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The Unvarnished Truth

Listening to Rush today I heard him quote CNN's reason for running the Iraq sniper video as a desire to show the "unvarnished truth." I wish that CNN was as concerned with showing us the unvarnished truth about many other subjects.

One subject that came to mind was abortion. If CNN finds it newsworthy to show U.S. troops being shot down by snipers so the public can see the unvarnished truth about the war, then why not show us the unvarnished truth about abortion. Let's see a partial birth abortion being performed before the election so that voters will know whether or not they want to vote for those in Congressmen who oppose a ban on it. Planned Parenthood's 90th birthday would be a perfect time to air it.

This "unvarnished truth" doesn't always have to be that shocking though. The same standard could be applied in countless ways. Maybe we could see video of some of those liberal politicians claiming to be men and women of the people walking out the front doors of their million dollar homes. Or maybe we could watch some radical environmentalist liberals flying around in their private jets and limousines. The problem with CNN's attempt at the "unvarnished truth" is that they never show the whole truth.

Update: I can't believe I didn't think of Eason Jordan's admission that CNN "varnished" the truth in Baghdad before the 2003 invasion. Luckily, reader Scotty did:

What happened to the "unvarnished truth" when CNN had their people in Iraq during the late 90's ? wasn't that the time that Mr' Jordan admitted CNN not reporting on Saddam's torture and murder all the while reporting Saddam's version of the "unvarnished truth" so they could keep their office open.


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Comments (47)

Anyone besides me get a rep... (Below threshold)
jhow66:

Anyone besides me get a reply on the video deal. If so note how they got the video. Wonder why they don't inform the military? Naa that might help.

Show video of 9-11? Too tra... (Below threshold)
Lurking Observer:

Show video of 9-11? Too traumatic. Too disturbing.

Show video of US soldiers being killed in Iraq? Unvarnished truth.

Although I agreee with the ... (Below threshold)
USMC Pilot:

Although I agreee with the idea that CNN shows a selective truth, I believe that all Americans need to see the videos. I was a helicopter pilot in VietNam, with over 700 combat missions, many of them medivac, and have first hand experience with the hell that war is. It is important that we the people know just what the sacrifices are that are troups are making. My only concern is that, if any of the victims are identifyable, the family might see the video. Otherwise, since they have to live it, we need to be strong enough to handle the reality, and still perservere.

Very nice comparison Lorie!... (Below threshold)
914:

Very nice comparison Lorie!

Video of babys being torn apart, Too graphic, Too much of the elephant in the room to be seen.

Our Sons and Daughters being cold bloodedly murdered In Iraq? A must see video. Highly appropriate and a necessity for election purposes.

The disgusting truth.

"Show video of 9-11? Too tr... (Below threshold)
BarneyG2000:

"Show video of 9-11? Too traumatic. Too disturbing."

Lurking, I guess you were sleeping when CNN (maybe it was MSNBC) showed 10-hours real time video from 9/11 on the anniversary, or the countless specials or hours of video replay from all networks during this last anniversary week?

Learn to talk for yourself, and not what Rush tells you.

will CNN also show video of... (Below threshold)
gozorak:

will CNN also show video of the US military slaughtering terrorist assholes? Of course not because it might offend terrorist assholes. That would be far too jingoistic in CNN's mind. Im so tired of mainstream western media's intentional efforts to downplay the nature of the enemy we face. I find myself really hoping that they find themselves at ground zero in the horrible event that another domestic terror event goes down. It would serve them right. Is there anything more laughably pathetic or unserious than CNN's "the Situation Room"? How many boobs rely on CNN or Fox or PMSNBC as their primary source of news?

What happened to the "unvar... (Below threshold)

What happened to the "unvarnished truth" when CNN had their people in Iraq during the late 90's ? wasn't that the time that Mr' Jordan admitted CNN not reporting on Saddam's torture and murder all the while reporting Saddam's version of the "unvarnished truth" so they could keep there office open.

Why does the Bush administr... (Below threshold)
BarneyG2000:

Why does the Bush administration forbid the publication of photos or video (coffins) of US causalities from Iraq or Afghanistan?

BarneyG2000. Are you sure a... (Below threshold)
Scrapiron:

BarneyG2000. Are you sure anyone broadcast it? Confused on who? Would take 30 seconds to find out if and who. You and Lee continue to play dumb and dumber.

If CNN were around in 1943,... (Below threshold)
Peter F.:

If CNN were around in 1943, they'd be broadcasting Toyko Rose. This convinces me of that fact.

You want October Suprises, libs? Try these on for size: Foley's e-mails, the Lancet "report", the leak of the National Intelligence Estimate, the alleged "failure" of Operation Together Forward, Bob Woodward's hack job of a book "State of Denial", the lame ass attempt to save the Plame Affair from the ashes by Ishkoff and Corn in "Hubris" and this sniper "story".

Talk about trying to undermine the morale of a country, my God..

This is the most infruiating and obvious, nay blantant, and concerted effort by the liberally biased media to negatively influence and impact mid-term elections that I can ever recall seeing. What an absolute farce of a press corps we have.

BarneyG2000Forbid ... (Below threshold)
914:

BarneyG2000

Forbid the publication?? You can publish them if You want but why would You??

In March, on the eve of the... (Below threshold)
BarneyG2000:

In March, on the eve of the Iraq war, a directive arrived from the Pentagon at U.S. military bases. "There will be no arrival ceremonies for, or media coverage of, deceased military personnel returning to or departing from Ramstein [Germany] airbase or Dover [Del.] base, to include interim stops," the Defense Department said, referring to the major ports for the returning remains.

Almost like it never happened?

Barney:Requests th... (Below threshold)
Peter F.:

Barney:

Requests that pictures and/or video of coffins not be shown is done so at the request of the families and their privacy, and it has been a long-standing policy of the US government for many, many years.

You're being disengenuous and deceitful to suggest there is any nefarious plot behind the policy.

You want October Suprise... (Below threshold)
Brian:

You want October Suprises, libs? Try these on for size:

Payback's a bitch, eh?

Actually the President DID ... (Below threshold)
Justrand:

Actually the President DID forbid showing photographs of American casualties.

Wilson...Democrat.

During the first World War, the government completely banned publication of images of American dead. The government did not allow a single picture of an American casualty to be published over the entire duration of the war.

Oops...another President did the same thing...

Roosevelt...Democrat.

For first two years of the second world war had the same policy!

I blame Bush.

Barney you the smackdown ab... (Below threshold)
BarneyKillaz:

Barney you the smackdown about the coffins. Be a man admit you were wrong and concede one little point. This needs to happen!

Brian:Payback? For... (Below threshold)
Peter F:

Brian:

Payback? For what? Clinton? Or is it the 2000 elections you still can't get over? Or was it the 2004 elections?

Whatever the case, you must feel reallllllll good about how the press is undermining the security of your country and our troops in the field to say something that stupid.

If CNN is so interested in ... (Below threshold)
Michael:

If CNN is so interested in showing the "unvarnished truth" about what the terrorists are doing in Iraq, why haven't they shown the immediate aftermath of a suicide bomb attack. Not the standard bloodstains in the streets or the bandaged people in the hospitals, but pieces of children laying in the gutter as their former owners writhe in agony and scream before bleeding out. A few years ago the Bush administration complained to the Israelis that their targeting of Hamas and Hezbullah leaders made things "difficult" for the peace process. When confronted with photographs and video of an attack on a pizzeria full of kids, the complaints stopped immediately.

"Be a man admit you were wr... (Below threshold)
BarneyG2000:

"Be a man admit you were wrong"

Wrong about what? The policy is in place.

Payback? For what?</... (Below threshold)
Brian:

Payback? For what?

C'mon, are you really that naive? You guys had the media do your dirty work for you in the 90s, and now you're complaining because the spotlight is turning against you.

Whatever the case, you must feel reallllllll good about how the press is undermining the security of your country and our troops in the field to say something that stupid.

Probably about as good as you did when the press was reporting Republican attacks on Clinton, day and night, with our troops in the field.

October was our bloodiest month in 2 years. Since our push to stablize Baghdad, attacks are up 22%. Generals are calling the campaign a failure. Bush condedes this is similar to Vietnam. Bin laden is free as a bird. The Constitution is being gutted.

On my list of things that are undermining the security of the country and our troops in the field, the media is very low.

I knew you were worse than ... (Below threshold)
BarneyKillaz:

I knew you were worse than worthless Barney. All I'm asking for is an admission that you were wrong on one little point. You can't even manage that. Subhuman.

Wow, BarneyG. 10 h... (Below threshold)
Lurking Observer:

Wow, BarneyG.

10 hours of video, five years later. Why, that's, lemme see here, hmmm, carry the two, that works out to an average of two whole hours of video every year!! Talk about wall-to-wall coverage!

I'm curious, do we think that there has been more or less coverage of Abu Ghraib, in terms of hours of news coverage, than 9-11? How about the actual shots of Lyddie England versus the showing of AA77 hitting the Twin Towers?

Why is the argument about... (Below threshold)
B's Freak:

Why is the argument about what else they would show if they were interested in "all" of the "unvarnished truth"? That accepts the idea that a collection of images edited by a miitant political group and shown to both recruit new members to its cause and dishearten the enemy can be defined as "unvarnished" anything.

Barney...do me a comparisio... (Below threshold)
VagaBond:

Barney...do me a comparision of Katrina coverage to 9/11 or any other hurricane.

"On my list of things th... (Below threshold)
914:

"On my list of things that are undermining the security of the country and our troops in the field,the media is very low."

C'mon the media is not even on Your list..Even though its obviously where you are getting your facts for everything else you stated.

"Our troops were in the field under Clinton?

Oh, you mean that illegal war in Kosovo, Or was it Somalia?

Bin Laden is free as a bird."

If He is alive that is? If you consider hiding amongst the rocks and sand free as a bird? so be it.

"This is like Viet Nam"

In that the media are undermining everything our militarys fighting for and the terrorists know this and are using it for their advantage.

"The constitution is being gutted."

I agree! by liberal activist judges..

Probably about as good a... (Below threshold)
Peter F.:

Probably about as good as you did when the press was reporting Republican attacks on Clinton, day and night, with our troops in the field.

First, I voted for the guy. Twice. Second, we never had "boots on the ground" in Bosnia or doing the bombings of Iraq and Sudan. So your comparison is baseless and pointless.

Generals are calling the campaign a failure. Bush condedes this is similar to Vietnam.

Proof that you don't do your homework? Here it is: 1.) Gen. Caldwell did not call Operation Together Forward a "failure". In fact, neither the word "failure" or "unsuccessful" appear in the transcript which I'll conveinently provide for everyone here. In fact--which reporter Nancy Youssef from McClatchy Newspapers "fails" to mention in her article which was spalshed around the country this morning--is that the operation had "not met their overall expectations". And that's as negative as it got.

And your quotation of percentage of the increase in violence is correct it lacks any context. Again, Gen Caldwell's direct words:

"In Baghdad alone, we've seen a 22 percent increase in attacks during the first three weeks of Ramadan, as compared to the three weeks preceding Ramadan.

In Baghdad, Operation Together Forward has made a difference in the focus areas but has not met our overall expectations of sustaining a reduction in the levels of violence. We are working very closely with the government of Iraq to determine how to best to refocus our efforts.

In regards to this spike in violence during Ramadan, it's no coincidence that the surge in attacks against coalition forces and subsequent increase in U.S. casualty -- casualties coincide with our increased presence on the streets in Baghdad and the run-up to the American midterm elections. The enemy knows that killing innocent people and Americans will garner headlines and create a sense of frustration.

Do you see the word "fail" or "failure" in there? No, you don't. In fact, do a search of those words in this doc and you won't find it. Those are the reporter's words, not the General's.

The President, like Thomas Freidman, is wrong in comparing or even remotely likening this up tick in Ramadan violence to the concerted or highly organized and grossly unsuccessful Tet Offensive of 1968. It is nowhere NEAR that at all. Not even the casualities, while significant in Iraq, come nowhere close to the 4000-8000 US wounded or KIA during Tet. Or the the 40,000+ the NVA lost during Tet.

The Constitution is being gutted.

It is? Name ONE loss of The Constitution you've experienced. (Don't worry, you can't. And no, your rhetorical nonsene doesn't count.)

Again the facts prevail over the feckless rhetorical musings of the Left.

Peter F:The irony ... (Below threshold)
Lurking Observer:

Peter F:

The irony is that, back in Vietnam, the comparison du jour being touted, it was the press that insisted on labeling it a failure.

This despite the gutting of the VC structure on the ground.

Even more ironic, Dubya, whom liberals immediately assume is an idiot, does not compare it to Vietnam, he notes that, as with the Tet Offensive, there's been an upswing in the violence. Hardly the same thing.

But then, one wonders what liberals or the media (not always the same thing) would have made of the Battle of the Bulge. After all, how else would one describe the surrender of an entire American division?! (The 106th, a new unit, in the Ardennes.)

"I Can't Watch CNN! Ernie P... (Below threshold)

"I Can't Watch CNN! Ernie Pyle, I Miss You!" Says Author Michael Class

In new American history book, time-traveling boy discovers war correspondents of the past were better.

On October 19, 2006, CNN aired a video obtained from America's enemy, the Islamic Army of Iraq, showing an Islamic Army sniper targeting and killing an American soldier.

"Like many Americans, I am shocked and outraged by CNN's decision to air the video. The video is enemy propaganda, designed to discourage American support for the war effort," says history book author Michael S. Class. "War correspondents of the past knew better."

Class is the author of a new history book for kids: Anthony and the Magic Picture Frame. In the book, Anthony, the author's real-life son, travels through time to meet the heroes of America's past. Advanced digital photography places Anthony in real historical photographs of Charles Lindbergh, Neil Armstrong, Thomas Edison, Jonas Salk, FDR, Lou Gehrig, and Audie Murphy. Anthony's conversations with the heroes of the past are based on things they really said. The Web site, www.MagicPictureFrame.com, displays some of the book's amazing photographs.

"I wanted to capture the interest of today's kids," says Class, "by turning American history into a grand time travel adventure - with a moral lesson. It's a history book with a lesson for the present day."

Anthony meets American war correspondent Ernie Pyle on Normandy beach on D-Day, June 6, 1944.

"I met a journalist who came ashore with the second wave of GIs," reports Anthony. "He was sitting on the beach, surrounded by the evidence of the day's chaos - crumpled machinery, dead bodies, and spent artillery. His name was Ernie Pyle and he was writing his latest dispatch to the newspapers in the United States."

Ernie Pyle writes the following words in his tattered notebook: "Now that it is over it seems to me a pure miracle that we ever took the beach at all. In this column I want to tell you what this battle entailed, so that you can know and appreciate and forever be humbly grateful to those both dead and alive who did it for you."

Anthony wonders: "Why are there no reporters like Ernie Pyle in my time?"

"Ernie Pyle's style of reporting seemed strange to Anthony," explains Class, "because Ernie Pyle made it clear which side he was on. Ernie Pyle never glorified war, but he explained combat in terms of the sacrifices that American soldiers made on behalf of the people back home. Pyle wrote of the American warrior with a heart-of-gold, fighting the good fight against evil, fighting for a just and moral cause."

Ernie Pyle was one of America's most famous and beloved war correspondents during World War II. Pyle set a new journalistic standard by moving among the soldiers on the front lines. His reporting gave the American people a closeness to war that they had never experienced before. Ernie Pyle died on April 18, 1945, while reporting on the Battle of Okinawa in the Pacific. A movie was made about Ernie Pyle in 1945: The Story of G.I. Joe, starring Burgess Meredith.

"In the new World War," explains Class, "it seems that journalists follow American soldiers into battle only to report on what goes wrong, to focus attention on mistakes, or to get the story from the enemy's point of view. When was the last time you read a newspaper article telling you about the bravery, courage, or success of our troops in battle? Can you imagine a TV news anchor closing a news broadcast with the words: Godspeed to our troops, and our prayers for the swift defeat of the enemy?"

Ernie Pyle was revered by Americans, but Class thinks that history might not be kind to modern-day journalists.

"I can't watch CNN!" says Class. "Ernie Pyle, I miss you!"

Anthony and the Magic Picture Frame was named Outstanding Book of the Year and Most Original Concept of 2006 by Independent Publisher, Reviewers Choice by Midwest Book Review, and Editor's Pick by Homefires: The Journal of Homeschooling Online. Nationally syndicated talk-show host Michael Medved calls the book "entertaining and educational." Apollo 11 astronaut Buzz Aldrin says "parents and teachers will appreciate the inspiring message this unique history book holds for America's next generation. I recommend this book to all young Americans, may they take us to the stars and beyond."

Anthony and the Magic Picture Frame (hardcover, 225 pages, $26.50) is available at www.MagicPictureFrame.com, by calling toll-free 1-800-247-6553, at select bookstores, and on www.amazon.com.

Anthony and the Magic Picture Frame includes built-in tools for parents and teachers: recommendations for hundreds of books, movies, songs, and places to visit, keyed to the subjects of each chapter. The author's Web site includes a fun final exam; the author's blog is a place for readers to discuss the book's moral lessons (www.MagicPictureFrame.blogspot.com).

The history channel has bee... (Below threshold)
USMC Pilot:

The history channel has been running a history of VietNam for several days now, and I have noticed that there are in fact some lessons to be learned. Every time the VC and NVA carried out a major offensive it appeared at first that they had a great victory, but the reality was that they suffered tremendous loses and never made any gains. My guess is that history will show that the terrorist are loosing massive amounts of troups and supplies durring this increased activity. They know they can't win a military victory, so hope to win a phycological one as the NVA did in VietNam. The problem is that we publish our casualties, but the enemy doesn't. Since the policy is to not give body counts, the public only hears how many of our troups are being killed. I have also noticed that with the tremendous activity in Iraq it seems that the number of bombings in Irael have greatly dimished, which would also indicate that the terrorist are realy shoting their wad in Iraq.

>Operation Together Forw... (Below threshold)
Brian:

>Operation Together Forward... has not met our overall expectations of sustaining a reduction in the levels of violence.
Do you see the word "fail" or "failure" in there?

Oh, please. And Enron did not meet expectations of sustaining a reduction in the levels of losses. And Clinton did not have sexual relations with that woman. We're now supposed to just accept double-speak now?

"Not met expectations of sustaining reduction in violence" =
"We expected it to reduce violence, but it didn't" =
"Its objective was to reduce violence, and it failed at that objective".

Name ONE loss of The Constitution you've experienced. (Don't worry, you can't.

So one now has to actually, in person, experience a loss for it to be acknowledged as a loss to society? Well, I have not been murdered, but I perceive others' murders to be a loss. I have not been arrested without charges brought, but I perceive others' unproven arrests to be a loss. I have not had my privacy violated (...or have I?!), but I perceive others' violations to be a loss. I suppose if the government just promises to be good, we won't even need a Constitution anymore!

And no, your rhetorical nonsene doesn't count.)

That's what the founding document of America is to you... rhetorical nonsense. *sigh*

Brian,Your mom is ... (Below threshold)
Hedgy:

Brian,

Your mom is rhetorical nonsense, bitch!

"So now one has to actua... (Below threshold)
914:

"So now one has to actually, in person experience a loss for it to be aknowledge as a loss for society?"

Well yes, The question was what constitutional right have you personally lost?

Since You cannot name one it is clear none have been lost..

One example would suffice?

>"So now one has to actu... (Below threshold)
Brian:

>"So now one has to actually, in person experience a loss for it to be aknowledged as a loss for society?"
Well yes

Ugh, what a shockingly stupid argument. It's unfathomable that anyone could actually hold such a philosophy, one that isn't right or left, but that violates logic itself. So I must conclude that you're simply baiting me. Well, I haven't personally been threatened by Saddam Hussein, so we shouldn't have invaded Iraq. So there.

"What a shockingly stupi... (Below threshold)
914:

"What a shockingly stupid argument"

I agree, It was Your argument.

And You left out My quote after " well yes,The question was what right have You personally lost?" And the answer is Zero.

Thank You very much!

"...applied in countless wa... (Below threshold)

"...applied in countless ways. Maybe we could see video of some of those liberal politicians claiming to be men and women of the people walking out the front doors of their million dollar homes. Or maybe we could watch some radical environmentalist liberals flying around in their private jets and limousines."

Or maybe we could watch some sanctimonious conservative politician cheating on his wife. Or, cheating on the American people by taking money from people who do not serve our best interests.

Too bad these reports by cn... (Below threshold)
MB:

Too bad these reports by cnn are so ignorantly done. The soldier we see in the first video, is Stephen Tschiderer age 22 from New York. He survived the attack thanks to his bulletproof vest. You can see him fall, stand immediately back up and take cover position while aiming his rifle trying to identify where the shot came from. He was actually interviewed by the news organization Spiegel (german) which shows him at home looking into a laptop at a dvd playing the incident. It is amazing to watch him in the interview specially when he says "I saw no blood on me. Got up and told myself "OK, guy. Get up and get the job done"". What a hero, what a soldier. Just for watching that portion, I recommend it. Shows you what the guys out there are made of.

Too bad that cnn piece is such a lousy pos job. The report done extensively by the german video magazine, explains the whole detail of what seems to be a "Juba" organization in Iraq comprised of snipers. It gets all of its information freely from the internet where it is all seemingly available although they do not name where.

So I do disagree about not showing this because it seems that it is freely available and other countries are doing reporting about it. BUT, I am disgusted that cnn cant produce a decent report about and specially tend to imply that all sniper attacks where deadly, when one can clearly see in the pictures on the uncut report, that that was not the case. AND, specially not even finding out or showing and interviewing that heroic soldier who stands up after getting shot with the words "Ok, let's get the job done".

Anyways, you might post this or not but I do encourage you to look for that Spiegel online article about the so called "Juba" sniper. It is in german and it is a 10min in-depth report and not just these iditioc talkshow garbage that is produced in many of the cable networks.

PS. And those snipers who took that potshot at Tscheder, yup, the boys found em, followed em and after a 2 hour chase, caught em. You can see part of that too in the report. They show the sniper rifle (held by a US soldier) used as well as the tiny camera mounted ON the russian made Dragonov rifle.

There is more than meets the eye in terms of what some hatchet job at cnn does with a report like this and what a serious news organization does. You guys could dig further into this.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-5123868758473905598

I agree, It was Your arg... (Below threshold)
Brian:

I agree, It was Your argument.

No, it was Peter's and yours. The argument that I, Brian, must have personally experienced a loss for it to be valid to be protected by the Constitution representing 300 million people. Including you, I might add.

And You left out My quote after " well yes,The question was what right have You personally lost?" And the answer is Zero.

Thank You very much!

If that's the basis for your inane argument, you're very welcome.

I've never published a newpaper; who needs the 1st amendment?
I've never owned a gun; who needs the 2nd amendment?
I've never had soldiers quartered in my house; who needs the 3rd amendment?
...

Thanks for the link MB, Ver... (Below threshold)
914:

Thanks for the link MB, Very interesting.

Brian, I think that to make the assumption that it has happened without even 1 example is disengenuous..Im sure if it was happening the examples would be splashed all over the tv and the internet and there would be a huge uproar about it and rightfully so.
In the absence of evidence however I find it a little bit too much.

LOL I'm still waiting for B... (Below threshold)
Wanderlust:

LOL I'm still waiting for Brian's mythical lost rights. But I think I found them for him:

I live outside the United States, as a US citizen living in a different country. Now, I used to have the right to call someone back in the US and talk about the latest terrorist planning du jour, without worrying that someone in Crypto City might be listening.

But no longer.

Call Kerry! Call Kennedy! Call Pelosi and Boxer!

MY RIGHTS AS A US CITIZEN HAVE BEEN INFRINGED!!!

See? Brian was right...

/sarc

(meanwhile, can someone ... (Below threshold)
Wanderlust:

(meanwhile, can someone make that blog comment advertising whore Michael Class go away already? I've seen enough of his comments whoring his silly book, and if he can't write well enough for it to sell on its own without hawking it in comment postings all over the blogosphere, he can just go awaaaaaaaaaaaaaaayyyyy)

Now what's really funny, is... (Below threshold)
Wanderlust:

Now what's really funny, is how CNN couldn't tell you that the soldier who was shot wasn't killed - and how the "insurgents" who shot the video were apprehended two hours later.

No bias there, nothing to see here, move right along...

Someone please wipe up the ... (Below threshold)
Jo:

Someone please wipe up the floor with Barney & Brian. Oops. Already done. Ouch.

Vagabond, do a comparison o... (Below threshold)
seamus:

Vagabond, do a comparison of the damage of Hurricane Katrina and other hurricanes in the lst fifty years.

Lurking, there was clearly way more coverage of 9/11 than Abu Gharib. It's not even close.

Yup.A nice and com... (Below threshold)
drjohn:

Yup.

A nice and complete close-up video of a partial birth abortion.

Unvarnished.


Yup.

Brian, I think that to m... (Below threshold)
Brian:

Brian, I think that to make the assumption that it has happened without even 1 example is disengenuous..

Oh, it has certainly happened, and there certainly are examples. That's not what I was asked. I was asked if it happened to me personally. That is what I was asked to provide examples of, and that's what I denounced as a laughable position. Many conservatives own no guns, but that doesn't stop them from decrying the erosion of the 2nd amendment. The position that one must personally suffer the loss of a right in order to value that right is what is disingenuous.

Im sure if it was happening the examples would be splashed all over the tv and the internet and there would be a huge uproar about it and rightfully so.

Yes, I guess you are right.

Brian, I think that to m... (Below threshold)
Brian:

Brian, I think that to make the assumption that it has happened without even 1 example is disengenuous..

Oh, it has certainly happened, and there certainly are examples. That's not what I was asked. I was asked if it happened to me personally. That is what I was asked to provide examples of, and that's what I denounced as a laughable position. Many conservatives own no guns, but that doesn't stop them from decrying the erosion of the 2nd amendment. The position that one must personally suffer the loss of a right in order to value that right is what is disingenuous.

Im sure if it was happening the examples would be splashed all over the tv and the internet and there would be a huge uproar about it and rightfully so.

Yes, I guess you are right.

Someone please wipe up t... (Below threshold)
Brian:

Someone please wipe up the floor with Barney & Brian. Oops. Already done. Ouch.

Whee! It must have been really fun for you to sit there watching from the sidelines, contributing nothing of intelligence to the conversation, then jumping in, sticking your tongue out, and running away again like a scared little child. Your mommy would be proud.




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