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Delusions of Grandeur

Meet Laura. Laura is a member of the Durham, NC Impeach Bush-Cheney Meet-Up Group, a 15-member-strong organization dedicated to removing the fascistic, evil cabal currently running the country--weather permitting.

Through their spirited displays of political protest, the Durham Impeach Bush folks hope to foment a groundswell of public support against the Bush administration, which would ultimately be unceremoniously tossed from office. From the looks of their feeble "website," they'd better start working overtime: They're looking less like a colossal pack of compelling Americans and more like a tiny collection of unhinged loons.

Case in point, dear reader, is Laura. According to her profile, this gal has been a member of the Durham Impeach Bush crowd for all of two weeks. A mother of three who's a Durham resident, Laura doesn't seem a likely candidate for the state's Public Enemy No. 1.

Even so, Laura writes by way of introduction:

Hello, I have 3 children, moved to Durham NC from Chicago 14 years ago. I'm a concerned citizen. I won't write too much here as we are probably being monitored...

Uh, is she kidding? Does she really believe that the bigwigs in the administration are directing federal resources to track a 15-member organization of dimwitted cooks clutching a handful of "No Blood for Oil" placards? Gosh, doesn't she think they have anything better to do? Like bite the heads off of children?

Naturally, Laura--if that is her real name--has serious delusions of grandeur. But her foolishness also says something unfortunate for American left-wingers who love to play the civil liberties card.

There are, to be sure, plenty of principled arguments to be had over the benefits and drawbacks of heightened security in this country. You needn't be a diehard civil libertarian (apt phrase, that) to be concerned about the calculus between our liberties and public safety in our post-9/11 world.

But, at some deep level, the apocalyptic rhetoric from the Left about the purported evils of Bush administration's Big Brother act doesn't appeal to the broader American public. The average Joe can tell that we do not, pace Laura, dwell in a country completely indistinguishable from the one depicted in Orwell's 1984.

An unserious John Dean can prattle on all he wants about the current administration as "proto-fascist," but the American people--or at least those who know what "fascist" means--will realize that he's off his rocker. This kind of piffle only appeals to the Lauras of the world, who are sufficiently delusional to think that Dick Cheney is scared stiff about a Durham housewife and a couple of her delusional confreres.

If it were true that the Durham Impeach Bush group had to hide from the nefarious secret police, leftist arguments about civil liberties would have some resonance. But, as things are, they do not have resonance--except to the nutters.

Though The New York Times inveighs against Bush administration security measures ad nauseam, its staff should realize that this is not a winning argument. Best to bring up another subject. Like, say, Joe Wilson.

(Note: The crack young staff normally "weblog" over at "The Hatemonger's Quarterly," where they are currently undertaking a massive sting operation aimed at the member(s) of the Dubuque Impeach Bush-Cheney Meet-Up.)


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Comments (58)

The scary part of Laura's s... (Below threshold)
Lorie Byrd:

The scary part of Laura's story is that she has three kids to teach to hate Bush.

Guess the news spreads kind... (Below threshold)
Scrapiron:

Guess the news spreads kind of slow in N.C. when you hiding from the evil Bush and don't dare turn on the TV since they're watching you through it. Someone tell the idiots that their whole world has fallen on their heads. Now over 700 WMD found in Iraq and the duo of Joe and Val have been proves liars, (Saddam really was seaking uranium in Africa) as if we didn't already know that. The leaders of the democratic party have made complete fools of themselves with the rant 'Joe speaks truth to power'. Wan't that the former presidential candidiate Hanoi John that was hugging Joe and proclaiming to the world that Joe speaks truth to power? Now it's sure Joe doesn't know what truth is and we also knew that Hanoi John was and still is anti-American to the point of being a full blown member of the communist party. Wonder if Momma 'T' pays his dues?

This is going to look like ... (Below threshold)

This is going to look like giberish, but I've got to test out a filter for "curly quotes" somewehre, and what better spot than here?

This is the "good stuff" ... And even more... And yet more "good stuff"

All of the quotes and elipses (pasted in from Word) in the previous line should be scrubbed when the comment is submitted and shown in ASCII-only mode.

And it works! No more inva... (Below threshold)

And it works! No more invalid characters...

You probably mean Howard De... (Below threshold)
Aubrey:

You probably mean Howard Dean rather than John Dean.

Howard Dean is a looney too... (Below threshold)
The Listkeeper:

Howard Dean is a looney toon.

John Dean is a rat.

Oh, and while the gov't may... (Below threshold)
The Listkeeper:

Oh, and while the gov't may not be monitoring her and her friends....


The blogosphere is happy to take up the mantle.

Perhaps John Dean is what w... (Below threshold)

Perhaps John Dean is what would happen if Howard Dean and John Kerry had a love child...

Actually, List, Silver, JOH... (Below threshold)

Actually, List, Silver, JOHN Dean has been saying those things. He's still riding the hell out of his "repentant for Watergate" act, 30+ years later.

J.

"Uh, is she kidding?"... (Below threshold)
scheisse:

"Uh, is she kidding?"
Uh, yeah, in all likelihood.

"...as we are probably bein... (Below threshold)
Joe:

"...as we are probably being monitored..."

Probably are. By some low level Secret service agent who p*ssed off his supervisor and now has all the nut jobs to watch as his duty. lol

We ignore these FIFTEEN peo... (Below threshold)
Justrand:

We ignore these FIFTEEN people at our peril!!

Within a few years their ranks could swell to OVER TWENTY!!

As difficult as it must be for the NSA to monitor every movement of these 15...just imagine if there were 5 more!!

We ignore these FIFTEEN ... (Below threshold)
MikeSC:

We ignore these FIFTEEN people at our peril!!

Within a few years their ranks could swell to OVER TWENTY!!

As difficult as it must be for the NSA to monitor every movement of these 15...just imagine if there were 5 more!!

If the press covered the story, we'd hear about a 33% growth in anti-Bush groups.
-=Mike

The scary part of Laura'... (Below threshold)

The scary part of Laura's story is that she has three kids to teach to hate Bush.

Posted by: Lorie Byrd at September 3, 2006 01:04 AM


Hope she teaches them to not vote for him in the future when they're all grown up.

I see - incredible e... (Below threshold)
muirgeo:

I see
- incredible evidence of election riggin
- privatization of our elections
- privatization of our military
- a war based on false and fixed intel
- fear mongering as a main platform for election and policy-making
- a president who has broken the law according to a H Bush federal judge appointee
- a countries energy policy done in secret
- a Vice Presidents x-company making huge profits
- An administration veiled in secrecy
- A country not compiling with the Geneva Conventions
- A President using signing statements to exempt himself from the laws passed by our senate.
- A senate that was willing to investigate a previous president for firing workers in the travel office but have refused to forward any investigation on this president
- A senate that refuses to investigate huge spending contracts with blatant discretions
- A president who says the terrorist hates us for our freedom and then takes away some of our freedoms to protect us from said terrorist
- Ear mark spending breaking the back of our countries future and a government in complete control by the Republicans doing nothing about it.
- A government that at every turn puts corporate interest over interest of the people

I see all this and much more and I hear this governments supporters tell me they don't understand why some people hate Bush. When in fact the real problem is you people hate democrats so much you're willing to sell out your country and look the other way to support your totally corrupt party over the interest of your country and democracy. Wake up fellas you can hate democrats but you better start learning to hate Bush and the current completely corrupt and unpatriotic Republican leadership.

Hi Muirgeo:English... (Below threshold)
sam:

Hi Muirgeo:

English not your first language, eh? Or are you twelve years old? Or is the bong-hit not worn off yet? Go watch "Path to 9/11" on ABC next weekend, it has some nice things to say about your traitorous democratic president and his burglar security adviser.

Sam, Great job!!!... (Below threshold)
muirgeo:

Sam,

Great job!!! When you can't address the points make it an issue of grammar and change the subject to the Clinton administration. Way to fall in line...did you shine those Jack Boots yet today?

I love these people living ... (Below threshold)
Andrew X:

I love these people living the fantasy that they are important enough for the Feds to lose sleep over them. In essence, that is truly what their philosophy is about.... how they themselves FEEL, about THEMSELVES... that is all important.

I can't help be reminded, when I encounter such people, of a related converstion held by a couple of friends I got to know over nine years....

===

George : Why did you refuse the package? Everybody loves a package.

Jerry : I don't know... it was weird . Crazy printing. I don't know who it was from.

George : (laughing) What do you think.... it's a bomb?

Jerry : It's not totally impossible.

George : Oh, the ego on you!

Jerry : Why can't I be bombable?

George : Who's going to bomb you? An airline, for all the stupid little peanut jokes?

Jerry : I suppose you think your bombable.

George : Hey. There are a couple of people that wouldn't mind having me out of the way.

Jerry : There's more than a couple.

===

Dead on.

Being from the area, I can ... (Below threshold)
Mitchell:

Being from the area, I can tell you that Durham probably has, along with The Peoples Republic of Carrboro/Chapel Hill, the highest number of wackos per capita than any other place in good old NC. It certainly is not representative of the place, thank God. I would have emigrated by now if it were.

It must be comforting in some way to concoct your own little world in which no one can come to tell you what "reality" is, since you already figured it out by reading Kos, Ward Churchill, and Joe Wilson. Sure beats the heck out of living in the real world.

You mean all "this" is not about me?!! NO way, I know "they" are monitoring my brain waves . . .!

I visited the site, and boy... (Below threshold)
Mitchell:

I visited the site, and boy, things look like they are really rolling now per "Dave" the leader of this wackfest:

"Hi all,

Our first meeting was very useful. We've got a number action items related to (1) designing a smaller flyer, (2) starting to plan for outreach activities at upcoming events such as CenterFest, and (3) finding ways to get students involved at NCCU, Duke and Durham Tech. We agreed on a goal of getting petitions together to present to the Durham City Council. We will also look into setting up an online petition for Durham City / County residents.

I've reserved a meeting room at the Library for next month's meeting on the 3rd Thursday, which is Sept 21, at 7pm. The small room was already reserved, so we will be in the large meeting room next month. A draft agenda, directions, etc. are at: http://impeachbush.me...

You can always get in touch with me through the 'Contact Organizer' feature on the Meetup.com website: http://impeachbush.me...

Regards,

Dave"

You got the library reserved, better flyer size, and a plan to convert the undergrads at UNC/Duke/NCCU. It's a steamroller, I'm tellin' you!

I can just imagine the faces on the undergrads when the nutroots show up about the time the kids are set to head out to a beer-fueled mixer with the sorority down the street--"before you head out, can we just have 2 hours of your time to explain to you why we want to impeach Bush/Cheney/McHitler . . ."

Any response to muirgeo? An... (Below threshold)

Any response to muirgeo? Any at all......? And I don't mean petty insults about grammer etc. I mean, you know, some facts to refute what she said......

Ok, I will be waiting and reading the brilliant posts to follow, about what a left wing tree hugging commie she is ;)

Field, You don't ... (Below threshold)
Dawnsblood:

Field,
You don't respond to an idiot's delusions. You just pray they get the help they need.

FN, I assumed you didn't su... (Below threshold)
Mitchell:

FN, I assumed you didn't subscribe to this nonsense, even though you do hold some nonsensical views.

Cheney resigned from Halliburton/Hall. basically made no money on the Iraq contract, show us one basic civil liberty "taken away," Dem senator now has a hold on anti-earmark legislation, Bush broke the law according not to H. Bush appointee, but Carter apppointee, etc . . .

You really have to do better than this. Looks like the public school system is really striking out with some folks these days. Or, is it just an inability to think critically? Take your pick.

Any response to muirgeo?</p... (Below threshold)
Andrew X:

Any response to muirgeo?

I'll take a crack.....

---

I see
- incredible evidence of election rigging

James Carville said in late 2000, “when the NYT and Co finish counting all the votes six months from now, then we will see the truth”. They did, and the truth was a story on page A13. Why? Because it was basically the same as the results announced 72 hours in, Bush by a very slim margin.

Meawhile, whole books have been written about Ohio in 2004, which conveineintly ignore Democrat chicanery in Wisconsin and Philepdelphia, as well as the fact that WI, MI, and PA all had closer pro-Kerry margins than the pro-Bush one in Ohio. Spare us. (Also, Bush received more votes in each of his election than Clinton did, who never got a majority in either 1992 or 1996.)

- privatization of our elections

Huh? Elections remain the provence of local governments. The election problems in Florida 2000 almost ALL took place under elctoral rules and procedures run by Democrats.

- privatization of our military

Philopsohical difference. You don’t trust “corporations”. We don’t trust “state beauracracies”. Duh. That’s what elections and parties are about.

- a war based on false and fixed intel

A lie, itself. How many times do we need to re-publish the entire Democratic ruling establishment saying the EXACT same things about Saddam Hussien all through the nineties? How many times do we need to repeat those quotes? (Answer: A LOT, and EVERY DAY, are you listening, Mr Bush?)

- fear mongering as a main platform for election and policy-making

Just like FDR used the economy to club Republicans in the 1930’s. Some wackos might argue that FDR did not “use” the economy, it was just that his opponents were hopelessly out of touch with the reality of the day that their 1920’s framework was completely unworkable for the 1930’s, and thus FDR’s opponents were left behind. Of course, that’s just crazy talk. It was really all about FDR’s cynicism in “using economic fear-mongering, etc” to win elections. Uh huh.

- a president who has broken the law according to a H Bush federal judge appointee

Would that be the judge whom the Washington Post itself said her reasoning was fatally and absurdly flawed, and about whom Republicans have universal confidence that her case will fall apart on appeal? But please, keep hoping that unelected officials will make everything right for you.

- A president who says the terrorist hates us for our freedom and then takes away some of our freedoms to protect us from said terrorist

Exactly as was done by Abraham Lincoln (R), Woodrow Wilson (D), Franklin Roosevelt (D), and Harry Truman (D), except ALL of them quite arguably did far worse than Mr. Bush.

- A government that at every turn puts corporate interest over interest of the people.

See previous regarding “corporate” vs “state”. An ideological question, not a policy one.

- Ear mark spending breaking the back of our countries future and a government in complete control by the Republicans doing nothing about it.

How DARE you accuse the GOP of….. um….. hmmmmm …….ummm…. never mind.

Anyway, that’ll do for now.

Muirgeo,you my fr... (Below threshold)
Tincan Sailor:


Muirgeo,you my friend are the reason some
animals eat their young,FYI,muirgeo I'm
a registered Democrar and Union member who
hates his party!!!!Sorry to rain on your
parade...

Hey FN:I was not a... (Below threshold)
sam:

Hey FN:

I was not aware that Muirgeo had made any points. He had a list of commie/lefty/loser asssertions that seem to come out of his drug-addled brain, if you can call what he has left a "brain". When he can get one piece of thought together, maybe I can address it.

- A president who says t... (Below threshold)

- A president who says the terrorist hates us for our freedom and then takes away some of our freedoms to protect us from said terrorist

And which freedoms are you missing exactly?

Nice try Andrew X, at least... (Below threshold)

Nice try Andrew X, at least you made an effort. A weak one, but an effort nevertheless. Yes Dems all agreed Sadaam was a bad guy, yes they gave frat boy the power to invade. But it still doesn't mean he had to. I see him falling all over himself trying to avoid a conflict with Iran and Syria, why didn't he do that with Iraq?

I have no problem with corporations being a central part of a democratic govt.over a state run beauracracy. But why does the elected person have to profit from the corporation? And shouldn't the corporation be competent, and those running the coporations obey the law? Agree with you about Presidents of all stripes taking away some of our liberties in times of crisis. Although I don't think any of them tried to give the executive branch so much more power like frat boy is doing. But you still didn't explain the run-away spending of your party on b#@@s#%^t while people are still literally starving to death in this country. Not to mention, the growing immigration crisis, and the fact that natl security is still being compromised while your boy "munchkin Rove" tries to make political points out of said natl security issues.

field-negro:Your n... (Below threshold)
sam:

field-negro:

Your note above is still full of lies, and is nothing more than mental diarrhea.

"people are still literally starving to death in this country.."

Show me one, just one, example of anyone "literally starving to death in this country". You cannot, you liar.

We will continue to make political points out of national security, as long as you and your party remain traitors willing to sell the country. Your party hads decided that they would rather bow to terrorists than fight. So be it. We'll point that out every chance we get, we love to hear you squeal like wounded pigs. Your party has given up any pretense of having any principles, voting to authorize war to get their names on the congressional record, but doing everything to undermine the effort without leaving any fingerprints.

Face it, your party has no guts. It clings to the dead socialist ideas of yesterday, and spends all its time trying to figure out how it can mask the failed ideas to "appear moderate". That is why all your leaders, from Kerry to Clinton, have to depend on "nunance" and "flip-flop". Sucks to be you, doesn't it?

"But why does the elected person have to profit from the corporation?" Talk about hypocrites. Ask your dem senators, including Hillary, Teddy, Kerry and the other millionaires where their money is invested.


Terri Schiavo!... (Below threshold)
914:

Terri Schiavo!

sam, I have no party, I am ... (Below threshold)

sam, I have no party, I am an independent.
You might want to check the October 29,2003 on line addition of the "South Jersey Courier Post" for starving children. Frat boy was in power then wasn't he?

Not to mention, kids are starving every day in our inner city schools. (Maybe not to death, so that was a little hyperbolic on my part)But with all the cuts in school lunches, and other social programs to fund your war, I think my statements about frat boy's administration was quite accurate.

I have seen recently the sc... (Below threshold)
Mitchell:

I have seen recently the school officials here pushing free lunches to kids who don't even qualify.

Hell, do you read the F'n news? Just today the WaPo has an analysis of the fact that, in reality, we have the lowest poverty in history. I'll even provide the fuckin' link, if you can read, you lazy bastard.

If there are any kids starving in this country that literally shovels money at the poor "problem," it sure as Hell isn't Bushes issue. Hell, he gave away the farm with Ed. "reform" and all the other social spending. Have you looked at the increase in the budget the last several years, you miserable know-nothing??

Kids starving in the street. Where do you live, Mogudishu? Managua? WTF???

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/09/01/AR2006090101409.html

f-n:I again say, y... (Below threshold)
sam:

f-n:

I again say, you and your party are liars and have always been liars. And no, it is not hyperbole on my part.

Also cowards. When I challenge you on your lies, you back-pedal, just like your lying and cowardly leaders.

Which school lunch program has been cut? Please cite an example, not just newspaper opinions masquerading as news.

Any response to muirgeo?</p... (Below threshold)
muirgeo:

Any response to muirgeo?

I'll take a crack.....

---

I see
- incredible evidence of election rigging

James Carville said in late 2000, “when the NYT and Co finish counting all the votes six months from now, then we will see the truth”. They did, and the truth was a story on page A13. Why? Because it was basically the same as the results announced 72 hours in, Bush by a very slim margin.


Posted by: Andrew X


Andrew you are wrong on your very first point. When all the Florida ballots were counted in each methodology Gore won.

http://www.aei.org/docLib/20040526_KeatingPaper.pdf

Robert Kennedy's article outlines all the other problems that only an non-ptriotic person could ignore.

http://www.rollingstone.com/news/story/10432334/was_the_2004_election_stolen

muirgeo,Save the c... (Below threshold)
Nahanni:

muirgeo,

Save the conspiracy theroy shite for the feveer swamps.

Now...

Andrew you are wrong on your very first point. When all the Florida ballots were counted in each methodology Gore won.

Not according to recounts that LLL newspapers such as the NYT and WaPo and LLL Harvard did.

Ever hear of a little thing called the "Law"? You are aware that under Florida state law if you wish to challenge election results you do that on a county by county basis. Al Gore only chose to challenge the results in 3 counties(or 5 counties, cant remember offhand). He did not choose to challenge the results in ALL the counties. Too bad for him, he screwed up. But the result would have been the same-HE LOST.

You know, at least Nixon had some class when the 1960 election was stolen from him by Mayor Daley and the "vote early-vote often especially if you are dead" voters of Chicago. He didn't throw a fit like an infant in a high chair like Al Gore did. Nixon understood that it would tear the country apart if he pushed the challenge and it would do no good except to feed his ego. Al Gore didn't care-THAT is how greedy for power the man is. Now he has resorted to founding his own religion. Guess he read that quote by L. Ron Hubbard that stated that if you want to be rich and powerful for your whole life found a religion.

Robert Kennedy's article outlines all the other problems that only an non-ptriotic person could ignore.

Um....

The Kennedy's are experts at stealing elections and running political machines-they have been doing it for at least 3 generations. How do you think Teddy ever got elected? How do you think that Jean-Francois Kerry got elected? How do you think those two manage to stay in power?

The only thing Bobby jr. is pissed off about is that they did not manage to steal the election in either 2000 or 2004. Too bad for him. Maybe Al Gore will make him a high priest in his new religion.

- incredible evidence of... (Below threshold)
MikeSC:

- incredible evidence of election riggin

If by incredible you mean "not credible", then yes, you are correct.

- privatization of our elections

Missed those government boards of election in every county in the country, eh?

- privatization of our military

Missed that whole Pentagon thing, eh?

- a war based on false and fixed intel

"False and fixed intel" that was widely believed to be true long before Bush came into office.

- fear mongering as a main platform for election and policy-making

It wasn't Bush who tried to claim that a vote for Kerry was a vote to reinstitute the draft.

Kerry DID imply that about Bush.

- a president who has broken the law according to a H Bush federal judge appointee

Umm, sure.

- a countries energy policy done in secret

WOW! Policy talks DONE IN PRIVATE?!?!? THAT'S NEVER HAPPENED BEFORE!!!

Well, except for all of the other times in history.

- a Vice Presidents x-company making huge profits

Which is relevant in what alternate universe?

- An administration veiled in secrecy

Wow, you'd have burst a blood vessel during FDR's tenure.

- A country not compiling with the Geneva Conventions

The ironic thing is --- we actually are, even though the thugs in our custody are not covered by them. A reality people would get if they'd actually read the Conventions.

- A President using signing statements to exempt himself from the laws passed by our senate.

Except the signing statements don't actually have any real standing in law, but hey, conspriacy theories are a hoot!

- A senate that was willing to investigate a previous president for firing workers in the travel office but have refused to forward any investigation on this president

On what grounds?

Specifics would be lovely.

- A senate that refuses to investigate huge spending contracts with blatant discretions

Again, specifics would be lovely.

- A president who says the terrorist hates us for our freedom and then takes away some of our freedoms to protect us from said terrorist

Feel free to name a single freedom you now lack.

- Ear mark spending breaking the back of our countries future and a government in complete control by the Republicans doing nothing about it.

Yes, earmarks started with the Republicans. Democrats never did that before.

I have this bridge in Brooklyn I'd like to sell you...

- A government that at every turn puts corporate interest over interest of the people

The lack of specifics is hurting you a bit here.

When in fact the real problem is you people hate democrats so much you're willing to sell out your country and look the other way to support your totally corrupt party over the interest of your country and democracy.

No, I don't trust the Dems, whatsoever, with national security. A more inept bunch of morons have never served in a government.

Wake up fellas you can hate democrats but you better start learning to hate Bush and the current completely corrupt and unpatriotic Republican leadership.

Wow, another leftie calling conservatives unpatriotic --- but will also likely whine that people call lefties unpatriotic.

That's some good irony.

Robert Kennedy's article outlines all the other problems that only an non-ptriotic person could ignore.

His article was torn to shreds before it even appeared in print, hate to break it to you. The "evidence" behind it is, to be generous, flimsier than the 9/11 conspiracies.

Also, note that the methods that were being used to actually conduct the re-count favored Bush. When you had to "assume" what the voters meant, than Gore won. That this study seems incapable of differentiating the concept of "ballots" and "votes" is a little sad. Not every ballot contains a legitimate vote (and, hell, if the press didn't erroneously call FL for Gore before the Republican-dominated panhandle polls closed, it wouldn't have even been a topic for discussion --- MINIMUM of 10,000 votes cost to Bush right there).
-=Mike

Regarding "Delusions of Gra... (Below threshold)
Carolyn Speer:

Regarding "Delusions of Grandure" and Laura of the Impeach Bush-Cheney Meet-up Group:

You seem to think we are a small insignificant "piffle" group that is of no interest to anyone. Let me advise you on Google you will find : "Impeach Bush" with 4,840,000 hits. "Bash Bush" has 5,410,000 hits. "Democrats Against Bush" has 22,200,000 hits and "Republicans Against Bush" has 18,700,000 hits. And, don't forget "Progressive Demograts" at 19,500,000. Those sites alone total 70,650,000 hits. You underestimate the "piffle" groups and their furor.

Respectfully Submitted,
Carolyn Speer

When in fact the real probl... (Below threshold)
muirgeo:

When in fact the real problem is you people hate democrats so much you're willing to sell out your country and look the other way to support your totally corrupt party over the interest of your country and democracy.

No, I don't trust the Dems, whatsoever, with national security. A more inept bunch of morons have never served in a government.

Posted by: MikeSC


Hmm that's funny because WW2 was done and over in less time then the current ongoing debacle in Iraq. And more recently peace and prosperity reigned during the Clinton years with Bosnia being settled without loss of a single soldier.

- A government that at ever... (Below threshold)
muirgeo:

- A government that at every turn puts corporate interest over interest of the people

The lack of specifics is hurting you a bit here.


Posted by: MikeSC


You repeatedly show what an uninformed fool you are. When was the last time you paid $1500 to attend a fundraiser dinner so you could talk to your representatives? I'm guessing you never did so.....the people who do so are almost exclusively lobbyist representing large corporations who are effectively paying off politicians with money once removed from their source.

This is a problem for both parties but has blossomed over the last 6 years. As the saying goes people like you get the government you deserve.

The silly argument is that contributions are a matter of free speech which is absurd if you truly believe in a government of, by and for the people. But I've actually herd people on this very board say they trust multinational corporations more then their own government (WHICH IS THEM!) Such ignoramuses don't deserve democracy....

- Ear mark spending breakin... (Below threshold)
muirgeo:

- Ear mark spending breaking the back of our countries future and a government in complete control by the Republicans doing nothing about it.

Yes, earmarks started with the Republicans. Democrats never did that before.

Posted by: MikeSC

Again, you refuted nothing. Ear marks are ballooning under complete Republican control and you're willing to ignore it.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/graphic/2006/01/27/GR2006012700168.html

- a president who ha... (Below threshold)
muirgeo:


- a president who has broken the law according to a H Bush federal judge appointee

Umm, sure.

MikeSC


You really are either ignorant or disingenuous.

WASHINGTON, Aug. 17 — A federal judge in Detroit ruled today that the Bush administration’s eavesdropping program is illegal and unconstitutional, and she ordered that it cease at once.

http://tinyurl.com/rtpqg

- A senate that was willing... (Below threshold)
muirgeo:

- A senate that was willing to investigate a previous president for firing workers in the travel office but have refused to forward any investigation on this president

On what grounds?

Specifics would be lovely.

Posted by: MikeSC

Things like these;

1. Providing false information to Congress about WMDs in Iraq.

2. Providing false testimony to the effect that Iraq was a threat to the U.S.

3. Withholding information about the cost of the Medicare bill.

4. Blowing the cover of an intelligence operative.

5. Imprisoning suspects for months in Gitmo on flimsy or zero evidence.

6. Outsourcing torture of terror suspects, again with flimsy or zero evidence.

7. Neglecting terrorism in favor of Iraq and missile defense in the first eight months of 2001.

8. Tasking the Secretary of State to go before the UN and lie like a rug.

9. Using resources of the IRS and Treasury Department for political propaganda.

10. Diverting money appropriated by Congress for Afghanistan to planning the Iraq invasion.

11. Withholding information about the cost in terms of money and personnel deployment of the Iraq invasion.

12. Under-provisioning and manning the Iraq invasion out of political considerations.

13. Failing to provide sufficient manpower to establish order in Iraq, post-invasion, leading to widespread misery and casualties all around.

14. Endorsement of the Likud government's land grab on the West Bank, reversing decades of U.S. policy and exposing the American people to the threat of Palestinian terrorism.

15. Sabotage of the U.S. revenue system, generating unsustainable deficits.

16. Destroying rights of public employees in the Department of Defense.

- A senate that refuses to ... (Below threshold)
muirgeo:

- A senate that refuses to investigate huge spending contracts with blatant discretions

Again, specifics would be lovely.

MikeSC


Over and over again you show you are either uninformed or unwilling to admit to obvious facts.

Go you know about the Truman commission during WW 2?

This says it all.

http://www.house.gov/tierney/press/truman5505.shtml

Democrats policed themselves while Republicans cover for each other.

muirgeo,I'm very i... (Below threshold)
Martin A. Knight:

muirgeo,

I'm very impressed. This is one of the best demonstrations of propaganda tactics that I have ever seen. You just level as numerous a set of charges (the thoroughly false liberally mixed with the thoroughly spun) as you can and demand that people take the time to refute them.

Nobody has that much time. There are not enough hours in the day to do it. A huge amount of the stuff you claim to have been done by the President has been refuted already, but you simply level them again and pretend as if they have been proven in a court of law.

And then you call others ignorant?

This is the same thing as throwing all the mud you can and hoping it sticks.

For example ...

    Blowing the cover of an intelligence operative.

You must have been comatose throught out last week if you still think this story has any validity whatsoever.

Another example?

    A president who has broken the law according to a H Bush federal judge appointee

Carter. The judge in question was appointed by James Earl Carter, not George Herbert Walker Bush.

Yet another example?

    Providing false information to Congress about WMDs in Iraq.

See what I mean about ignorance? If you actually knew what the heck you were talking about, you'd know that the Intelligence Agencies report directly to the Intelligence Committees of the Congress. The President has no censoring power over much of what can be shown to the members of the Committees, and absolutely none over the Chairmen and Ranking Members.

So, muirgeo, while I am full of admiration at your facility with cut and paste and your in-depth knowledge and near flawless execution of a tactic of propaganda warfare, it would simply be a waste of time to take the hours to refute all that mud.

That is, unless for each of the charges you have leveled, you present a case with links and cites to relevant factual articles, case law and your own interpretation of where the law was broken or some other perfidy committed.

If you want us to take the time and effort to take you seriously, best invest the time and effort when presenting your own argument.

Have a nice day.

[quote]This will be the sec... (Below threshold)
y7:

[quote]This will be the second Meetup for Durham Impeach Bush Cheney Meetup Group!

The meeting will be in the library's Large Meeting Room

Draft agenda:
1) Introductions
2) Update on action items...[/quote]

"Hi, my name is Dave and I hate Bush. To update our action items...well, despite the recent influx of members, we still only have two bullets on our draft agenda. Everyone knows we need at least three...we need three bullets on the draft agenda
or we won't be taken seriously. So, in that vein, I propose "create new action items" as the third bullet. Until the the next meetup, as a stopgap, we will use "Vote on the third bullet" as the third bullet point. 'K?"

This must be one of thier action items...http://files.meetup.com/296375/Draft%20Impeachment%20Petition%20to%20Durham%20City%20Council.doc

Hmm that's funny because... (Below threshold)
MikeSC:

Hmm that's funny because WW2 was done and over in less time then the current ongoing debacle in Iraq. And more recently peace and prosperity reigned during the Clinton years with Bosnia being settled without loss of a single soldier.

Funny, the troops are STILL in Bosnia.

And considering the way they treated Lieberman, your current Dem would loathe FDR.

Back during WW II, America realized that the bigger enemy wasn't the guy on the other side of the aisle but the one that wanted to slaughter you.

We lost that with Vietnam, thanks to some petulant rich kids. It's still the case now, again, thanks to some petulant, lilly white rich kids.

You repeatedly show what an uninformed fool you are. When was the last time you paid $1500 to attend a fundraiser dinner so you could talk to your representatives?

If I want to talk to my representative, which I do not ever wish to do so, I actually DO know how to pull it off.

This is a problem for both parties but has blossomed over the last 6 years.

Clinton RENTED THE LINCOLN BEDROOM TO DONORS AND SOLD PARDONS.

If you think this "blossomed" recently, you're quite delusional.

The silly argument is that contributions are a matter of free speech which is absurd if you truly believe in a government of, by and for the people.

Says who? If I as a group want to get my message out, how can I do so? I can't buy TV time close to an election now.

WASHINGTON, Aug. 17 — A federal judge in Detroit ruled today that the Bush administration’s eavesdropping program is illegal and unconstitutional, and she ordered that it cease at once.

You mean the decision that nobody actually defends as a good decision and one that will be overturned on appeal without much of a problem?

THAT decision?

Umm, yeah, sure kid.

Again, you refuted nothing. Ear marks are ballooning under complete Republican control and you're willing to ignore it.

I don't need to refute it. Only show that this "problem" is hardly new and hardly Republican in nature.

Earmarks were much, much worse about 20 years ago.

1. Providing false information to Congress about WMDs in Iraq.

The same "false intel" that Congress had and cited years before Bush came into office. That's a swing and a miss.

2. Providing false testimony to the effect that Iraq was a threat to the U.S.

Seeing as Bush never said it was imminent threat to directly attack us --- hell, said specifically we need to prevent them from becoming that --- yet ANOTHER whiff.

3. Withholding information about the cost of the Medicare bill.

A tiny smidgeon of evidence would be beneficial here.

4. Blowing the cover of an intelligence operative.

Armitage did it. Armitage doesn't like Bush and he, Powell, and their cronies were a cabal inside the Bush administration that, blessedly, was removed in 2005.

Bush said the leaker would not have a job in his administration. And, lo and behold, the leaker DOESN'T have one.

5. Imprisoning suspects for months in Gitmo on flimsy or zero evidence.

He takes PRISONERS OF WAR?

That BASTARD!

Nobody has EVER done that before!!

6. Outsourcing torture of terror suspects, again with flimsy or zero evidence.

HE DOESN'T STOP THE WORLD FROM TORTURING PEOPLE!

ARRGGHH, THE HUMANITYYYYY!

It's not Bush's job to tell Pakistan how to do its job.

7. Neglecting terrorism in favor of Iraq and missile defense in the first eight months of 2001.

Nice.

Shame that it's, you know, an utter lie.

And I'll let you try and build up your point because I'm looking to swat down some more inane points of yours.

Come on, give me something to do.

8. Tasking the Secretary of State to go before the UN and lie like a rug.

Bush had the same info everybody else had for years.

Apparently, Bush is the one who "lied", though --- even though what he said is identical to what Clinton said.

Or Kerry said. Or Edwards. Or, hell, any Democrat any Congress.

9. Using resources of the IRS and Treasury Department for political propaganda.

I'm sure evidence is forthcoming.

And I ALSO guess you missed Clinton launching audits, routinely, against political opponents. Hell, I bet you already forgot about Clinton taking the FBI files on hundreds of Republicans.

10. Diverting money appropriated by Congress for Afghanistan to planning the Iraq invasion.

It's hard to refute items you pull out of your butt. Got to be honest.

11. Withholding information about the cost in terms of money and personnel deployment of the Iraq invasion.

Bush was one of the FEW saying this will be a long-term struggle.

12. Under-provisioning and manning the Iraq invasion out of political considerations.

He did what his generals said he should do. Bush, you know, left the military planning TO THE MILITARY.

Which any SANE person would do.

13. Failing to provide sufficient manpower to establish order in Iraq, post-invasion, leading to widespread misery and casualties all around.

You have a point there. Enough troops weren't there.

You're going to impeach him over that?

Have a blast.

14. Endorsement of the Likud government's land grab on the West Bank, reversing decades of U.S. policy and exposing the American people to the threat of Palestinian terrorism.

So, you are saying the sub-human thugs are, in fact, sub-human.

He should endorse Israel carpet bombing every square inch of territory in that hellhole.

Israel has tried, since its inception, to live in peace with its neighbors. It's barbaric neighbors won't permit that.

15. Sabotage of the U.S. revenue system, generating unsustainable deficits.

Deficit is plummeting as --- and, wow, who saw this coming? --- the tax cuts have increased revenue.

He only inherited an economy in utter freefall.

16. Destroying rights of public employees in the Department of Defense.

Feel free to point to one.

Democrats policed themselves while Republicans cover for each other.

I'll go ahead and give you a heads up, since you're clearly beyond help.

Halliburton won the LOGCAP contract, which means the military gives them all of its contracts during the length of the contract and seperate bidding does not occur.

There is no such thing as "no-bid contracts" in this conflict and those who say they are should be ashamed of being so utterly ignorant.

You, to be generous, are REALLY bad at the whole "making a point" thing.
-=Mike

muirgeo demonstrates that t... (Below threshold)
Mitchell:

muirgeo demonstrates that the No Nothing wing of the Demo party is alive and well, and is approaching probably 90% of that miserable crowd.

You make the most fundamental of errors in your "list" of nefarious activities, including the party affiliation of the Federal Judge in the NSA case.

So, basically, you're just making shit up. Typical of partisan Dems. such as yourself. Now no one will take you seriously on this board.

That's the same problem your leadership has.

Muirgeo:As I point... (Below threshold)
sam:

Muirgeo:

As I pointed earlier, you and your party are LIARS, and always have been. Sucks to be you, doesn't it, loser? Must be a pretty miserable and depressing life for you, when your entire life is built around delusions.

Just a piece of advice, for your sanity: Let go of communism and socialism, they are dead and not coming back. Hillary is not going to be president, give it up.

Does she really believe ... (Below threshold)
scarshapedstar:

Does she really believe that the bigwigs in the administration are directing federal resources to track a 15-member organization of dimwitted cooks clutching a handful of "No Blood for Oil" placards?

Yeah! After all, the government would never spy on innocent peace activists.

In other news, down is up.

Hey lil republican fellas. ... (Below threshold)
muirgeo:

Hey lil republican fellas. If you're right and I'm wrong about all this stuff about Bush's job performance why are all the Republicans distancing themselves from this guy during the coming campaign season? Hum? Why?

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20060904/ap_on_go_co/campaign_ads_gop

God, you two are imbeciles.... (Below threshold)
Mitchell:

God, you two are imbeciles.

To paraphrase Churchill: And you, muir/scars, are stupid. As for my conditon, it will pass by morning. You, however, will still be stupid.

Muirgeo,If you're s... (Below threshold)
corwin:

Muirgeo,
If you're seriously citing th RFK.jr article in Rolling Stoner,quote te specifics and I'll knock 'em down.Otherwise,I'll just add someting equally relevant-like Mary Kay and Ashley Go to Ohio as an authority.Seriously,don't you wonder about a certain lack of introspection you seem to possess?
Your posts are only lacking the claim GWB is bringing the nova of the sun closer.Now,I'm serious here.Get an MMPI from someone-maybe on line.Take the test and study what it says about you.They can be computer scored for 40 bucks or so.This isn't a Republican plot to make you feel insignificant.Take the eval and act on it.
By the way,muirgeo isn't a socialist or a communist.He's a Fuzzy.Fuzzies know how not to know.I don't really think he'll act on my advice.but I did take an oath.

Muirgeo,If you're s... (Below threshold)
corwin:

Muirgeo,
If you're seriously citing th RFK.jr article in Rolling Stoner,quote te specifics and I'll knock 'em down.Otherwise,I'll just add someting equally relevant-like Mary Kay and Ashley Go to Ohio as an authority.Seriously,don't you wonder about a certain lack of introspection you seem to possess?
Your posts are only lacking the claim GWB is bringing the nova of the sun closer.Now,I'm serious here.Get an MMPI from someone-maybe on line.Take the test and study what it says about you.They can be computer scored for 40 bucks or so.This isn't a Republican plot to make you feel insignificant.Take the eval and act on it.
By the way,muirgeo isn't a socialist or a communist.He's a Fuzzy.Fuzzies know how not to know.I don't really think he'll act on my advice.but I did take an oath.

Corwin,How ... (Below threshold)
muirgeo:

Corwin,


How about the fact that in the 2004 election the exit polls showed an overwhelming victory for Kerry but by midnight, the official tallies showed a decisive lead for George Bush.

"The first indication that something was gravely amiss on November 2nd, 2004, was the inexplicable discrepancies between exit polls and actual vote counts. Polls in thirty states weren't just off the mark -- they deviated to an extent that cannot be accounted for by their margin of error. In all but four states, the discrepancy favored President Bush.

Over the past decades, exit polling has evolved into an exact science. Indeed, among pollsters and statisticians, such surveys are thought to be the most reliable. Unlike pre-election polls, in which voters are asked to predict their own behavior at some point in the future, exit polls ask voters leaving the voting booth to report an action they just executed. The results are exquisitely accurate: Exit polls in Germany, for example, have never missed the mark by more than three-tenths of one percent.(17) ''Exit polls are almost never wrong,'' Dick Morris, a political consultant who has worked for both Republicans and Democrats, noted after the 2004 vote. Such surveys are ''so reliable,'' he added, ''that they are used as guides to the relative honesty of elections in Third World countries.''(18) In 2003, vote tampering revealed by exit polling in the Republic of Georgia forced Eduard Shevardnadze to step down.(19) And in November 2004, exit polling in the Ukraine -- paid for by the Bush administration -- exposed election fraud that denied Viktor Yushchenko the presidency.(20)"

Corwin,In 2000 Kat... (Below threshold)
muirgeo:

Corwin,

In 2000 Katherine Harris presided over the contested 2000 US presidential election in Florida and was Bush's Florida campaign co-chair. She was even responsible for 2004 hiring a private firm to scrub voter rolls and to supply computer voting machines. The same thing happened in 2004 with Kenneth Blackwell in Ohio. The man was in charge of elections and was also in charge of Bush's Ohio campaign.

Can you honestly say that such conflicts f interest are OK?

From a study of statistics ... (Below threshold)
muirgeo:

From a study of statistics experts on the subject of the exit poll discrepancies;

"The absence of any statistically-plausible explanation for the discrepancy between Edison/Mitofsky’s
exit poll data and the official presidential vote tally is an unanswered question of vital national
importance that demands a thorough and unflinching investigation. "

http://tinyurl.com/rou82

and

http://www.rollingstone.com/photos/gallery/10467024/


Your democracy is at risk and you really don't care because some how you think you are winning...that's sad.

I'm still amazed that the L... (Below threshold)
Martin A. Knight:

I'm still amazed that the Left is seriously demanding that we replace actual vote counts with exit polls.

Sorry muirgeo, absolutely no dice.

Most of us here read RFK Jr.'s poorly researched, highly biased and incoherent article and dismissed it for what it was. A partisan conspiracy theory masquerading as a serious piece of work.

Since 2000, the Democrat National Committee have resolved to level accusations of voter fraud and voter intimidation every time they lose an election. RFK's article was just part of their new M.O.

Either way, the fact that you continue to cite one of the most discredited and incredibly incompetent articles on an election ever written just proves that what you are is a dishonest propaganda artist.

Monstrously ignorant and significantly idiotic, but an excellent propaganda artist nonetheless. People like you subtract from the sum total of human knowledge.

How about the fact that ... (Below threshold)
MikeSC:

How about the fact that in the 2004 election the exit polls showed an overwhelming victory for Kerry but by midnight, the official tallies showed a decisive lead for George Bush.

How about the difference in vote counts was well within the usual margin of error of any polling, which the article tries to claim is not the case?

How about the polls oversampled large cities and undersampled more rural areas?

Heck, read this:
http://www.salon.com/news/feature/2006/06/03/kennedy/index_np.html

Note: Salon.com ain't fond of Bush.

Over the past decades, exit polling has evolved into an exact science.

No, it never has been exact as POLLING is not exact.

Indeed, among pollsters and statisticians, such surveys are thought to be the most reliable. Unlike pre-election polls, in which voters are asked to predict their own behavior at some point in the future, exit polls ask voters leaving the voting booth to report an action they just executed.

And they oversample large cities, as they have always done.

Just because you dislike the result does not make the result bad or wrong.

In 2000 Katherine Harris presided over the contested 2000 US presidential election in Florida and was Bush's Florida campaign co-chair.

One of the people in charge of the recount, Mr. Butterfield, was a Gore deputy in Florida.

Your point is...?

She was even responsible for 2004 hiring a private firm to scrub voter rolls and to supply computer voting machines.

It was done in 1999. And do you know WHY?

Because the Miami mayoral race had so many felons and illegal voters voting that she was REQUIRED to do it by the voters. The press, which won numerous prizes for its coverage, uncovered all of the problems.

Can you honestly say that such conflicts f interest are OK?

I won't condemn people because you don't know history and wish to remain ignorant.
-=Mike




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