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Mayday for America

The latest tactic of those pushing for shredding our immigration policy and erasing our borders reforming our immigration laws and policies and decriminalizing the 10-million-plus illegal aliens in the country is to threaten a one-day strike. On May 1, they propose, NO illegal aliens undocumented workers migrant workers migrants will work, will shop, will in any way participate in our economy. They intend that this will show America just how valuable their contribution to our economy is, and help convince most Americans that it's time to forgive and forget, MoveOn, and just put all this silliness about laws and procedures aside.

Several commenters have discussed the symbolism of May 1 as the target date. They cite the involvement of International A.N.S.W.E.R., the IWW, and several other groups with Marxist/socialist ties who are major behind the scenes players in the recent protests, and remind us that May 1 is May Day, the most revered (can't quite call it "the holiest") day to Communism. I'm not quite sure I buy into that -- after all, May 1 is the first day of the next month, barely two weeks away, and it happens to fall on a Monday -- but I'm sure it was recognized as a happy coincidence by those so inclined to celebrate that political movement that's racked up a body count well into nine figures on its way towards building the perfect society. After all, what's a hundred million or so corpses when you're trying to perfect a system that's never worked, and most likely never can work?

But I digress. Back to the threatened strike. I say bring it on. In fact, I say expand it.

I modestly propose that in addition to a one-day stoppage of contributing to the economy, the illegal aliens also take a holiday from enjoying the benefits of being in America. For that one day, they should stay off the publicly-funded roads. They should not attend taxpayer-supported schools. They should stay out of taxpayer-supported hospitals. Take no public transportation. Refuse any government assistance entirely. Give back any public support they receive for that one day. Just for that one day, completely and utterly cease to exist to America.

That would be a far truer test of the costs and benefits of having so many illegal aliens in the country.

A day without illegal aliens? Bring. It. On.

Of course, my suggestion will never fly. The whole point of the demonstration is to show the benefits of having these folks around, not to discuss the costs. And I strongly suspect that as May 1 looms closer and closer, the organizers will find some excuse to cancel it publicly -- while at the same time quietly encouraging it to go forward. That way, they can point to any inconveniences as "the price of having even a few rogue strikes," hinting that that is the mere tip of the iceberg as to what could have happened had they actually gone on ahead.

How do I find it so easy to predict their actions? It's simple. I just ask myself "how could I best achieve my goals with a minimum of effort, if I were not encumbered by conscience, ethics, scruples, integrity, or fear of the media exposing my scheme?" When I think of it that way, it's usually pretty obvious.


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Comments (46)

Remember that stupid movie ... (Below threshold)

Remember that stupid movie "A Day Without a Mexican", perhaps this will be it come to life.

Honestly a day without an Illegal would be a great day where I live.

But the main point is that single day boycots are pointless. Just like "dont buy gas day" is a massive failure that makes zero impact on the economy. This day too will mean little or nothing

Will Taco Bell be closed?</... (Below threshold)
LJD:

Will Taco Bell be closed?

Jay Tea:You are co... (Below threshold)
kevino:

Jay Tea:

You are correct that the event, if successsful, will highlight the economic benefits without the costs. However, the call to action is "A day without immigrants" -- not a "day without illegal aliens"

Part of the political power that the illegal immigrants have is the relationship that they have with legal immigrants. By linking hardline views of illegal immigration with racism, legal immigrants are encouraged to side with the illegal immigrants. Also, the legal immigrants know that they can gain more political power as a group if more illegal immigrants become citizens.

No, this is all being positioned as "Immigrant's Rights."

They'd probably get better ... (Below threshold)
Sheik Yur Bouty:

They'd probably get better participation from the illegal community if they moved it to May 5th (Cinco de Mayo).

Now if the employers would ... (Below threshold)
SmartGuy:

Now if the employers would just have the spine to fire the illegals that don't show up for work that day, because they decided to protest.

The only thing these people... (Below threshold)
Aitch748:

The only thing these people will manage to do on May 1 is make nuisances of themselves. What do they think will happen? Do they imagine the Dow is going to plummet by 2000 points or something?

I could support this boycot... (Below threshold)
Matt:

I could support this boycott if they included not invading America for that one day as well.

How about everybody else boycott any business related to Illegal Immigration for that one day. Don't let the landscaper work, don't let the nanny come to work, don't eat at illegal-staffed restaurants, don't buy made in Mexico products etc.

A day without an Illegal could be a day when some of my neighbors could lay down their arms and let their kids play outside safely.

Will the guys printing up t... (Below threshold)
Tim:

Will the guys printing up the fake social security cards be taking the day off too?

Does this mean the car-thei... (Below threshold)
Matt:

Does this mean the car-theives will boycott stealing for one day?

SmartGuy,I might r... (Below threshold)

SmartGuy,

I might remind you that those are the employers who are already violating the law by hiring illegals.

I find the date very <a hre... (Below threshold)

I find the date very symbolic.

A meat packing company in M... (Below threshold)
Rick13:

A meat packing company in MI fired some employee's.

They were told that if they did not show up to work during the last protest they would be fired. The company kept their promise.

This is the phone #: 313-259-7500. Call them and show your support for the stand they are taking. I did!

I wonder if on May 1st, the illegal alien's will still be able to get free health care or other financial aid?

Did I imagine it, or was th... (Below threshold)
Nell E:

Did I imagine it, or was there a time when the mainstream media actually competed with each other so fiercely that they would jump at the chance to expose each other's errors? Didn't they fight so hard for the "scoop" that, even if a story was unflattering to a Democrat, (the party most mainstream reporters belonged to even then),they had to run with it because otherwise someone else would beat them to it? Or did I dream that? Maybe I just naively assumed that, because that's how it ought to be.
As Jay says, there is no liberal fear of the MSM exposing their schemes. Somehow the biggest papers and all of the TV/cable news stations but Fox seem to have an agreement to never, ever say anything that might cast liberals in a bad light or give conservatives a crumb of credit.
Their fact-twising, truth-concealing, source-omitting techniques were bound to bring them down, as the role of competitor was picked up by those who don't share the agenda. They gambled that there wouldn't be effective competition before they became the only legally allowed media, I guess.
Now when there's MSM coverage of another flag-festooned "Peaceful March for PeaceCivilRightsJobsHealthcareDignity", I dash to the internet to see what really happened. 'Cuz I have a "right to know", y'know? I can absolutely count on the entire MSM to skip right over the foreign flags, communist sponsors, and anarchist thugs that I want to see. The truth--it's so much more interesting than, say, Katie Couric.


What a great idea! That way... (Below threshold)
jumbo:

What a great idea! That way they can show us, yessiree Bob, that America is incompetent abd incapable unless propped up by the tide of iilegals.

But have the A.N.S.W.E.R. folks given enough thought to this? There's more to do! They should show their impact on ALL aspects of American life. But maybe they've already planned on it.

So I guess they're going to boycott the hospitals, right? That would show the clinics and the ERs, right? And the maternity wards! Particularly the maternity wards, right? Heck, would the doctors, nurses and other workers at tax-supported clinics and maternity wards even have jobs if it weren't for the illegals?

And it's an old story for a young pregnant illegal to time her entry so that she comes across from Juarez to make it into the American ER just as her contractions are 2 minutes apart, meaning the baby those selfish Americans paid will deliver the baby and hospitalize and care mom and child both, so that the baby is automatically an American citizen. And she'll be entitled to SSA and foodtsamps and WIC vouchers...all those will be abandoned on Monday, right? And the state and local assistance they may be getting? That's out the window, right?

Now the schools: they're going to stay home Monday, right? Boy, that'll show those thousands of greedy and lazy Yanqui English-as-a-second-language teachers, the Spanish-speaking teacher's aides and the bilingual tutors which virtually every school system has been forced to hire.

And the illegals are not going to bother the police on May Day, right? So when some guys steals Pedro's money roll, Pedro is just out of luck on Monday?

And speaking of money, the shipments of currency back to the true homes in Mexico are going to stop on Monday, rght?

And speaking of shipments, here's a tough one: the drug shipments. Look, I don't want to take the meth out of their mouths, but they're going to do a slowdown on those, right? Not come through on Monday? I don't know what the crystal meth users will do, but it will teach them to be properly grateful for all the illegals do for them, and out of the kindness of their hearts, too.

Oh, and taxes. Not paying them will be a great way to show the northerners. Don't pay the real property taxes, the personal property taxes, stop those SSI and Medicare withdrawals, and above all don't pay a single red cent of federal, state or local income or occupational tax on Monday. Oooh, and no garbage fees. No community assessments of any kind. That will get the word out!. Oh....whaddaya mean, "they don't anyway"? Well, okay, so maybe the tax thing is not such a good idea. Never mind.

Overall, it's a great idea, but doesn't go far enough. The illegals should take these suggestions and really stick it to The Man, uh, Hombre on May Day. Yep, those weak gringoes will be simply begging for them to come back, I just know.

Sad to see that this thread... (Below threshold)
John Garcia:

Sad to see that this thread has changed from what is usually good discussion into blatant racially biased insults. It must be easy to joke like that since we are talking about "illegals" anyway, they don't have the standing you do as a US citizen. They must be beneath you because of that, and the fact they work menial labor jobs you would never do or encourage your kids to do yourself. Maybe it is insulting to your US citizenry that they speak a language you don't understand, and are probably talking about you. How suspicious you must be.
Fortunately, the US govt, however is more "human" than you and allows them the courtesy of health care and social services, because what is truly relevant here, they exist right now among us. They shop and contribute to their local economy, send money home, and in effect make lemonade from the lemons they were given in life. The fall in love and have children that have been given American education and those children now understand civil concepts and don't want to see their parents made into felons. We know illegal immmigration is wrong. We know the system is not working. Can you not see from your office seat that this issue is about displacing families?
A boycott is suggested only to show they have some "human worth" to you. That they in fact exists "economically" which to them may mean more in your eyes than what they do now, the gardener, nanny or cook, the lower class, the butt of racial jokes and hatred for their non-americaness. Seriously this issue has gone from communist influence and conspiracy, dems vs republicans, legal vs illegal etc. None of which the "people" in question are concerned with. A poorly designed and easily skirted immigration policy caused this. They are here now, millions strong, willing to be a part of our society and are voicing that to you right now. Instead you look down your nose at them, and belittle their efforts. Life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. To bad your happiness includes making fun of the less fortunate in a public forum.

You earn your rights to L,L... (Below threshold)

You earn your rights to L,L and POH by BECOMING A CITIZEN!

What part of illegal don't you folks understand???? Or should we translate it for you?

inmigrante ilegal
immigrant ilegal
противозаконный иммигрант
非法移民
onwettige immigrant
immigré illégal
ungültiger Immigrant
παράνομος μετανάστης
immigrante illegale
違法移民
불법 이주자

Here we go again with the r... (Below threshold)
lakestate:

Here we go again with the race card - John. This has absolutely nothing to do with race - NOTHING. It has nothing to do with LEGAL immigration - NOTHING. It has everything to do with ILLEGAL immigration - EVERYTHING. Come here legally, and there's no problem. Why should we have to pay for and support illegals coming to OUR COUNTRY? Then... have illegals call us racists because we don't want them here illegaly. Look at the Mexican immigrant laws - and tell me how fair they are. They're 100 times harsher than US immigration laws. Stop your whinning and come here legally - you wouldn't hear any complaints out of the MAJORITY of LEGAL American citizens.

My bad, I should have said:... (Below threshold)

My bad, I should have said:

BECOMING A CITIZEN LEGALLY

not by intimidation, economic blackmail, etc.

Mr. Garcia,Could you... (Below threshold)
DaveD:

Mr. Garcia,
Could you please explain why the country FROM which these people are arriving cannot offer the same opportunities as they see in the United States? That might be a nice place for you to begin your discussion

What's even more hillarious... (Below threshold)
lakestate:

What's even more hillarious is the Hollywood elite and leftist Moonbats that go around running down the US saying Americans are stupid, etc.. Yet here we have 12 million people that have risked their lives to get in to the US albiet illegally just so they can cut the lawns, wash the cars, walk the dogs and babysit those same damn elitists. Like Bill Mahr said in an interview, no illegal immigrants would destroy Beverly Hills. That's racist if I ever hear it. Why doesn't the left condemn him?

You conservatives cannot j... (Below threshold)
katie couric:

You conservatives cannot just arbitrarily stop these legal illegals from a better life.

Here we go again with th... (Below threshold)
John Garcia:

Here we go again with the race card - John.
Posted by: lakestate at April 13, 2006 02:57 PM

Sorry, I didn't play it, it was played by commenters before me, using car thieves, taco bell employees, and social security card forgers as descriptors of illegals. Funny that you start with such a comment though as if you are already tired of hearing yet another opinion. Personally, I feel you are off- topic, the original post by Jay Tea is in regards to the choice of May 1st as a communist inspired day which happens to be the planned day for the boycott. My addition is an attempt to show you that regardless of which organization is aligning themselves to a position in this cause, communist, socialists, dems, conservatives whatever they all fall short of the reality of the problem. Legal Mexican-American minors, US citizens by birth are questioning the very same parents that have provided food shelter etc. for them about their illegal status, all the while seeing america debating if their parents become felons. The parents are rallying together because they know they are wrong but nobody has bothered them about it till now. They are faced with a big "what should I do now" and that is the issue. No one from any walk of life wants their family torn apart by incarceration or deportation. They want to show they are worth more, but instead are still the subject of american explotation. (much like Bill Maher's comment)
Mr. Garcia,
Could you please explain why the country FROM which these people are arriving cannot offer the same opportunities as they see in the United States? That might be a nice place for you to begin your discussion

Posted by: DaveD at April 13, 2006 03:12 PM

hard to tell if there is sarcasm there, let's just go with it as is. Try researching it yourself, start with Vicente Fox's stalled democratic reforms, Free market supply that cannot to keep up with a growing population, not enough jobs to go around, add NAFTA opening the door for potential in 1994 but just the year 2000 as marking the first true democratic election and YOU should be able to begin your own discussion once you are more comfortable.

What is illegal are busine... (Below threshold)
Drew E.:

What is illegal are businesses large and small who try to get an edge by either knowingly or looking the other way to hire someone at a lower wage. This is especially true when it comes to small construction businesses. If you want to stem the tide start incarcerating the greedy b's hiring. If these people had a choice of paying a reasonable wage to a citizen or legal green card employee or going to jail that would make the biggest difference.

remember a lot of those nic... (Below threshold)
chela:

remember a lot of those nice houses you live in and those well groomed lawns you walk on the work is being done by some of those illegal immigrants! so before you end up putting you foot in your mouth think about what you are saying. these people come here to work and do jobs that you wouldn't do if they weren't here, they pay taxes and take good care of their families. not all of them get public or governmental assistance like you claim. the majority of people on public or governmental assistance are caucasian people not hispanics or african americans. so always think before you speak because the words you say can always turn around and bite you in the behind. a day without the hispanic population will truly show you how big of an empact they have on this country and maybe that's what it's going to take for the people that hide behind their so called citizenship to realize there's no race that's above any other we are all one race and that's the human race!!! what's next are you going to try to send everybody back to where they really originated from? you know all the african american's didn't come to this country willingly!!!!

In regard to Jay's referenc... (Below threshold)
Drew E.:

In regard to Jay's reference to May Day..the biggest holder of the Republican Congress, never veto President outragious DEBT is Communist China..you know the folks who crushed an attempt at democracy at T Square in 1989. The Chinese actually believed in the tide that ended the Soviet Union. The same thing is now happening right now in Tibet where thousands are being arrested. Heck, next year if China demanded we celebrate May Day or they call in their debt what would we do?

colonyn ... (Below threshold)
Heralder:

colony

n 1: a body of people who settle far from home but maintain ties with their homeland; inhabitants remain nationals of their home state but are not literally under the home state's system of government.

Given the above definition, I think we're past the point of illegal immigration and into a different realm...with what, 12+ million illegal immigrants here?

John Garcia: Everybody has the right to a better life. Yes? Then you wouldn't mind donating some of your paycheck so I can feed my kids right? I know I set up a tent on your lawn and by law, it's your property, but I do mow it for you occasionally right? I mean, I do a job you don't want to do.
In fact, you know what..I deserve to live on your lawn and I'm going to protest in front of your house until the government changes it's property laws to allow me to keep generously contributing to your life and livelyhood.
I know the people next door saved for 5 or more years to buy a house in this neighborhood, and me having the law changed so I don't have to buy a house to live here would completely undermine, and in fact destroy the whole point of doing things the right way...but I wan't to be here and that's what matters in the end right, my situation?

Wait, wait, my 3rd child was born on your lawn!..so you can't send me away now, because then she would have to stay and that would break up my family. Take her with me? No, no...my apartment is a mess and I just can't bear cleaning it. Maybe if you cleaned it for me I wouldn't be living on your lawn in the first place.

Now John, I don't want the above to sound mocking, that was not it's intention. Analogy is sometimes better than just repeating the same facts over again. Does it make any more sense as an analogy?

This topic is going to rage... (Below threshold)

This topic is going to rage on and on for time untold. I believe much more is going on here than meets the general publics eye. It baffles me that we have seen hundreds of thousands, and I'm presuming the majority are illegal, demanding that Our government change OUR laws to accommodate them, when they should in fact be demonstrating in their OWN country demanding THEIR government institute changes to provide them a better life in THEIR country. I'm not a conspiracy theorist but I'm sure beginning to think that something is and has been going on between the U.S and Mexican governments when it comes to this issue.

Chela, that is the very POI... (Below threshold)
Jay Tea:

Chela, that is the very POINT of what I wrote: I do not believe what you wrote is true. I believe that the true costs of the benefits you describe vastly exceed them, and I am ready, willing, and eager to put it to the test. In fact, that's what the whole point of the May 1 protest is all about.

J.

Chela"remember ... (Below threshold)
Heralder:

Chela

"remember a lot of those nice houses you live in and those well groomed lawns you walk on the work is being done by some of those illegal immigrants! so before you end up putting you foot in your mouth think about what you are saying."

You're saying that without people coming to this country illegally we couldn't mow our own lawns or pay the kid down the street $2.00 to do so? You mean if I wanted my roof re-shingled there simply isn't any American citizen who would be able to do it for me?

"these people come here to work and do jobs that you wouldn't do if they weren't here,"

What, like the West Virgina coal miners? They weren't immigrants. They make your jobs look like a walk in the park. We would still do those jobs Chela, because they need to be done.

"they pay taxes and take good care of their families. not all of them get public or governmental assistance like you claim."

How does one pay tax if one is not supposed to be here in the first place? You need a social security number to pay taxes here do you not? I may be totally wrong about that, I'm not sure.

And you're right, not all of them are on governmental assistance. But do keep in mind that most public services that illegals use are paid for by legal citizens, so in a way they are being assisted by the government and it's citizens.

"the majority of people on public or governmental assistance are caucasian people not hispanics or african americans. so always think before you speak because the words you say can always turn around and bite you in the behind."

That can be argued, and in fact there's no solid answer to your claim, as we have no way to really document all the people here illegally.

"a day without the hispanic population will truly show you how big of an empact they have on this country"

I know they have a big impact on this country...but is it a positive one?

"and maybe that's what it's going to take for the people that hide behind their so called citizenship to realize there's no race that's above any other we are all one race and that's the human race!!!"

So-called citizenship? Are you refuting my citizenship? If you want to be accepted here, try not insulting it's legal citizens.

You're correct, "we are all one race and that's the human race!!!" but do tell me what breaking the law of another country has to do with that? You may want to make race a factor here, but it simply isn't...sorry.

"what's next are you going to try to send everybody back to where they really originated from?"

Not if they came here legally.

"you know all the african american's didn't come to this country willingly!!!!"

True, they didn't. Are you saying that we kidnapped upwards of 12 million people from their home countries and forced them to work in the U.S.? Well, if that's the case, by all means, you're now free to go home. If you want to come back, please do so legally.

Things like ethics, scruple... (Below threshold)

Things like ethics, scruples, honesty, don't seem to have gotten in your way thus far - why start now?

Whoa John !!!! "Sorry, I di... (Below threshold)
Tim:

Whoa John !!!! "Sorry, I didn't play it, it was played by commenters before me, using car thieves, taco bell employees, and social security card forgers as descriptors of illegals." John that was MY question ... "Are the guys making the fake social security cards taking the day off." How is that racial in any way, shape or form? Is it not illegal to forge SS cards? Who would forge a SS card? I never mention a race. Any illegal of any race will forge a SS card. Therefore John, it was YOU that played the race card, not I.

Heralder, I think I ... (Below threshold)
John Garcia:

Heralder,
I think I can bridge the gap for us. Your analogy in my opinion fails when you state "In fact, you know what..I deserve to live on your lawn and I'm going to protest in front of your house until the government changes it's property laws to allow me to keep generously contributing to your life and livelyhood." This idea is not in the minds of the illegals and if it was voiced it was said because LULAC or some other political group viewed it as a necessary "I am an American, give me my rights" stance. My opinion is that politics is the driver here and the actual illegal wants to remain as non descript as they have been for the past 30 years. Silent, staying amongst their own, not drawing attention to themselves and dreading that one day they will be caught and returned. Because after all, regardless of the view that some might have, they know right from wrong and know the chance they take by being illegal. Now weighing the difference between what they have and what America can offer has made many an engineer into a 7-11 clerk and many a teacher into an unskilled laborer. Now just like yourself and myself and any other commenter here, we like to think we can make a difference and change our governments stance on an issue. DO those of you whose arguement includes clean up your own nation first actually think that can happen. We can't even settle that here in America with our "for the people, by the people' government. How are Mexican Nationals responsible for their government yet. They have 5 major political parties, none of which is a majority, two of which do nothing but oppose the President. People please, face facts, Mexico is years away from being able to rid itself of corruption and turmoil. The illegals are here now. They will be here tomorrow, they will continue to get sick and use our resources, they will get caught and sent back and there families will go on welfare until the breadwinner returns. They will educate there kids in better schools with the hope they lives will be better than their own. American political agenda has backed them in a corner, what would you do in their shoes? One american hand wants to hire them, one wants to smack them and send them back. You may not understand their language, you may view them as less than you because of their legal status or inclination to work unskilled jobs, but they are no less a person than you. You don't want to accept them because why? Because they broke our laws? Perhaps illegals should open recording studios instead. Self professed drug dealers and pimps are millionaire superstars because they entertain us. All seems to be acceptable then. The young hollywood starlets whom your daughters try to emulate are all whorish coked up princesses but we love them anyway. Ask yourself why this affects you personally and what difference it would make if Americans agreed that those already here need to become legal and those coming over are subjected to some sort of border security and maybe we can solve the problem as people. Just really tired of the whole I am an American, you are not, I count, you don't, let me translate that for you, is Taco Bell going to close, bullshit.

Chela ... "these people com... (Below threshold)
Tim:

Chela ... "these people come here to work and do jobs that you wouldn't do if they weren't here," ... Why are you people so eager to believe the evening news? Have you seen ONE study, ONE poll, ANYTHING that says Americans won't do these jobs? I'm in construction and I can spell it out for you. The American skilled tradesman is being pushed out!!! With the influx of illegals which has gradually entered the construction industry over the years, it's becoming more efficient to hire even more illegals, because they can communicate better between other trades. They are NOT working for low wages. DO NOT BE FOOLED BY THE PROPAGANDA. The illegals I see are making $12-$25 an hour with 401k, health, dental, life, vacation, and a bonus package. They are infact taking American skilled labor jobs. Welders, pipefitters, plumbers, electricians, sheet metal mechanics. Sheetrock, roofing. These are NOT jobs that Americans don't want. These are jobs being stolen from underneath us.

Excellent post John. Thank... (Below threshold)
Heralder:

Excellent post John. Thank you.

A few points:

"This idea is not in the minds of the illegals and if it was voiced it was said because LULAC or some other political group viewed it as a necessary"

I have a hard time here, because I don't believe these protesters are pawns of LULAC. What are the signs of the protesters saying to me?

"We are America" No, you're not. Is Australia England? Is Saudi Arabia France? Has this some deeper meaning along the lines that they are our economy? Totally untrue. So what does this sign say to me? It says we deserve to be here...just as much as you. Abstractly? yes, that can be agreed upon...land is land, people are people. Legally? (and that's what is being argued here) no they do not deserve to be here.

Then there are the obviously ignorant ones like:

"Honkies why don't you take your asses back to Europe"
Which I don't believe merits comment.

The thing is John, by waving the magic wand of law-abolishment we then completely undermine our legal system. Do you think making people that snuck into the country citizens would solve the problem? No, it would worsen it. "Hey I hear that America is making citizens of people walked over the border, let's go!"
Not to mention the ones that did go through the very real pains of becoming a citizen then feel totally cheated for doing so. Why wait over 5 years to become a citizen when you can intimidate the government into granting it to you for holding a sign?

"How are Mexican Nationals responsible for their government yet."

How are we responsible for Mexico's government? This hints at a larger issue in the world that people want us to interfere in their issues and then vilify us for it.

"what would you do in their shoes?"

A good question and one I've thought on extensively. To what conclusion did I come? None. I have no idea what I would do in their shoes...really. I have no personal basis for comparison. Perhaps that very reason is why so many American's are having a hard time understanding this whole thing (that and the language barrier).

"One american hand wants to hire them, one wants to smack them and send them back."

Very true John. That does underscore that part of the problem is indeed shared by us.

"You may not understand their language, you may view them as less than you because of their legal status or inclination to work unskilled jobs, but they are no less a person than you."

I do not think them any less a person than I.

"You don't want to accept them because why? Because they broke our laws?"

Yes, but alot of it is failure to assimilate. If a majority of them were trying to that'd be an easier pill to swallow...but coming here to work and send the money you earn (and they do earn it, I will never fault them for that) out of the country, benefiting from your host, never learning the language...those things begin to feel less like illegal immigration and more like invasion. When I turn on the TV excited to see the Simpsons on, only to find at 8 O'clock primetime on a major network the Simpsons is in Spanish...that makes me feel a bit alienated. When I see a sign at the check cashing place that is only in Spanish, when kids look at me on the street and start talking to each other and laughing (maybe they were talking about last nights Simsons epsidode in Spanish) that makes me feel alienated. And in turn it makes me a little bit annoyed that I should feel that way.
If they wan't to petition to be Americans, they should indeed try and be Americans, not Mexicans living in America. They should never have done the first rallies flying Mexican flags. They've seen the damage that did to their cause and abandoned it, but nobody forgot it. Nobody forgot flying our flag upside down.

On the issues of our celebrities being glorified for breaking laws...on that you are 100% correct. It is a hypocrasy to our law-breaking argument.

"Just really tired of the whole I am an American, you are not, I count, you don't,"

In essence, and hear me out, they do not count. They cannot pay taxes (I'm still not sure on this issue, help me out here) they cannot vote, and in fact they cannot take part in everything that would make them American, in America. Do they count as citizens because the snuck over the border? I say no. Do they count as people? Never in question Hell yes they do.
The comments like the Taco Bell comment are indefensible.

Illegal immigrants may take all this, and all that I said, as me arrogantly flaunting my citizenship in their face as some sort of merit badge that makes me more human. But I hope you disagree John.

As much as I'll debate this issue as a whole, I have to say that we cannot very well arrest and mass deport these people. But going forward we really do need to start acting as strict as every other country in the world when it comes to undocumented immigration.

Hmmm.In an amusing... (Below threshold)
ed:

Hmmm.

In an amusing way this reminds me of the strike France had to endure last year from unemployed entertainers, musicians and artists.

No they weren't unemployed because they were on strike. Nor were they on strike because they were unemployed.

They were on strike because their benefits for being unemployed weren't good enough and they were threatening to continue to be unemployed until the benefits got better.

...since we are ta... (Below threshold)
...since we are talking about "illegals" anyway, they don't have the standing you do as a US citizen.

I can't believe you wrote this with a straight face.

John and Heralder - pretty ... (Below threshold)
F15C:

John and Heralder - pretty good discussion. Too much detail for me to comment on appropriately, but let me add a couple of aspects to the discussion.

First, though the pro-illegal-immigrationists want to paint the picture that those who want to control our borders are racists and xenophobes, they offer not proof beyond their words and cannot refute the fact that America is probably the least racist nation in the world and further is less racist on the whole than are the populations of illegal immigrants themselves.

In fact, the race-baiting tactics they employed by activists and their mindless synchophants are becoming less effective daily. More good people are realizing that being labeled racist and/or xenophobic is a cheap ad hominem tactic and is simply the price to be paid for taking a stand.

I find it funny because Casear Chavez was adamantly against illegal immigration because it depressed the wages of the legal immigrant workers that he championed. I've yet to hear Casear Chavez called racist and xenophbic.

Let me be clear: I do though most certainly hate what illegal immigrants are doing my nation's culture and sovereignity. I fully understand that the largest segment of them are good folks just wanting to make a living. Fine - but that is utterly irrelevant.

The fact is that illegal immigrants by their sheer numbers and increasing demands are illegally, immorally, and unethically changing the culture of a sovereign nation and burdening the citizens of that nation with the costs of their existence (illegal aliens consume $2700 per year in services than they contribute) while they send billions of dollars outside our nation yearly that does not benefit our economy in the least.

John, regardless of either the reasons or rationale behind their actions or their race or color, what illegal immigrants are doing is simply wrong and Americans have every ethical and legal right - and I believe obligation - to stop them.

Whatever your stance on ill... (Below threshold)
B Moe:

Whatever your stance on illegal immigration, lumping all Latinos in a big pile, and thinking the demonstrators speak for all of them is wrong. It is just as wrong as thinking Code Pink and ANSWER speak for all Americans at one of their protests.

One think I wish people would consider, we are at a very low unemployment rate now, the economy is growing rapidly and population growth has been nearly stable in this country for decades. The reason we have this problem is we have a labor shortage, and current immigration laws are apparently creating a bottleneck. Deportation would wreck large parts of our economy, because it is not the illegals are doing the jobs Americans won't do, there aren't enough Americans around to do them.

In fact, the race-baitin... (Below threshold)
John Garcia:

In fact, the race-baiting tactics they employed by activists and their mindless synchophants are becoming less effective daily. More good people are realizing that being labeled racist and/or xenophobic is a cheap ad hominem tactic and is simply the price to be paid for taking a stand.- Posted by: F15C at April 14, 2006 12:56 AM

I agree, and feel compelled to demonstrate that it effectively masks any decent positive discussion that is necessary to solve or at least pose a solution. My tactic is simply to remind those of us that good people solve problems, and I accept any good person and their view regardless of which side of the fence they grew up on.
I very much agree as an American, that illegal immigrants should have no say in what happens to them. They chose to cross illegally and live in an illegal status. Can we blame them? I say no. Does the candy store clerk turn his back when the school kids on a field trip come into his store? Well we have for several years now. It is our fault American workers are losing jobs to illegal. American contractors choose to hire them. Tim wrote- With the influx of illegals which has gradually entered the construction industry over the years, it's becoming more efficient to hire even more illegals, because they can communicate better between other trades. This is true and an excellent point as to "what do they provide for us" and at the same time demonstrates the "monster" we created.

Heralder, thanks for your comments and I really agree with you in principle, but I feel personally it is too late for us to effectively "clean up" this problem by enforcing rules that have been ignored for years. I just see "civil unrest" as a term we would learn very quickly. Honestly though I don't have an answer yet. Amnesty offends my personal moral code, and I am sure there are others that feel that way. Please anyone reading this don't get me wrong, I did not speak out for any other reason other than to attempt to bring some "human face" to those referred to as 'illegals". Positive people work towards solutions, solutions that effectively show our kindness, humanity, and tolerance. Look past the agendas of all the politicos whose only attempt is to cull support for themselves and hope a stronger message from the people is heard and adopted as policy. Do I have an answer? of course not, What I can do is continue to discuss, explore, decide and question all sides of this issue in the hopes understanding will be the key to overcoming the problem.

Does anyone have any figure... (Below threshold)
Lizzie:

Does anyone have any figures on how many people who are in the US illegally actually tried to take the legal route and got rejected?

I posted about this and som... (Below threshold)

I posted about this and someone left a comment with your blog URL. He was right!

Great post!

If Homeland security contin... (Below threshold)
obviousBob:

If Homeland security continues arresting immigrants(about 2 thousand in the past 2 days) Within Months we will run out of room in jails and prisons, and theyll have to start using internment camps. They are already to go, fully built and stocked by halliburton. Any way even if we could afford to deport every immigrant and jail all their employers, We would have 5 dollar tomatoes and 7 dollar gas. A meal at a resturaunt would tripple. Some of us would have o clean up after ourselves, and raise our own kids. Oh and the cost of building anything like a house or office building will skyrocket. So Put your racist Ferver in your rear pocket and sit on it. You cant afford them all to leave so stop the hatebreeding Lip-Service.
Educate yourselves and grow-up,

Also Were all decendants from immigrants fortunatly arriving early enough to either steal the land or be welcome with open arms from everywhere!

obviousBob, care to cite a ... (Below threshold)
Jay Tea:

obviousBob, care to cite a source or two for your "Halliburton internment camps" or $5 tomatoes? Give the location of just one of those camps. If they're all built and stocked, then you should be able to point out just one of them. And who's gonna work at them? Any towns reporting a huge dip in unemployment as hordes of their workers suddenly have brand-new jobs they don't wanna talk about?

I happen to think you're talking out of your ass, and I'm so confident that I'm willing to risk it and see if that actually happens.

J.

you tell em jay tea! its pe... (Below threshold)
proamerica:

you tell em jay tea! its people like this that promote unease and fear in the situation in turn adding fuel to the fire.why doesnt everyone white thier congressman and senators who CAN make the changes or let them hear your solution it truly is the only way to solve the problems. the american democratic way. the adresses and contact info can be found at any public library.

Jay Tea, you asked for it, ... (Below threshold)
Danny:

Jay Tea, you asked for it, you got it... http://www.commondreams.org/views06/0418-27.htm . Check it out...And $5 tomatoes...yeah...usually thats what happens when people stop working for $.20 and the people that hire them are forced to start paying people at least the minimum wage...pretty big difference in the cost of production there(in no way am I saying this is right, but a lot of things aren't right...sort those out for yourself)...but I dont want to get into it, just passing by and adding to the discussion.

i happened to stumble acros... (Below threshold)
glo:

i happened to stumble across this blog looking for news stories on today's immigration protests. I would have to say the most dissapointing aspect of this country is really dumb people sitting on the computer all day saying really dumb things. You guys rule!




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