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Saint Elizabeth

Brent Bozell reminds some of those in the media who spent the past week praising Elizabeth Edwards for denouncing the hatefulness on the right of some things Edwards (and some of those working for her husband) have said in the past few years. Evidently those in the media were not aware of the statements or I am sure they would have stopped praising Edwards long enough to ask her about them.

I have expressed my disapproval of some of the things Ann Coulter has said in the past, but I know that she is not typical of most pundits on the right. If Edwards wants to speak out against the hatefulness and ugliness on the right, she should at least acknowledge those on her side of the aisle engaging in language every bit as "ugly." If I had a nickel for every time I have read someone on the left wishing for the death (usually by assassination) of Dick Cheney, I would be a very rich woman. And for those who don't think Edwards should be held responsible for everything anyone on the left says, I agree. She shouldn't, but she she should at least acknowledge what those she had a role in hiring have said. Anyone remember Amanda Marcotte and Melissa McEwen? No one in the media seemed to this past week.


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Comments (56)

Is this the same Elizabeth ... (Below threshold)

Is this the same Elizabeth Edwards who's praised Democratic Underground? The same who has blogged at Huffington Post? Talking about RIGHT-wing hate?

The irony's so bright, I'm blinded.

J.

Also, let's not forget that... (Below threshold)

Also, let's not forget that it was Elizabeth Edwards who hired the demented, rage-filled Amanda Marcotte as the official Edwards campaign blogger until the public scandal forced to Edwards to drop her.

And now she's got her panties in a wad about "hate"? What a sanctimonious fraud.

Dont you just love how the ... (Below threshold)
GeminiChuck:

Dont you just love how the left puts people out front that we "aren't supposed to criticize"? Several come immediately to mind. That way they get their hateful messages out without receiving many attacks in return. I've always felt that Edwards was an empty suit - now I see that Elizabeth is the brains behind that outfit and John hides behind her skirt (eg, he refuses to appear on any FXN show). gc

If she doesn't stop, I'll..... (Below threshold)
drjohn:

If she doesn't stop, I'll.....I'll....send out my wife to yell at her.


Take that, Elizabeth!

Elizabeth Edwards says ... (Below threshold)
marc:

Elizabeth Edwards says she is scared of the "rabid, rabid Republican" who owns property across the street from her Orange County home -- and she doesn't want her kids going near the gun-toting neighbor.Edwards, the wife of Democratic presidential candidate John Edwards, particularly recalls the time neighbor Monty Johnson brought out a gun while chasing workers investigating a right of way near his property. The Edwards family has yet to meet Johnson in person.

"I wouldn't be nice to him, anyway," Edwards said in an interview. "I don't want my kids anywhere near some guy who, when he doesn't like somebody, the first thing he does is pull a gun out. It scares the business out of me."

If Elizabeth Edwards denoun... (Below threshold)

If Elizabeth Edwards denounced everything ever said by anybody would she still be right about Ann Coulter?

My answer is yes. This article and Bozell's article are pretty poor attempts at deflection.

"If Elizabeth Edwards de... (Below threshold)

"If Elizabeth Edwards denounced everything ever said by anybody would she still be right about Ann Coulter?"

Yes, she would, but then she wouldn't be a hypocrit. Pointing out someone's hypocrisy is not a "deflection" of the issue, because hypocrisy IS the issue.

The loons on the left are r... (Below threshold)
Gianni:

The loons on the left are really reaching when they claim Coulter offended Edwards.

Blue Neponset I proved repe... (Below threshold)
Paul:

Blue Neponset I proved repeatedly that she lied about Coulter.

You know that because you where there.

Yet you lie about it.

Classless.

Pointing out someone's h... (Below threshold)

Pointing out someone's hypocrisy is not a "deflection" of the issue, because hypocrisy IS the issue.

A politician is a hypocrite. Oh my word, say it ain't so!!! You mean to tell me that Elizabeth Edwards doesn't denounce those who agree with her every time they cross the line of good taste? I can not believe it.

Sorry to be so snarky in response to one of your comments, Oyster, but 9 out of 10 times a hypocrisy argument in politics is pure deflection. Simply because all politicians, without exception, are hypocrites. Elizabeth Edwards was right as rain about Coulter, and her comments about AC have nothing whatsoever to do with how much of an idiot Amanda Marcotte is. If we only listened to true saints then we would never ever listen to what any politician has to say.

Paul,You are reall... (Below threshold)

Paul,

You are really an ignorant person. I don't agree with you about what EE said. That doesn't mean I am lying about it. In the future please feel free not to respond to any of my comments. Have a great day!

"A politician is a hypoc... (Below threshold)

"A politician is a hypocrite. Oh my word, say it ain't so!!! You mean to tell me that Elizabeth Edwards doesn't denounce those who agree with her every time they cross the line of good taste? I can not believe it."

Well, what's the problem then? We agree that some people go too far in their rhetoric and that those who selectively choose who speak out against for it are hypocrits. Looks like we're done here.

Blue n' sounds like another... (Below threshold)
jhow66:

Blue n' sounds like another wee wee lee lee wardie from bluie. He cannot tell night from day per his above statements.

I don't want my kids anywhe... (Below threshold)
kim:

I don't want my kids anywhere near some guy who, when he doesn't like somebody, the first thing he does is pull a hired gun out.
============================

Her husband, the fucking pi... (Below threshold)
kim:

Her husband, the fucking pirate.
===================

We agree that some peopl... (Below threshold)

We agree that some people go too far in their rhetoric and that those who selectively choose who speak out against for it are hypocrits.

Tell that to Lori. She seems to think a charge of hypocrisy is enough to dismiss what EE said about Ann Coulter.

Ease up, kim. These birds ... (Below threshold)
kim's sock puppet:

Ease up, kim. These birds are sitting.
==================

Blue n' sounds like anot... (Below threshold)

Blue n' sounds like another wee wee lee lee wardie from bluie. He cannot tell night from day per his above statements.

Oh yeah poopy head? At least I have the stones to tell you want I believe. All you got is some kindergarten name calling.

Blue Neponset, now you are ... (Below threshold)

Blue Neponset, now you are misrepresenting Lori again.

Robin Roberts, you are misr... (Below threshold)

Robin Roberts, you are misrepresenting what I said.

Blue, do you have an actual... (Below threshold)

Blue, do you have an actual argument to make about what Lori said, or do you wish to continue to attack strawmen you've invented? If the latter, I'm sure we can all ignore you now and save time.

If Elizabeth Edwards denoun... (Below threshold)
LoveAmerica Immigrant:

If Elizabeth Edwards denounced everything ever said by anybody would she still be right about Ann Coulter?

My answer is yes. This article and Bozell's article are pretty poor attempts at deflection.
------------------------------------------------
I think your post is a pretty poor attempt at deflection of EE 's hypocrisy. That 's the main point. She is willing to use her son 's death as a fundraising tool again and I think that is ugly.


Robin,Why do you k... (Below threshold)

Robin,

Why do you keep insisting on misrepresenting what I said? If that is all you can do then please ignore me. Have a great day!

Okay, let's look at this lo... (Below threshold)

Okay, let's look at this logically.

Did Mrs. Edwards mischaracterize Mz. Coulter's statement? Yes.

Did Mrs. Edwards do so knowingly and deliberately? Yes.

Is that evidence of a deliberate falsehood, a/k/a a lie? Yes.

Spin all you want, Blue, you cannot get past those simple facts.

A politician is a hypocrite... (Below threshold)
LoveAmerica Immigrant:

A politician is a hypocrite.
---------------------------------
Thank you for admitting that EE is a hypocrite. So Loris and Brent were right about EE as rain (using your own standard).

Blue, I would be grateful i... (Below threshold)

Blue, I would be grateful if you would point out exactly what Lorie said that you have construed to mean that she thinks Coulter's statement should be dismissed because Edwards is a hypocrite.

Because what I gathered from her two paragraphs is A) Edwards was bemoaning what she called "right-wing hate talk" and B) that she did NOT believe Edwards should be "responsible" for what the left says, but should at least acknowledge that the right is not alone in it.

In other words, Lorie expressed an opinion on what she thinks Edwards should do to lend credibility to her argument that there is too much "hate talk". She did not say that because Edwards only brought up transgressions committed by the right Coulter should be dismissed. Again, I would like for you to tell me where Lorie said this.

If Edwards wants to spea... (Below threshold)

If Edwards wants to speak out against the hatefulness and ugliness on the right, she should at least acknowledge those on her side of the aisle engaging in language every bit as "ugly."

Why should Edwards have to acknowledge hateful speech from others in order to denounce hateful speech from Ann Coulter?

Why should Edwards... (Below threshold)
Why should Edwards have to acknowledge hateful speech from others in order to denounce hateful speech from Ann Coulter?

Because it makes her look a lot less like a purely partisan hypocrite? --shrug--

Nevermind that what you sai... (Below threshold)

Nevermind that what you said below is not an answer to the question. The question was what did Lorie say that means she thinks Coulter's statement "should be dismissed" because Edwards is a hypocrite.

"Why should Edwards have to acknowledge hateful speech from others in order to denounce hateful speech from Ann Coulter?"

She doesn't have to. But her admission that this kind of speech is not exclusive to the "right-wing" or even Ann Coulter is conspicuous in its continued absence.

Now can you please answer my original question?

Now can you please answe... (Below threshold)

Now can you please answer my original question?

I did.


Your original question:

Blue, I would be grateful if you would point out exactly what Lorie said that you have construed to mean that she thinks Coulter's statement should be dismissed because Edwards is a hypocrite.

You can disagree with my conclusions but I clearly told you what I "construed to mean" Lorie's dismissal of EE's Coulter criticism.

Robin Roberts, you... (Below threshold)
Robin Roberts, you are misrepresenting what I said.

Posted by: Blue Neponset at July 5, 2007 12:07 PM

What was it you were saying?

John, evidently Blue is rew... (Below threshold)

John, evidently Blue is rewriting Lori's comment to make it closer to what he wished it said. Less work to attack it, you know.

In other words, Robin, Blue... (Below threshold)

In other words, Robin, Blue is responding to what he hallucinated that Lori said rather than to what she actually said.

Its a moot point anyway. j... (Below threshold)
moseby:

Its a moot point anyway. john edwards will not get the nomination...he's done. If he was a true liberal C he would donate the rest of his campaign funds to charity. And his dopey wife has more fat in her head than in her ass!!!

You guys really suck at mak... (Below threshold)

You guys really suck at making witty comments.

Thank you, Blue. Coming fro... (Below threshold)

Thank you, Blue. Coming from you, that is quite the compliment.

Ah, you construed that stat... (Below threshold)

Ah, you construed that statement to mean that Lorie was dismissing Coulter's comment even though Lorie she preceded it with, "I have expressed my disapproval of some of the things Ann Coulter has said in the past, but I know that she is not typical of most pundits on the right."

Though she said explicitly that she has expressed disproval of some things Coulter has said .... You still think she is dismissing what Coulter said. You've accused her of that which you have decided is in her heart, in spite of that statement. Okay. I got it now.

But just one more thing, if you'll please indulge me. It would probably be wrong of me to accuse you of attempting to dismiss, say, Howard Dean's statements due to your calling *all politicians, without exception* hypocrites.

Ah, you construed that s... (Below threshold)

Ah, you construed that statement to mean that Lorie was dismissing Coulter's comment even though Lorie she preceded it with, "I have expressed my disapproval of some of the things Ann Coulter has said in the past, but I know that she is not typical of most pundits on the right."

No, I construed it to mean that Lorie was dismissing Elizabeth Edward's comments about Ann Coulter. The way I read it was, Lorie was arguing that EE is being hypocritical because she hasn't denounced hateful speech from the Left so we should ignore what EE has to say about Ann Coulter. YMMV.

But just one more thing, if you'll please indulge me. It would probably be wrong of me to accuse you of attempting to dismiss, say, Howard Dean's statements due to your calling *all politicians, without exception* hypocrites.

I don't think Howard Dean has said anything worse than what has been said by his opposite number at the RNC. Ann Coulter, however, is a peddler of hate speech.

Blue, what about the blogge... (Below threshold)

Blue, what about the bloggers that Edwards briefly hired for his campaign?

BLue has admitted that EE i... (Below threshold)
LoveAmerica Immigrant:

BLue has admitted that EE is a hypocrite. So it is a given that EE is a partisan hypocrite who ignored hate speech by her own staff. And other partisan hyprocrites will try to defend EE 's hypocrisy. We shouldn't be surprised at that either.

BTW, EE 's silence can be c... (Below threshold)
LoveAmerica Immigrant:

BTW, EE 's silence can be construed as condoning liberal hate speech and EE is only interested in silencing people of opposing view. This fits with the pattern of liberals' effort to squash freedom of speech.

Blue Neponset:... (Below threshold)
marc:

Blue Neponset:

I don't think Howard Dean has said anything worse than what has been said by his opposite number at the RNC.

Ok, here are a few Dean quotes see if you can "top them" by posting quotes from his opposite number at the RNC.

"You know, the Republicans are not very friendly to different kinds of people. They're a pretty monolithic party. Pretty much, they all behave the same, and they all look the same. ... It's pretty much a white Christian party.'' --speaking about the lack of outreach to minority communities by political parties

Nothing like pulling the race card huh Blue?

"I still want to be the candidate for guys with Confederate flags in their pickup trucks."

Yeah.. that won him some Southern votes - not!

"I'm a metrosexual." - employing the buzz phrase for straight men who are in touch with their feminine sides, then later admitting he didn't know what the term means

"This president is not interested in being a good president. He's interested in some complicated psychological situation that he has with his father."

Dean channels Dr. Phil!

"Now that we're on dog pee, we can have an interesting conversation about that. I do not recommend drinking urine...but if you drink water straight from the river, you have a greater chance of getting an infection than you do if you drink urine." -- teaching an eight-grade science class in La Crosse, Wisconsin.

"You think people can work all day and then pick up their kids at child care or wherever and get home and still manage to sandwich in an eight-hour vote? Well Republicans, I guess can do that. Because a lot of them have never made an honest living in their lives."

Republicans are all reprobates right Dean, right Neponset?

The Irony award goes to... Howard the Duck.

Hypocrisy is a value that I think has been embraced by the Republican Party. We get lectured by people all day long about moral values by people who have their own moral shortcomings.

I hate Republicans and everything they stand for.

I've waffled before. I'll waffle again.

John Ashcroft is not a patriot, John Ashcroft is a descendant of Joseph McCarthy. At least he didn't recall Hitler.

Tom DeLay ought to go back to Houston where he can serve his jail sentence. Never mind having a trial right Dean?

And finally the classic Dean BS

"Not only are we going to New Hampshire ... we're going to South Carolina and Oklahoma and Arizona and North Dakota and New Mexico, and we're going to California and Texas and New York! And we're going to South Dakota and Oregon and Washington and Michigan. And then we're going to Washington, D.C. to take back the White House, Yeeeeeaaaaaargh!"

"The way I read it was, ... (Below threshold)

"The way I read it was, Lorie was arguing that EE is being hypocritical because she hasn't denounced hateful speech from the Left so we should ignore what EE has to say about Ann Coulter."

Okay, now we're getting somewhere. It was your inference that led you to accuse her of something she didn't say. Why, I'd almost call that a deflection from the very point of her post.

If you had asked Lorie outright, "Are you saying we should dismiss Coulter's remarks?" This might have been different. She likely would have answered you in a polite manner saying that's not at all what she meant. But you chose to accuse her of it instead.

I'm arguing this as logically and dispassionately as I can. I have no dog in this hunt. I don't buy Coulter's books. I've seen her on TV exactly once and that was due to channel flipping. And I don't really care what she has to say because it seems she always does it in a way to get the most shock value as it's always in the newspapers and all over the blogs the next day.

What else I'm saying is that I would personally have more respect for Edwards if she had simply had the honesty to call all spades out.

Now THAT'S something I could get behind no matter the political persuasion of the person who does it.

Instead what has evolved is that it looks more like Edwards is treating Coulter like a campaign rival. Here's what hateful thing Ann said today. Give to my campaign." And then what?

What silly arguments. So an... (Below threshold)
ChrisO:

What silly arguments. So anyone who criticizes someone from the other party is obligated to immediately follow up with criticism of their own party or they're a hypocrite? Says who? So every time someone on this board criticizes a Democrat,they immediately follow up with a criticism of Republicans? In your dreams.

I might point out that one of EE's main points was that Coulter felt that the death of her son was acceptable fodder for political attacks. I suppose she shold just accept that, because her husband's campaign hired some bloggers who have been rude in the past? Please provide me with an Amanda Marcotte quote that's anywhere near as digusting.

I might point out that one ... (Below threshold)
LoveAmerica Immigrant:

I might point out that one of EE's main points was that Coulter felt that the death of her son was acceptable fodder for political attacks.
-------------------------------------------------
And Ann 's main point was that EE herself used her son's death as a campaign fodder for political fund-raising and attack. At the same time, we might add that Edward used Mary Cheney as a fodder for his attack against Cheney.

This is another silly and hypocritical arg to deflect from EE 's partisan hypocrisy. She can criticize Ann, so Ann and other people can criticize EE as hypocritical and cheap political hacks.

In other words, if EE was w... (Below threshold)
LoveAmerica Immigrant:

In other words, if EE was willing to use her son 's death as a fodder as a political campaign, then she shouldn't complain when people called her on it. If she can dish it out, then she shouldn't pretend to be outraged when peopel call her on it again. This is simply another case of free speech for me, but not for you.

So anyone who crit... (Below threshold)
So anyone who criticizes someone from the other party is obligated to immediately follow up with criticism of their own party or they're a hypocrite?

What is wrong with a statement like, "I know our own party has a few bomb-throwers, but nothing like Ann Coulter"?

"What is wrong with a state... (Below threshold)
ChrisO:

"What is wrong with a statement like, "I know our own party has a few bomb-throwers, but nothing like Ann Coulter"?"

There's nothing "wrong" with it, but why should it be required that every statement carry a caveat? If you make a statement without qualifying it, it makes you a hypocrite? I can see you at a ball game. "C'mon ump, that was a strike. Of course, you've made several good calls, as well."

ChrisO, this might come as ... (Below threshold)

ChrisO, this might come as a big shock to you but, politics is not a baseball game.

If you make a statement wit... (Below threshold)
LoveAmerica Immigrant:

If you make a statement without qualifying it, it makes you a hypocrite?
-------------------------------------------------
So we don't need to qualify it. EE is a partisan hypocrite. Even Blue agreed with that.

Geez, Blue. I say... (Below threshold)
Lorie Byrd:

Geez, Blue.

I say that I don't agree with Coulter's past statements and that she is not representative of pundits on the right and that is construed as a defense of Coulter. You must be a contortionist. Edwards is being hypocritical in the extreme and that the media did not call her on it is just one of the more blatant examples of media bias.

Oh, and if you cared about the truth or about representing me accurately, but just didn't believe the statement I made in my post about my disapproval of some of Coulter's comments (if you even read the entire post) you could check my previous posts on the topic of Coulter to see that I have definitely not defended her outrageous remarks.

For those interested in my ... (Below threshold)
Lorie Byrd:

For those interested in my previous comments about Coulter, you can find them in my Wizbang post entitled "Ann Coulter Doesn't Speak for Me".

http://wizbangblog.com/2007/03/03/ann-coulter-doesnt-speak-for-me.php

ChrisO, it is Elizabeth who... (Below threshold)
kim:

ChrisO, it is Elizabeth who has introduced the motif of her son's death; is that anywhere near as disgusting as Ann?

Or you?
==================================

I wouldn't call occasional ... (Below threshold)

I wouldn't call occasional instances of someone complaining about cruel words another said without consistently pointing out an equal but opposite instance "hypocrisy". What I would indeed call hypocrisy is one who often and consistently points out cruel words of an opposing group without ever acknowledging the same behavior by those who share their leanings. That's what Edwards is doing and the media is complicit in giving her a platform to do it.

She's had ample opportunity through many subsequent interviews to call for decency in dialog from all sides, but instead has focused on one person that most of us agree uses far too provocative language and attempts to paint all her political opponents with the same brush.

The same Elizabeth Edwards who posited that Lynne Cheney was ashamed of her daughter's sexual preferences.

At least Obama, in his own plea for decency, isn't so selective.

Just want to make that clear.

kimOnce again, you... (Below threshold)
ChrisO:

kim

Once again, you have demonstrated your unfailing ability to be completely off base (oh wait, that's a baseball reference. I don't want C-C-G to get upset.) Coulter introduced the topic of her son's death quite a while ago. EE called her to confront her on it, as many mothers would.

I can't blame you for playing the fool again, though. You're probably still celebrating after the Appeals Court agreed with you that the Libby trial was a travesty. Oh, wait...

"is that anywhere near as disgusting as Ann?

Or you?"

Boy, repeatedly getting your ass kicked in arguments really makes you bitter, doesn't it, Kimmy?

Sorry, the Edwards invoked ... (Below threshold)
kim:

Sorry, the Edwards invoked their dead son before Ann brought him up.

More to come on Libby. Check following threads, since I'm working backward. This appeals court made no judgement about the trial, only the decision to deny bond on appeal. Try to keep up.

This affair is now on the right track, awaiting appellate judgement and civil case discovery, if the Wilsons' case is allowed to continue.
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