Might as well give everyone a home theatre setup to.

The perfect Dem state. Give away everything and expect the schmucks that actually work to pay for it....Since the 'takers' votes outnumber the 'payers'.

Like in Illinois.. Governor Blowdryovich is going to tax the gross receipts of businesses to pay for his giveaways. Businesses that can't even break even will pay through the nose for the 'privledge' of doing business in the state. That's triple taxation. The company pays for its receipts..gets taxed...They make a profit...get taxed on that...Then the stockholder gets socked with a tax on any dividends.

Wait for the 'Carbon Tax'. Of course when the Gorebots have finally been shown to be mind-numbed idiots, the tax will still be in place because the funds for 'global warming' will have been diverted to legislators' pet projects and payoffs to special interest groups.

What's wrong with giving kids Ipods? I know when I went to school, if someone had given me an Ipod I would have filled it with audio versions of my text books that I could listen to during every waking minute of the day. All of the kids I know would be doing the same thing. No kid would be lame enough to put MUSIC on an Ipod. Jeez!

Blagojevich (could you people be any more childish with the names?) is having a very hard time getting support for his tax plan. A plan, by the way, which will pay for education, not "giveaways." No idiotic mp3 giveaways or such have been proposed here in Illinois.

Oh Kim, Democrats are stupid in Washington state, too. Why just last week beloved Democrat and Seattle Mayor Greg Nickels complained there was a shortage of affordable housing for the poor in Seattle.

And what happens this week?

He proposes to spend $240 million to increase and fix bike lanes in the city of Seattle, claiming it would, Nickels hopes, increase bike commuter traffic from 6,000 riders daily to more than 8,000 daily. Imagine, 2000 people off the roads! Our traffic woes relieved! Of course, cyclists weaving in and out of the homeless people laying in the bike lanes because they can't find affordable housing could be an issue, but so what? We've got new bike lanes!

http://archives.seattletimes.nwsource.com/cgi-bin/texis.cgi/web/vortex/display?slug=bikeplan05m0&date=20070405&query=bike+lanes

Just in Michigan???

I suspect the nice people at Apple have been filling the politcos heads with visions of school kids downloading lectures and the like. Similar plans were made in the 90's when Apple envisioned very school kids with their own MAC.

iPods can be a valuable add-on for college students who are disciplined enough to download and actually use audio and video learning materials, but this application does seem a bit over the top (as is Kim's headline).

Welcome to my State!!!

MI? don't forget the crazy people in MN...this comes from a Minneapolis Fox station..it may or not be true..

Exclusive: Shake Up at the U.S. Attorney's Office
Last Edited: Thursday, 05 Apr 2007, 9:11 PM CDT
Created: Thursday, 05 Apr 2007, 9:11 PM CDT
MN U.S. Attorney Rachel Paulose
MINNEAPOLIS -- It's a major shakeup at the offices of new U.S. Attorney Rachel Paulose.

Four of her top staff voluntarily demoted themselves Thursday, fed up with Paulose, who, after just months on the job, has earned a reputation for quoting Bible verses and dressing down underlings.

Deputy U.S. Attorney John Marty is just one of the people dropping themselves in rank to simply a U.S. Attorney position. Also making the move are the heads of Paulose's criminal and civil divisions and the top administrative officer.

The move is intended to send a message to Washington - that 33-year-old Paulose is in over her head.

Paulose was appointed before the 8 U.S. Attorneys were given their pink slips, but she has deep connections to the scandal.

She was a special assistant to Attorney General Alberto Gonzales, worked as a senior counsel for deputy attorney general Paul McNulty and is best buds with Monica Goodling - the assistant U.S. Attorney who recently took the Fifth rather than testify before Congress.

Add to the suspicions the fact that Minnesota's former U.S. Attorney Tom Heffelfinger stepped down just as the White House was developing its hit list.

Heffelfinger responds to questions whether he was forced out by saying, "emphatically no." But there's been a lot of speculation that Heffelfinger, a moderate Republican, may have been able to read the writing on the wall.

And indeed, some of the early White House memos indicate three people on the hit list resigned before they could be fired.

Paulose was not available for comment on the shake-up."

Hey...Kim..your references are sometime valid sometimes not...but c'mon...you are seldom critical of the weird shit that comes from Republicans...I respect your support for your Party...however..c'mon...just as the spectrum of Dem's don't necessarily reflect my views...
I am sure..you don't for a second not see behind..Mitt's pandering...
I have no problem with you pointing out Dem Pandering...can you do the same for your Party?

Democrats here are exporting the Detroit downward spiral to the entire State. Start with a declining population and tax base, raise taxes to compensate causing more to leave, go out of business etc., raise taxes again...

After the 400% rise of tax on smokes (way higher than nearby States) we actually got Hizbollah here importing truckloads of smokes and sending millions back to the ME to help kill our troops.

When you create the conditions for a black market, you will get...a black market!

Here in Michigan we say that the lucky ones were the first couple of hundred thousand who left while they could still sell their houses.

Just image what will happen when the next Democratic president like Edwards or Obama get the entire U.S. economy into a death spiral. They will be forced to raise taxes to pay for healthcare, college for all, trust funds, etcs for the growing number of illegal immigrants. Of course, the free programs will cause an increase in the number of immigrants while causing many people to enter the black market instead of pay sky high taxes.

Thus, when the government revenue goes down, they will just raise taxes again. Look at how California is entering into the same budget cycle. Increase benefits for the poor and for immigrants while driving the middle class out of the state.

Lee, it's "Mac", not "MAC". Common error but understandable.

I don't defend this abuse of taxpayer funds at all but I do believe that Macs should be the computer of choice in schools if they are going to install them in the Media Center.

Kids need to have access to computers and a computer lab that is easy to use, has no viruses, can be managed by a non-IT person, and is relatively inexpensive (comparable HP or Dell machines actually cost more than the Apple product), is a good investment. What is lunacy is what most schools do wherein they purchase a slew of Windows PCs that last only a couple of years and take numerous (depending on the number of machines purchased) IT techs to manage them. Each of these techs can cost as much as $75K a year in salary, all of which is paid for by the taxpayer.

A colossal waste of money.

Can't read.

Can't write.

Can't spell.

Can't make change for a buck.

I know, let's give 'em an i-pod!

Its true Nogo! Mn is full of kooks and tax hikers.

As well as the smoke free nazi's that have put over a hundred bars out of business and are even trying to ban smoking in Your car or house!

I haven't checked the facts behind this editorial, so I won't comment on the ipod allegations which may or may not be accurate. But even if these claims are true...

Michigan budget deficit: $1 billion
Cost to Michigan of Iraq War: $11 billion

http://costofwar.com/index.html

Compared with that, ipods seem quite cheap. And so far I haven't heard of anyone being killed by an MP3.

Do these come with the Communists Manifesto audio book already loaded ?

Seriously though..
Government has no wealth and therefore cannot give to one citizen without taking from another. Consider who the government is depriving of what in order to fund this.

How to spot an unhinged moron:

Look for the person that interjects Iraq or Bush into every discussion.

I gotta ask..what part of your life do you feel so angry about...that you use "superdestroyer"?,,,

As for this subject...
The link is to an editorial..can anyone provide a link...to ah...FACTS?
What is this opinion based on?...probably something...can someone link?

This may well be like Keith Richards doing his April Fools Day joke about snorting his father's ashes...that was picked up and spread as fact...

Sorry for the off topic, but this is of interest to many of us:
CNN is reporting that Monica Goodling, top aide to Attorney General Alberto Gonzales, will resign.

If Monica resigns, will they still give out the i-pods?

Will Democrats still remain stupid?

For those playing along at home...

cat interjects Iraq.
Barney interjects Bush.

so we've got the requisite two here already.

And so far I haven't heard of anyone being killed by an MP3.

Now you have.

And I'm fairly certain that state budgets and federal budgets are on completely separate ledgers. Your comparison seems rather shakey in that regard.

And so far I haven't heard of anyone being killed by an MP3.

Sorry, couldn't resist.

"Compared with that, ipods seem quite cheap. And so far I haven't heard of anyone being killed by an MP3. "

Does cat even know how imbecilic this statement is? How about if we just give every student an iMac, and iPod, a home theatre system, a 42" plasma for their bedroom, a closet full of new clothes, a Wii or Playstation (their choice), Starbucks gift cards, and a second iPod in case their first one gets filled up with the free music the state will also buy for them?

Why not? I haven't heard of anyone being killed by an iPod, iMac, home theatre, plasma screen, clothing, Playstation, or Starbucks Coffee! I guess the basis upon which we now give away taxpayer funded goodies is if they haven't killed anyone!?!!?

Sheesh.

Sounds like another case of the blue state blues.

You guys are being a bit unfair on the iPod. Remember, iPods don't kill, people do. :-)

For those playing along at home...

cat interjects Iraq.
Barney interjects Bush.

so we've got the requisite two here already.

Quite right. All we're missing is the 9-11 connection....

I suspect the nice people at Apple have been filling the politcos heads....

Oh sure, like old Billy Gates has been quiet as a church mouse with the release of Microsoft's Zune MP3 player. Gates has more computers in more schools, K-12, than God. (In fact, even God can't figure out Vista at the moment.)

Somehow implying that Steve Jobs' Apple Co. is some sort of lumbering corporate monster rolling over the social lanscape of the Western world seems to be a bit of a stretch. Come on, don't you remember the "1984" commercial?

;-)

Welcome to MI.

I guess thats what we get for continually voting these idiots in when we have budgetary issues that democrats create in the first place... They always act like they are trying to fix our money issues by cutting extra curricular school programs, police and other types of essential public services and then send this kind of spending crap right up the pike. Just a shining example of your democrat party.

Remember the crap they were all saying about the deficit a year or two back? Then they send this HUGE spending bill right up the pike, also loaded with tons of taxes which will stifle every corner of the economy

Yo Peter F - glad to see you haven't lost your edge...

Apple's education division has been actively pushing Apple products for classroom use for decades. I don't know if MS has a similar initiative (although I suspect they do, and also suspect it is only marginally effective by comparison).

I didn't mean to imply that Apple is some lumbering corporate whatever -- just passing on info that they have a history of aggressively pushing their products in the K-12 area.

The IPod's may be a joke but look at the rising tax rates in States ran by democrats. Va went from a 'real' surplus to borrowing Billions in just a few months, and that after every tax and fee in the state has been raised over and over by two dhimmi governors. I don't see any improved services so evidently the governor has a lot of brother in laws, or owes billions to those that bought the office for him, and believe me we have the most idiot governor piles of money can buy.

Peter F. Thanks for the link. I am now reconsidering my earlier belief in the relatively benign nature of iPods. However, the article does say that the teenager was killed in a fight *over* an iPod. The iPod itself does not appear to have been the murder weapon.

In a separate case, Sputnik's link certainly suggests otherwise, though Macworld says this: http://www.macworld.co.uk/news/index.cfm?newsid=8138
But then they would say that, wouldn't they?

So, the non-lethality of iPods is under debate. But do I really have to point out to beeblebrox that my throw-away sentence was a joke. I'm not actually suggesting that I think the state should give every child a free iPod.

Until I hear otherwise (and a big otherwise may well emerge) my provisional assumption is that the alleged Michigan Democrat call of "iPods for All" is a classic case of lobby-induced corruption. Rather like this:

http://www.crooksandliars.com/2007/04/02/under-the-influence-how-lobbyists-wrote-and-bought-the-rx-drug-bill/

Mike, in one of the comments to an earlier post, I thought you were agreeing with Jay Tea that respect was important. Your words "unhinged moron" suggest you were actually agreeing with his gorilla analogy.

Why did I mention the $11 billion? Well, a surplus of $10 billion might have come in handy. Does it really matter to you if you pay that $10 billion in federal or state taxes? An iPod's an iPod, whichever shop you buy it in. And $10 billion is $10 billion, whoever you pay it too.

Lee,

Oh, I totally agree and know that Apple has been wedging its way into schools for decades now. Just was pointing out that MS is pretty active in that area, too--especially here in the Puget Sound, Billy Boy's base. (BTW: He puts on a helluva 4th of July fireworks display...from his house.)

Here's where the societal rub is though: Is it good or bad or just real grey when it comes to corporations helping supply school districts? Or is it just a corporate marketing program to brand their product to a potential future buyer disguised as good corporate will? It's hard to say, really; it all depends on what the corporation is supplying.

I was going to provide some examples of what some corporations supply and whether they're good, bad or in a semi-grey area, but I know you don't like long posts. ;-)

Relax, I kid on that last paragraph. ;-)

Cat, if it was a joke, I apologize. Use the *wink* next time!

How about if we just give every student an iMac, and iPod, a home theatre system, a 42" plasma for their bedroom, a closet full of new clothes, a Wii or Playstation (their choice), Starbucks gift cards, and a second iPod in case their first one gets filled up with the free music the state will also buy for them?

You planning on running for office anytime soon, Beetlebrox ?

You got my vote.

Yes, I'm running on the "an iPhone in every pocket" platform. Give me $699 and your vote and if elected, I promise you will get what is coming to you. ;-)

Peter F: "Is it good or bad or just real grey when it comes to corporations helping supply school districts? Or is it just a corporate marketing program to brand their product to a potential future buyer disguised as good corporate will?"

Oh I think Apple is helping themsleves first - and always. They may be a better-than-most copporate citizen, but Jobs' first allegiance is to his stockholders - as it should be, but if I recall correctly Wozniak has always been a big supporter of education, so there's that lineage behind their motives...

- but I'm sure "education" is just another "market" for Apple - pretty much like any other market. They do offer educational discounts that include students - so if you're shopping for an Apple even a few units at your local Community College may qualify you for a pretty decent discount - hardware and software.

I forget that you are in Seattle, Peter. Nice town.

but I'm sure "education" is just another "market" for Apple - pretty much like any other market.

Oh, no doubt! As a society we have to ask do the benefits (i.e. better educated and computer literate children) outweigh the costs of likely being viewed as little more than target market. (I'm not stating that last clause very clearly, but I imagine you see my point.)

Nike and adidas supply many, many schools with uniforms in exchange for market exposure (their logos on jerseys, etc.) and to build and keep brand awareness. That's good because it helps schools defer the costs of expensive uniforms, jerseys, etc. But it gives Nike and adidas too much sway and influence over young, impressionable athletes who, when approached with lucrative endorsement deals (think LeBron James), skip college. I think that's wrong. But those companies keep high school sports alive in many districts, so it's a real sticky wicket.

But Coke and Pepsi machines and fast food chains that have taken root in our schools, well, those products have zero redeeming benefits to students.

I forget that you are in Seattle, Peter. Nice town.

Particularly today! It's 75 beautiful degrees! After the winter we've had, I'm outta here! Have a good one.

What is Bush doing about the enormous deficits that he has produced. This does not even include the cost of the illegal and immoral iraq war.

Yes morons who read this page the Bush deficits DO NOT even include the horror in the desert.

Maybe he'll give our troops MP3 players and oustanding medical care that is avaialble at Walter Reed. Well, 1 out of 2 ain't bad for a complete abject failure first as a businessman and then as president of the united states.

Look in the mirror right wing morons.

Please ignore the above troll-boy. Evidently too many days alone in the parent's basement. Kind of pathetic really.

Marty can put two movies in his iPod, but not two thoughts in his head.
=============================

cat:
Mike, in one of the comments to an earlier post, I thought you were agreeing with Jay Tea that respect was important. Your words "unhinged moron" suggest you were actually agreeing with his gorilla analogy.

Actually, my post in that thread simply addressed the worthlessness of the U.N. and questioning your thoughtless assertion that Iraq was a 'source' of terrorism due to U.S. Anything other was a baseless inference on your part.

Further, respect is something that is earned. When you come into a thread and interject the same unrelated drivel is that what you would call respectful of the post's author ? The discussion here had nothing to do with what you interjected. Yet, apparently, due to some mental malady you're unable to discuss anything outside of the two topics I mentioned previously.

Can I just have a Corvette?

What's the big deal that Apple aggresssively humps its product?

Why wouldn't they?

It's superior in every aspect that would be important to a large-scale publicly funded system (as bellblebrox so eloquently stated).

They'd be idiots if they didn't. In fact, being an Apple stockholder, I'd sue them for stupidity.

What I find totally amazing is how ridiculously successful Microsoft is considering what an atrocious product they sell.

Hey...Kim..your references are sometime valid sometimes not...but c'mon...you are seldom critical of the weird shit that comes from Republicans

If you feel strongly that the weird shit that comes from Republicans ought to be covered, why not start your own blog and cover it yourself?

Just a thought.

And since fairness and balance seems to be a concern of yours, have you posted comments on DailyKos and DU complaining about their lack of coverage of the weird shit that comes from liberals?

What I find totally amazing is how ridiculously successful Microsoft is considering what an atrocious product they sell.

In my opinions, Apple made some bad decisions in their first Macs. I remember seeing one of the first ones in 83 or 84, around that time. Yeah, the graphical interface that Apple lifted from Xerox was pretty slick, but the machine itself, and especially the keyboard, had this cheap, plastic, PlaySkool feel to it, so when you used it, it felt like a toy rather than a serious tool that you could use to get actual work done.

You could design the best damn computer in the world, but if you package it with a crappy keyboard, nobody will want to use it.

Meanwhile, IBM made the decision, quite out of step with they way they did business in the past, to make it easy for third parties to license their architecture and peripherals. This led to the explosion of PC clones in the 80s and 90s. Apple didn't do this, they kept a tight rein on things so that if you wanted to buy a printer for your Apple, you had to buy an Apple printer, and I believe it cost them dearly.

The pioneer spreadsheet program Lotus 123 was developed for the PC platform and it, along with the Microsoft Word and WordPerfect word processors, enabled the PC to achieve dominance in the business market, which I think is the most important market there is. So this is where Microsoft chose to concentrate its development, and they have profited greatly thereby.

Apple puts out some good computers now; my son recently bought himself a MacBook, and it's pretty impressive, but Apple is just too far behind to catch up, unless Microsoft blows it big time (*cough*Vista*cough*).

The current hysteria is a symptom of displacement, a psychological mechanism that allows one to ignore real threats like Islamic terrorism, in order to focus on imaginary phantasms like Anthropogenic Global Warming and an IPod in every schoolbag. Part of the left's denial of reality, a symptom of a larger mass psychosis infecting much of the American electorate.

Oregon,

Not to disagree with a fellow traveller but some context might be in order here. First of all, the original Mac is what, for all intents and purposes, took Apple to the next level after its success with the Apple ][.

It had the most sophisticated graphical interface which, BTW was NOT "lifted" from Xerox, this is an urban legend. Things we associate with a modern graphical interface (dragging, double-clicking of icons, pull-down menus, a menubar at the top, trash can, use of a mouse, etc.) were all developed at Apple which the never released, $40,000 Xerox Alto "personal computer" did not have. Visit The Apple Museum for a complete history.

Other errors in your post:

1. Word, Excel, and many other revolutionary apps (such as Pagemaker which launched the desktop publishing revolution) were first developed for the Mac. In fact, while Apple did not copy the GUI from Xerox (only the concept of bitmapped graphics - everything else had to be written from scratch with no benefit of access to Xerox code), Microsoft had an "in" at Apple because they were the developer of Word and Excel for the Mac. They HAD access to the Mac OS code, the user interface guidelines, the whole ball of wax. This is why Windows looks like the Mac OS. The fact that John Scully, then CEO of Apple, allowed Bill Gates access to the Mac OS was probably the single biggest mistake in the history of computing (not the relatively minor issue of keyboard design which really stopped no one from using the Mac especially since it was the first computer to use a mouse). Apple wanted Microsoft to continue developing for the Mac and didn't realize just how big of a plagiarizer Bill Gates was.

2. Microsoft was successful in the business market, not because that is the "most important market there is" (which is arguable on its face) but because that is where IBM chose to market its hardware. Apple was interested in the consumer and education space where a GUI was essential. IBM was already well intrenched in the business world with its MS-DOS based, NON-graphical computers. Microsoft built their empire on putting an Apple-like GUI onto MS-DOS so that it could use the hardware already in place.

3. Licensing of the technology by IBM helped Microsoft but ultimately killed IBM. A little quiz here... of IBM or Apple, which one still makes computers? What you tout as a good move by IBM and a bad move by Apple (tightly controlled OS and architecture) is why IBM is gone from the PC world and Apple now owns the top spot in the digital home entertainment world. Were it not for the manner in which Apple controlled the hardware, OS, and application paradigm, there would be no iTunes store, no iPod, no AppleTV, no DRM-free future, no virus free OS X, and no "it just works" marketing opportunities. Apple would be gone today just like Compaq. The PC box makers sell a commodity and thus, they come and go. Apple is a developer and as such, is probably the light on the hill of the computing world and as long as they keep at it, they will continue to be one of the most profitable and well known companies in the world.

IMHO, Microsoft is a dead company walking, at least on the OS and music side. Vista is an abject failure, Microsoft DRM is toast, the Zune is dead, and really only their apps like Office, Project, and Exchange have any hope of keeping their business alive. Now that Macs run Windows and eventually will run Windows apps WITHOUT Windows installed and given that Apple hardware is less expensive than comparable equipment from Dell or HP, I think we are going to see a HUGE sea-change in the computing world in the next 5 years.

Ultimately, Apple made the right choices at the right times for the most part (except for the aforementioned contract with the devil) and in the end, will probably be the 900lb. gorilla that we will all end up hating because they own 90% of the market.

But for now, this is why the iPod is the favorite mp3 player and the Zune is not. Apple knows how to integrate hardware and software better than any company on the planet.

For what it's worth, the Marietta, GA school superintendent was going to provide a laptop for each student 6th grade and higher, for only a measly $100 mil. Having seen what a bored teenager can do to an IBM keyboard (it ain't a pretty sight), I estimated that about 2/3rds of that would have been for maintenance. Yeah, giving away freebies sounds good - but I'd rather see an emphasis on giving teachers what they say they need rather than going bluesky and giving out hardware without a rational idea of what it'll be used for. (In the case of the laptops, wheel chocks came to mind...)

BTW, that superintendent is now an EX-intendent.

Great article, WB.

Wanted to let you know it made Right Michigan's offial "iPod Andy's Top 10 iPod Blogs" list.

http://www.rightmichigan.com/story/2007/4/25/103142/031

--Nick