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Most Democrats Don't Deliver On Gay Marriage

Glenn Reynolds notes that in spite of Andrew Sullivan's siding with the Democrats over the issue of gay marriage, he has not gotten much for it. Glenn's quotes from John Kerry on the subject are startling when you consider how much support the Democratic party gets from those in support of gay marriage. I had forgotten how strongly Kerry came out (at least in some of his statements) in opposition to gay marriage in the last election. I wonder if it is a case of Dems running for major office getting a pass because those supporting them assume they are just saying what it takes to get elected, but that they will act differently when in office.


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Comments (20)

Democrats have some weird s... (Below threshold)

Democrats have some weird spell they cast over entire groups of people which enable them to convince the voters they are "on their side" and "fighting for them," while they do nothing of the sort.

They have gotten away with it with blacks because of resentment over the Civil Rights Acts. Yeah, I know a higher % of Republicans in Congress than Democrats voted FOR those acts, but that is irrelevant. The GOP nominated Goldwater, a strong opponent, and soon welcomed to our ranks most of the conservative Southern Dems who had done the same.

This resentment must evidently work its curse of blood like the Israelites in the wilderness: only when all the generation who were there have passed away will entry to the Promised Land be possible.

But blacks have, at least, a legitimate (if counterproductive to their self-interests) excuse in that ugly chapter of our history. Gays who support Democrats reflexively must surely be liberals anyway.

Gays who support Republicans would naturally keep a low profile of it, having seen what happens to conservative blacks. And Republican gays are probably too busy being successful and productive members of society that they have little time to worry about it.

My guess is the gays are mo... (Below threshold)
Jon:

My guess is the gays are more worried about people who want to block the marriages than the people who don't want to pass them. They know they can't ask for much. You'd be surprised at some of the high ranking Democrats, like Spitzer, and Feingold, and probably Sherrod Brown, who support gay marriage. They can get away with it because the media doesn't want to focus on any Democrats who have positions out of step with the public.

Many Democrat politicians a... (Below threshold)
jpm100:

Many Democrat politicians are like many Republican politicians. They are afraid to permanently alienate some voters while taking their base for granted.

There are two differences though.

The first is that the media will not hold them accountable for their statements or actions. So they are free to say one thing during the election period and do something else once elected. They can reverse Republicans' Pay lip service to the base and do nothing in office without the media bashing them over the head with it.

The second difference is they defer repercussions by allowing liberal Judges to mold the law, doing what should be Congress' job. This approach makes tilting the Supreme Court Bench to the liberal side an imperitive. Hence, I predict the '08 elections to make 2000 & 2004 look like child's play.

It's the same with the blac... (Below threshold)
hermie:

It's the same with the black community.

The Dems make promises, but only deliver more hand-outs and token Cabinet positions.

They pander to the race hustlers like Jackson and Sharpton, while ignoring those who want to be free of crime, have jobs, and want their kids to actually learn math and English in school.

Of course, the Dems used ho... (Below threshold)
hermie:

Of course, the Dems used homophobia when they go after Hastert and Republican House candidates. They use the 'gay = pedophile' line to scare voters, while taking donations from the gay activists.

" I wonder if it is a ca... (Below threshold)
Lee:

" I wonder if it is a case of Dems running for major office getting a pass because those supporting them assume they are just saying what it takes to get elected, but that they will act differently when in office."

I wonder if it might be because in America people are entitled to have different opinions, and to speak their mind on the issues, without being expected to buy in to one particular ideology.

Yes, you will find mindless Republicans repeating the evangelical "party line" that they've been told to repeat, and those Republicans who disagree will remain silent. Nazi Germany flourished under the exact same conditions.

Not so in the Democratic party.

Which party is the best for America? The party which allows and encourages debate and dialog, or the one where someone else decides what you should think for you.

One party - the Democratic party -- welcomes ideas from all sides of the table. The Republicans do not.


And Lorie -- What is the ba... (Below threshold)
Lee:

And Lorie -- What is the basis for your statement that (emphasis mine) "Most Democrats don't deliver on gay marriage"?

Do you have statistics to back up this claim that the majority of Democrats don't support gay marriage, or did some Republican tell you think that?

Lee, that's a total joke. ... (Below threshold)
Chasen:

Lee, that's a total joke. Democrats certainly do NOT welcome ideas from all sides of the table. They welcome ideas that fit with their agenda, and those that don't fit get censored or ignored or mocked.

Poor Glenn. Trying to use ... (Below threshold)

Poor Glenn. Trying to use logic on Andrew. It's both futile and unfair; Andrew isn't used to being logical.

Lee:<br ... (Below threshold)
_Mike_:

Lee:


Yes, you will find mindless Republicans repeating the evangelical "party line" that they've been told to repeat, and those Republicans who disagree will remain silent. Nazi Germany flourished under the exact same conditions.

Yes, you will find mindless Democrats who can't muster any better argument than comparing everything to Nazi Germany. It's truly a testament to their depth of the knowledege.

Do you have statistics t... (Below threshold)
Steve L.:

Do you have statistics to back up this claim that the majority of Democrats don't support gay marriage, or did some Republican tell you think that?


In our humble little state in the 2004 election, we had a constitutional amendment banning gay marraige on the ballot as well. The President won over state by about 54-46. The amendment won by a 75-25 margin. I did the math and discovered that, if you assume every supporter of the President also supported the gay marraige ban, 44% of the people who voted for John Kerry also voted for the amendment. While that isn't a majority, it is a large percentage.

The thinking of the pro-sam... (Below threshold)
Mark L:

The thinking of the pro-same-sex-union* crowd goes like this:

Democrat candidates have to publicly state that they oppose same-sex-unions to get elected, but they are lying about their opposition and we know they are lying. Once they get a majority and the Presidency the Democrats will legalize it, knowing that even if they get thrown out it will be impossible to put the toothpaste back into the tube, and repeal the law.

*Why do I call it same-sex-union? Because "gay marriage" is already legal. If a gay man and a gay woman wish to marry each other they can do so today -- in any state in the Union. What they want is the right for two men or two women -- or really "n" men and "m" women -- to enter into a legal partnership where in the eyes of the law they are seen as one corporate individual. And I say "n" men and "m" women because if you allow same-sex-unions what real argument can you make aganst polygamy and polyandry? That God intended marriage to consist of just two people? Not when both polygamy and polyandry have existed throughout history, yet until the 20th century there was not a single civilization with same-sex-unions. (Even Ancient Greece, which glorified homosexual relations did not have it.)

One party - the Democra... (Below threshold)
Jo:

One party - the Democratic party -- welcomes ideas from all sides of the table. The Republicans do not.

Oh really? Let's ask Joe Lieberman about that.

You have to love this tortu... (Below threshold)
J.R.:

You have to love this tortured logic from hyper partisan Lee. In one message he broadly accuses every Republican with this:

Yes, you will find mindless Republicans repeating the evangelical "party line" that they've been told to repeat, and those Republicans who disagree will remain silent.

No proof necessary, right Lee?

The next message Lee tries to criticize Lorie with this:

And Lorie -- What is the basis for your statement that (emphasis mine) "Most Democrats don't deliver on gay marriage"?

Do you have statistics to back up this claim that the majority of Democrats don't support gay marriage, or did some Republican tell you think that?

Now we need statistics??

Lee, you are the perfect emulation of your preferred party's symbol. You are a jack-ass.

Excellent point Jo.... (Below threshold)
J.R.:

Excellent point Jo.

Lincoln freed the slaves---... (Below threshold)
Scrapiron:

Lincoln freed the slaves---Republican
Who fought for and passed the civil rights act---Republicans

Who fought the civil rights act to the last minute, KKK Byrd----Democrat

Who is outing 'gays' that don't want their private lives made public-----Democrats

Who keeps promising the black community the sky and never deliver more than enough to keep them on the dole----democrats

The democrats of today would give their grandmother's up for slaughter for a vote.

It now appears that more of the public have reconized that the dim's are lying as the saying goes, through their teeth.

Anyone capable of reading even the slimey news outlets like the NYT/lat has to know the economy is in the best shape, actually in history, and left alone it will eleminate deficit spending simply by growth. The dim's just keep lying on an hourly basis.

The terrorists around the world have stepped up the slaughter to benefit the dim's in their losing election efforts, not it appears that won't work either. Loser are losers and they want to take as many as possible down with them.

"One party - the Democratic... (Below threshold)

"One party - the Democratic party -- welcomes ideas from all sides of the table. The Republicans do not."

I support gay marriage, am squishily pro-choice, am a fierce agnostic, support decriminalizing drugs, and have slammed Rush Limbaugh, Oliver North, Bill O'Reilly, Sean Hannity, Newt Gingrich, and iconic figures on the right. Yet Lee routinely calls me a "Republican shill" or words to that effect.

I'd like to add Zell Miller and the late Bob Casey (the pro-choice Democratic former governor of Pennsylvania) to those who would have some interesting thoughts on the Democrats as the "big tent" party.

J.

One party - the De... (Below threshold)
OregonMuse:
One party - the Democratic party -- welcomes ideas from all sides of the table. The Republicans do not.

AHAHAHAHAHAHA! What, Lee, are you completely delusional or something? This statement's total disconnect from reality is absolutely breathtaking.

To pick one example, I can cite any number of nationally prominent Republicans who are pro-abortion rights. How many nationally prominent Democrats are pro-life?

And, once we ask SenatorLie... (Below threshold)
Robert:

And, once we ask SenatorLieberman then lets ask Zel Miller.

When looking at state anti-... (Below threshold)

When looking at state anti-same sex marriage ammendments the voting consistantly shows that a majority of Democrats voted against same sex marriage.

The Democratic candidates realize this is true, which is why Kerry was so careful not to push the wrong buttons on the issue. And yes, no matter what he said the assumption is that he's lying to get elected and that the Democratic party (which has gay marriage in the platform, I'm told) will vote in all that good stuff they never actually do anything about.

The Republicans, OTOH, can say *exactly* the same things during a campaign cycle and any other time, and they too are assumed to be lying, that they actually have a secret agenda to actively persecute gay people.

What a racket, huh? Republicans can demonstrate that they look to a person's qualifications before their color and really would rather just ignore sexual orientation if at all possible. You really think all those gay staffers are completely under the radar? Heck no. Yet Republicans are supposedly anti-gay and racist.

Democrats can demonstrate no better record, and indeed the party leadership plays the race card or sexual orientation card blatantly. Yet Democrats are supposedly pro-gay and not racist.

Yet they don't deliver. Because they can't. Because the *Democrat* base doesn't want gay marriage and the general elitist attitude that people aren't really able to govern themselves includes all those minorities who vote so faithfully.

(And one does wonder, considering the frequent incompetence of Democrat women and minorities in office if they get the offices they do because the people who put them there believe that's as competent as a woman or minority can get. In my local US congressional race not even the people who support the Hispanic/female Dem candidate pretend that she's competent. Or even honest. And she might win.)

((Actually, they do pretend she's honest, but not even her supporters believe it.))




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