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Cornball America

Sunday I was watching the "Justice League" with my daughter. The episode featured several members of the League being sent into a parallel universe where another group which existed as a comic book in the first world, the Justice Guild, served the same purpose as the League did in its world. Without going overboard about a cartoon adventure, it turned out the Justice Guild sacrificed itself for the survival of the Justice League, who eventually found their way home. At the end of the episode, one of the characters was mourning the loss of the Justice Guild, even though in fact it had never really existed at all, but lived only as the illusory construct of a projecting mentality. Somehow, that struck me as important.

OK, so I was watching a children's story, one fictional entity musing about another even more illusory identity. But even so, it reminded me that abstracts matter, to all of us I think, and ultimately the distinction is how we pay attention.

Until about 1850, the Democrats were the guys worrying about abstract concepts for the most part; the Whigs were focused on more pragmatic concerns. But where Slavery and the balance between the power of State and the Federal governments were concerned, the Democrats were timid, even hypocritical. The "Missouri Compromise" was a masterpiece of delusion and negligence by design, and its fruit was bitter indeed. Far too few Americans have any idea that the Republican Party originally came about in response to a broad national demand for a party of reform. Even fewer understand the significance of Grover Cleveland, that best of Democrats who took up the cause of reform when the Republicans let it slip, but whose work was overshadowed by the even greater Democrat ignominy of Tammany Hall. When we look back to men like Lincoln and Cleveland, and again in Teddy Roosevelt, we see a broad, deep vision for America, one which has seldom been considered in History and Political Science classrooms, much less national committees. America, these men avowed, stood and stands for something greater than the moment and the single issue, created and supported by the very will of God, though these days such ownership is constantly challenged by special interest groups, usually poked along by lawyers and other infernal minions. And so we find ourselves wondering whither America? And what of our destiny?

To be sure, Republicans have their ogres and warts. Our leading candidates for President include men of dubious consistency and vacuous support for the causes we say we revere. Our leadership in both the House and Senate include men whose spines are made of something rather less than steel and far too much like butter. Yet the Democrats have abandoned the vision wholly in their leadership, and their spokespeople think nothing of slander and deceit. This why they want us to pay close attention to veterans like Murtha and Kerry, yet ignore the Joint Chiefs of Staff, or men like Marc Elias or Peter Damon. This is why they want us to accept stories about the war in Iraq from Dan Rather and Peter Arnett, but ignore first-hand accounts from Michael Yon or Bill Roggio. This is why they want us to consider Bill Clinton a legitimate military authority, even though he never spent a day in uniform, but scorn the service of George W. Bush, who served honorably in the Guard.

This is why when I brought up parallels between this worldwide conflict and the fight against the Nazis, they demanded that I not speak unless I first enlisted and went into a battle zone, even though they never once demanded this of even a single anti-war blogger. This is why they refuse, to this day, to defend their charges in substance and with civil discussion; their purpose is not to discuss or illuminate the issues, but to attack and defame. Ultimately, this is why they lose. While there are just about the same number of self-identified Republicans as Democrats, there is a large portion of reasonable people who listen to their gut, and while we all make mistakes, for the most part the people know who is good for the country, and who is not.

From my experience, people do not worry about a President's enunciation so much as his character, they do not worry about the opinion of the French nearly so much as they do the effect of a matter on their state and town. They like cornball, when that cornball means the values that mattered to their parents and to their soul. They understand silly concepts like Justice and Democracy, and they don't think it strange to believe that everyone should have a chance to vote freely and to choose their government. They don't like being told their hometown is "flyover country". They don't like some New York or LA smart-suit making fun of their kids playing football or going to church every Sunday. They don't like seeing celebrities wearing next to nothing and spouting obscenities telling them that their traditional beliefs are bad for their kids. They don't like being told that their opinion doesn't matter, next to some paid consultant or D.C. influence activist.

They don't vote for traitors.

And they don't forget the price paid by soldiers, whether those guys fought Hitler, the Koreans, in Vietnam, or took down Saddam and went after Al Qaeda. They don't forget the Coasties, either, or the Guard, just because those guys do their jobs without all the publicity and big-budget tools.

Call us Cornball, but we are the real America.


Comments (27)

In point of fact, the Justi... (Below threshold)
Chuckg:

In point of fact, the Justice Guild *had* existed for real at one time -- the 'reality projector' was obsessed about recreating a world he had lost, not projecting a world he had entirely dreamed up.

It's just, they'd all died years ago, along with their world, and he couldn't mentally deal with that.

Oh my god someone criticize... (Below threshold)

Oh my god someone criticized a conservative and those wonderful flyover folks. How un-American, they should all be shot as traitors. Maybe you hypocrites should stop slandering all liberals and the French and admit Bush and Cheney are stupid, corrupt and fascistic. But that takes character too.

And just what slander are y... (Below threshold)
The Listkeeper:

And just what slander are you referring to?

"While there are just about... (Below threshold)
muirgeo:

"While there are just about the same number of self-identified Republicans as Democrats, there is a large portion of reasonable people who listen to their gut, and while we all make mistakes, for the most part the people know who is good for the country, and who is not."

So explain to me;

Is the largest deficit in history good for the country?

Is the fact that the real debt is actually much higher then what the government numbers show.... good for the country?

Is the prospect of a 30 - 40 year war in the Middle East ... good for the country?

Is the huge/record trade debt .... good for the country?

Are the middle wage earners stagnant incomes compared to 150% increases in the top 1% wage earners... good for the country?

Is the rising poverty level good for the country?

Is the bursting housing bubble... good for the country?

Is the rising gap between the rich and the poor... good for the country?

Is the fact that the average CEO's earning is 400x the average workers earning , compared to 50X in the 1970's ...good for the country?

Is the falling value of the dollar...good for the country?

Are off-shore accounts good for the country?

Is the fact that it takes two incomes to get by in the middle class... good for the country?

Is the rising poverty level good for the country?

Is the bursting housing bubble... good for the country?

Is the falling value of the dollar...good for the country?

Are off-shore accounts good for the country?

Is the fact that American workers have to compete for wages and jobs with peasants in 3rd world countries with no rights and regulations ...good for the country?

Are the ballooning number of capital Hill lobbyist ... good for the country?

Is our deteriorating infrastructure.... good for the country?

Are regulatory agencies headed by former CEO's of the regulated industry... good for the country?

Is a Medicare bill written by a former Pharmaceutical rep that doesn't allow competitive bidding ...good for the country?

Is an energy policy formulated in secret....good for the country?

Were Jack Abramoff, Tom Delay, Duke Cunningham ect ... good for the country?

Is the fact that millions of more American now have no health insurance good for the country.

Is the fact that we pay almost $6,000 / year for health insurance when every other industrialized nation pays about half that good for the country?

Is the rampant unchecked hiring of illegal immigrants good for the country?

Are no bid contracts with no regulatory over-sight given to large campaign donors...good for the country?

Is the fact that tens of billions of tax dollars go uncollected each year...good for the country?

Is the fact that some one who inherits wealth and can live off his dividends at a tax rate of 15% while a middle class worker will pay 25% or more on their earned income ...good for the country?

Is the fact that every trend in are country from tax collection, to regulation, to gap between the rich and the poor is making us more like countries like Mexico...good for the country?

Is the suppression of scientific findings...good for the country?

And just what slander are y... (Below threshold)
muirgeo:

And just what slander are you referring to?

Posted by: The Listkeeper


How about presuming that anyone who is liberal is a communist or a socialist? How about presuming that anyone who thinks there is a better way to fight the "war" on terror besides bombing things and killing people is weak on defense or a supporter of terrorist?

Hey "murigeo" no one has to... (Below threshold)
jhow66:

Hey "murigeo" no one has to "presume" anything to tell that you have to be the dumbest idiot around.
Get off your lazy ass and make it yourself instead of waiting around for some "liberal" to take care of you from birth to your grave. Oh yeah would like to see you "talk" a terrorist to death. Please let everyone know so we can come and watch. Sheeeze.

jhow,I'm doing jus... (Below threshold)
muirgeo:

jhow,

I'm doing just find making 200K + a year. But I'm worried about the future of my countries democracy. These guys in power are all about corporate welfare and nothing about working class Americans.

You may claim to support democracy but if you agree with the Bush polices you are supporting corporate rule over rule OF,BY and FOR the people...it's that simple.

This government is supposed to represent the interest of the people not the interest of multinational corporations.....the fact is you are supporting Plutocratic/ Oligarchic rule....not democratic principals.

Plutocracies are represented by governments like Mexico and in South America...do you understand that? Is that what you want?

muirgeoI see you d... (Below threshold)

muirgeo

I see you don't have any experience in economics. First off the correction in the housing market is most definately good for the country. The 35% average appreciation over the last 5-7 years was not sustainable.

Even though the dollar is quite firm and has been on an upward trend for the last 2 years a "falling" dollar is in fact very good for America. It makes our goods here cheaper overseas. When the dollar was hitting "record" lows against the euro companies like Ingersol Rand, Cat, and other cyclicles were making record profits.

The extremely low deficit (1.8% of GDP) is not a concern in any economic circles.

I'd try and get a little better informed next time cause you're just embarrassing yourself.

To muirgeo:Just one ... (Below threshold)
jhow66:

To muirgeo:
Just one word to your 2K and all the rest of your big sounding words to make us think you are "smart"----BULLSHIT

"Call us Cornball, but we a... (Below threshold)
Aeneas:

"Call us Cornball, but we are the real America."

I'll just call you part of the conservative extremist minority. I don't care what your opinions are on most issues, as you have no credibility. In your poor musings you call prominant Democrats communists. If that's the "real America" I want no part of it.

Very sad.

I 2nd DJ's comment: "From m... (Below threshold)
Heidi:

I 2nd DJ's comment: "From my experience, people do not worry about a President’s enunciation so much as his character..." I vote for the people that will represent my values (Christian). Capitalism isn't perfect, but it works. "There can be no prosperity or even freedom for our people if we ever abandon the competitive economic system that transferred this country into the strongest nation in the world." -R. Reagan. Bill Cosby has my utmost respect for how he is addressing the black community. I think we (Americans) should all listen to his speeches or find them online. I'm going to throw another quote at you: "How can we hope to retain our freedom through the generations if we fail to teach our young that our liberty springs from an abiding faith in our Creator?" I don't see my values reflected in the democrats these days. I can't relate to their anger and animosity.

This is good:ODE T... (Below threshold)
Mitchell:

This is good:

ODE TO AMBASSADOR WILSON [Cliff May]

Cas Balicki in British Columbia wrote that he hoped to lighten my day with “this bit of doggerel written in elegiac (the most suitable for the occasion) form.”

I just have to share it with other Corner readers.
Tea in Niger

Pour out my dear

I like mine clear

No milk to befog

In this political smog

Among the scones, tarts and pies

Who’ll spot the political lies

Ah! Devonshire cream

This must be a dream

Lather on the jams and jellies

It’s the politics of full bellies

Dibs on the last crumpet

Bids the Vanity Fair strumpet

What’s that at the end of the tray

Yellow cake, you don’t say

Alas, time to leave this resort

And write my CIA report

All the rest, as they say, is history

Armitage dispelled the mystery

Or was it Wilson to Corn

Big mouth to lowly inkhorn

Oh! what a bummer

Ain’t no Fitzmas this summer

Rove’s out of the jam

Powell’s on the lam

We’re done with Plame

And her fifteen minutes of fame

Heidi, You have n... (Below threshold)
muirgeo:

Heidi,

You have no proof your creator exist. Basing government policy on religion is theocracy. If you can't keep your religion separate from your politics then you are likely to be a bigot or theocrat and push for bigoted policies. Further fundamentalism and democracy are absolutely incompatible. Do you understand that? That's what we are fighting in the Middle East.
By the way does Jesus support the war in Iraq and tax cuts for the wealthy? Who does he say we bomb next? Would he vote republican because he's against gay marriage and wants to jail women for having abortions?

http://www.stopviolence.com/images/9-11/iraq12yearold.jpg

DJ, that was a fantastic an... (Below threshold)
SomeJoe:

DJ, that was a fantastic and moving little essay. Thank you.

muirgeo, thanks for cluttering up the place with your personal, poorly considered, and poorly written blather. Here's my response, most of which didn't require particularly much thought:

> Is the largest deficit in history good for the country?

No, but I don't lose sleep over it.

> Is the fact that the real debt is actually much higher then what the government numbers show.... good for the country?

Speculation, ignored.

> Is the prospect of a 30 - 40 year war in the Middle East ... good for the country?

As if the war were avoidable. We're still not setting the terms of this war, and are lucky to have forced the battlefield into the Middle East so far. Get used to it, the West is going to be at war for the next 10-15 years minimum and things are going to get much worse before they get better.

> Is the huge/record trade debt .... good for the country?

Depends on who you ask.

> Are the middle wage earners stagnant incomes compared to 150% increases in the top 1% wage earners... good for the country?

Middle incomes may appear to stagnate as a result of record-low unemployment. The US economy is nearing a point modern economists refer to "full employment", as low-earning jobs are filled, the greater pool of earners would naturally bring down the median.

> Is the rising poverty level good for the country?

It matches rising definitions of "middle class", since overall wealth is increasing and the poverty level simply follows that metric, then yes, a rising poverty level is a good thing. (think hard about that, rising poverty level == greater overall wealth)

> Is the bursting housing bubble... good for the country?

Speculation, ignored.

> Is the rising gap between the rich and the poor... good for the country?

Mostly speculative, but considering that two of America's richest (Gates & Buffett) just committed their fortunes to education, I'm not so troubled by the rich.

> Is the fact that the average CEO's earning is 400x the average workers earning , compared to 50X in the 1970's ...good for the country?

See previous. The CEO of a large company may be directly responsible for the income and well-being of over a million people. Pay them well if they do their jobs well.

> Is the falling value of the dollar...good for the country?

Yes, absolutely. It's good for manufacturing, exports, tourism, local businesses etc. Why are we the strongest economy in the world, by far, yet our currency isn't the most expensive? The weaker dollar has been fantastic for US economic growth.

> Are off-shore accounts good for the country?

Ill-considered, vague question.

> Is the fact that it takes two incomes to get by in the middle class... good for the country?

You'd prefer women barefoot and pregnant? No, it doesn't bother me that it takes two incomes to support a family.

> Is the rising poverty level good for the country?
> Is the bursting housing bubble... good for the country?
> Is the falling value of the dollar...good for the country?
> Are off-shore accounts good for the country?

You copied and pasted this whole section twice. Check that before dumping this crap into someone else's comments.

> Is the fact that American workers have to compete for wages and jobs with peasants in 3rd world countries with no rights and regulations ...good for the country?

How 2002 of you.

> Are the ballooning number of capital Hill lobbyist ... good for the country?

No, but who exactly is advocating for more lobbyists?

> Is our deteriorating infrastructure.... good for the country?

Where exactly? I'm seeing construction all over the place. If you specifically mean the New Orleans levees, then perhaps you should have read Paul's post from last week.

> Are regulatory agencies headed by former CEO's of the regulated industry... good for the country?

Because businessmen are two dimensional caricatures incapable of using their experiences to craft regulations capable of helping people AND businesses.

> Is a Medicare bill written by a former Pharmaceutical rep that doesn't allow competitive bidding ...good for the country?

Two questions, see previous answer for the first part, and no for the second part.

> Is an energy policy formulated in secret....good for the country?

You posted this, so your lights are obviously on, therefore something's working. Don't worry, we'll know all about this in 15 years, I'm betting it turns out not to be terribly interesting.

> Were Jack Abramoff, Tom Delay, Duke Cunningham ect ... good for the country?

I don't keep track of scandals, but I bet someone who does could easily throw an equal list of names at you from the other side of the aisle. Anytime a corrupt politician is run out of Washington DC it's a good thing.

> Is the fact that millions of more American now have no health insurance good for the country.

Based on recent employment numbers, I'm betting this figure isn't as solid as you might think it is.

> Is the fact that we pay almost $6,000 / year for health insurance when every other industrialized nation pays about half that good for the country?

Why do so many foreigners come to the US for treatment? It's not ideal, but I wouldn't trade US medicine for that of anywhere else in the world.

> Is the rampant unchecked hiring of illegal immigrants good for the country?

Hey, that's a conservative issue!

> Are no bid contracts with no regulatory over-sight given to large campaign donors...good for the country?

I smell a Haliburton allusion around here somewhere.

> Is the fact that tens of billions of tax dollars go uncollected each year...good for the country?

Oh come on, you love that a few people are able to "stick it to the man". Personally, I'd much rather see major tax reform and more effective collection, but that just dovetails with my general beliefs about government.

> Is the fact that some one who inherits wealth and can live off his dividends at a tax rate of 15% while a middle class worker will pay 25% or more on their earned income ...good for the country?

Is it good for the country to tax the dead? Wait, are you're saying investments should be taxed more or that workers should be taxed less?

> Is the fact that every trend in are country from tax collection, to regulation, to gap between the rich and the poor is making us more like countries like Mexico...good for the country?

Lol. Speculation, and totally absurd. BTW, nice grammar, do you even read this stuff?

> Is the suppression of scientific findings...good for the country?

You mean like anyone critical of human-derived "Global Warming"? Or are you just casting everyone you disagree with politically into the same presumed belief-set. Regarding stuff like Terri Schiavo and stem cells, don't confuse medical ethics with science. Also, don't confuse scientific THEORY with scientific fact, or true science with pseudo-science.

Capitalist Infidel,<p... (Below threshold)
muirgeo:

Capitalist Infidel,


Thanks for the economics lesson. Let me make sure I learned it right.

On housing;

A pop in the housing bubble is good because all those people with interest only loans really don't deserve their houses and at least this time they won't be able to file for bankruptcy under the new bankruptcy laws. The end result being nice dividends and CEO bonuses for Fannie Mae / Freddie Mac and Citirroups stock holders. Oh yeah and $4 trillion dollars of loan debt is nothing to worry about because the government can always bail them out.


On the value of the dollar:

A falling dollar is good because then we can be like Mexico and other inexpensive third world countries so instead of us having to travel to expensive European countries they can just come here and visit us and buy our cheap things. And then maybe they will like us again.


On the deficit:

Government spending is good. Especially if its Republican spending on things we need like bombs to blow stuff up and kill people with and if it artificially boost the economy and helps war profiteers and corporate donors because then they can use the government money they got to keep the same guys in office by giving them more money to run their FEAR campaigns to get re-elected so government spending can go on uninterrupted lifting the economy and creating more war and disaster jobs.


Let me know how I did.

> Is the fact that every tr... (Below threshold)
muirgeo:

> Is the fact that every trend in are country from tax collection, to regulation, to gap between the rich and the poor is making us more like countries like Mexico...good for the country?

Lol. Speculation, and totally absurd. BTW, nice grammar, do you even read this stuff?


Posted by: SomeJoe


Let me just focus on this Joe,

Would you like to be a Mexican citizen? If not why not? They have low taxes, minimal regulation, single party conservative government, you have a ruling elite, a small middle class and a huge gap between the rich and the poor and abortion is illegal and the population is exploding.

What more could a conservative like you ask for?

And of course you would defiantly take Mexico over liberal Canada right? I mean all those taxes and regulations and free medical care must be terrible.

So why aren't you living in Mexico Joe?

muirgeoThanks for ... (Below threshold)

muirgeo

Thanks for proving my point. Anyone stupid enough to take out an interest only loan deserves what they get. I know you America hating leftists aren't much into personal responsibility but the rest of us are.

I also gather facts don't mean much to you either. The deficit is 1.8% of GDP, I gather you wish it were much higher but it's not. At that rather low number it's easily manageable.

As far as the dollar you proved my point. It's much better for the American economy to have a soft dollar rather than a firm one.

muirgeo,You do rea... (Below threshold)
Headzero:

muirgeo,

You do realizw that pieces like this drive you out of the woodwork for one reason and one reason only - to be able to have Rove Track your IP address.

Thanks for posting.

DJ,Excellent and wel... (Below threshold)
Son Of The Godfather:

DJ,
Excellent and well-written piece!

Muirgeo,
Stay away from lead-based paints.

muirgeo:What polit... (Below threshold)
Heidi:

muirgeo:

What politician in the U.S. (past or present) has views most similar to the ones you've expressed here?

muirgeo:What polit... (Below threshold)
muirgeo:

muirgeo:

What politician in the U.S. (past or present) has views most similar to the ones you've expressed here?

Posted by: Heidi

Thomas Jefferson

I believe that banking institutions are more dangerous to our liberties than standing armies. If the American people ever allow private banks to control the issue of their currency, first by inflation, then by deflation, the banks and corporations that will grow up around [the banks] will deprive the people of all property until their children wake-up homeless on the continent their fathers conquered. The issuing power should be taken from the banks and restored to the people, to whom it properly belongs.

Thomas Jefferson

Believing with you that religion is a matter which lies solely between man and his God, that he owes account to none other for his faith or his worship, that the legislative powers of government reach actions only, and not opinions, I contemplate with sovereign reverence that act of the whole American people which declared that their legislature should 'make no law respecting an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof,' thus building a wall of separation between church and State.

-Thomas Jefferson

It would be interesting to ... (Below threshold)

It would be interesting to view the source of the first alleged Jefferson quote, since the concept of banking inflation and deflation was not clearly defined in his day.


Here is the whole qu... (Below threshold)
SCSIwuzzy:

Here is the whole quote, btw

The central bank is an institution of the most deadly hostility existing against the Principles and form of our Constitution. I am an Enemy to all banks discounting bills or notes for anything but Coin. If the American People allow private banks to control the issuance of their currency, first by inflation and then by deflation, the banks and corporations that will grow up around them will deprive the People of all their Property until their Children will wake up homeless on the continent their Fathers conquered.

Notice how the meaning changes when put in fuller context?

Is the largest deficit i... (Below threshold)
MikeSC:

Is the largest deficit in history good for the country?

Very low in terms of GDP. And, please, let us know what programs you'd support cutting funding to.

Is the fact that the real debt is actually much higher then what the government numbers show.... good for the country?

You mean the government plays with numbers? Color me stunned.

Is the prospect of a 30 - 40 year war in the Middle East ... good for the country?

It's already been going on for well over 20 before we did anything.

Is the huge/record trade debt .... good for the country?

More goods here at lower prices. Sounds real good.

Are the middle wage earners stagnant incomes compared to 150% increases in the top 1% wage earners... good for the country?

Are the number of people moving up in the brackets good? I think so.

Is the rising poverty level good for the country?

Well, non-existant myths can't be that bad.

Is the bursting housing bubble... good for the country?

Yup. Affordable housing for folks. Better than the dot-com bubble bursting that your side sat on.

Is the fact that the average CEO's earning is 400x the average workers earning , compared to 50X in the 1970's ...good for the country?

Yup. Next question.

Are off-shore accounts good for the country?

Ask the Kennedys.
And Soros.
And Kerry.

Is the fact that it takes two incomes to get by in the middle class... good for the country?

It's not a fact, so yes.

Is the fact that American workers have to compete for wages and jobs with peasants in 3rd world countries with no rights and regulations ...good for the country?

Are you advcoating the removal of all protections? Or are you advocating massive tariffs?

Both ideas are equally asinine.

Are the ballooning number of capital Hill lobbyist ... good for the country?

Wow, you'd think it's a brand new phenomenon. You'd have to ignore history, of course.

Is our deteriorating infrastructure.... good for the country?

Feel free to point to "deteriorating infrastructure"

Are regulatory agencies headed by former CEO's of the regulated industry... good for the country?

Well, we know that mines have become markedly and demonstrably safer now that Bush has mine operators regulating them.

Is an energy policy formulated in secret....good for the country?

Considering that we didn't have one at all prior to Bush --- yeah.

Were Jack Abramoff, Tom Delay, Duke Cunningham ect ... good for the country?

Better than Abscam, William Jefferson, the House Bank bouncing checks, and massive fraud in the House Post Office.

Is the fact that millions of more American now have no health insurance good for the country.

Many make that choice willingly.

Is the fact that we pay almost $6,000 / year for health insurance when every other industrialized nation pays about half that good for the country?

That you can get, say, heart surgery in less than a month rather than the usual multiple month wait you have elsewhere --- yeah.

Is the fact that some one who inherits wealth and can live off his dividends at a tax rate of 15% while a middle class worker will pay 25% or more on their earned income ...good for the country?

Again, ask Kerry.

Is the fact that every trend in are country from tax collection, to regulation, to gap between the rich and the poor is making us more like countries like Mexico...good for the country?

Wow, are you saying that's why they flock over here?

How about presuming that anyone who is liberal is a communist or a socialist? How about presuming that anyone who thinks there is a better way to fight the "war" on terror besides bombing things and killing people is weak on defense or a supporter of terrorist?

Hey. I just think your battleplan is moronic.

You may claim to support democracy but if you agree with the Bush polices you are supporting corporate rule over rule OF,BY and FOR the people...it's that simple.

Whew, thank God you don't slander.

A pop in the housing bubble is good because all those people with interest only loans really don't deserve their houses and at least this time they won't be able to file for bankruptcy under the new bankruptcy laws.

No, the pop was needed because the growth was unsustainable.

A falling dollar is good because then we can be like Mexico and other inexpensive third world countries so instead of us having to travel to expensive European countries they can just come here and visit us and buy our cheap things. And then maybe they will like us again.

Except conservatives don't spend time worrying about people liking us.

We, you know, left high school.

Government spending is good. Especially if its Republican spending on things we need like bombs to blow stuff up and kill people with and if it artificially boost the economy and helps war profiteers and corporate donors because then they can use the government money they got to keep the same guys in office by giving them more money to run their FEAR campaigns to get re-elected so government spending can go on uninterrupted lifting the economy and creating more war and disaster jobs.

Yet, mention reducing the rate of growth of Medicare, Medicaid, Social Security, etc and you'd think people were dumping bodies in mass graves.

BTW, I love how only the right gets painted with the "politics of fear" brush. You've apparently missed --- hell, the Dems fairly consistent pattern of that for decades.

The "Daisy" ad wasn't a Republican one.
-=Mike

Drummond:Nice. Wish I... (Below threshold)

Drummond:

Nice. Wish I had written it.

jJake:

Maybe you hypocrites should stop slandering all liberals and the French and admit Bush and Cheney are stupid, corrupt and fascistic.
Its not slander when it's true: the French are an insipid, mealymouthed blight on the Continent. Not all "liberals" fall into the same category, but enough that the generalizations made of them ring true. As to admitting Bush & Cheney are "stupid, corrupt and fascistic," I'd be first in line to do so. If it were true. History, the downfall of the socialist class.

muirgeo: There is so much that is wrong with your posts (factually, that is) that it's tempting just to ignore it, especially since several other posters have addressed your "concerns." But you're such an easy target, I just can't resist.

Is the largest deficit in history good for the country?
As Capitalist Infidel points out, a deficit of ~1.8% of the GDP is historically quite low, and as SomeJoe says, "...I don't lose sleep over it." If you're worrying about the deficit, and really "...doing just find [sic] making 200K + a year..." then you are either pictured in the dictionary there next to the definition of 'idiot,' or you're extremely neurotic. Either way, professional help is advisable.

You go even further out on a limb with this:

Let me know how I did.
Well, bubba, you're batting about zero. Particularly stupid in that post is this:
...we can be like Mexico and other inexpensive third world countries so instead of us having to travel to expensive European countries they can just come here and visit us and buy our cheap things.
Unless I am missing something, tourist dollars spend as readily as any other kind: and since I live in a small fishing community whose infrastructure is maintained by "out of towners" spending money here, I find the parallel quite apt. (I also enjoy being catered to as a tourist when I visit small Mexican fishing villages.) And finally, I have to admit that the demographics of the region I live in have changed, I am not really in the "upper" middle class around here anymore. But my standard of living hasn't gone down, and since a measurable part of my life was spent on welfare when I was a kid, I ain't complaining because life is a whole lot better than it was.

Now, quit whining and get a job.

Mike,Your post rem... (Below threshold)

Mike,

Your post reminded me of a few weak points in muirgeo's posts that I hadn't addressed. To wit:

Is the prospect of a 30 - 40 year war in the Middle East ... good for the country?
Listen up. Warfare is my stock in trade, and this war has been going on for a very long time (about FOURTEEN CENTURIES at last count). There is a personality cult built around the ravings of a megalomaniacal thief, pederast and murderer. Thirty or forty years of military involvement is a pittance to pay against the time that this antisemitic, sapiencidal cult has had to accrete a following of numbnut robots willing to carry out genocide in the belief that this maniac's visions of physical bliss will be the rewards of those who forsake their humanity for murder.

Get over it. Whether you, muirgeo, want to be at war or not, there are those quite willing to destroy you: not just kill you, but to obliterate you, your family, your way of life, the very memory of your existence on this plane of existence.

Get used to it. You don't have to change your life, but for crying out loud, stop getting in the way of the people who are, ultimately, saving your ass.

GROUND RULES: Let me... (Below threshold)
saibelohn:

GROUND RULES:
Let me just tell you right out the gate all the sentences that end in a ? are rhetorical questions, so guess what no need to answer them becouse I wont be replying back.No, I will be using my time on things that matter. Also dont get all hung up on spelling, grammer and such this is not a paper. So chill out honestly, some of you guys get too emotionally involved, and remember lets engjoy our right to communicate freely, and with out communist views...while we still can.

ALL OF YOU CONSERVITIVE "CLAIM TO BE CHRISTIANS" ARE SMOKING CRACK WHITH A BUSH PIPE LOL!!

Whats wrong with you? Go take a history class or something, becouse your ideas on correcting the war on middle class America that Pres. Bush has started are outragous and just flat out incorrect.

One of the main causes of the depression was the unequal distribution of wealth throughout the 1920's and other factors such as inflation.

Money was distributed disparately between the rich and the middle-class. This imbalance of wealth created an unstable economy. The Gov. favored business, and gave them tax cuts, and decreased tax returns for the middlec class. Now this started the thing we now call credit, credit cards aka debt.

This created a monopoly becouse only certain companies had much of the wealth in the U.S., and we depended upon these industries to expand and grow becouse that is where the money was centralized at.

Roosevelt's New Deal gold policy helped, and the various reform programs helped as well.

When you say the middleclass will have to learn there is no free ride. Your just plain ignorant, big business, the rich, has been riding free sinse the 1800s, actually when the U.S came up with a great idea to smuggle humans so they could enslave them.

Also, who in the hell has been bemefiting from tax cuts sinse Bush's humiliating Presdency started???? The rich/corporations/ thats who. Middle class folks work hard for every measley penny they have earned breaking their backs to find out that they dont have insurance...why becouse the big companies are too freaken greedy to even offer the basic nessicities!!!!!!!

When companies take all their business out of the US and their taxes? Walmart charges 15.96 for a shirt that cost them less than 1.00 to make.

Disney paying their "third world countries employees"13.5 and 36 cents an hour. What a joke.
Dont laught too long, becouse our contry is weakened while greed drives the economy.

Hey, heres in ideal go support you conrad's new book "ake This Job and Ship It: How Corporate Greed and Brain-Dead Politics Are Selling Out America By Byron Dorgan its on sale at amazon.com for $16.47. Any chance on my convencing you to donate the change to your local charity? lol

What you dont realize is that the middle class is all taxed out. Bush with his incompetent leadership would't know how to do the job if he was falsely elected.

Theres is mp more taxes you can collect from the middle class, becouse the middle class is increasingly losing their houses,cars, childrens college tuitition sinse the intrest rates have spiked.

Dont you realize, that 60 years ago a middle class family could live comfortably with only one parent working? Now both parents must work , and if there is any trajedy or illness that permits them to miss work, then their screwed.

The ratio of poor to rich is at an obcene differce, and youv got the audasity to type such vulgar words??

Dont you realize that 4 more years of the "republican party", this country wont be showing commercials to save little starving african kids, no no we will be a third world country!! Also without an adequate rich to middle class paportion, the economy will crumble on its big fat greedy face?

Also if there is any country on this world that needed liberation, and begged for liberation it is the starving African people, so do you think Bush with all his christian views woould go to help them and offer assistence, that will really get to the starving people not to the corrupt governments? No becouse we need the oil!! 3.00 gal. Nice real nice, what's next oh, wow I got my Electric bill its only 705.00. NO he just insist that no homosexuals, no abortions, no stem cell research...and guess what, I am a christian and I actually agree with some aspects of those issues, however I'm not sure that this Pres. can effectively convey the need for morality on these issues. He has refused to give more a percentage the Africa, and implement a plan wherre the aid will actually benefit the starving children and people. And not go to the fat cats that rule Africa. Why doesn't he take up worthy christian causes as thoes? I know that when I read my bible is says to love your neighbor as YOURSELF, FEED THE HUNGRY, HELP THE POOR.

HE NEEDS TO CREAT JOBS AND STIMULATE THE ECONOMY, LETS GET COLLEGE ENROLLMENT AT AN ALL TIME HIGH!!!!!!! Lets stop feeding the fat cats, hell lets boycott theyre services, if theyre not willing to contribuit to this country in a fair economical way.




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