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Why bother?

I haven't written too much this weekend. It's because I discovered that Bill Whittle has published again. And this time, he speaks truth to trooothers, going after the conspiracy nuts in a way that ought to leave serious scars.


Comments (24)

Nice link, Jay.The... (Below threshold)
drjohn:

Nice link, Jay.

There is a great deal of work in that post.

And it's really good.

He sure hits the nail squar... (Below threshold)
Allen:

He sure hits the nail squarely on the head. Better believe there is a bunch of idiots running around the world. Can't wait to read some posts decrying this, because it will sure show their IQ. Good job Jay.

Speaking of the JFK assasin... (Below threshold)

Speaking of the JFK assasination, does anybody know where I can find the gag picture of Oswald and Jack Ruby photoshopped into a rock band?

What? They really were a rock band?

The take away para is:... (Below threshold)
marc:

The take away para is:

"This is the first time in history that fire has ever melted steel," she said. This is a statement of such pristine and perfect idiocy that it surely must be emblazoned in stone across the entrance to the Physics Imbecile wing of the Moron Museum of Natural History. But mastery of physics and engineering requires some intelligence, some perseverance and some discipline: none of which are in evidence in this buffoon. Everything is a conspiracy to a mind this far gone. The 15 British sailors kidnapped at sea? All a plan by our evil (but incompetent!) government to get the next war it so desperately needs. "Gulf of Tonkin! Google It, people!" she said on national TV.

And I will, Rosie. I promise. As soon as I finish googling MAD COW DISEASE.

Sweet.... (Below threshold)
Jo:

Sweet.

Bill Whittle and his admire... (Below threshold)
Steve Crickmore:

Bill Whittle and his admirer Jay Tea have to ignore a good part of history .Organized Crime or is that part of some wacko theory, including mobster Jack Ruby links to Sam Giancana and the Chicago Mafia/ Mob who encouraged Ruby to move to Dallas. (am I permitted to use these words -the Mafia and the Mob or are they just bad unproven hypotheisis) We are supposed to believe that Ruby who detested Kennedy had strong ties to Cuban CIA trained exiles, killed Oswald without any other motive than to spare Jackie Kennedy coming to Dallas to testify..And the CIA what about the family jewels' "Colby presented Committee members with the 600-page Inspector General report on Agency abuses, a document popularly known as the 'family jewels'". I guess they are just an intelligence gathering agency.after all..The naivity of Jay Whittle and Jay Tea is breathtaking..One of the interesting things in life is unpealing official reports to try find out what really happened. Hey I don't accept all the conspiracy theories, the advocates sometimes are just as one-dimensional as the cover-up plaintiffs, but in many cases they seem a good deal more open than the case closed mentalities, that seem so admired by our host, except of course at Chappaquidick.

The Whittle article is one ... (Below threshold)
Scrapiron:

The Whittle article is one of the best in a long time. Common sense and easy to understand. I can't wait until the third graders (liberal arts college graduates) and left wing retards show up. Lee, Lee, where are you.
I live in mining country and have seen a lot of coal and iron ore come out of the ground. Fire from the coal melts the ore and results in steel beams (all steel products). I have yet to see a mine produce preformed steel right out of the ground. That's just in Rosie's left wing dream world.

wavemaker, you can find the... (Below threshold)

wavemaker, you can find the Lee Harvey and the Patsies pic here.

Gawdblessya, Bullwinkle.</p... (Below threshold)

Gawdblessya, Bullwinkle.

I found it Friday. <... (Below threshold)

I found it Friday.

I wish I could write 1/4 as well.

wavemaker, Don't k... (Below threshold)
bryanD:

wavemaker,

Don't know about a photoshopped band shot, but check out the famous photograph used as evidence of Oswald's guilt.
Find the incongruencies. (Hint: begin with a plumb line.)
http://www.canf.org/2006/images/kennedy/Lee%20Harvey%20Oswald%20am%2022%20nov%201963.jpg

Oh my bryan!! Thanks!! This... (Below threshold)

Oh my bryan!! Thanks!! This will change my life.

I've linked to that post a ... (Below threshold)

I've linked to that post a couple of times on my blog. Even if you don't read through the whole thing, skim through and find the link to the video of an F-4 testing the strength of a reinforced concrete wall.

One of the more fantastical Truther claims (are any actually more far out than others?) is that there were not plane wrecks at the Pentagon or the field in Pennsylvania. This leads to insane conspiracies about disappearing the real planes and real passengers... somehow.

In any case, it's just a really fun video to watch. Over and over. :-)

Before someone sarcastical... (Below threshold)
Steve Crickmore:

Before someone sarcastically says 'blame it on Bush', wavemaker, November 22st, 1963 changed everyone's life, except you and curiously President George Bush, senior (41) who claims to have been somewhere vaguely in Texas..He can't remember where exactly? Could have it been here?

Steve, I'm not certain why ... (Below threshold)

Steve, I'm not certain why I followed that link, but that photo is so poor that my first impression was that it resembled Bobby Kennedy more than George H. W. Bush.

And what the hell would the son of a United States Senator -- and, at that point, candidate for the US Senate himself -- be doing that deep into some grand conspiracy?

Sheesh... Crickmore, I had you pegged as annoying, but relatively sane. I guess I'll have to re-evaluate that opinion.

J.

Jay, Tthe second point, yo... (Below threshold)
Steve Crickmore:

Jay, Tthe second point, you raise is a good one....Perhaps he couldn't say what he is was doing...Maybe, or likely there is nothing sinister that so many people were in Dallas that day?....Most of these conspircies theories have weak links..But reading and examining the Warren Report personally changed my life? It was the first time I really began to disrust official reports ..No one seemed to want to get at the truth?..Oswald was questioned for 12 hours and we have no record anywhere ]of what he said..and Ruby..if ever a man had on the earmarks of making a hit, it was him????

The simplest or most obviou... (Below threshold)

The simplest or most obvious explanation is usually (not always) the right one, and anything that can be explained by sloth or stupidity is probably best explained by sloth or stupidity rather than malice.

Not always. But it's a good place to start.

And whatever goes beyond those things should have a burden of proof involved. *Show* that the more elaborate thing actually did happen.

I've never been interested in the Kennedy assassination so I know little about it other than a dimly remembered documentary debunking the conspiracies. There really are not *problems* with the simpler version even if the more complicated version has greater entertainment value.

I'm more interested in the 9-11 conspiracy theorists who insist that I should pay attention to "questions" without answers.

The obvious answers aren't fully understood. No doubt engineers are studying how and why the buildings fell as they did and how and why the planes crashed at the Pentagon and in Pennsylvania left so little behind. That not every detail is understood doesn't even begin to put into question the obvious.

Fire never melted steel, so we're supposed to believe that a hoard of evil and perfectly loyal minions with the expert knowledge to do urban building demolition wired the world trade centers to blow, which no one ever once noticed, and then flew two planes into them before blowing them. No one has ever talked, gotten an attack of guilt, or bragged.

And the other two so-called "crashes" are obviously not airplane crashes so we're supposed to believe that two planes with all passengers were made to disappear from the face of the earth while other evil and perfectly loyal minions staged the crash site in PA (but didn't bother to put big chunks of plane parts there) and sent a missile into the Pentagon.

I don't often disagree with... (Below threshold)
DJ Drummond:

I don't often disagree with Bill Whittle, but the JFK Assassination was a bad choice for his argument.

Here's a test question: What is the present official U.S. Government position on the assasination?

No, asking questions does not automatically make you a 'conspiracy nut'. But it is part of any proper method of logic, to ask and answer reasonable questions. When the orthodox answer refuses to answer any questions or respond to reasonable doubt, for me it is a sign that the Orthodox answer cannot stand on the evidence.

Sure, the 9/11 troothers appear to be a bunch of nutballs. Let them put together their case, and let people answer as they will. In the case of 9/11, the answers to every theory presented so far have shown the lunacy of the theories, especially when the theorists refused to accept when they were wrong, but instead traded their last shreds of reason for stronger venom. The answers strengthened the case for the orthodox explanation, and that's as it should be. Show your work.

I've seen such hysteria before. I recall dozens of web theories that Bill Cinton was a communist agent, that LBJ was behind killing JFK, that FDR wanted a war so he "let" Pearl Harbor happen. In retrospect, we laugh at such absurd claims now, but partly because the claims were addressed with hard evidence.

When the orthodox powers refuse to answer serious questions, we see things like the Dreyfuss Affair, we see things like Chessmaster Kasparov arrested as some kind of threat to the Russian government, or blogger Hao Wu simply picked up and "detained" for half a year by the Chinese authorities. If reasonable questions cannot be asked, and the story given must be accepted without question, then Mike Nifong would still have three innocent men facing decades in prison on a false charge, simply because he wanted to win re-election.

You don't have to like the questions, but they need answers, sometimes even when a nutcase poses them.

"What is the present offici... (Below threshold)
bryanD:

"What is the present official U.S. Government position on the assasination?-DJ"

"Present" could be a trick, but the House Committee re-investigating the JFK assassination in 1978(?) found that "Oswald" DID NOT act alone. Too many shots. Not enough time. Plus witness Sam Giancana being shot the night before his appearance before the committee and Judith Exner's linking of Giancana and JFK (for the record) just made it too hard for the committee to finesse it.
This result was the culmination of the 1975 Church committee's revelation of the CIA "executive action" program ZR/RIFLE, a joint operation with La Cosa Nostra against Castro.
Of course, the government stands by the pecularly American "lone nut" theory by pretending they don't know any better.

I'm more interested in the ... (Below threshold)
bryanD:

I'm more interested in the 9-11 conspiracy theorists who insist that I should pay attention to "questions" without answers_synova

Check out the 53rd or 54th minute of Loose Change.
There are thermite explosions on video, running ahead of the collapse.

The whole movie is Must-See, but if more than 30 seconds of controversy makes your liver quiver, start at around the 53rd minute.

I kind of agree with<a href... (Below threshold)
Steve Crickmore:

I kind of agree with Bill O'Reilley and his assessment of the Kennedy assasinationso Jay is maybe right afterall, and I'm not so sane. The 9-11 was no conspiracy other than the Al Queda, though I wouldn't doubt that a few agents from our special relationship country were trailing them...the largely Saudi hijackers seemed so conspicious to the trained eye.

Well, I am strangely at odd... (Below threshold)
DJ Drummond:

Well, I am strangely at odds and in agreement with you, bryan.

"Loose Change" is complete crap. My high school fantasies about Farah Fawcett were more true-to-life.

But you're right; the present position of the United States government, is that President Kennedy was killed as the result of a multiple-person conspiracy, most likely influenced by Organized Crime. That Bill Whittle left that part out, is a bad lapse at best.

Also, even people who believe Oswald is totally guilty, agree that the case was mangled by the government. Evidence disappeared, Oswald was killed in police custody by a man with Mob membership, witnesses were told what to testify by the FBI, and so on. It gave a clear impression of a cover-up, so that reasonable doubt was created by the very people who ought to have understood that honest investigation would clear up a lot of the mess.

Let me be clear, that I do not believe 99% of the conspiracy theories surrounding JFK's death. LBJ didn;t do it, neither did the CIA or the FBI, and in all likelihood Oswald was shooting a rifle at the President that day, and so was complicit. But I also believe that just because you like one piece of evidence or theory, does not excuse throwing out contrary evidence or refusing to answer legitimate questions. And there are a lot of serious questions in that affair.

DJ, I can't believe ... (Below threshold)
bryanD:

DJ,
I can't believe we're actually almost in agreement on one or two things.

But I don't believe Oswald was the shooter and that he WAS the patsy he claimed to be. The poor guy probably thought he was helping to avert a communistic plot that day. After all, in his marine corps days at the top secret U2 base in Japan, he had been paid to troll for communist Mata Haris in local whorehouses (VD with no "office hours"(reprimand) in the 50s? No way!): , and his "defection" to the USSR was only one of many the Army (mainly) was sending at the time for use as double agents.

The Fair Play for Cuba Committee was being run out of Naval Intelligence in NOLA (there were no other members. 100% fake) and is where the "set-up" probably began: creating a communist image of the "assassin" to throw the scent off of LBJ.
And yes, LBJ was the kingpin of a plot that may have started elsewhere.
LBJ (best friend: JE Hoover) was the only one powerful enough to stymie the million leads to the CIA, FBI and their relationship to the mafia. And to control the Warren Report witness testimony and alteration of evidence (the president's body, autopsy photos; and in this digital age, those photos have been incontravertibly shown to be altered)
Plus LBJ is a suspect in the murder of a neighbor and political rival, and his own sister (who was a sociable drunk with a big mouth and on the outs with Lyndon). And everybody knows he went crazy and was dead in 7 years. And his famous nightmares were not REALLY about Vietnam.

Best book: They Killed the President -Marrs
Best ANYTHING: the 12 or 13 part Australian documentary the History Channel plays on assassination weekend: The Men Who Killed Kennedy. Anthony Summers uses no re-enactments that are the bane of US docs, but locations , interviews, and period photos and film.

Bryan and DJ..Thanks for yo... (Below threshold)
Steve Crickmore:

Bryan and DJ..Thanks for your comments...Have you guys been to Dallas? Crouching under cover of the leafy trees just beyond the grassy knoll with a rife resting on the picket fence, gives one an unobstructed view looking about 20 feet down of the President's car about 50 feet away slowly wheeling into view, before it would exit under the tunnel an on to the freeway..And the Zapruder film.. The President recoiled backward. All the President's brain tisue flew back on to the trunk, ..That would have had to be a helluva backlash from a shot fired from along way behind. No with apologies to Jay who wasn't born then..the Kennedy assasination was a coup d'etat.




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