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Ann, stay off our side

There were a lot of stories to be told at the 33rd annual Conservative Political Action Conference in Washington, D.C., this week. Conservatives from all over the country gathered to discuss immigration both legal and illegal, the economy, the size and scope of government, national defense and homeland security, all the favorite conservative issues. There were big ideas, big subjects, big questions of policy and basic political philosophy.

Which is why it's such a crying shame that the big story turned out to be a few intemperate words tossed off carelessly by a speaker more interested in making a buck than inspiring her audience.

On Friday, controversial conservative columnist and author Ann Coulter -- on her way to a well-attended book signing on the show floor -- addressed the assembled attendees at CPAC 2006 with a speech that blogger Sean Hackbarth called bad stand-up comedy with a conservative schtick. Sean was being too generous. In fact, Coulter sailed right past the bounds of good taste, past her usual tactlessness, past the furthest extent of what could be considered socially acceptable discourse.

During her prepared remarks, on the subject of Iran, Coulter said, "Maybe they do [have nuclear weapons], maybe they don't, but they're certainly acting like they do. ... If you don't want to get shot by the police, don't point a gun at them. Or as I think our motto should be, post 9/11," Coulter said, "'Raghead talks tough, raghead faces consequences.'"

Six words. That's all it took. That's all it took to derail the entire conference. That's all it took to confirm every negative stereotype about conservatives. We're no longer smart, driven, sincere people who are trying to raise the level of public debate and shape the future of our country for the better. Now we're all just a bunch of bigots. Now that's the story.

Thanks a lot, Ann.

A prominent conservative blogger who's covering the conference with me describes Ann Coulter as a "gateway conservative." Because she's so controversial, Ann Coulter attracts the attention of people who wouldn't ordinarily find themselves drawn to conservative political thought. They start out reading her, then they get exposed to columnists like Charles Krauthammer and Michael Barone and George Will, and they "mature a little in their political philosophy."

I think that's a valid point. I think that there's something to be said for appealing to people who respond to vitriol and bile and righteous anger in order to get them thinking about more nuanced issues. But there are two major problems with that approach, and because of them I think figures like Ann Coulter end up doing more harm than good.

Every time Ann Coulter gets up and calls Iranians -- or Iraqis, or Jordanians, or Saudis or Pakistanis or Yemenis or Afghans or Sudanese or whomever because really, aren't they all pretty much the same anyway? -- "ragheads," she gets the attention of people who think she's right on. She gets thunderous applause from the members of her audience who share her anger at and disgust with the Muslim fundamentalists who are presently waging their diffuse little war against civilization.

But she also attracts the attention of people from both the left and the right who think that there are better ways of expressing anger than flinging outrageous and condescending ethnic slurs around. And at that moment, she's not just Ann Coulter. She's an icon of the entire conservative movement. She is the conservative movement. When she says "raghead" live on C-SPAN in front of a sign that says "Conservative Political Action Conference," she's speaking for all of us.

And a whole lot of us wish she'd just shut up.

The other problem is even worse, if considerably less obvious. Yes, conservatism is the big tent. Yes, ours is the political philosophy of pluralism and tolerance. Yes, we advocate a marketplace of ideas, where any reasonable position deserves to be heard and included.

But seriously, do we really want to include people who think that the best way to address geopolitical tensions is to throw the word "raghead" around? Are these the people we really want to invite to our party?

There are those out there who think that controversial speech should be controlled by the government. There are those who think that saying things like what Ann Coulter said -- or publishing editorial cartoons deemed by some to be sacriligious -- should be against the law. These people clearly have the wrong idea. But just because Ann Coulter should be allowed, by law, to say whatever she wants to whichever audience chooses to invite her, so also should she be held responsible for saying things that do more harm than good. And calling people "ragheads" to resounding applause certainly does more harm than good. Harm to the conservative cause, harm to east-west relations and harm to the national discourse.

Ann, seriously. From now on, just stay off our side.


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Comments (131)

Hey Jeff,Lighten up ... (Below threshold)
Paul:

Hey Jeff,
Lighten up and stop taking yourself and the conservative cause so seriously...that's the liberal Dems job. Ann's got it right - they ARE ragheads Jeff...who, well, essentially want to KILL US! You, me and any other western infidel. And if we can't laugh at 'em Jeff, we might start wringing our hands, and trying to rationalize and apologize...but oh that's right - it's the liberal Dems and their lapdogs the MSM who do that for us right Jeff...?

Great piece; describes exac... (Below threshold)

Great piece; describes exactly how I felt when I heard about Coulter's comments.

Jeff,Leave Ann alone... (Below threshold)
cryinginthewilderness:

Jeff,
Leave Ann alone. What the hell's wrong with you?

I am a hard-core conservati... (Below threshold)
Matt:

I am a hard-core conservative. I have tried reading Ann Coulter's books. After the first chapter or two, I start wishing she would shut up and stop whining. Then I remember it is a book, close it and return it to the library (I wouldn't spend my own money on her).

I think we need more people... (Below threshold)
von:

I think we need more people like her that aren't afraid to stand up and speak their mind.

While it's not appropriate ... (Below threshold)
Mike:

While it's not appropriate for Ann to use a cultural slur in her speech, I can't help but notice that the same liberals who now have their panties in a knot over Ann's language seem to have no problem at all when their own minions refer to devout Christians as "fundies" and "christers." Or when Howard Dean declared that all Republicans "look alike." Or when Robert Byrd casually tossed out a phrase like "white n****r" during a TV interview.

So Jeff, it's nice that you... (Below threshold)
Chris:

So Jeff, it's nice that you're trying to disavow the comments of Ann Coulter, who has done as much as anyone to poison the discourse in this country. But so far from the comments I'd say your notion that she doesn't represent conservative thought is just wishful thinking.

Lighten up and stop taki... (Below threshold)
Robert:

Lighten up and stop taking yourself and the conservative cause so seriously...that's the liberal Dems job. Ann's got it right - they ARE ragheads Jeff...who, well, essentially want to KILL US!

This statement is one of the reasons I could never be a Republican.

Racism sucks.

So what race are ragheads, ... (Below threshold)
B Moe:

So what race are ragheads, then?

Ann may be dangerous, but a... (Below threshold)

Ann may be dangerous, but at least she hasn't decapitated anyone...yet.

The Mobys are out in force ... (Below threshold)
JohnAnnArbor:

The Mobys are out in force today.

Call a raghead a raghead. ... (Below threshold)
DJFelix:

Call a raghead a raghead. I think it's a perfect derrogitory term for people who subjugate their women by forcing them to cover their face, for fear of being raped. I agree with Ann whole-heartedly. If more conservatives "had the balls" to say half the stuff Ann says, perhaps we'd be better respected.

Was it a demeaning thing to say? Yes. Do they deserve it? Absolutely. Could she have said it worse? Aboslutely. I can think of quite a few other epithet's to throw out that would probably get me banned from the comment system. Raghead is one of the most tame, and I don't see what the big deal is.

At least she didn't call them liberals. That would be unforgivable ;)

So Jeff, it's nice that ... (Below threshold)

So Jeff, it's nice that you're trying to disavow the comments of Ann Coulter, who has done as much as anyone to poison the discourse in this country. But so far from the comments I'd say your notion that she doesn't represent conservative thought is just wishful thinking.

That's true. Conservatives do have a problem with this sort of thing, and if it gets progressively worse, one day we'll be nearly as poisonous and hate-filled as liberals.

OK ... I stand corrected ..... (Below threshold)
DJFelix:

OK ... I stand corrected ... I went and read Ann's latest column and there right at the end ... she does call them liberals.

That is absolutely terrible to use such a foul word. To call someone a liberal is just horrible. Ann needs to apologize for that immediately ...

OregonMuse,It woul... (Below threshold)
Sheik Yur Bouty:

OregonMuse,

It would take us decades of falling in the gutter to get that bad.

-syb

Now we're all just a bun... (Below threshold)
Beth:

Now we're all just a bunch of bigots. Now that's the story.

Hang on a second. I'd be willing to bet MOST Americans, left or right, have said "ragheads" (or worse--Google it and things like "camel-f*cker," "goat-f*cker," etc., just for the internet talk), especially right after 9/11. Ann Coulter just didn't lose the post-9/11 rage like so many others have. And obviously, in a statement like "Raghead talks tough, raghead faces consequences," she's referring to the Ahmedenijads and Saddams and Mullah Omars and bin Ladens of the world. I'd call that bunch something a whole lot worse than "raghead." I just don't see how she was talking about Joe Schmo Muslim.

I'm tired of making excuses for people on the right because we're worried about what a bunch of f'n barking moonbats who say MUCH WORSE will think of us. No matter what we say about others' derogatory remarks, it's not going to change their minds.

Why let them--those who slander "us"--frame the debate? As far as I'm concerned, the REAL racism is practiced in left-wing policies, no matter how pretty they talk. The low expectations, the nanny state, forbidding the poor to get a decent education with school choice and school vouchers, calling REAL "progressives" (those who advocate doing things differently) things like "Uncle Tom," "Aunt Jemima," "house n****r," and other inexcusable, blatantly racist euphemisms, just because they don't follow the left-wing Party Line. Which is worse? Saying "ragheads" about despotic Muslim leaders and terrorists, or using racist language against Americans serving their country?

I'd seriously be interested in hearing how many Americans (or Europeans, for that matter) haven't said "ragheads." And remember, this stuff is just the way things are in human nature--people said "gooks" about the Vietnamese, remember? In every war, there's a slur for the enemy. We're not going to stop it by playing the politically correct game, either. If it's troublesome, then don't say it yourself.

Ann wouldnt have the popu... (Below threshold)
CarScenic:

Ann wouldnt have the popularity she enjoys if she wasn't saying what the Right was at least thinking or murmuring under their own breath.

There is no excuse for Coul... (Below threshold)

There is no excuse for Coulter to use that term. She's a lawyer and knows exactly what phrases are leaving that mouth, especially during a prepared speech.

I don't care that leftists are hypocrits on this basis. They have to live with more ideologically bad ideas then mere criticism. But those right of center should never let ourselves be defined by their hypocrisy.

And we should never let such base collectivism such as racism be go unchallenged when it rears its ugly head within the conservative/libertarian camp.

It is time to stop inviting Coulter to events for grown-ups.

It's refreshing to see some... (Below threshold)
tony:

It's refreshing to see some conservative bloggers here denouncing Ann Coulter, but unfortunate that more of you are defending her (DJFelix comes to mind). She's as much an asshole as any left wing know nothing talking head. It's too bad that voters don't realize that people like Ann Coulter are getting very rich creating a divisive electorate, and that it has real and negative repercussions on what will happen to this country down the road. And it isn't very difficult to go on the web and see how much of what she says is misleading and false.

Comment to Mike: as a liberal Christian, not once in my life have I heard anyone ever make a reference to "fundies" or "christers". I think it's just another myth to believe that all religious people in this country are conservatives.

I would now point to the id... (Below threshold)

I would now point to the idiocy mouthed by CarScenic as the fallout to be expected by the deliberate asshattery uttered by Coulter.

I think Jeff has a valid po... (Below threshold)
Scott:

I think Jeff has a valid point about how Ann's comments will be interpreted, but I think that he and anyone else who 'doesn't get it' will cause as much trouble as the remarks themselves. She could have used 'terrorist' instead of 'raghead', but terrorist could refer to the likes of the IRA, who clearly her comments aren't aimed at. Is she referring to all arabs/muslims as ragheads? No. It was clearly referring to those who threaten Western civilization and intended to be offensive to them. It's no different to using a racial epithet rather than a swear word against someone who is stealing your car. It doesn't make you a racist, it just allows those who don't take into account the context to block themselves off even further from the intended message.

ScottWe have enoug... (Below threshold)

Scott

We have enough of Coulter's context, for several years ago, to know she is being racist in this regard.

The Left enables Gore, Uncle Teddy, Dean the Scream in their addled, degenerate rants with the excuse of "hey, look at the context..they are really saying ...." I refuse to play that game just because a person claims to be conservative.

We are all so politically c... (Below threshold)
BluesHarper:

We are all so politically correct now a days that everyone seems to be "sensitive". Everyone is offended by everything.
Sticks and stones....
Grow up.
Callous up.
What a bunch of cry-babies.
Go ahead and call me a kraut or any other name.
And - If the shoe fits...
Mommy, Mommy, Billy threw sand in my hair.

For Ann it is just about ma... (Below threshold)
NeilS:

For Ann it is just about making money. She has learned that the more outrageous your statements, the more talk shows you are invited to and the more books you sell. Follow the money.

I'm convinced, no more "rag... (Below threshold)

I'm convinced, no more "raghead" remarks for me. How about "death-cult murderers"? Like that better?

No, dchamil, I like "Moon-G... (Below threshold)
Beth:

No, dchamil, I like "Moon-God Death Cult" better. ;-)

Why is "raghead" so much more offensive than the Mohammed cartoons? (It's not, to Muslims.) How many who are pissed at Coulter were pissed at the cartoons?

This is really funny. Is yo... (Below threshold)
Chris:

This is really funny. Is you guys' answer to everything "at least we're not as bad as the liberals?" Besides the fact that that's just not accurate, the bigger question is, is that really how you define yourselves?

These comments are providing more insight than you realize. This notion that we all use racial epithets is just false. I was as pissed as anyone after 9/11, and it just didn't occur to me to call anyone a "raghead." Not that I'm particularly pure, I just don't remember anyone I know using the term. And if a black guy's stealing my car, I don't call him nigger. I guess the logic is, if someone's bad we're free to use racial epithets. So let's call Tookie a nigger, and explain that we don't mean all black people. That will really help your cause.

And Darleen, it's kind of stupid for you to refer to CarScenic's comments as idiocy, when virtually every other comment on this board is bearing him out. Look at the number of people who are defending using racist terms. Just keep telling yourselves that everyone does it, so you don't have to face up to what you really are.

It's refreshing to see s... (Below threshold)

It's refreshing to see some conservative bloggers here denouncing Ann Coulter, but unfortunate that more of you are defending her (DJFelix comes to mind). She's as much an asshole as any left wing know nothing talking head. It's too bad that voters don't realize that people like Ann Coulter are getting very rich creating a divisive electorate, and that it has real and negative repercussions on what will happen to this country down the road.

You know what's cool about this is that we're actually having this discussion here on this conservative blog. What would be even cooler, though, would be to see similar self-examination on, for example, the DailyKos or Atrios blogs concerning the more or less continuous stream of invective and hate rhetoric coming from their side of the aisle.

I would no more use the ter... (Below threshold)

I would no more use the term "raghead" then I would "nigger" "kike" or "wog". The terms are irredeemable, regardless of context.

Islamists are fascists. Theirs is a bloody ideology that extends beyond Arab stereotypes (Indonesia, anyone?!). The Danish cartoons easily demonstrate the violence and evil at the bottom of this particular ideology (modern echo of Krystallnach).

Let's not obfuscate the moral argument of defeating this evil ideology with appeals to racism.

Darleen, "But those right o... (Below threshold)
Beth:

Darleen, "But those right of center should never let ourselves be defined by their hypocrisy."

I'm saying we shouldn't be defined by their slander. I sleep soundly at night knowing that we are not the racists--although in EVERY group, there are exceptions. I just refuse to accept their characterization of us as racist because of what ANN COULTER says.

And the context does matter. It's not like she said "kick out all the ragheads" or something; she was talking about the Iranian crisis. I'd call that crazy Ahmedenijad and those like him something a LOT more offensive than "raghead."

And to you leftards like CarScenic: you're not fooling anyone, you morons. We don't "murmur things under our breath" like you cloaked racists do. We say what we think, because we have nothing to be ashamed of. That's the difference between us. You scumbags say things under your breath and to each other, but talk in PUBLIC with the politically correct voice/Party Line, and you know it. Liars. If you leftards had that bleeding heart, you'd stop lying to those you mock amongst yourselves with your racist beliefs and policies.

Murmur that sh*t under your breath, moonbats.

Yes, Chris..."every other c... (Below threshold)

Yes, Chris..."every other comment on this board" is all of the Right.

meshugga

BethI meant that t... (Below threshold)

Beth

I meant that this argument over what is/is not acceptable adult behavior should be ours to make regardless of what the morally bankrupt babies of the Left Cult have to say.

Ann is no silly ninny so I must assume her remarks were deliberate. I find them unacceptable because I assume she would be perfectly aware of their reception to most people who reject the collectivism of racism.

She was fired from National Review for good reason. This event just underlines the wisdom of NR.

It is more than a bit instr... (Below threshold)
Bat One:

It is more than a bit instructive that while there are all sorts of conservative voices raised against Ann Coulter and her performance at CPAC, from John Hinderaker to Ed Morrissey to Jeff Harrell, etc., I can't recall any similar leftwing voices raised against the Democrats' more hateful, virulently-tenored adolescents.

And even at here most "inappropriate" or "intemperate"," Coulter does not descend to the potty-mouth level of rhetoric made so famous by the angry left. It should be a well-accepted fact that in most areas of public behavior, conservatives are far, far more principled than are our leftist brethren.

The commentary of Jeff Harrell, Rick Moran, and all the others merely proves the point.

Beth:You seem real... (Below threshold)
rachel:

Beth:

You seem really angry. Here's something that (if you're honest with yourself) should get you really pissed off. But can you turn that pent-up anger you have on the White House? Read on...

Nuking the Economy
By PAUL CRAIG ROBERTS

Last week the Bureau of Labor Statistics re-benchmarked the payroll jobs data back to 2000. Thanks to Charles McMillion of MBG Information Services, I have the adjusted data from January 2001 through January 2006. If you are worried about terrorists, you don't know what worry is.

Job growth over the last five years is the weakest on record. The US economy came up more than 7 million jobs short of keeping up with population growth. That's one good reason for controlling immigration. An economy that cannot keep up with population growth should not be boosting population with heavy rates of legal and illegal immigration.

Over the past five years the US economy experienced a net job loss in goods producing activities. The entire job growth was in service-providing activities--primarily credit intermediation, health care and social assistance, waiters, waitresses and bartenders, and state and local government.

US manufacturing lost 2.9 million jobs, almost 17% of the manufacturing work force. The wipeout is across the board. Not a single manufacturing payroll classification created a single new job.

more...
Paul Craig Roberts was Assistant Secretary of the Treasury in the Reagan administration. He was Associate Editor of the Wall Street Journal editorial page and Contributing Editor of National Review. He is coauthor of The Tyranny of Good Intentions.He can be reached at: [email protected]

And before anyone starts ranting about "liberal" this and that, note this information comes from a former Reagan official and Wall Street Journal editor. Now, how angry are we at Bush for lying about the economy?

This notion that we all ... (Below threshold)
Beth:

This notion that we all use racial epithets is just false. I was as pissed as anyone after 9/11, and it just didn't occur to me to call anyone a "raghead." Not that I'm particularly pure, I just don't remember anyone I know using the term. And if a black guy's stealing my car, I don't call him nigger. I guess the logic is, if someone's bad we're free to use racial epithets.

I didn't say we all say nigger, nor do I approve of it out of anyone's mouth, under any circumstances. It's funny how YOU immediately thought of "stealing my car" as an example, though. Talk about enlightening.

I still believe most Americans HAVE said "raghead" (or some variation), regardless of whether people will admit it. I know I said "motherf*cking ragheads" on 9/11, and I'd say it again.

I guess the logic is, if someone's bad we're free to use racial epithets.

When it refers to murderous people who want us all headless (or nuked) or praying to their moon-god five times a day, well, YEAH. I'll excuse it. I think "raghead" is a lame word compared to what I call them, though. But pardon me for dehumanizing the enemy; I didn't mean to hurt their feewings.
The ones who don't care who we pray to, if at all? NO, not at all, and my actions in life are entirely consistent with that. But call me a racist if you want, then, if that's what it takes to make you feel superior. I really don't care, because (warning: "God" alert!) my God and I know the truth. I guess I'm also a "fundie" since I mentioned God, huh?

Actually, Rachel, I'm far f... (Below threshold)
Beth:

Actually, Rachel, I'm far from angry. I'm merely amused at the left's hypocrisy.

I'm not wasting my time on your attempt at thread-hijacking, either. Get your own blog and take it there.

What I get out of this disc... (Below threshold)
Robert:

What I get out of this discourse is that the Republican Party is filled with angry white males who sit around and resort to childish name calling.

This just doesn't do anything to promote what the Republican Party is suppossed to be about.

After all, didn't you free the slaves and were you not the party of John Brown, the militant abolitionist?

You all need to grow up and do some reading on what your party is really about.

So if all of you who think ... (Below threshold)
rachel:

So if all of you who think Ann Coulter is right when she calls middle easterners "ragheads", why are our young men and women dying to "bring democracy" to the middle east? It's disgustingly unpatriotic.

It's funny how right-wingers call liberals unpatriotic for being against the war, but lots of bigots here seem to think it's ok to support the war AND call them ragheads at the same time. Hypocrites all.

I'm not wasting my time on ... (Below threshold)
rachel:

I'm not wasting my time on your attempt at thread-hijacking, either. Get your own blog and take it there.
Posted by: Beth at February 13, 2006 12:06 PM

Or maybe you're not responding because you can't. I don't care if you admit it to me, but hopefully in the quiet of your own mind, you'll admit that Bush really sucks, and you're being taken along for the ride

sit around and resort to... (Below threshold)
Beth:

sit around and resort to childish name calling.

Whatever. Any opportunity you can get to use that line works for ya, huh? Like you weren't saying the same thing before?

See? No matter what our side says, criticizing Ann Coulter, condemning racism, whatever--it doesn't matter to our political opponents. That's the problem with politics; you can't discuss ANYTHING without intellectual dishonesty (if not outright lying) intruding.

Robert, there's a world of difference between racism against blacks (or others) and calling terrorists names as a way of expressing hatred (yes, hatred) for their goals and actions. If you can't see that, it's a damn shame and it says more about you than anything.

RachelSTFU.... (Below threshold)

Rachel

STFU.

Oh, here comes angry Darlee... (Below threshold)
rachel:

Oh, here comes angry Darleen again. Sadly, we've seen Darleen quoting scripture, and now telling people to "shut the fuck up". As I said, hypocrites all.

Dar, have you taken those meds yet?

RachelSometimes th... (Below threshold)

Rachel

Sometimes the morally bankrupt like you only need four short words in reply.

I quote scripture?

I thought Peter Jennings ha... (Below threshold)
Eneils Bailey:

I thought Peter Jennings had passed away. Excuse me while I get into my spaceship and return to a known universe.

Rachel,The analysi... (Below threshold)
robert:

Rachel,

The analysis of segments of the economy is worthwhile but hardly conclusive proof of the entire economy.

"Goods producing" and "manufacturing" are related, if not the same thing, and have been in decline in the US for a good deal longer than five years. Increasingly, we are a service economy.

FAX and copier sales are down too, from which a critic might extrapolate all sorts of bad things if one had a mind to. Buggy whips remain sluggish while housing and lending are booming.

Are you saying that the 4.7 unemployment and 3-4 percent growth rates are fiction?

Rachel, she didn't call ALL... (Below threshold)
Beth:

Rachel, she didn't call ALL of them "ragheads," but I guess context doesn't matter. And I guess you missed my comment above where I said quite the opposite from what you imply. Read it again. I don't know why this concept is so difficult for some of you to understand.

I used to have neighbors who were Afghani, and they babysat my daughter on occasion in their home. AFTER 9/11. I lived in Turkey for a year and a half and had plenty of Turkish (and Kurdish) Muslim friends. I would never, ever call them "ragheads," or any other people like them. Those who kill "the infidels," strap on bomb vests and step onto Israeli buses, chop off heads, and try to get nuclear weapons so they can "wipe Israel off the map"--YES. I don't care if people call them ragheads, although I PERSONALLY think it's a weak euphemism. It's not the word I would use (I prefer "pig-f***ing splodeydopes" or "pedophile worshippers"), but I understand it.

GET IT?

So if all of you who think ... (Below threshold)
bethright:

So if all of you who think Ann Coulter is right when she calls middle easterners "ragheads", why are our young men and women dying to "bring democracy" to the middle east? It's disgustingly unpatriotic.

It's funny how right-wingers call liberals unpatriotic for being against the war, but lots of bigots here seem to think it's ok to support the war AND call them ragheads at the same time. Hypocrites all.

Posted by: rachel at February 13, 2006 12:11 PM

Rachel:

You go girl! You're right. A few weeks ago, many of these same bloggers were critical of anyone who opposed the war, saying they weren't being respectful of our troops, and now they're defending Ann Coulter when she calls middle easterners "ragheads". Unfortunately, they can't seem to see their own hypocrisy. What disrespect they show for the troops in Iraq and Afghanistan, and for these troop's families.

Disregard Darleen. I've never seen her post anything worth debate on this site. She's obviously a very frustrated, sad person.

robert Are you ... (Below threshold)

robert

Are you saying that the 4.7 unemployment and 3-4 percent growth rates are fiction?
Don't underestimate depth of denial of reality that the Left cult members can engage in.

Robert, there's a world ... (Below threshold)
Robert:

Robert, there's a world of difference between racism against blacks (or others) and calling terrorists names as a way of expressing hatred (yes, hatred) for their goals and actions.

But Beth, I just want to know, what really does it accomplish to call people names? I just don't get it. Are you any better off doing it than I am and not doing it? Does it add money to your paycheck? Does it help pay your mortgage? Does it enrich your life and enhance it in any way.

As it is, Beth, most of you Republicans are holier than thou Christians. So, does this type of behavior come in line with the Word of God? What would Jesus do? You should be asking yourself that, not me.

Oh "WAAAAAH!". Some... (Below threshold)
Son Of The Godfather:

Oh "WAAAAAH!".
Someone called terrorists "ragheads". "WAAAAH!"
Ann is acerbic. No surprise, and I hope she remains that way.
There are bigger issues... For goodness sake, people are blespheming the Prophet in cartoons!

most of you Republ... (Below threshold)
most of you Republicans are holier than thou Christians
Now that's an unbigoted statement!

/sarcasm

Yes, Darleen, you do quote ... (Below threshold)
rachel:

Yes, Darleen, you do quote scripture. If you can't remember, you do need those meds

Darleen, Well, wha... (Below threshold)
Robert:

Darleen,

Well, what do you expect from a Socialist pot smoking liberal? LOL. Im the epitome of all that is wrong with mankind!

But really, is it Christian to call people names?

Are you saying that the 4.7... (Below threshold)
rachel:

Are you saying that the 4.7 unemployment and 3-4 percent growth rates are fiction?
Don't underestimate depth of denial of reality that the Left cult members can engage in.
Posted by: Darleen at February 13, 2006 12:31 PM

Darleen:

You just don't get it. Those numbers for unemployment and growth rate come from the Bush administration. Ånd you're still dumb enough to believe them? Why is it that the cult of the republitards can't realize that they've been had by your president, and he and Cheney are laughing all the way to the bank?

Would "Little Sheet Heads",... (Below threshold)
David:

Would "Little Sheet Heads", have been better? ;-)

Ask yourself, David, WWJD?<... (Below threshold)
Robert:

Ask yourself, David, WWJD?

RobertIs it ok for... (Below threshold)

Robert

Is it ok for non-Christians to call people names?

You know, even Jesus lost his temper. Humans are not perfect and even Christians know that. Being human is a struggle between learning and defining what is right and then trying to live up to is.

Real easy how not to be a hypocrit

Don't have any values

As it is, Beth, most of ... (Below threshold)
Beth:

As it is, Beth, most of you Republicans are holier than thou Christians.

Oh, really? How many do you actually know? I know a hell of a lot of Republicans, and I HONESTLY (unlike you) wouldn't call them that at all. Nor would I call 90-95% of them evangelical Christians.

Are you prejudiced or something? Oh, I forgot. It's OK to denigrate Christianity, but NOT ISLAM!!!!11!!oneone!!

:rolling eyes:

rachelDon't you ha... (Below threshold)

rachel

Don't you have a MoveOn "support Saddam" rally to attend? You know, with featured speaker Mommy Sheehan, she-who-pimps-her-sons-corpse?

Here goes Darleen again abo... (Below threshold)
nick:

Here goes Darleen again about having "values". She thinks poor people are poor because they don't have "values". Remember Darleeen?

Unfortunately, she doesn't realize that having values means not throwing stones when you live in a glass house.

WWJD?Actual... (Below threshold)
Beth:

WWJD?

Actually, Robert, Jesus would have preached the word of (the REAL) God to them. And then the splodeydopes would have beheaded him.

But then again, nowadays leftards would have tried to make Jesus keep His God to himself, anyway. Can't have people going around talking about Christianity, after all.

Think about it, mmkay?

She thinks poor people a... (Below threshold)
Beth:

She thinks poor people are poor because they don't have "values".

Yeah, right, Nick. I see you're another intellectually dishonest one who doesn't know how to read. Hilarious!

No, Darleen I have all day ... (Below threshold)
rachel:

No, Darleen I have all day to point out what a hypocrite you are.

I love it. MoveOn supports Saddam Hussien? See how easy you make it to prove how ignorant you are? And in typical republitard style - anyone who disagrees with you is a traitor, Saddam-supporter, blah, blah, blah. Where's your degree from, Karl Rove University?

Don't you have a John Birch society meeting to attend. One with little Dick "I'm a draft dodger and mistake 6' tall men for small birds" Cheney as featured speaker?

Hmmm.1. Well at le... (Below threshold)
ed:

Hmmm.

1. Well at least Ann Coulter hasn't pelted a black Republican with oreos, illegally obtained a credit report or called black Republicans "Uncle Toms".

2.

You just don't get it. Those numbers for unemployment and growth rate come from the Bush administration. Ånd you're still dumb enough to believe them? Why is it that the cult of the republitards can't realize that they've been had by your president, and he and Cheney are laughing all the way to the bank?

That is quite possibly THE most ignorant thing I've read today. Quite a feat really.

She thinks poor people are ... (Below threshold)
nick:

She thinks poor people are poor because they don't have "values".

Yeah, right, Nick. I see you're another intellectually dishonest one who doesn't know how to read. Hilarious!

Posted by: Beth at February 13, 2006 01:00 PM


Beth,

You should know what you're talking about before you call people "intellectually dishonest". It's so predictable from your kind. Darleen went on a rampage last week about poor people and their "poor values". Of course, in your Dick Cheney style paranoia, you assumed I was judging Darleen from her posts today. I leave that to the right-wing to be hypocritically judgemental.

I still don't know what rac... (Below threshold)
B Moe:

I still don't know what race ragheads are. Can anyone tell me?

Nick:Yes, Beth is ... (Below threshold)
jesus:

Nick:

Yes, Beth is surely paranoid. Anyone who read your post could tell you weren't referring to Darleen's posts today. I'm not sure that they even realize that they never actually address the issues, they result to putting people down - just like their heroes in the White House. Pray for them

"I didn't say we all say ni... (Below threshold)
Chris:

"I didn't say we all say nigger, nor do I approve of it out of anyone's mouth, under any circumstances. It's funny how YOU immediately thought of "stealing my car" as an example, though. Talk about enlightening."

Beth, you do need enlightening, because I'm sorry, you're an idiot. Scott said "It's no different to using a racial epithet rather than a swear word against someone who is stealing your car." Which is what I was responding to. Which you'd know if you used your brain before covering your computer screen with angry spittle. And you may be proud of the fact that you said "motherf*cking ragheads," but as hard as it may be for you to digest, the fact that you said something doesn't make it the norm (and is that an understatement.) And this notion that using a racist epithet is OK as long as you're not applying it to the whole race is ridiculous. So it's OK to call someone a kike, as long as you only mean him, and not all Jews? And the reason I use kike and nigger as examples, is because I get the feeling that to you raghead is OK, while other epithets are wrong. So you're only racist against certain people, which makes you OK. What a hateful little world you live in.

You guys can stop patting yourselves on the back for the high level of discourse you all engage in (I mean, you have read Beth's and Darleen's posts, haven't you?) Kos is the most popular political blog out there, and gets its share of ranters. There are plenty of left wing blogs where people discuss things in a sane manner. You mention Kos, I'll mention Little Green Footballs or Ace of Spades, where the right wing rhetoric is just as hateful. So get over yourselves.

It's especially amusing to see you guys congratulating yourselves on your reasoned conversations, while at the same time rationalizing using racial epithets. And the best you can come up with is that the Left says the same stuff, only under their breath. Well if we're saying it so no one can hear, how do you know we're saying it? That's the most ridiculous argument I ever heard. You "know" we do it, and that's all that matters. How about backing that up with a couple of examples? Coulter gives us a whole boatload of examples on the right, and don't forget those standing ovations she gets when she does it.

The only the thing I can't ... (Below threshold)
kyer:

The only the thing I can't stand more than the words coming out of Coulter's mouth is the sound...

Golly-gee-wiz... that voice just makes Susan Estrich sound like a phone sex operator.

No wait.

Scratch that.

Hmmm.I st... (Below threshold)
ed:

Hmmm.

I still don't know what race ragheads are. Can anyone tell me?

*shrug* I know a couple Sikh gentlemen who wear turbans who might fit the description. I also know a few guys who wear do-rags, also made of cloth, who possibly could fit, but unlikely.

In this context I'd suggest turban wearing middle eastern types. Perhaps anyone wearing a fez is not included. Which would be nice as I wear a fez on occasion. They're very comfortable actually.

Frankly I don't mind this sort of nonsense. In fact it might actually be a good idea. People think that by stepping on eggshells that somehow things will be made better. IMHO all that will result is thinner eggshells. The muslim world has a hard time dealing with unintentional insults. Perhaps they need some experience with *intentional* insults to finally figure out the difference.

Chris:You're a gen... (Below threshold)
jesus:

Chris:

You're a genius. If even a fraction of what you say penetrates Beth's and Darleen's thick skulls, they'll still be better off. I read Beth's post too, and got the same impression. She rationalizes her own racism. I lived within site of the World Trade Center and watched it all, and never once muttered anything about "ragheads" on 9/11. She's pathetic.

And where the hell did she get the "you only mutter it under your breathe" comment? She's truly delusional, or is watching too much O'Reilly factor.

Beth, You keep on ... (Below threshold)
Robert:

Beth,

You keep on side-stepping my argument. I am saying that you condone insulting people and calling them names and such, while the Bible is against such behavior. So, how can you call yourself a Christian if you intend on doing things that are very anti-Christian, ie calling people names, and just being as nasty and surly as you are?

In Christianity, it is said that you must love your neighbor. That saying that Jesus lost his temper is just a cop-out. Saying that nobody is perfect is a cop-out. If you are a Christian, you must condut yourself in the best way possible.

When I say "holier than thou" Christians, Im talking about hypocrites. You all probably go out in public and condemn everybody else for being such sinners, but then you all get on here and do this insulting stuff and you show the world what sinners you really are.

Thing is, nobody can see your face as you go out in public and tell people how they should live, but then you all live foul in secret. Just like the Bible says, what is done in the dark will come out in the light.

Perhaps they need some e... (Below threshold)
Robert:

Perhaps they need some experience with *intentional* insults to finally figure out the difference.

But Ed, is this behavior in line with compassionate conservatism?

Are we not liberating these people? So how can you say that we should insult them? I thought that as a conservative you were suppossed to love all people.

Conservative hypocrites.

Robert:Darleen and... (Below threshold)
jesus:

Robert:

Darleen and Beth seem to forget that God sees what they do no matter where they are. Darleen says that poor people are poor because of a lack of values.

The bible says Darleen should give the shirt off her back to those very same people. Darleen, He knows you down "to the number of hairs on your head." It's amazing how little people who claim to be Christian really know about being Christian.

Nick/rachel/bethright... (Below threshold)

Nick/rachel/bethright

how "many" of you are using the same ip, eh?

And obviously the whole argument of values behind the line "from shirtsleeves to shirtsleeves in three generations" is beyond your feeble intellect.

No wonder the self-responsibility-denying Left cult is so comforting to you.

I'll go with the Midrash if... (Below threshold)

I'll go with the Midrash if "jesus" doesn't mind

He who is merciful to the cruel will end up being cruel to the merciful.

RobertThanks for t... (Below threshold)

Robert

Thanks for the longer posts that mark your bigotry well.

You call all Arabs (terrori... (Below threshold)
Robert:

You call all Arabs (terrorist and non-terrorist) "ragheads" and now Im the bigot?

The backwards logic of Republicans. I guess it just doesn't feel right unless you are going through a day without calling somebody names.

And being Christian is not a bad thing, Im just telling you what I know about being a Christian. So how am I a bigot? And if you arent a Christian, why not? That might be part of your problem.

RobertDo you alway... (Below threshold)

Robert

Do you always drink this early in the morning? Where did I call all arabs "ragheads"?

And you make assumptions about all Christians based on your own interpretation of Christianity.

I'd say that qualifies you as a bigot.

Darleen:You seem t... (Below threshold)
jesus:

Darleen:

You seem to be bothered that so many people disagree with you? Maybe you're just wrong.

Robert is a bigot because he interprets Christianity in a way you don't agree? You are a very, very sad person. And obviously a very angry one. It's no one's fault but your own that you are the way you are.

Oh, and one last thing: My name is Jesus - I'm latino. Is that allowed in your small view of the world?

Robert, you said: ... (Below threshold)
Jay Tea:

Robert, you said:

"What I get out of this discourse is that the Republican Party is filled with angry white males who sit around and resort to childish name calling."

Um... did you miss the part where the initial remark was made by a WOMAN?

J.

I just want to know if I ca... (Below threshold)
B Moe:

I just want to know if I can start calling people who don't like Christians or Republicans or Steeler fans racist now, it seems like the term has become pretty damn all-encompassing.

My name is Jesus - I'm l... (Below threshold)

My name is Jesus - I'm latino.

Yeah. Right. Sure. That's the ticket.

Im not assuming anything. I... (Below threshold)
Robert:

Im not assuming anything. Im just making my basis on what I see...people who are so quick to condemn homosexuals, abortion providers and people who dont see things the way that they do. I didn't say that was all Christians.

Like, what is up with people who say that "God hates fags". There just seems to be a movement based on ignorance, anger and prejudice that I see in the Republican movement.

At the same time, the Republican movement today acts like it represents all things Christian. Then I see someone like Ann Coulter. What is that suppossed to communicate to somebody who might consider being a part of the Republican party?

I'd be a part of the part of the great abolitionist John Brown. Now that is a hero. You might think that Ann Coulter is on the same level as John Brown, but she really doesnt do much for me.

Im just trying to also say that if you did pursue being a Christian seriously, you wouldnt have so much hate and anger, and wouldnt fall to this mentality. Thats all that I see from the likes of somebody like Ann Coulter. So, if you think I am a bigot, well, fine, but I find it hard to say that somebody like Ann who says that she would say nasty things about all blacks and hispanics under any circumstances is not worthy of my respect.

B Moe"Raghead" is ... (Below threshold)

B Moe

"Raghead" is better defined as an ethnic slur.

My name is Jesus - I'm lati... (Below threshold)
jesus:

My name is Jesus - I'm latino.
Yeah. Right. Sure. That's the ticket.
Posted by: Darleen at February 13, 2006 02:00 PM

Darleen:

You're not even making sense anymore. Lay down and take a nap before you burst a blood vessel

Hey Jesus, you alright with... (Below threshold)
Robert:

Hey Jesus, you alright with me. Darleen doesnt respect you because she feels you are taking away a minimum wage job that she feels she is entitled to, even though you probably dont need it. Oh well. You can't make these people like anybody but their small circle of friends.

Yeah, all of you are right.... (Below threshold)
Beth:

Yeah, all of you are right. We ALL call everyone ragheads, whether they're terrorist or not, and we ALL think nobody has any values (except for Us), and we all go around telling everyone else how to live, and we all are cheering on Ann Coulter.

I STG, it's pointless even trying to discuss anything with you people. Which wasn't actually even my point in commenting, by the way--I was debating the issue IN THE POST with others on my side, and you may note we did so without insulting one another or each other's intelligence by misrepresenting what the other said.

Thanks for fucking up what COULD have been an intelligent discussion between people on the same side of "the aisle," with your idiotic generalizations and ridiculous conclusions. Tell me, do you people actually know any conservatives? Because you obviously think we're just evil. Sounds like projection to me.

No wonder you veer to the left--the loser mentality side.

Do you really think you're going to change anyone's minds here? I mean it's a BLOG. Nobody ever changes their minds in blog comments, especially when said comments are completely, comically baseless and speculative.

Darleen (and Jeff) and I--and some of the others--do actually know where one another are coming from (and yes, I know you weren't talking about Darleen's comments here, dumbass--she's a friend of mine). Therefore we can discuss things and understand the other's point of view.

Conversely, TOTAL STRANGERS who think they know another person's 1) religion, 2) race, 3) motivation, 4) economic status, and 5) beliefs, and choose to use those assumptions as a basis for argument (or more to the point, insults) really don't warrant my attention, especially when said strangers REFUSE to even bother trying to understand what I say. Why I even bothered responding to any of you nitwits is beyond me. GROW UP.

There was a question of whe... (Below threshold)

There was a question of whether or not Jesus would call someone names - not sure if that question was rhetorical, but yes, He would. In the 23rd chapter of Matthew He called the Pharisees and Scribes hypocrites, serpents, and a brood of vipers. But I believe it was out of a broken heart for Jerusalem more than malice. Anyway, just didn't want to leave that question unanswered.

I just find it interesting that one of the most commented posts I've seen on Wizbang is apparently about name-calling. No, Ann probably shouldn't have called them ragheads, but there is a lot of stuff in the world that is much more worth getting worked up over - I don't have much left for schoolyard name calling.

No wonder you veer to th... (Below threshold)
Robert:

No wonder you veer to the left--the loser mentality side.

Doesnt sound very Christian to me. WWJD, Beth, WWJD?

But Gene, would he call Ara... (Below threshold)
Robert:

But Gene, would he call Arabs "Ragheads"? I don't think so.

Hmmm.@ Robert... (Below threshold)
ed:

Hmmm.

@ Robert

1.

But Ed, is this behavior in line with compassionate conservatism?

How should I know? I'm a *conservative* not a "compassionate conservative", whatever that means.

2.

Are we not liberating these people?

No. We're liberating the people of Iraq and Afghanistan, not the entire middle east. Read what I write, not what you wish I wrote.

3.

So how can you say that we should insult them?

What idiotic world do you inhabit where people are forbidden from insulting one another?

4.

I thought that as a conservative you were suppossed to love all people.

Really? On what cereal box did you garner this wisdom?

5.

Conservative hypocrites.

Your explicit membership in the Jackass Club is irrespective of your politics.

BethI've been comm... (Below threshold)
Chris:

Beth

I've been commenting on this blog for quite some time. When did it become your little club that only people you approve of are supposed to comment on? You spewed plenty of insults and hateful talk, and now you criticize others for messing up an intelligent conversation. Get over yourself. Or to quote you from earlier in this thread, "Get your own blog."

Well, Robert, seeing as the... (Below threshold)

Well, Robert, seeing as the terms "hypocrites", "serpents", and "vipers" were terms of derision, I think it's quite possible He would. But, to state again, I don't think it was (or would be) with malice, but a broken heart for the people of Jerusalem (including the Pharisees and Scribes).

ChrisBeth was spea... (Below threshold)

Chris

Beth was speaking to the trolls. If you aren't one, then carry on. Otherwise, Beth is right. The bots like rachel/nick/jesus/bethrigh (or singular bot as I believe they are one and the same) and the eager-beaver wannabes like "Robert" (who believes someone who calls him/herself "latino" and immediately thinks "illegal alien" and again betrays himself) have not been here to discuss, just spew.

Hmmm.@ Robert... (Below threshold)
ed:

Hmmm.

@ Robert

1.

At the same time, the Republican movement today acts like it represents all things Christian.

So. Are you trying to say that the Democratic Party is representative of Christians? Then why didn't you reply to my explicit point about the treatment of conservative blacks by liberal Democrats? I.e. throwing oreos, illegally obtaining credit reports, name calling.

Aren't you rather hot on the issue of name calling?

Hmmm.@ Robert... (Below threshold)
ed:

Hmmm.

@ Robert

Doesnt sound very Christian to me. WWJD, Beth, WWJD?

Sounds like you don't know what being a Christian is.

BTW ChrisBeth does... (Below threshold)

BTW Chris

Beth does have her own blog ... an excellent read.

But you knew that.

ed, the oreo thing never ha... (Below threshold)
mantis:

ed, the oreo thing never happened. They just made that up.

Yes, mantisthe ore... (Below threshold)

Yes, mantis

the oreos appeared on the floor by way of a disruption in a quantum singularity.

"Beth was speaking to the t... (Below threshold)
rachel:

"Beth was speaking to the trolls. If you aren't one, then carry on. Otherwise, Beth is right. The bots like rachel/nick/jesus/bethrigh (or singular bot as I believe they are one and the same) and the eager-beaver wannabes like "Robert" (who believes someone who calls him/herself "latino" and immediately thinks "illegal alien" and again betrays himself) have not been here to discuss, just spew."
Posted by: Darleen at February 13, 2006 02:31 PM

Chris:

Yes, apparently Beth and Darleen (and I'm afraid lots of other people on this site) don't want any dissenting opinion whatsoever. You're allowed to stay on as long as you agree with them. That's the democratic/patriotic ideals they're fighting for. Hoorah!! What phonies.

And it's no surprise that Beth and Darleen are friends - they share the same hypocritical and racist viewpoints - they deserve each other.

Darleen claims she's here to "discuss" but tries to silence anyone who doesn't follow the lock-step republitard mentality. Sorry Dar, we're not going anywhere.

"A congressional report due... (Below threshold)
jesus:

"A congressional report due out this week slams the government's response to Hurricane Katrina, calling it a "failure of leadership" that left people stranded when they were most in need. "Our investigation revealed that Katrina was a national failure, an abdication of the most solemn obligation to provide for the common welfare," the report says. "At every level -- individual, corporate, philanthropic and governmental -- we failed to meet the challenge that was Katrina. In this cautionary tale, all the little pigs built houses of straw."

Darleen:

This is from today's wire services. Still want to tell us that Bush is doing a great job? Or will you do what republitards did to Tom Kean (from the 9/11 Commission and one of the finest Republicans in this country) and start chewing out all the Republicans who participated in the quote above?

There are plenty of left... (Below threshold)

There are plenty of left wing blogs where people discuss things in a sane manner. You mention Kos, I'll mention Little Green Footballs or Ace of Spades, where the right wing rhetoric is just as hateful. So get over yourselves.

Nice attempt at dodging the issue. Let me spell it out for you again: I have never seen you lefties go after one of your own the way that conservatives criticize Ann Coulter (and Michael Swvage, for that matter). It's not a question of who has "hateful rhetoric" The question is, where is the self-policing once the hateful rhetoric occurs. As far as I can tell, the only ones who even attempt to do this are conservatives. Over there in lefty land, deranged moonbats such as Cindy Sheehan, Al Sharpton, Louis Farrakhan, Teddy Kennedy, Jesse Jackson, Michael Moore, Ward Churchill, etc. spew their vile garbage all day long and nobody on your side of the aisle ever says "boo" about it. In fact, they're held up universally by your side as heroes.

OreganMuse:The sho... (Below threshold)
maggie:

OreganMuse:

The shoes on the other foot. I was on a liberal blog site the day Coretta Scott King died, and the racist trash that was spilling from some of the conservative bloggers was truly unbelievable. The majority of it is unrepeatable, but suffice it to say that she was called everything from a n----r whore, to much, much worse. While lots of comments were being made by those leaning right regarding the wire tapping of King by J Edgar Hoover during the Kennedy administration, not one of them asked that the racist comments from the hard right stop. Not a single one.

All this "your side is worse than our side" is completely stupid and juvenile. How about agreeing to disagree?

Hmmm.@ mantis... (Below threshold)
ed:

Hmmm.

@ mantis

ed, the oreo thing never happened. They just made that up.

Why are you forcing me to ask for a link?

Got a link?

Hmmm.<a href="http... (Below threshold)
ed:

Hmmm.

link

Here's one that references someone who was there. How about you mantis?

Hmmmm.@ maggie... (Below threshold)
ed:

Hmmmm.

@ maggie

I was on a liberal blog site the day Coretta Scott King died, and the racist trash that was spilling from some of the conservative bloggers was truly unbelievable.

And how you know they are "conservative bloggers" since you were on a liberal website?

And isn't it curious that I've been on many conservative blogs and I have yet to see anything like that at all.

So put up, or shut up.

was on a liberal blog si... (Below threshold)

was on a liberal blog site the day Coretta Scott King died, and the racist trash that was spilling from some of the conservative bloggers was truly unbelievable.

care to link?

'course, Leftists would NEVER stoop to pretending to be 'conservative' then saying vile things... just like they'd never post under several different names in order to appear legion.

Darleen claims she's her... (Below threshold)

Darleen claims she's here to "discuss" but tries to silence anyone

Uh... I'm just a commenter here, how can I "silence" anyone?

Oh, that's right. Criticism of the Left and its dogma = censorship in Left Cult dictionary.

Hmmmm.@ jesus... (Below threshold)
ed:

Hmmmm.

@ jesus

This is from today's wire services. Still want to tell us that Bush is doing a great job? Or will you do what republitards did to Tom Kean (from the 9/11 Commission and one of the finest Republicans in this country) and start chewing out all the Republicans who participated in the quote above?

1. Congrats for regurgitating something from the MSM.

2. Bush is doing a good job, as good as possible when dealing with incompetents such as Gov Blanco and Mayor Nagin. Nagin who couldn't be bothered to actually evacuate people after having declared a mandatory evacuation. Blanco for having her state police prevent emergency groups from entering New Orleans to provide food, water and shelter.

But that would be too difficult a concept for "libertards" like yourself to understand. That in a federal system of government it is up to the state and local authorities to maintain control and provide the first level of response. It would be nice if you libertards did understand, considering all the yapping you've done over funding of these "first responders", but that would be asking far too much. Good heavens! Actual knowledge and logical thought.

I know it's a dream, but someday you'll escape this eternal ignorance and finally begin to understand that Barney really isn't a purple dinosaur, he's just a guy in a big purple dinosaur suit.

Don't cry. Please don't cry. The truth hurts.

3. Using the term "repulitards" automatically makes you a jackass. It might also make you a twit, but that's subjective. But it definitely confers the title of jackass.

4. Tom Kean used to be my governor. He sucked then, he sucks harder now. The problem with using has-been politicians is that they start to think they can use it as a platform to restart their political career. So we got Department of Homeland Security.

Frankly that doesn't make me feel safe. Do you? Does having an extra layer of bureaucracy make you feel safer?

There are two Roberts on th... (Below threshold)
robert:

There are two Roberts on this thread.

My only prior post was about 4.7 and 3-4.

Darleen warns about denial, and Rachel promptly, then, denies it. Nostra Damas should be so good.

Ed notes that Rachel's denial is possibly the most ignorant thing he's read today. True no doubt, but one can only marvel at Ed's sources of ignorantisms, if this is only good for one day.

Darleen, We... (Below threshold)
Dan S:

Darleen,

Well, what do you expect from a Socialist pot smoking liberal? LOL. Im the epitome of all that is wrong with mankind!

But really, is it Christian to call people names?

Posted by: Robert at February 13, 2006 12:40 PM

As I recall, jesus himself called the Pharisees names, "whited sepulchers" for one. I think it's important to note that he was making a specific point, not slinging hate, however. But clearly name-calling per se is not a sin if he did it.

Do you think I am not a Chr... (Below threshold)
Robert:

Do you think I am not a Christian because I don't think like you? There is more to being a Christian than just thinking like you. Why don't you read the Bible, Im sure you have one.

I looked at Beth's blog. It... (Below threshold)
Robert:

I looked at Beth's blog. It has curse words on it. What if children look at it?

I thought you Republicans were about protecting the children.

I wouldn't waste my time reading something with F words anyway. Not too much going on there.

Darleen. Beth. - ... (Below threshold)
CarScenic:

Darleen. Beth. -

Coulter enjoys her popularity from the same ilk who both think and say the same shit she does -period.

and you know it...

edThe story that O... (Below threshold)
Chris:

ed

The story that Oreos were thrown at Steele is false. You referring to a site that talks about Oreos being passed out at a Steele speech does not support that story. You've got one guy who says he saw one Oreo in the air, but doesn't know if it was aimed at Steele. From this we get endless references to Oreos being thrown at him? And what kind of link is Mantis supposed to give you? A link to every story ever written about Steele to prove the incident never happened? If you are asserting that it did, then clearly the burden is on you to come up with the link.

As for illegally obtaining credit reports, we've gone over this before. The campaign workers who did it were wrong, and they were fired and reported to the authorities by Chuck Schumer the day he learned about it. But on what basis are you saying this had anything to do with race?

And "name calling?" Are you serious? Yeah, it's terrible the way the unhinged traitorous moonbat Saddam-loving Democrats have introduced name calling into politics.

And OregonMuse, I wasn't sidestepping any point, and you don't have to spell out anything for me. I was responding to Beth scolding people for coming to this blog and interrupting the high-minded discourse. Next time you're going to use a condescending tone you might check to see if you're even part of the conversation.

I don't normally participat... (Below threshold)

I don't normally participate in comments, but since I've got insider knowledge, I just thought I'd let y'all know: The comments on this page posted under the names "tony," "rachel," "bethright," "nick," "jesus," and "maggie" all came from the same company. And it's one you've all heard of.

There's no way to know whether these comments all came from the same person, of course, but the fact that they were all submitted with the same e-mail address sort of indicates that some shenanigans are afoot.

This isn't my site. I don't set or execute policy here. But the tone of these comments is really disappointing to me. Maybe a little less responding to open provocation might be in order.

Just a thought.

Chris - What race are raghe... (Below threshold)
JD:

Chris - What race are ragheads ?

Chris - So the Oreos were passed out at a Steele event, not thrown, though the author claims to have seen one fly through the air. Are we to assume that the people passing out the Oreos were just there to ensure adequate blood sugar levels for those attending the event ? All you have attempted to prove is that there was not a swarm of Oreos being thrown in the air during the event. The existence of the Oreos, and the underlying BS double standard employed by the Left has not been shown to being anything other than true.

Credit reports - Why were they taken in the first place? Because he is a Republican ? How many other Republicans had their credit reports illegaly obtained? Or was it because he is a black Republican? But folks, you must remember, the Left in their highly enlightened state could never possibly be racist.

I was responding to Bet... (Below threshold)

I was responding to Beth scolding people for coming to this blog and interrupting the high-minded discourse.

Until your side starts distancing itself from certifiable moonbats like Louis Farrakhan and Ted Rall to the same extent you demand conservatives avoid Ann Coulter, your complaints are nothing but laughable.

You have a great blog, but ... (Below threshold)

You have a great blog, but I think Ann Coulter had it right. The Muslims in this world who got upset about a bunch of cartoons can shove it! It's time to quit apologizing for freedom of expression and quit worrying that any namecalling is going to setback any progress made between East and West. I think after all the riots, threats, and anger, it's time to stand up for freedom of expression and tell the Islamists to mind their own religion and their own business.

You really do need to light... (Below threshold)
Devvil:

You really do need to lighten up. Don't you understand? Anne's JOB is to be provocative and cause controversy. It is people like her that reinforce and 'buck up' people who would otherwise be mealy-mouthed moderates. Conservatives need vocal, controversial spokesmen who "stand up" to PC orthodoxy and aren't afraid to say what they think, no matter how far from conventional wisdom. By showing she cares not a whit for 'offensive' PC speech codes, she is saying it is okay to stand up for what you believe in, to defend your conservative beliefs.

What a bunch of nonsense. T... (Below threshold)
MikeM:

What a bunch of nonsense. This is making a mountain out of a mole hill. She called our enimies a demeaning name how awful. Next she will behead and burn them. We need to quit being so hyper sensitive for everyone elses feelings. Poor taste yes, major outrage get real.

At the risk of being labele... (Below threshold)
Democraps:

At the risk of being labeled a "racist" myself, I confess I find it very troubling that conservative commentators like Mr. Hogberg are so offended by a few harsh words for our sworn enemies. Let us not forget that these enemies, who are committed to a way of life that is antithetical to our own, have killed thousands of our fellow citizens and would gladly kill millions more.

How can it be that calling these enemies "rag heads" is so intolerable, but killing them by the hundreds and thousands in Iraq and elsewhere is deserving of praise? After all, we on the right (and center) loudly applaud President Bush whenever he speaks of "destroying" our enemies. But Ann Coulter calling them "rag heads" is going too far? This is a ridiculous example of political correctness run amok. But "politically correct warfare" is an oxymoron, and a foolish and self-defeating way to fight a war.

Steven M. Warshawsky
http://www.therealitycheck.org/GuestColumnist/swarshawsky021306.htm
----
The examples of liberals and Democrats hurling equally detestable epithets at their opponents (Jesus freaks, fundies, nazis, flat-earthers, christers, house niggers, Klansmen, etc.) are too numerous to catalog, and yet Democrats see themselves as the paragons of virtue and tolerance and respect.

We are refering to Muslim terrorist for Allah who call us infidels and Christians "Cross suckers". Those are the raghead, camel jocks, etc. And what about those cartactures of mohamad? There was no rage when Egypt published them. Just like the libs, double standards. Where is the mass outrage for that? The ambient din of a million crickets is louder.

Heaven forbid that we should use "bad names" to describe the city burning Muslims who follow the pedophile for prophet. They only walk in step to the Quran, Hadiths with their call to convert or kill us all. Dhimmitude, look it up people.

This type of reaction to an Ann Coulter speach is really a hoot. She calls an Arab a "raghead" and all of a sudden she has committed "hate speach" and gets compared to every hate group from the KKK to the NAZI party, yet the same people who condemn this type of act on the part of Coulter seem content to remain silent on the fact that the UN human rights committee is being headed by some of the most murderous butchers on the planet. I guess in the view of Coulters critics, their interpretations of "hate speach" must be condemned but outright murder is OK as long as other nations maintian their killing within their own borders.

But Islam should be repected... OK let me ask this, who in their right mind would live Muhamhead's teachings as a certified terrorist and 54 year old child rapist (Ayesha was 6 at the time)? Who would follow a cult that requires the husband to kill his wife if she leaves Islam?

Ragheads.

Who would be offended by Coulter calling our nursery burning killers of Allah for cartoons, "ragheads"? Only the uneducated who haven't taken the time to learn about Islam's historical call for complete domination. And that's in their own written words and history. And if you can't even name the century Muhamhead was born in, don't confuse your opinions of Islam as facts.

Deal with it. For the most part we learned all we needed to know about Islam on 9-11. The rest have apparently forgotten. Even Daniel Pipes is dancing around Muslim terrorist excusers like CAIR. Coulter hasn't forgotten and we need to remind the rest.

In every war America has fo... (Below threshold)
Thor:

In every war America has fought we have had a derogotory term for our enemies. Those terms are commonly used by all (and we all know it). Ann's sin is saying it in a public forum. Why is that a sin? Because the left will know that the right does not care for Islamofacists or even Islam in general? I think they already know what Ann Coulters opinion is on that subject..and what the majority of the right wing that she represents thinks. I also dont believe that Ann nor those folks on the right that love Ann give a hoot what the left thinks about the subject or about them.

Ann has said time and time again that we are at war with a culture...a religion. Did anyone expect reverance from her? A "sensitive" war aint what these people have in mind. Winning the war is the goal, not making sure our enemy is happy with our rhetoric, or that the leftist PC checkers have nothing to complain about.

Hmmm.1. <blockquot... (Below threshold)
ed:

Hmmm.

1.

Ed notes that Rachel's denial is possibly the most ignorant thing he's read today. True no doubt, but one can only marvel at Ed's sources of ignorantisms, if this is only good for one day.

"ignorantisms". Almost as good as "republitards".

You're rather amusing in a freakshow sort of way robert. Keep up the good work.

2.

The story that Oreos were thrown at Steele is false.

*shrug* thrown or handed out. You don't think people handing out oreos is just as bad? You think that's acceptable behavior?

And I notice that you didn't address the eyewitness's comments that the person handing them out was specifically in response to Steele's presence.

A clumsy evasion that.

3.

And what kind of link is Mantis supposed to give you?

*shrug* how about something that backs up his assertion by quoting or linking to someone who was *there*. You know. Like I did.

4.

The campaign workers who did it were wrong, and they were fired and reported to the authorities by Chuck Schumer the day he learned about it.

Got a link? Since you're the one asserting that Chuck Schumer turned these people in to law enforcement. I frankly haven't read any instance where this was alleged. I've read where Chuck said he had nothing to do with it, but never a single instance where Chuck was supposed to have actually *turned them in*.

So. Got a link?

5. Curious when it's something the White House is alleged to have done the blame automatically goes to the President. When it's something a Democrat does, it's always the lowbies who did things without higher authorisation.

Pardon me. You logical inconsistencies are showing.

edTo answer some o... (Below threshold)
Chris:

ed

To answer some of your questions:
"*shrug* thrown or handed out. You don't think people handing out oreos is just as bad?"

No, I don't think it's just as bad. You really think handing something out at a rally is the same as throwing things at the candidates? What kind of idiocy is that? I can assure you that if I'm on stage, I'd much rather people in the audience be holding food than throwing it at me. I was specifically commenting on the canard that Democrats threw Oreos at Steele. Now that it turns out it's not true, you start talking about what's "just as bad." That still doesn't make you're original false story true.

"*shrug* how about something that backs up his assertion by quoting or linking to someone who was *there*. You know. Like I did."

Your inability to think logically astounds me. To repeat: You assert something happened. Mantis says it didn't. The logical thing is to show proof that it happened. Proving a negative is virtually impossible. But since you ask, the Baltimore Sun, following the debate you mentioned, reported the following on 10/1/02: "Ehrlich spokesman Paul Schurick said Democrats in the audience went over the top. They booed Ehrlich's wife and parents, he said, and distributed Oreo cookies in the audience -- a racial insult apparently aimed at GOP lieutenant governor nominee Michael S. Steele, who is black."

Do you think the Republican spokesman would have mentioned it if the Steele was "pelted" (your word) with Oreos?

Then, on 10/31/02, the Washington Post wrote: "supporters of the Democratic candidate for governor, Kathleen Kennedy Townsend, mocked him by bringing Oreo cookies to a debate last month, Ehrlich said." Hmmm. Still no "pelting."

Then, in the Baltimore Sun on 8/31/04: "Steele and Ehrlich still talk about how supporters of former Lt. Gov. Kathleen Kennedy Townsend tossed Oreo cookies at Steele during the lone gubernatorial debate in 2002."

So now, two years later, the story is that Oreos were "tossed" at them. Funny how it took two years for them to be outraged enough about the Oreos being thrown to finally say something about it. Who's the bullshitter here?

But I forgot. Holding an Oreo and throwing it are the same thing in your world.

And by the way, the Democrats claim there were no Oreos. The only people saying there were are Republican operatives. This doesn't mean the satory isnauomatically false, but it doesn't make it automatically tue, either.

Let me get this right, Chri... (Below threshold)
JD:

Let me get this right, Chris, let us all make sure we understand this. It is entirely appropriate within the context of the current political discourse to disparage a candidate's race, ie. passing out Oreos at one of his events ? That is alright with you ? You do not expect any more from your party ?

Once again, we see that, like most matters, the left likes to preen and pose and brag about their moral superiority, but in the end, they condone that which they condemn in others, so long as the target is a Republican.

Nah... she's right. I would... (Below threshold)
Jason:

Nah... she's right. I would have agreed with you a year or two ago, but right now I think "ragheads" will do just fine. We're at war with these backwards idiots, and we might as well stop pretending we're at a tea party.

JDPerhaps if you r... (Below threshold)
Chris:

JD

Perhaps if you read what I wrote before responding your comments would make more sense.

First, there is a dispute as to whether the Oreos were ever passed out.

Second, and more importantly, what I took issue with was the fact that ed was repeating the story that Steele was "pelted" with Oreos. The fact is that the Republicans have been spreading a lie about what went on, and every time I've pointed that out, the responses have had to do with everything but my point. Do you think the responsible thing for the Republicans to do was to spread a racially charged lie? How does that help?

Oh puhlease! These are the ... (Below threshold)
Kevin Mayfield:

Oh puhlease! These are the same people that are out in the streets rioting over cartoons, when they should be at work. I think Coulter is right on.

missing the point. <... (Below threshold)

missing the point.

Ann used the derogitory term Raghead on purpose, not to hurl an insult or offend anyone (but liberals) to make the point that the same people who engage in terrorism, beheadings, crulity to women, slavery, and general savagry, in the case of Iran threating the destruction of a nation, can't take it when they are called a name, and liberals in this country bend over backwards to be nice to them as they plot to kill us.

Sun zu says if your enemy is mad enrage him.




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