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Let's give them a fair trial, then hang 'em

Yesterday was a bad day to be a liberal.

First up, it was revealed that the outing (and resignation) of former congressman Mark Foley (R-FL) was done at the hands of a staffer for the "Human Rights Campaign" (one of the George Soros-backed groups with lofty names that keep springing up like cockroaches, and that will be struggling for a purpose to exist once George Bush leaves office), who had done the outing while on the clock at HRC, and apparently used HRC computers and other resources to take down the incumbent sleazeball.

Next, ACORN (the Association of Community Organizations for Reform Now) was accused of submitting literally hundreds of fraudulent voter registration cards in Missouri. This is the same ACORN (another group backed by Soros, oddly enough) that was accused of pulling the same shenanigans in Ohio, Minnesota, North Carolina, and Virginia in 2004.

It never fails to amaze me how so many on the Left can repeatedly accuse Diebold of rigging elections without solid evidence, yet conveniently whitewash and forget about incidents like this. I guess it's OK to commit election fraud on the retail level, but bad to possibly steal an election wholesale.

Now, normally, I'd say that fine, we caught the bad guys, let's fire 'em, prosecute them if necessary, and then just move on from here. But that's old thinking. In the light of the Tom DeLay and Mark Foley examples, among countless others, there is a new ethical standard to be upheld.

In that light, I am calling for a full federal -- perhaps even Congressional -- investigation into both HRC (no, not Hillary Rodham Clinton, Human Rights Campaign) and ACORN, as well as demanding the immediate resignation of the top leaders of both groups. Either they knew about and the misdeeds of their underlings and covered for them, or they should have known and were inept and negligent in not knowing.

In all seriousness, this matter should give HRC a serious black eye, and destroy any credibility they've managed to buy over the years. ACORN, however, should be thoroughly investigated. I had nearly forgotten about ACORN's history of shady voter registrations, always explained as the misdeeds of some "misguided volunteers and employees." They need to be looked at, and looked at hard.


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Comments (88)

HRC is an organization I ab... (Below threshold)
Jon:

HRC is an organization I abhor, but they've been around longer than the average cockroach. They were founded in the early 80's, and used to be very radical. Then they became what the libs would call "corporate" and "establishment" by endorsing various Republicans (they endorsed Senator d'amato in 1998, they endorsed Shays, and Mary Bono, and...oops...Mark Foley).

They have no real purpose today, as identity politics are on the wane. I don't think they ever recovered from the discovery that 25% of gays voted for President Bush in the 2004 election. They were sure every single "GLBT" out there would do their bidding.

Since when was a full Congr... (Below threshold)
epador:

Since when was a full Congressional Investigation fair?

So are the Democrats going ... (Below threshold)
_Mike_:

So are the Democrats going back to their old voter rallying cry ?.... "Bring out your dead."

Don't be so quick Jay Tea</... (Below threshold)
Baggi:

Don't be so quick Jay Tea

There is a lot more coming in this case. What is the name of this staffer? Why did he start a blog just for the sole purpose of outing Mark Foley? Did he know before he started the blog about Mark Foley (The answer to that is obvious) and if he knew, who did he find out from?

Here is what most likely happened and will be demonstrated after all the facts come out.

This staffer was used by the Democratic party to "out" Mark Foley as an October surprise. Someone above his pay grade got access to the nasty IM's (Not the Email's) and set out to make political hay out of it, rather than to protect children and pages from Mark Foley.

Now that they've been caught, they are scrambling to cover their trail. But in today's day and age that will be all but impossible. We probably will not find out the whole story before the elections but we will find out the whole story and when we do it won't be pretty for the Democrats.

Is this the twilight zone o... (Below threshold)
muirgeo:

Is this the twilight zone or did I miss something? OR is this just another right wing blog who's so desperate and so far down the drain they can only hope to take others with them.

I'm not sure of the details of who brought the child predations of Mark Foley to light but in the universe I come from that makes them the hero not the villain.

Bad day to be a liberal??? I'd say it's a bad day to have a sexual predator in your ranks.....but again this who incident pales in comparision to the complete selling out of America and it's middle class to multinational corporations by the Republican controlled government.

You've all been preyed upon and corn-holed by the Republican predators....and apparently you liked it so much you'll make excuses for it and want some more. What's that called the Stockholm Syndrome??....You got it bad baby!!

Again why is this a signifi... (Below threshold)
muirgeo:

Again why is this a significant issues when as we speak I can point you to drug companies flooding the campaigns of struggling republicans so they can use their money to by pass democracy and keep the Medicare drug bill intact protecting it from the evil Pelosi so Idiot America can continue to not bid out contracts for Medicare drugs. Thus costing silly Republican votes and all other Americans to support multi-million dollar CEO pensions while hurting the program, the seniors who benefit from it and the nations wallet.


Tell me why you tolerate being treated by a page and allow this raping of Democracy to go on and allow this corruption and corporate welfare to bankrupt your country. Tell me why this is not the true story?

As for ACORN and the dead v... (Below threshold)
eddie bear:

As for ACORN and the dead voting, they are just recruiting the one bloc of the Democrats that never votes below 110% support.

We should hang Soro's first... (Below threshold)
steak111111:

We should hang Soro's first....

and hang HRC while we're at it too (no, i don't mean the Human Rights Campaign) as she is guilty as h*** (or do i have to enumerate the offences beginning with the billing records)....

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/arkansas/docs/recs.html

"In addition, investigators had the FBI conduct fingerprint analysis of the billing records. Of significance, the prints of Vince Foster and Hillary Clinton were found."

By the way, what ever happened to Vince Foster???

"one of the George Soros... (Below threshold)
cmd:

"one of the George Soros-backed groups. . .that will be struggling for a purpose to exist once George Bush leaves office."

You mean like MoveOn.org?

"the child predations of Mark Foley. . ."

Predations? That's all you got, muriego? What a joke - all you clowns have are dirty e-mails. He didn't commit a crime, unlike your predatory pervert chickenhawk Studds. Please. If Foley were one of yours, you'd be screaming like a banshee about how he should be left in peace, he was only mentoring the pages, his personal life is his own business, and all it proves is that Rethuglikkkan theocrats are obsessed by sex.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. You hate Bush. You hate the GOP. You hate business. Tell you what, pal - take another toke off the bong and leave the grownups alone, will you?

muirgeo said Is this the... (Below threshold)
Sheik Yur Bouty:

muirgeo said Is this the twilight zone or did I miss something?

It would take a 21 volume encyclopedia just to begin to describe all the things you've missed in order to arrive at your twisted view of "reality".

Why is it, Muirego, that wh... (Below threshold)
Chasen:

Why is it, Muirego, that when Democrats crow about Republican scandals it's big news, but when Democrat offenders are flushed out, it's "not significant"? Double standard much? For every "point" (whether on topic or not) you make about "corrupt" Republicans, you can be easily countered by a Democrat corruption. But you'd probably ignore those points as "not significant" too.

Interesting that the outing... (Below threshold)
Lee:

Interesting that the outing of Mark Foley, sleezebag extraordinaire, should be seen as a bad thing.

Only a Republican would think that way... Maybe renaming them the Pedophile Party would be appropriate.

Nobody is excusing Foley he... (Below threshold)
D-Hoggs:

Nobody is excusing Foley here Lee, unlike the democrats treatment of their pedophiles, you know, the ones that ACTUALLY have sex with young-uns?! But keep distorting, its all you know how to do.

Nobody is excusing Foley? T... (Below threshold)
Lee:

Nobody is excusing Foley? Then why as his outing a "misdeed?

In that light, I am calling for a full federal -- perhaps even Congressional -- investigation into both HRC (no, not Hillary Rodham Clinton, Human Rights Campaign) and ACORN, as well as demanding the immediate resignation of the top leaders of both groups. Either they knew about and the misdeeds of their underlings and covered for them, or they should have known and were inept and negligent in not knowing.

Explain why the Family Values Party thinks outing Foley was a "misdeed"?

The reason the Left preempt... (Below threshold)
sammy small:

The reason the Left preemptively accuses Diebold of cheating is that they are already immersed in scam tactics as their modus operandi. They assume others will be acting the same way. They probably get away with it enough to make it worthwhile. ACORN is just the latest example.

Because #2 Lee (Herman is #... (Below threshold)
Mitchell:

Because #2 Lee (Herman is #1), the information was not disclosed to protect "The Children," as you guys would say. It was held for months, despite the continuing "threat" from Foley, and its release was timed for political effect, not to protect The Chirren.

Sigh. You know, explaining things to #2 Lee is like talking to a child.

I see, the outing of Foley ... (Below threshold)
civilbehavior:

I see, the outing of Foley is a crime worse than the predation of said congressman towards minors. Repeatedly, and under the cloak of fellow republican cover.

Oh yes, I get it, The HRC actually was behind Mark Foley typing out explicit sexual innuendo for their fantasy fullfillment all the while claiming the need for concern about Missing and EXPLOITED children.

What you lackeys seem to constantly miss is the absolute and mindnumbing HYPOCRISY of the right. Do as I say not as I do synndrome.

And as for ACORN, of course a few kids getting paid $6.95 an hour are going to pad their accounts by throwing a few curveballs past the authorities. But never you mind the white collar criminal throwing BILLIONS down the drain, living in their Mcmansions claiming God's will be done while sitting in an office stolen from the people who legitimately voted but had their votes trashed will remain the republicans idol.

Foolish Americans........

Outing Foley was not his mi... (Below threshold)
D-Hoggs:

Outing Foley was not his misdeed lee, it was the misuse of HRC's resources as well as holding the information he had until such time that he wanted to reveal it, if he was so keen on outing a predator, why didn't he do it as soon as he got the info?! ACORN's misdeeds are obvious, though not to you I know. For someone who pats himself on the back for being so nuanced, you sure are thick lee. Once again, not one person has excused Foley's actions, this is about the conduct of those playing politics with said actions, which, once again, never included ACTUAL sex, unlike the democrats you continue to put back into power and never excoriate.

Jesus, civilbehavior and le... (Below threshold)
D-Hoggs:

Jesus, civilbehavior and lee are just so frigging dense. civilbehavior, "What you lackeys seem to constantly miss is the absolute and mindnumbing HYPOCRISY of the right. Do as I say not as I do synndrome." that is the funniest shit I've ever read in light of the dhimmicrats treatment of gerry studds, who ACTUALLY had sex!

and let's not forget Jay's ... (Below threshold)
Lee:

and let's not forget Jay's headline...

Let's give them a fair trial, then hang 'em

Nice try D-Hoggs, but we don't know how long he had the information and sat on it.

civilbehavior's post demons... (Below threshold)
Mitchell:

civilbehavior's post demonstrates the illogic of the Left. He makes an assumption that the discussion here compares HRC culpability to Foley's.

As no one has posted that Foley was not culpable, or slimey, his irrational, hysterical post is par for the course when talking with a Lib.

Needs a hysterectomy.

And the same for Pee. Eith... (Below threshold)
Mitchell:

And the same for Pee. Either a hysterectomy, or major meds for the psychotic episodes.

lee, by your own admission,... (Below threshold)
D-Hoggs:

lee, by your own admission, "we don't know how long he had the information and sat on it." So you agree, he had the information and he sat on the information. It doesn't matter how long he sat on it, he sat on it. Holy shit man, get a clue. Still spinning your wheels. Hey, that studds guy was a great man wasn't he.

What's foolish, civilbehavi... (Below threshold)
Gary:

What's foolish, civilbehavior, is that you seem to think anyone here or in the GOP is defending Foley, and that hypocracy is only on one side.

Explain why the Family V... (Below threshold)
VagaBond:

Explain why the Family Values Party thinks outing Foley was a "misdeed"?

He was outed on purpose and timed for the election. that was the misdeed. I lived in WPB. everyone knew foley was gay and didn't care. he did his job.

Gary, in their warped world... (Below threshold)
D-Hoggs:

Gary, in their warped world, we should have re-elected him to another 12 years instead of kicking his ass out.

Gary, in their warped world... (Below threshold)
D-Hoggs:

Gary, in their warped world, we should have re-elected him to another 12 years instead of kicking his ass out.

Lee, The democratipedophili... (Below threshold)
steak111111:

Lee, The democratipedophiliticass party of Studds (sorry, i couldn't put a capital "d" on that) has so corrupted America that it's common knowledge the dead and "imagined" voters that ACORN dreamed up are pedophiles too....

btw, do you have a job?
I mean a REAL one???

What Lee and some of his li... (Below threshold)

What Lee and some of his liberal brethren fail to grasp is no one is claiming that bringing Foley's actions to light was a bad thing. What bothers clear thinking folks is the fact that they pick and choose what to expose. The clowns who set up the fake blog about pedophilia would have no problem with a politician sending out those emails and IM's as long as the politician adhered to a liberal viewpoint. I haven't heard one conservative upset that Foley was bounced out of Congress. Many of us have a problem with someone holding this information for some length of time and then releasing it strategically for political advantage. If there was an ounce of concern for the pages the first person who became aware of the IM's (parents, politicians, whoever) would have immediately made a major issue of Foley's nuttiness.

The outing of Foley was a g... (Below threshold)
Scrapiron:

The outing of Foley was a good thing, the delay in the outing for political purposes and the outing through the media instead of the law says volumes about the sleeze in the democratic party. In effect, as the gay organizations pointed out, the democrats lumped the child molestors in with all gays. Another democratic double standard?

Another prime example that the crazies are running the democratic party is the 'racist' scream about the RNC ad supporting Corker agains Ford in Tn. I've watched the ad dozens of times and there is only one fact that stands out. If the ad is racist then every movie made with a 'black star' in the past 20 years is racist. In fact the only people that see the ad (black man-white woman) as racist are "the racist of the democratic party" and the 'me to' media.

"he did his job"I ... (Below threshold)
groucho:

"he did his job"

I don't think Foley's gayness is the issue here. So you would support everyone just looking the other way and ignoring this jerk's duplicitous immoral behavior because he did his job? Congratulations, you've just won a seat on the Republican re-election committee, the one soon to be vacated by Tom Reynolds. His gayness never needed to be outed. His behavior did. Whoever did it did the right thing. If you have a problem with the timing, shut up and quit your crying, a little hardball politics never hurt anybody, right?

Yeah. I'm not gonna hold my... (Below threshold)

Yeah. I'm not gonna hold my breath waiting for that to happen. If you were talking about Conservative groups, hell, they'd be under investigation right now. Not to mention the MSM playing it up for all it's worth.

No, these groups will remain beyond the reach of investigations of any depth. Pity, too.

The basic argument here, Ja... (Below threshold)
astigafa:

The basic argument here, Jay, is that the crime of knowing something and reporting it at an opportune moment is greater than the crime of actually doing something immoral or definitively criminal.

That's just stupid. You're number than a bag of hammers, the lot of you.

Here's a fun thing to do, Jay: if a given organization must be investigated because one of its staffer has done something objectionable, and if you possess the personal integrity to apply your moral standards to organization that are not liberal, go to Google and type in the following search: +republican +staffer +criminal. Then do the same for "conservative," "neoconservative" and other appropriate labels.

Then call for an investigation of all the organizations in which you find that a staffer has committed a crime or done something objectionable.

I'm sure you'll enjoy the excercise.

groucho, "So you would supp... (Below threshold)
D-Hoggs:

groucho, "So you would support everyone just looking the other way and ignoring this jerk's duplicitous immoral behavior because he did his job?"

Kind of how the democrats kept gerry studds around for another 12 years after ACTUALLY HAVING SEX huh? At least Foley was gotten rid of. The fucking hypocrisy is ASTOUNDING.

Another prime example th... (Below threshold)
astigafa:

Another prime example that the crazies are running the democratic party is the 'racist' scream about the RNC ad supporting Corker agains Ford in Tn. I've watched the ad dozens of times and there is only one fact that stands out. If the ad is racist then every movie made with a 'black star' in the past 20 years is racist. In fact the only people that see the ad (black man-white woman) as racist are "the racist of the democratic party" and the 'me to' media.

Right; the only objectionable thing about this ad is that there is a black person in it.

Good thinking, Scarpiron. You scintillate today. Can you feed yourself yet?

As for bad days...... (Below threshold)
nogo postal:

As for bad days...Check out the Race for Gov. in NV.

I am an Independent..a former Dem..then a former Rep...It is obvious the working man and womam are falling behind. The Dems have been whinning for over 5 years..I want them to sweep..then see what will happen..that is what elections are for..
If two years from now if medical insurance for my wife and I is more than our now too high $1,100 a month they failed.
If our son is still paying 6.8% or more on his loan(yes he still works 30 hours a week @ $8 an hour..his share of a 2bdm apt is $450)then they will have failed..
But I know that Rep. have burdened us with heavy costs on basics...they have failed

As for racist..if the Dems win at least 8 important committees will be chaired by blacks or Latinos...right now all 21 committees are chaired by whites..19 of them male..
Sorry but that simply does not reflect our society.

d-hoggs,Referencin... (Below threshold)
groucho:

d-hoggs,

Referencing 23 year old scandals is pointless and off topic. Try living in the present, it's healthier.

". . .if the dems win at... (Below threshold)
cmd:

". . .if the dems win at least 8 important committees will be chaired by blacks or Latinos. . .right now all 21 committees are chaired by whites. . .19 of them male. . sorry but that simply does not reflect our society."

What a pathetic piece of work you are, nogo. Ever stop to think those whites might be eminently qualified for their jobs? No, of course not. They're white, so they must be part of the VRWC. Kick the bastards to the curb and put in blacks or latinos so it "looks like America." Funny how you asshats never complained about the lack of blacks in cabinet-level positions when the Syphilitic Hillbilly was jerking off into the Oval Office sink.

Boy, that MLK with his judging by the content of the character rather than the color of the skin - he was just a goddamned Rethuglikkkan Uncle Tom, wasn't he, nogo?

groucho, thanks for helping... (Below threshold)
D-Hogs:

groucho, thanks for helping to showcase the utter hypocrisy of the left. It is totally pointless and off topic to reference how the democrats vote their pedophiles who ACTUALLY HAVE SEX back to office for 12 years while the Republicans kick theirs out on their ass immediately, how convenient for your agenda.

ACORN isn't all bad - ... (Below threshold)
rw:

ACORN isn't all bad -

ACORN screws-up, disenfranchises 1,100 voters

They were nice enough to send 1100 new voter registrations via UPS instead of USPS, causing all of the made up registrations to be ineligible due to a missing postmark.

Wow, that's pretty harsh. W... (Below threshold)
groucho:

Wow, that's pretty harsh. Why bring qualification into the issue? Are you assuming all the comittee heads are qualified because they're white? If the appointments follow the Bush administration guidelines, they are most likely poorly qualified and were handed the jobs because of who they knew.

A government that reflects our society? That's so retro...but it's so retro it just...might...work!

Jay Tea of Wizbang (yes, TH... (Below threshold)
hyuk hyuk:

Jay Tea of Wizbang (yes, THAT Jay Tea!) demanding a Congressional investigation is feckin' hilarious.

Hey Jay Tea--YOU don't get to demand anything. You are 100% uninfluential.

Notice how the koskids jump... (Below threshold)
Zelsdorf Ragshaft III:

Notice how the koskids jump to the defense of any democrat accused of anything. The only thing they do is muddy the waters. Groucho, Charlie Rangle is no qualified to clean toilets, sorry. John Conyers is an absolute danger to America. What committee would you put William Jefferson in charge of? Jay Tea's article was and is correct and nothing you idiots write can change that.

Apples and oranges.<p... (Below threshold)
groucho:

Apples and oranges.

Studds, an openly gay man, stood up and was publically censured by the House for an affair with a 17 year-old 10 years earlier. He then returned to his district where he faced any and all questions from his constituents and was easily re-elected to six more terms.

Foley, a closeted gay man, who was a figurehead in the missing and exploited children movement, resigned in disgrace after his multiple ongoing illicit contacts with pages were brought to light. He then, via a spokesman, cried about being an alcoholic and a victim of child molestation by a priest, then skulked away to a 30K per month "rehab" facility in Arizona after facing no one.

I don't condone either man's actions, but how they handled themselves speaks volumes.

Where's the hypocrisy again?

You are exactly right grouc... (Below threshold)
D-Hoggs:

You are exactly right groucho, how they handled themselves does indeed speak volumes. One man did the right thing and resigned whereas the other thumbed his nose at the country. What speaks larger volumes is how their respective parties handled themselves. You say you don't condone either man's actions, yet somehow you condone different punishments. Thats where the hypocrisy is. I guess you side with lee's methods of holding ALL politicians equally accountable.

I don't condone e... (Below threshold)
_Mike_:
I don't condone either man's actions, but how they handled themselves speaks volumes.

It certainly does. Foley sent inappropriate messages to a minor and was run out of town. Studds took a minor out of the country, got him drunk, had sex with him, and showed no shame for his actions.

THAT speak volumes..

Even worse_ Mike_ Are all t... (Below threshold)
914:

Even worse_ Mike_ Are all the libs that voted and supported this sexual predator pervert Studds for 12 more years.. There all sick'os to the max..

Like the Traitor Fraud... (Below threshold)
Rob LA Ca.:

Like the Traitor Fraud Kerry and Pardoned Criminal Psyco-B Rodham Clinton proudly admitted: "Over 85% of felons vote democrat".

THE DEMOCRAT PARTY "IS" THE PARTY OF CRIMINAL FRAUDS.


ABORT THE DEMOCRAT PARTY NOW!

I'd love to see an investig... (Below threshold)
Xennady:

I'd love to see an investigation into this specifically and other leftist vote fraud activity in general.However it's not going to happen.If congressional Republicans had the balls or the sense to go after these people they'd be in a lot better shape this year.Unfortunately they have neither.

Funny, but when I hear the ... (Below threshold)
groucho:

Funny, but when I hear the words "criminal fraud" the names that come to my mind are Cunningham, Ney, Delay, Abramoff, Reed, Hastert, Reynolds, I could go on...

Kind of sad that all you've got to defend the corrupt, clueless current leadership is dredging up decades old scandals and attempting to shoot the messenger. When the bright lights come on in November or early next year, we're really going to see the cockroaches scurrying for the dark corners where they've been hiding for the last 6 years.

It was held for months, ... (Below threshold)
Brian:

It was held for months, despite the continuing "threat" from Foley, and its release was timed for political effect, not to protect The Chirren.

Wow, it's amazing to see someone still parroting this canard, even after it's been repeatedly disproven and discredited, both in the blogosphere and in the media.

whats sad groucho is that y... (Below threshold)
D-Hoggs:

whats sad groucho is that your party excuses their garbage while the republicans take theirs out.

brian, whats amazing is tha... (Below threshold)
D-Hoggs:

brian, whats amazing is that you somehow know what this staffer knew and when he knew it when he was JUST IDENTIFIED! How could the fact that this information was held back be disproven and discredited when they just found out who released it in the first place?!

nogo postal: Are you drunk?... (Below threshold)
Xennady:

nogo postal: Are you drunk? Was that supposed to be your story or part of some campaign commercial? In any case I've got a big hint for that loser who can barely afford his share of the rent:Get a full time job! Shocking idea huh? But that's typical of Democrats-always looking for someone else to pay their bills.

I have to laugh at the comm... (Below threshold)
Michelle:

I have to laugh at the comments from the liberals here. The Democratic party claims to be open-minded, but if Lee, groucho, and company are representatives... it shows Democrats to be closed-minded, blind, and stupid. Scandal about the Democrats? Claim it's irrelevent, happened too long ago to matter, or simply totally refuse to acknowledge it. These are the people who claim to be tolerant, open-minded, and embracing all opinions, yet as soon as a dissenting voice speaks, they rush frantically to censor it (like the Columbia University liberal crowd who rushed the stage and shut down the minutemen and proudly crowed about showing everyone those with dissenting opinions weren't welcome there... and then claimed THEY were the victims.) Two sayings really stand out regarding your crowd: Do as I say, not as I do... and There are none so blind as those who refuse to see.

Yeah Brian its been disprov... (Below threshold)
Xennady:

Yeah Brian its been disproven just like the Swift Boat Vets were refuted-that is not at all.

Groucho, Studds was NOT "an... (Below threshold)

Groucho, Studds was NOT "an openly gay man" until his getting the 17-year-old page all liquored up and having his way with the boy was exposed. Then -- and only then -- did he bravely "come out."

Several other points have given me a notion for a followup piece; I ought to have it ready for tomorrow.

J.

This waiting on the electio... (Below threshold)
JOHN RYAN:

This waiting on the election is sooo dificult

Have you ever noticed that ... (Below threshold)
jhow66:

Have you ever noticed that when the name "groucho" comes to mine you think of DUMBASS?

Michelle the reason why the... (Below threshold)
Xennady:

Michelle the reason why the left behaves in such a way is that their only purpose and goal is to obtain political power.Claiming to be open minded and tolerant helps disguise their totalitarian nature,actually being open minded and tolerant would expose it.They fear and hate dissent like a vampire fears daylight-hence the never ending attempts to shut up those who oppose them by any means available.They ignore scandals and crimes in their own ranks because having ethical standards would interfere with obtaining power.For example they have no problem with Harry Reid and his real estate crimes but are still LIVID because ex-congressman Foley sent dirty IMs to a page.Another example is the endless vote fraud by groups such as ACORN.Democrats have no problem with that but as Jay Tea noted they continually froth at the mouth about Diebold.Any tactic is acceptable if it helps them "win" elections.In other countries the left killed millions to silence dissent-here they're reduced to stealing elections and rushing stages.While this is despicable I still think the US has been lucky especially when compared to the worst hit countries-look what the left did to Cambodia or Russia for example.I'm sure they'll keep trying here though.

George Soros is just like T... (Below threshold)
spurwing plover:

George Soros is just like Ted Turner their both always donating to certian leftists groups and if i remember ACORN was that group who invaded congressional HQ waving food trays i mean they even got certiian laws past then tried to sue so they were exempt from the very laws they got past what a bunch of nuts ACORN is NO PUN INTENDID

How could the fact that ... (Below threshold)
Brian:

How could the fact that this information was held back be disproven and discredited when they just found out who released it in the first place?!

When it was released and who released it are two different issues. We know when the information was released. Identifying the releaser doesn't change that.

Yeah Brian its been disp... (Below threshold)
Brian:

Yeah Brian its been disproven just like the Swift Boat Vets were refuted-that is not at all.

"Not at all" for those for whom exposure of their lies leaves them with nothing left to say. But "quite soundly" for rational people.

"Quite soundly for rational... (Below threshold)
nikkolai:

"Quite soundly for rational people." Like the 70 million that voted for Bush?

Jay,Studds' gaynes... (Below threshold)
groucho:

Jay,

Studds' gayness became a more public issue after his behavior came to light, but apparently surprised very few, I think La Cage au Foley was a little more in the closet. No matter, it's just another lame attempt at gotcha by the reeling right.

My day is complete! I've been noticed by jslow66!

Good afternoon Brian.The on... (Below threshold)
Xennady:

Good afternoon Brian.The only evidence you have that the Swift Boat Vets were refuted is your own baseless assertion.Keep saying it though-one day you might actually come to believe it.And I have much much more I could say about this and every other subject too.But we've been over this before haven't we?

Hi Groucho I've noticed you... (Below threshold)
Xennady:

Hi Groucho I've noticed you too! Now your day is even better! So Foley was in the closet you say.I take it that you mean his private life was in fact private.So then please explain how the house GOP leadership could have been involved in a cover up? I mean, he was in the closet right? And wasn't that the whole reason why anyone outside his district should care about Foley-because the GOP leadership was covering something up? Good work Groucho-now my day is complete.You just admitted that the entire Democratic line on Foley is nothing more than a sham designed to fool people.But we all knew that already didn't we?

grouchy,You were n... (Below threshold)
Sheik Yur Bouty:

grouchy,

You were noticed the way a cockroach gets noticed scurrying across the floor when you turn on the light in a dark room.

If you actually listen to people FROM FOLEY'S DISTRICT, his gayness was well known.

IOW, why cover up something... (Below threshold)
Sheik Yur Bouty:

IOW, why cover up something (Foley's gayness) that's common knowledge?

Brian, identifying the rele... (Below threshold)
D-Hoggs:

Brian, identifying the releaser has EVERYTHING to do with it, because there is NO POSSIBLE WAY that you could EVER now how long that person was holding on to the information! The only thing you know, as you admitted, is when the information was released, there is no way you could know how long it has been known given the "knower" was just identified. Good god man.

I see three separate issues... (Below threshold)
groucho:

I see three separate issues:

-Foley's sexual preference. None of my, nor any of your, business.

-his well documented long history of behavior most certainly immoral and inappropriate for his office; no longer a congressman, that's a good thing.

-the pretty clear evidence that this behavior which virtually everyone, regardless of party, would agree IS unacceptable for a congressman was tolerated and ignored by those in leadership for purely political reasons. THAT"S my issue. Not a very shining moment for the "values" party. And guess what?...most non-sheeple can see it for exactly what it is.

Sheik...that was my line! Get your own material..

The only evidence you ha... (Below threshold)
Brian:

The only evidence you have that the Swift Boat Vets were refuted is your own baseless assertion.

And the pages I linked to, which you naturally dismiss. BTW, your evidence that Dems had the Foley info for a long time and sat on it is more than baseless assertions?

But we've been over this before haven't we?

Indeed we have.

Like the 70 million that... (Below threshold)
Brian:

Like the 70 million that voted for Bush?

I've said before that Kerry did a poor job of exposing the lies. But it's been some time since then, and exposed they have been.

To the 70 million that voted for Bush, and to the majority of Americans who favor impeaching him.

Brian, identifying the r... (Below threshold)
Brian:

Brian, identifying the releaser has EVERYTHING to do with it, because there is NO POSSIBLE WAY that you could EVER now how long that person was holding on to the information!

Your point that I was addressing was that the info was held until released at a politically motivated moment, for political purposes. We know, though, that the info was obtained in July, and promptly turned over to the FBI. I have yet to see a demonstration of political timing based on those events.

The only thing you know, as you admitted, is when the information was released, there is no way you could know how long it has been known given the "knower" was just identified.

Whatever it is, it's not nearly as long as these knowers.

Brian: On the Swift Boat ma... (Below threshold)
Xennady:

Brian: On the Swift Boat matter you linked to one page.It was some guy commenting on a Susan Estrich column! I'm still amazed you would do something so unbelievably amazingly pathetic.And the guy commenting didn't even like the column! Couldn't you just link to the original column for God's sake? So no I remain unconvinced that the Swift Boat Vets have been refuted.On the Foley matter I told you where to find numerous stories-gatewaypundit-documenting the statements I have made about Foley et al.You yourself have commented tonight on another thread here about a staffer being fired for actions regarding the Foley case.Now why would anyone get fired if Republicans were only making baseless assertions? So yes indeed we have been over this-and you still can't come up with anything to back up your assertions!

Groucho-you said earlier Fo... (Below threshold)
Xennady:

Groucho-you said earlier Foley was in the closet.So which is it? Was he in the closet and thus unknown to be gay,or did have a long history of inappropriate behavior? And inappropriate by what standards? I can see why Republicans would want Foley to resign-but I can't see why Democrats would even notice.Barney Franks lover was running a gay whorehouse in Frank's apartment-wasn't that inappropriate? You dismiss the case of Gerry Studds because it happened "decades ago".So if we waited 10 years would Foley's conduct be OK too? So what reasons do Democrats tolerate Jay Mollahan? Not because they'll lose that seat if he goes is it? How about real estate magnate Harry Reid? What about his conduct? Do you want him to resign too? Heads the Democrats win,tails the GOP loses.Foley must go because the GOP has standards-i.e. we're the "values" party-but Harry Reid,Barney Frank,Jay Mollohan,Gerry Studds,etc can stay because Democrats have no standards-i.e. they are the "no values" party.That's MY issue Groucho,and that's why I think you folks are nothing but a swarm of slimy hypocrites

You yourself have commen... (Below threshold)
Brian:

You yourself have commented tonight on another thread here about a staffer being fired for actions regarding the Foley case.Now why would anyone get fired if Republicans were only making baseless assertions?

You are back to your basic tactic of making up things that no one ever said so you can respond to them, or conflating two separate events.

A staffer being fired for misusing a web site has no relationship to the argument that someone knew of and withheld sordid facts for an unknown length of time (except as admitted by Republicans).

So what did I make up Brian... (Below threshold)
Xennady:

So what did I make up Brian? What? I put no words in your mouth.I just noted that you had made a comment on another thread about an HRC staffer being fired.So you deny making a comment? Your complaint doesn't make any sense.I find your desription of the reason for this staffer losing his job-"misusing a website"-bizarre and misleading.Go read the article posted at gaypatriot-I know you won't like my desription of it.I note that it ties into the stories at gatewaypundit about Foleygate when the scandal first broke-which I'm sure you read with interest since the Foley story is so important to you and your party.

I just noted that you ha... (Below threshold)
Brian:

I just noted that you had made a comment on another thread about an HRC staffer being fired.So you deny making a comment?

Not at all. I observed that he was fired for inappropriately using the web site. But then you said:

Now why would anyone get fired if Republicans were only making baseless assertions?

Those "baseless assertions" are a reference to when I said you baselessly claim that "Dems had the Foley info for a long time and sat on it".

So you are in effect saying, "Now why would anyone get fired [for posting to the web site] if Republicans were only making baseless assertions [that Dems had the Foley info for a long time and sat on it]?"

And the answer is... huh??? One thing has nothing to do with the other. It's like saying, "why would Foley resign if the Republicans were only making baseless assertions that the Dems knew all about it?"

So what did I make up Brian? What?

That.

Brian you still aren't maki... (Below threshold)
Xennady:

Brian you still aren't making any sense.You know,one of the many amazing things about leftists is just how credulous they become when one of their own gets caught doing something unethical or criminal.For example Harry Reid's real estate dealings.He "forgot" to file the proper forms.Oh okay.Case closed! No need to ask anymore questions! Now you make yet another baseless assertion-that the reason the staffer was fired has nothing to do with the Democrats sitting on info about Foley.How do you know that Nostrodamus? Because the HRC says so? Do you really expect anyone to come out and say it was a pre-planned political hit job? Do you think they won't try stop questions by firing the point man-at least until the election is over? Now obviously you believe everything leftists say no matter how stupid but I don't.You can be as credulous as you obviously are but I'm not.And I'm still waiting to hear how the Swift Boat Vets were refuted.No doubt you baslessly think they were just because Kerry asserted it so I won't hold my breath.

Is this the twilight zon... (Below threshold)
Rod Sterling (ghost written by James Cloninger):

Is this the twilight zone or did I miss something?

Witness, if you will, a dissolutioned young liberal. He lives in a world or apathy and sorrow. His sense of reality is epherimal, at best--and crushed at worst. He seeks to find some justification in his life and he stumbles into a conservative blog...or so he thinks. But he discovers, to his horror that he has entered...


THE TWI-RIGHT ZONE.

My day was quite bitter and... (Below threshold)
epador:

My day was quite bitter and sad
And to Wizbangblog fuming and mad
I did lurk and then surf
Til I saw JC's Mirth
Oh your pun is quite right and I'm glad!

For example Harry Reid's... (Below threshold)
Brian:

For example Harry Reid's real estate dealings.

Oh my, you go right to changing the subject when you are caught in a lie, don't you? Let's go back to the actual topic at hand, shall we?

Now you make yet another baseless assertion-that the reason the staffer was fired has nothing to do with the Democrats sitting on info about Foley.

Oh yes, quite "baseless". I have nothing to "base" it on. It is "based" on nothingness. There is no "base" here:

A spokesman for the group, the Human Rights Campaign, said it first learned of its employee's role this week and immediately fired him for misusing the group's resources.

Now, you can say he's lying, and you can say the NYT is In Osama's pocket, and you can say Hilary Clinton knew about Foley 10 years ago and has been blackmailing him for cocaine money all this time. But before you don your tinfoil hat and go spouting off your conspiracy delusions in a public forum, all the while deriding factually supported arguments as "baseless", you ought to be prepared to back them up with some "base" of your own. Otherwise you're just sputtering hallucinogenic nonsense. Which you're quite good at, by the way.

brian you are seriously del... (Below threshold)
D-Hoggs:

brian you are seriously delusional. First you try to argue that we know when the information was obtained, July you say, let me point out that that is 3-4 months before it was released, which is exactly what everyone has been saying, it was held back and politically timed!! Further, you say:

"A staffer being fired for misusing a web site has no relationship to the argument that someone knew of and withheld sordid facts for an unknown length of time"

This just makes zero sense. How is it possible for a staffer to create a website devoted to outing Foley while at the same time having no knowledge of any sordid facts?! This is such a ludicrous statement! The staffer being fired has EVERYTHING to do with someone having knowledge of sordid facts! HE HAD THE SORDID FACTS, how long did he have them and sit on them? If he didn't have sordid facts then just what exactly was his website about that he got fired for?! It just blows my mind that you can't comprehend this, though it really shouldn't surprise me. I must add one more thing. I said:

"The only thing you know, as you admitted, is when the information was released, there is no way you could know how long it has been KNOWN given the "knower" was just identified."

You said:

"Whatever it is, it's not nearly as long as these knowers (link)."

So by saying that it wasn't known for nearly as long as the info from your link was known, you conceded that it was indeed known for a time. You contradict yourself at every turn, truly pathetic.

July you say, let me poi... (Below threshold)
Brian:

July you say, let me point out that that is 3-4 months before it was released, which is exactly what everyone has been saying, it was held back and politically timed!!

Known in July, and released in July. Not held back, not politically timed. This is an incontrovertable fact.

How is it possible for a staffer to create a website devoted to outing Foley while at the same time having no knowledge of any sordid facts?! This is such a ludicrous statement!

Yes it is, and I didn't make that statement. Clearly someone who made the site had the facts at the time that he made the site. What's ludicrous, pathetic, makes zero sense, and the other adjectives you throw around is making the baseless leap that he must have known this information for a long time and held it back. For all you know, he found out about it that morning, and was so disgusted that he put it up on the site. Do we know for sure? Not really. But then I'm not the one making up conspiracy theories based on what we do know.

brian you've got to be fuck... (Below threshold)
D-Hoggs:

brian you've got to be fucking kidding me, you can NOT be this dense?! If all of this information that you say was obtained in july, was released in july, then why did we not here about the im's until a month ago?! Because you say its incontrovertible does not make it so.

You say "Clearly someone who made the site had the facts at the time that he made the site", it is not just someone, it is the guy who got fired who made the site, and he had the information to make the site, and if you think he got the information that morning and decided to throw up a website instead of reporting it to authorites, than you are denser than I knew. Not to mention, he obviously had the information, and DID NOT give it to authorities, he made a website instead. You are truly delusional, no surprise from such a blinded by hate liberal. You say, "Do we know for sure? Not really" yet you consistantly say that your arguments are incotrovertible!! Amazing!!

If all of this informati... (Below threshold)
Brian:

If all of this information that you say was obtained in july, was released in july, then why did we not here about the im's until a month ago?!

Again conflating two separate things. Because in July it was released to the FBI, the responsible thing to do. What sparked ABC to run the story the day they did? I don't know. But I do know that accusations that "the left" sat on this without telling anyone are blatantly false.

You can keep getting yourself into a lather over "maybe this" or "conspiracy that". And when you can cite new facts to contradict the ones that are out there, I'll believe you. But until then, you're just shaking your tinfoil hat loose.

I think the problem here br... (Below threshold)
D-Hoggs:

I think the problem here brian is that you simply don't understand any of this and are just parroting your liberal talking points. The e-mails were released in july to the FBI, who didn't think they were particularly interesting, the im's came out last month. What sparked ABC to run the story the day they did? You have got to be kidding me! They ran it the day they did because they had a scoop on the im's, what a coincidence it just happened to be in october! For you to say that the accusation that the left sat on these im's before giving them to ABC is blatantly false is ridiculous, you have ZERO proof that they didn't sit on them, just as I have zero proof that they did. But, the FACT that the media received the im's (and not the FBI), the fact that the guy who was fired was creating a website to out foley with the im's and other information, meaning he had all of this information previous, unlike what you think, that he just all of a sudden threw a web page together after getting the info that morning, and the fact that this is a major fucking election ALL point towards the dems sitting on it. Both sides here are doing all kinds of ridiculous shit this election cycle brian, for you to think that this wasn't politically timed is just completely naive and idiotic. And no matter how many times you say your arguments are incontrovertible, you have ZERO evidence, just as you have ZERO evidence to say that accusations against the left are blatantly false. How can you say that? Do you know? Were you there? Do you just not believe that the dems would ever do something like that? How do you know brian? How do you KNOW that those accusations are blatantly false, give me some evidence brian.




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