Sorry Cassie, but the boyfriend isn't the one that makes the decision, ever! You can't expect women to treated equally on the one hand, and then claim they are powerless to stand up to men on the other. It just doesn't wash. The truth is, men (even husbands) have no say in the matter whatsoever.

Abortionman punches the girl in the stomach to demonstrate the violence inherent in abortions.

Valid satire, not well done.

Now, about Ms. Hamm's video of her throwing the cat off the balcony...

P.S. Would someone please inform Hamm that she's taking up valuable media time that could be going to the Genuinely Hot, such as Amanda Carpenter? Carpenter could actually buck-up the sagging wingnut roster while adding officer-class glamour. Hamm is strictly NCO.

Offensive humor way past decency, but it appears to be either anti-abortion, or anti- abortion-is-a-form -of -black-genocide.

Intentionally or not, it will provide, just when most politicians do not want it, a strong debate on abortion.

I think MKH said you might be able look at it as a parody but didn't think that was the intent.

Bryan, seems to me that the sagging roster is leaning left and low these days.

Hamm and Carpenter both very attractive women.

err...are both.

Cassy, this is one of the only times I disagree with you on the power that women have. When It comes to aborting a baby or bringing it to delivery, the entire time the girl has the power. To put this on men is very unreasonable. ww

The pressure from the father's side, I believe, comes a lot more before the baby is created than after, but I don't believe that there is never any pressure from the father even though it may not occur in every instance. (Of course the father dosen't even even know he created a child in many instances.)

So I wouldn't say what Cassie said was wrong at all. It's just not always applicable.

I initially thought that I gotta disagree with Scottie's absoluteness. Certainly women do decide to have abortions against the desires of the father, and he's powerless to do anything about it.

Some of the time, men [or family members of any gender] have their say and attempt to influence a mothers actions in either fiscal, physical or emotional blackmail. For or against abortion.

Certainly the woman "has the final say," but if whether by her own bad choices, lack of resources, or whatever, she perceives herself painted into a corner with men bullying her, she may have an abortion. Or simply base her actions on what the father's stated desires are. Another very bad decision. Aided and abetted by men. Not exactly mugged by AbortionMan, though she may distort her memory or statements about the process to make it more like the video than not. Which is one of several areas where this ugly satire resonates very uncomfortably.

And where I realize Scottie (and Wayan) is indeed spot on.

"Bryan, seems to me that the sagging roster is leaning left and low these days."-oyster

Au contrair!
As goes the establishment, so goes the establishmentarians these days. Consolidations, self-indenturings, turtle-time drills, ignoring Dear Leader's inititiatives and aphorisms.

Some Mercurius Aulicus you people are!

"Hamm and Carpenter both very attractive women."-oyster

No, we all don't get trophies today!
Carpenter's a 9.5 (contingent upon not being able to see her can)

Hamm is a courtesy 7. (Mainly mentioning the whole subject due to Hamm's trademark blown-kisses to the troops last Christmas, as if MKH is Joey Heatherton in 1968. The idea of Hamm's kisses are well south of Joey Heatherton's and just north of Bob Hope's in my opinion.

Any of you movers-'n'-shakers ever been to a big city club? Mary Katherine would have to wait in line.

And the reason why it's fair (and fun) to point out how completely average she is, is because she has on more than one occasion positioned herself (or allowed herself to be positioned) as a "sexy" blogger, and not merely a blogger. It's like bragging about being the third sexiest person on the Romanian Olympic women's powerlifting squad.

How has this thread become a beauty contest all of a sudden? Grow up guys. ww

Sure she's not sexy if sexy means "looks like a slut".

I think the video is definitely anti-abortion and strongly so. The intended audience is probably black men.

And the idea that women who are pregnant are not vulnerable is offensive and opportunistic. The hormone load itself messes a person up *badly* and the only people who don't admit that are those feminists who have an investment in insisting that women do not have disadvantages in the workplace associated with pregnancy and pro-choice activists who could not possibly allow any suggestion that making life altering decisions while pregnant is making those decisions while severely impaired.

Oh, and men who don't want to be responsible for anything about the situation... and I'd include those who do so while pretending to be feminist.

Oh, it sucks to be a man because any woman can kill your child, but that only matters to the men who want their children and not all of them do. Abortion is custom made for the man who wants to avoid responsibility and since deciding to bear a child involves figuring out how to support that child and yourself during the most vulnerable situation possible, physically and economically, it is beyond easy for anyone who might be expected to be *supportive* of the child to force an abortion... parents... boyfriends... husbands... by vowing to withhold support.

it is beyond easy for anyone who might be expected to be *supportive* of the child to force an abortion... parents... boyfriends... husbands... by vowing to withhold support.

Just to clarify one point. Like the mother, the father is on the hook to support the child, but no one else has any responsibility to do so. It's not blackmail of any type for parents to tell their adult daughter she has to find another place to live before, during, or after pregnancy with or without a baby. An employer can't discriminate, but apart from the father, any other party who's volunteering support of any kind can end or change that support regardless of an adult women's pregnancy status or intentions. To do otherwise would be a violation of the volunteering party's constitutional rights of association and private property.

Yes, some women are pressured one way or the other regarding abortion, but it's legally protected pressure. I can't imagine some judge telling the parents of a competent adult daughter that they are on the hook to continue to care for their daughter and grandchild. Nor is the reverse likely, that a parent can't kick their competent adult daughter out of the house for having an abortion. The parents may need to follow the proper eviction process, but that's a reasonable and temporary restriction. It would be the same for all other parties (other than the father) who are volunteering support.

I don't think the video has a serious message. It treats the woman as evil for getting pregnant in the first place and then for wanting to keep the child. It then sanitizes the idea of forced abortion. It should be remade using a Chinese communist party member in place of the father and a mob of abortionists in place of Abortionman. That video could be used to protest these real circumstances in china during the Olympic games.

Thank you Epidor.

Mac, what does legal responsibility have to do with it?

And "parents" who do have legal responsibility toward minor daughters can just as easily vow never to lift a finger to help as parents of adult daughters can.

They can, *easily*, force an abortion on someone who would otherwise hate the idea and prefer not to kill her child by withdrawing emotional support and vowing not a penny more financial support than the courts demand of them.

And I don't know about you, but as a 40 year old woman I depend on support from my parents. Not financial support but certainly emotional support. That's what families are FOR. What a horrible way to live without that! Adults usually have a support network of friends and relatives and we'd be lost without them.

Legally protected pressure?

Yeah. It's entirely legal for people to be self-centered manipulative abusive jerks. It's entirely legal for parents of minors or adult daughters to use all emotional weapons available to them to set up a situation where it would take an extraordinary effort and a willingness to face a never ending future of emotional abuse grudge holding to stand up against.

Fathers might be legally required to supply child support but they can withdraw emotional support and make it clear that any penny received is going to be bought with blood.

What *possible* relevance is the legality of the pressure applied? It's pressure and results in the desired abortion.

And the video? Loser male (nearly typical geek) playing a kid's video game panics and cries for help like a baby because his girlfriend is pregnant. The outright violence of abortion is emphasized. The message about who benefits from the abortion is clear... the immature male.

Yeah. It's entirely legal for people to be self-centered manipulative abusive jerks.

First off I wasn't talking about minors as I clearly stated. Minors are entitled to support from their parents or guardians regardless of their relationship with each other.

There are a few people left in this world who's religion runs against having an unmarried daughter become pregnant. In such a family the adult daughter could be considered the self-centered manipulative abusive jerk for going out and getting pregnant. It's her right to do so, but it's the parents right to say you have to leave OUR house.

The opposite is more likely, that the parents oppose abortion and if their adult daughter gets pregnant and then has an abortion (kills the grandkid) the parents have every right to say you have to leave OUR house. Having moral values concerning marriage and abortion does not make someone a self-centered manipulative abusive jerk.

What *possible* relevance is the legality of the pressure applied? It's pressure and results in the desired abortion.

First the pressure can be to not have an abortion as much as to have an abortion. Second, people in the life of some women who gets pregnant have their own legal rights that the woman's right to an abortion, or not, dose not trump. They are no more blackmailing the pregnant women than the pregnant women is blackmailing them. I don't see where you acknowledge that fact in any of your posts on this subject.