?'

Those are starters and I leave it to your imagination and competence (*cough*) to search elsewhere.

Saying you hate Bush in any of a number of ways, while technically factual, does not mean you have contributed anything substantive other than a vented spleen - anatomy that is both greusome and compelling in its own warped way. Sometimes, I actually enjoy your rants because it's such a parody of what the far Left has become. You could make a verbatim skit of it and sell tickets. Just make sure barf-bags accompany the seats since some of the less hardened will be wholly repulsed.

Me? I want front row, center. I love a good tragecomedy.

Thanks but no thanks, I don... (Below threshold)
EddyJ:

Thanks but no thanks, I don't want to venture into your suggested websites. After the lies that the right and neocons have been churning for years, I prefer to do my own thinking. I refuse to be brainwashed. If you want to continue being in a state of denial and believing in the Vacationer-In-Chief while thousand die in the War on Error and the Gulf Coast tragedy, then go ahead. Bush's Presidency ended last week, so if you want to continue propping the empty leisure suit up, then go ahead. I prefer to hang out with truth tellers. Even some Repulsvicans with a conscience are jumping ship while you enablers of the President continue to push the propagnda. The chickens have come home to roost and finally America is waking up while the GOP is self destructing. God has a way of equalizing evil doing.

"Sorry if the truth ... (Below threshold)
B Moe:


"Sorry if the truth hurt but imagine if you were one of the citizens whose were not saved..."

Sorry but I honestly can't imagine being that stupid and lazy, because the cold hard facts are that is why most of them died. You want a survival plan for an emergency like that? Buy a gallon of water and some Toastchee, find a dry place and STFU for a couple days until someone can find you. It ain't rocket science.


RE: B Moe's post (September... (Below threshold)
AnonymousDrivel:

RE: B Moe's post (September 5, 2005 01:50 AM)
...You want a survival plan for an emergency like that? Buy a gallon of water and some Toastchee, find a dry place and STFU for a couple days until someone can find you. It ain't rocket science.

While what you say sounds superficially callous, it is valid. I've lived in the Caribbean's hurricane alley and that was what one did the instant one moved in... everyone knew this. We had several plastic, multi-gallon water jugs, canned food only with peel-away lids, kerosene cookers and lanterns with fuel, multiband radio with extra batteries, flashlights, candles, matches, and numerous other goodies all weather-proofed and ready to go. Furthermore, we lived inland, several miles from any beach and well above sea level in 1 and 1/2 ft wide concrete walled homes with flat roofs and iron rejas over fixed-metal "blinds".

Storms were routine but we were fortunate enough to not experience any L5s. Nevertheless, I'm certain our entire city would have fared just fine though the landscapes would have been thrashed (perhaps scoured). We were set to last at least two weeks without assistance barring some catastrophic medical injury requiring surgery. Our neighbors were too - they were more hardened than we were since we were non-natives. There was no pretense that the government was going to come save you should the worst hit one's home.

The US is not the Carribean... (Below threshold)
EddyJ:

The US is not the Carribean, you idiot, therefore there's no validity to Moe's 3 Stooges comment. This is American and we should be able to get water and food to folks when new crews and others were able to get thru. Admit, Bush and his inept crew dropped the ball and his Presidential legacy will be impacted by the greatest blunder of his reign. Our homeland is not as secure as folks thought under the 9-11 President and his mission has not been accomplished. You neocon moonbats are as clueless as your leader. You can't spin incompetence, no matter how you try, when thousands have lost their lies due to a slow, impassionate covservative government. As they say, Republicans are good at winning elections but they sure can't govern effectively. All smoke and mirrors!

RE: EddyJ's discombobulatio... (Below threshold)
AnonymousDrivel:

RE: EddyJ's discombobulation (September 5, 2005 02:25 AM)

Oh, goody! Act II has begun. Actually, it's transparently Act I in rerun... but who cares? Good thing I brought popcorn to the seat. It complements the nut on the stage. I wonder if this comedic debacle has an encore?

"This is American and we sh... (Below threshold)

"This is American and we should be able to get water and food to folks when new crews and others were able to get thru"

Of course, had the poor "victims" not been so lazy and stupid, they could have just followed the news crews back out.

Oh, and nobody has commente... (Below threshold)

Oh, and nobody has commented on our new, super-secret weapon, the steerable hurricane.

Bush guided that baby right up the pike, didn't he? Too cool!

Next, Atlanta, then Detroit. By end of the hurricane season, there won't be enough democrats left to fill a flooded bus!

Go, Bushitler!

Well Capitalist you live up... (Below threshold)
Americanfirst:

Well Capitalist you live up to your name. You sound like a true Republican. Calling the victims stupid.. Wow you guys really have stooped to a new low. For once why dont you call them what you really want to call them? Or do you not have the guts even in cyberspace???

No, Americanfirst, I think ... (Below threshold)

No, Americanfirst, I think "stupid" used to describe people who can't figure out how to get themselves out of trouble by following a road is the right term.

Now, just what term is it that you think I might be wanting to use?

So with your fine knowledge... (Below threshold)
Americanfirst:

So with your fine knowledge of FEMA how in the hell were they supposed to get out? Oh i know what term you wanted to use....

Anyone who thinks this was ... (Below threshold)
NtvAmrcn:

Anyone who thinks this was not a pretty successful effort is not thinking too clearly. What astounds me is no one has commented how incompetent the so called "reporters" and "journalists" are. I was discusted the other night when Gretta V Sustran was reporting on that young black man who "stole, commandeered, found", a bus and drove it to the Astrodome in Texas and arrived before all the other busses. THEN she actually appologized for feeling good about reporting on something so noble. I couldn't believe it.

If President Bush gets the ... (Below threshold)
Baggi:

If President Bush gets the blame for LA, does he get the credit for Mississippi?

How about the incredible response in N.Y. after 9/11?

What about Florida after the hurricanes?

Let's be real for a moment. The response to disaster in New York, Florida and Mississippi was perfect. The response in LA was horrific.

What's the difference that we can find in those four places that will help us avoid horrible disaster response in the future? What does New York, Florida and Mississippi have that LA doesn't? Hmmmm?

I have to disagree. The res... (Below threshold)
Americanfirst:

I have to disagree. The response in Florida was great because it was an election year and his brother was the Gov. For all 3 Florida hurricanes last year he was there within 72 hours and was passing out ice and water. I took him 5 days to get to Mississippi. This was not a sucessful effort. I was in Ft. Lauderdale when Andrew blew through and Bush I acted just like W is now......

Gee, I dunno, Americanfirst... (Below threshold)

Gee, I dunno, Americanfirst...maybe they could have tried walking...because sitting on their asses sure didn't work

Geez!I'm in the Gulf... (Below threshold)
Lunacy:

Geez!
I'm in the Gulf Coast. Just got my power back on. It took 9 days to get power on after Ivan. I'm lucky this time. Only 6 days. I've been surviving on the canned goods and candle light method. Batteries are a good thing!

I'm not believing the unrealistic expectations folks talking about New Orleans are voicing.

Those folks knew well in advance that this was a serious storm. Many chose to stay. Last night I watched Tim Russert talking to some man name Boussard?. He was crying because his friend's mom drowned. Well, shit! She revealed that his friend kept telling her someone would come, day 1, day 2, day 3. What the hell was happend day -2? THAT's when his pal should have gotten ma out the nursing home! THAT's the day Nagin should have loaded those school buses and got folks out. THAT's the day Nagin should have called for rations to be brought into the Superdome! You can't haul that many people out a city that size in a day.

Got friends who left NO to come here. Over beers they tell me Mayor Nagin didn't want folks to leave. Didn't want the responsibility or liability. They say folk didn't want to leave because last big storm they got to live out the storm in a high end hotel courtesy of the city.

The fault here, in my humble opinion, lies with the long term corruption in the state of Louisiana and the City of New Orleans. How many years between Camille and Katrina? 40? You reckon a stronger levee system might have helped? I read it costs 2.5 million to build. They probably spend that on Mardi Gras. We can hold back the Columbia River but we can't keep Lake Ponchatrain out New Orleans twice a century?

And while the media are all livid over New Orleans and tossing race baits out, does anyone know how the folks in Waveland, Pass Christian, Biloxi, Hattisburg, Gulf Port, Bayou la Baitre, Grand Bay and Dauphin Island are fairing?????

I didn't think so. Media doesn't care about poor white folk. It doesn't fit their politcal agenda.

Lunacy

I'd be walking if I were st... (Below threshold)
Lunacy:

I'd be walking if I were stuck in NO without a car. But there are many folk who can't walk. THAT's who Nagin et al should have been locating and moving out days before. It really is his fault and it really is criminal.

L

The news crews were ... (Below threshold)
B Moe:


The news crews were mostly already there, and the ones that came in later were traveling light. Are you really so dim-witted you don't know the difference logistically between moving two people and a camera and food and water for 100,000 people. No wonder you geniuses think Haliburton is over-paid. And everybody who stayed didn't do so because they had no option. Many had cars and chose to ride it out because leaving was a pain in the ass, many could have gotten rides and didn't bother, just like they didn't bother to take a fuggin' bottle of water with them to the shelter. Do you really think if a poor family with a couple of kids walked out by the interstate and stuck out their thumb NOBODY would give them a ride? People have to take care of themselves first. The government can't do everything for you.

Michelle Malkin's <a href="... (Below threshold)

Michelle Malkin's THE NEW ORLEANS P.D. MELTDOWN is a must read. From the post you will find a transcript of a DOD National Guard briefing by Lt. GEN. BLUM:

From the transcript of the Department of Defense Briefing we find this:

Q: One quick follow-up. Is it fair to say, using the convention center as an example, that one reason it took until Friday to get aid in is the National Guard needed time to build up a response team with military police to ensure law and order because the New Orleans Police Department had degraded so much?

GEN. BLUM: That is not only fair, it is accurate. You've concisely stated exactly what was needed, and I told you why. We took the time to build the right force. The outcome was superb. No lives hurt, nobody injured. It was done almost invisibly.

It appears that the military assessed the situation and thought more harm would be done by responding with a small and inappropriate contingency.

Is there any doubt of the field day the liberal MSM would have had if a small, inexperienced, unqualified group of National Guardsmen showed up, killed lawless civilians, possibly some innocents as well, while defending themselves in a attempt to assist with NO Convention Center and Superdome, no matter how altruistic their intentions might have been?

Looks to me like a conscious 'triage' decision was made for the greater good in light of the situation.
That's what experienced leaders like Gen. Blum are paid to do. Make the tough joices that on the surface look wrong but in the end save more lives than they risk.

"People have to take care o... (Below threshold)
mac:

"People have to take care of themselves first. The government can't do everything for you"

Well done Moe, you finally hit the nail on the head!
these "libs" (what a misnomer, BTW) are always looking for the fed to bail them out of everything!
Eddy, your are a fool, or can you really be that stupid!
This whole race issue is disgusting, the way the major networks handled this tragedy is disgusting,
I don't think I can ever watch the "so called" news again!
Of course some people are going to panic and not provide properly for themselves in an emergency, also, some will be very stubborn about leaving all they have behind, and still some others will just refuse to believe the situation is THAT serious, after all, wasn't it just last year that they faced a similar situation and safely weathered that storm?
Now, this said, how is the government supposed to step in like "BIg Brother" , magically figure out who these folks are, and rescue them?
It's the local authorities who should have been prepared, and able to act quickly, even if it had turned out not to be such a disaster, better to be safe then sorry!
I can only hope that this painful lesson will be worthy of sacrifices made by too many people because of this incompetency!

It's bizzare watching folks... (Below threshold)

It's bizzare watching folks who have no idea of the logistical complexity of providing aid in an area where damn near everything's wiped out = INCLUDING damn near every means of getting aid INTO the area.

Railways: Gone.
Roads: Gone.
Airports: Flooded and unusable.


Only 4 days to start getting the aid in? That's a damn miracle in my book. My hat's off to the logistics planners on this - and a pint of blood and $150 to the Red Cross, to boot.

Hey, EddyJ - just because Domino's can get you your pizza in 30 minutes doesn't mean FEMA can get thousands of tons of food and water into an area in 4 days when there's no way to transport the stuff on the ground, and noplace to land it by air.

As far as by sea - it'd take time to get the supplies to the docks, the ships loaded, sail them up the Mississippi, and then HOPE that you can find both a working dock and transportation facilities to distribute the stuff once you get it there.

Logistics is a vastly underrated component of any operation, be it civil disaster relief or military.

J.

My Bad!In the middle... (Below threshold)
mac:

My Bad!
In the middle of this mess, I must revise my previous assessment of "incompetency".
I keep forgetting that thousands of people were successfully rescued and aid is still getting there.Logistics sure do get underestimated. Not to mention the incredible generosity of the american people who seem to have ever deepening pockets when it comes to donating $$ for these relief efforts! Kudos to the military,Red Cross and other relief orgs., and God bless to all who helped make a difference, you know who you are...
Also, it is always so easy to, how do they say, "monday morning football" is that right?
M.

I quite agree, having said ... (Below threshold)

I quite agree, having said something like this on my own blog yesterday. Fact is, I see a massive wave of lawsuits against any government official that MOVES after this. But the ones against the Feds won't stick. The Governor and local officials, for all the hype of those going after Bush right now, are the ones going to be fried here.

In fact, in spite of all the yowling, at the very worst point in all this, with the dead estimated in the tens of thousands, does the public blame Bush? ABC News says 44% yes, 55% no. Bush-bashers now will call the majority idiots, further alienating them.

This all comes down to a si... (Below threshold)
bereal:

This all comes down to a simple question.

What was the plan? Everyone knew a category 4 or 5 hurricane would not only cause massive damage, but could also cause the levees to overflow or break, causing the flooding of New Orleans.

So if everyone knew, what was the plan? Obviously local police and state national guard would not be able to handle this alone, so what was the plan to coordinate with other state national guards and with the U.S. government, including the military.

A plan lays out who will do what with which resources. If there was not plan, every single politician in Louisiana and every official connected with disaster planning in the U.S. government should resign in shame.

So far, it looks like the plan was "see if the locals can handle it, when they fail, make them sign over complete control to the military and then we'll start pulling some resources together". If that was the plan, they should be ashamed of themselves and they are responsible for the needless deaths of thousands of people.

If you are going to be a leader, you have to have plans in place, and contingency plans for when your plans fail. If you are just running this thing by the seat of your pants you are not a leader, you are a hazard to public safety.

An emailer pointed out to m... (Below threshold)

An emailer pointed out to me that my comment above should read:

"Looks to me like a conscious 'triage' decision was made for the greater good in light of the situation.
Make the tough choices [instead of joices...not sure how I typed that out ] that on the surface look wrong but in the end save more lives than they risk."

I apologize for the mangling... :)

So if everyone knew, wha... (Below threshold)
rayabacus:

So if everyone knew, what was the plan?

Go here and you will be able to read the plan.

The Federal government assists the local government. The Locals are always in coltrol. Most everyone bashing the Feds, it seems to me, are lazy - both physically and intellectualy. They won't take the time to learn anything about what transpired, who was responsible for what part of what, what the law says the Feds and Locals can and can not do and what preparations were put in place by what agencies.

A post up above listed 4 sites that have comprehensive analysis, complete with facts and links, that you could go to and learn some facts about what actually transpired and who did what.

So if you have an argument that consists of whining about the FEMA response, go find some action they did or did not do. Simply stating that they are incompetent, without facts to back up that assertion, is not an argument.

The simple fact is Governor... (Below threshold)
MichaelS:

The simple fact is Governor Blanco refused to give up her authority over police and national guard troops. Another simple fact is things are under control now WITHOUT Blanco having to give up her authority as Bush so desperately wanted.

Another simple fact is ... (Below threshold)
rayabacus:

Another simple fact is things are under control now WITHOUT Blanco having to give up her authority as Bush so desperately wanted.

Operable word being "now". Perhaps if she had acceded to his request earlier, things might or might not have gone smoother. We'll never know. I do think that the whole scenarior will be replayed during Cong hearings.

The following post reviews ... (Below threshold)

The following post reviews details directly from Louisiana's Homeland Security Emergency Preparedness site discussing Louisiana's first responder responsibilites:

The Federal/State of Louisiana emergency response agreement

Post contains diagrams and specific text passages from the federal plan, published on Louisiana's site.

After reviewing the information, you should also conclude that the President's and federal response should actually be applauded instead of derided.

I have read the plans. Any... (Below threshold)
really:

I have read the plans. Any person who spends 20 minutes thinking about the realities of evacuating a city the size of New Orleans would figure out that it requires local, state, and federal COOPERATION. There is no way a local government can evacuate and secure a city with only 1500 police officers and then after the storm immediately perform both security and rescue operations with that number of people.

There is only one person what can make SURE that the local, state and federal agencies/departments are working together. That person is the President of the United States. Unfortunately for the poor people of New Orleans, the President was on vacation, the FEMA director was overwhelmed, and the head of DHS seems to have been getting his briefings from reading the newspaper. Too bad he didn't watch Fox News or he would have learned much earlier what the hell was going on.

Obviously once the military kicked into gear, they got the Superdome and Convention center cleared out in two days. If the President had been on the job and had been acting as a leader, he could have broken through the red tape in 10 minutes on the second day and those people would not have suffered and died the way they did.

The military were waiting for a mission and the President was playing golf while American citizens were dying from lack of food and water in a major American city.

President Bush let us down. I'm sorry I voted for him (twice). I would have never believed his administration would be so incompetent.

Oh. My. God.So the... (Below threshold)
Jack:

Oh. My. God.

So the mayor is saying that President Bush PERSONALLY delayed aid for 24 hours because he wanted to force the Governor to sign an unneccessary piece of paper?!

I don't believe President Bush would do that. I just don't believe it.

I can't stop thinking about... (Below threshold)
Jack:

I can't stop thinking about this. There is one possible reason I can imagine President Bush getting caught up in 24 hours of red tape instead of cutting through it.

It's possible the President was getting bad advice. In particular, bad advice from his military adivisors. Bush himself is not schooled in the specific legal relationships between state and federal entities. It's possible his people told him that they HAD to have this agreement from the Governor and he only found out later

It wouldn't be the first time his military advisors let him down in the planning area, as we all know.

A stronger President would have cut through this in a minute. Unfortunately President Bush seems to be so committed to a fully delegated government that he can't seem to take back the reins when he needs to.

Delegation is fine when you can trust your people.

Yeah...I'm really effing pi... (Below threshold)
moseby:

Yeah...I'm really effing pissed that the President wasn't down there with millions of electric fans diverting the hurricane. Goll-dern tax cuts for the rich prevented any chance of that....

I believe we're seeing just... (Below threshold)
Martin A Knight:

I believe we're seeing just how deeply the Left actually misunderstands the United States' Constitution.

Jack ... you cannot possibly be this ignorant. The President did not appoint the Governor of Louisiana. And as such he did not delegate any power to her. That delegation was done by the people of Louisiana when they elected her.

Bush therefore had absolutely no power to override her authority, anymore than he could force her to cut state taxes or appoint someone he picks to sit on the LA Supreme Court. She HAD to give it up or else his hands are tied. The officers in the LA National Guard could disobey his orders.

This is quite simple. What you call red tape is the reason why this nation is a free nation.

Martin, I am intimately fam... (Below threshold)
Jack:

Martin, I am intimately familiar with the Constitution. And with the number of times in history that Presidents taken a bold action even though it technically violated the law. (Lincoln, Teddy Roosevelt, Harry Truman, etc.).

The problem for the President is that his macho bluff (or whatever the hell that was) didn't work. History will show that the Governor of LA did the right thing. She did NOT cede control of the LA National Guard to the President.

Yet somehow, even though she did not cede control, the Superdome and Convention Center got cleared out. How, with COOPERATION between the Guard, the Navy, the 82 Airborne and others. That's what

Personally I think the reason we finally saw the rescue of those people is that Geraldo and Shep Smith were crying and begging live on Fox News. Now that is some bad PR. Just the fact that they were able to broadcast live from there for 4 days -- while administration officials first denied the problem and then said they couldn't get in -- is an embarassment to the Administration.

No, I don't think Bush and the Administration were responsible for the hurricane or the flood. They were responsible for the response to the hurrican and the flood.

If they can't handle an event like this, with all the foreknowlege they had, how are they going to handle a dirty bomb in downtown Phoenix or a chemical explosion in Manhattan or a major earthquake in San Francisco?

I'm not interested in the politics of this. I'm interested in the results. I believe it is immoral to ask for a position of leadership and then refuse to lead, especially when so many lives are at stake.

Shouldn't post when I'm tir... (Below threshold)
Jack:

Shouldn't post when I'm tired. Let's try this paragraph again...

Yet somehow, even though she did not cede control, the Superdome and Convention Center got cleared out. How? With COOPERATION between the Guard, the Navy, the 82 Airborne and others. That's what should have happened in the first place.

" Once the situation is sta... (Below threshold)
Lightning Joe:

" Once the situation is stable and re-building has begun, the left will demand a "Katrina Comission" to white wash the record...just like 9/11."

History revision in action here. The 9/11 Commission was a whitewash job, yes; but for the administration. They glossed over any hint that Bush should have known and taken action on specific warnings by his staff regarding impending terrorist acts.

We lefties *will* demand an independent investigation, yes; but we won't stand for any whitewash.

B Moe, FEMA was turning awa... (Below threshold)
Lightning Joe:

B Moe, FEMA was turning away help, in small and large lots. If they couldn't handle the situation, why did they set themselves up as the field authority? They certainly did take charge in the authority sphere. Check the Red Cross website; they were told they could not take food and water into NO, because FEMA did not want to encourage people to stay in the city.

Problem was, no one was being allowed to leave. Walking doesn't do it, if police on the bridges out are shooting over your heads to turn you back from their largely unflooded city and parish.

Capitalist, whether or not ... (Below threshold)
Lightning Joe:

Capitalist, whether or not it was race-based (and the blacks at subject most certainly think it was), the fact is that no one was allowed to walk out of NO. FEMA seems to have had the motivation to force them to do so. At least that was the reason they gave the Red Cross, for not allowing them in to distribute food and water.

But Gretna and Jefferson Parish police blocked the bridges that led out from the Superdome and the Convention Center, pointing their weapons and firing shotguns over the heads of any approaching the bridge.

Maybe they would have let a right-wing Bush supporter through, but i kinda don't think you would have wanted to chance it, either. Welcome (back) to the Superdome.

And, oh yeah, they were actually *locked* into the Convention Center.

For Lightning Joe <p... (Below threshold)
rick:

For Lightning Joe

Hurricane Katrina: Why is the Red Cross not in New Orleans?


Acess to New Orleans is controlled by the National Guard and local authorities and while we are in constant contact with them, we simply cannot enter New Orleans against their orders.

The state Homeland Security Department had requested--and continues to request--that the American Red Cross not come back into New Orleans following the hurricane. Our presence would keep people from evacuating and encourage others to come into the city.

http://www.redcross.org/faq/0,1096,0_682_4524,00.html

State NOT fed.

R.




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