Jesus Wept....

So many lawsuits by people like Silky Hair Edwards that people are scared to get involved.
A lot of states still don't have laws to protect the average citizen when 'doing their best' to help people involved in accidents.

Now we have so many real and so many phony cases of child molesting that even as an EMT on an ambulance I was hesitant to touch a child without their parents approval, which they can't give if they're seriously injured or dead.

Lawsuits by shady ambulance chasing lawyers like Edwards have killed a lot of people.

I still would have tried to assist the victim of the hit and run driver.

There are also millions of people in this country that will not help, but will lift your wallet and watch as you lay dying in the street, not just Hartford. That's just a fact of how far we have fallen and the fall is not over. The do anything that pleases you liberal crowd has influenced liberal politicians so much no one cares about anything but self.

This makes me want to puke right here at my pc. What the hell is wrong with these people?!! I can't believe my eyes! NO ONE STEPPED OUT! NO ONE!!! ALL THEY HAD TO DO IS STEP IN THE ROAD AND STOP TRAFFIC! Don't give me that, "I'm scared I'll get sued," garbage. Andybody can frickin' stop traffic on a street like this. This is not like a 6 lane highway. I want to puke again. I hope Hartford is very, very proud. Yeah, I saw that fat pig snapping a pic to show all her fat friends. Sick.

Because liberals have fostered the opinion that all problems are handled by the government. This is a liberal town isn't it? ww

This has nothing to do with liberal/conservative issues or lawsuits. This is all about the sick twisted minds of every single passerby that went about their business after a man was just hit by a CAR! Slowing down just enough to catch a glimpse as if he was some sort of sidewalk artist. This is absolutely morally reprehensible, I'm so disgusted with every single person in this video. What a bunch of assholes!

Yeah this is my Connecticut. By the by, I was driving to New Mexico last year (to visit my parents, my daughter's future school, and to go to the opera) and in Arkansas a car wrecked right in front of me and several dozen cars and trucks stopped to aid and assist. We are going back this summer (to settle my daughter in) and I plan on taking a full first aid kit just in case (last year I could just call emergency services and watch, I do not want that to happen in the future).

This is just my way of saying that this absolute callousness is a Northeast thing.

By the way, in 2000 I got a flat in pouring rain in Colorado and a kid stoped to help me change my tire. My engine died here in CT (Rt 169 if you care) and I literally had to jump in front of a state trooper's car to get some assistance. I live in a sick state.

Doesn't happen in Texas or Arkansas. On the few occasions that I have broken down in those two states, someone always stopped to help.

I guess what happened in Hartford just goes to show how backwards we folks are in the sticks like Texas, Arkansas, Colorado, and New Mexico, as opposed to the sophisticates in the Northern to mid-Atlantic Coast states.

Lots of the people appalled by this video would do the same exact thing. It's one thing if you see the accident, but it's another to come upon such a scene. The first thing you see doesn't add up. There's a man sprawled out in the middle of the road and people are looking at him, but no one is helping him. You wonder what they know that you don't know? Is it a set up like you've seen on some really stupid TV shows? Does the crowd already know the guy is dead and beyond help? Does he have a gun? Someone must have already called 911, right?

Save your disgust for the people who ran this guy down and for those who saw the accident, but did nothing. As for the rest of the people, well that's what most of you would do in the same circumstances. At least before seeing this video, anyway. It's called crowd dynamics and it's a science in it's own right.

Its a big blue city right? Wasn't the mayor under investigation by the state for something, as he was running for election?

Liberalism definitely played a role in the apathetic response of passers-by.

You miss the point Mac, the people who witnessed the act should be the first responders. What is even more sickening is NO ONE called 911. A police car responding to another call just happened upon the accident scene.

And to anyone else, the street thugs that did this should find themselves in jai for a long time, they are the ultimate scum.

By the way, I am totally incensed about this and I need time to stomp around and scream between comments. Many of the people who watched the accident actually knew the guy that got hit. What part of disgusting doesn't that hit you?

You miss the point Mac, the people who witnessed the act should be the first responders.

I didn't miss it at all. Read my post again. You'll find this sentence "Save your disgust for the people who ran this guy down and for those who saw the accident, but did nothing."

Mac,
No, "crowd dynamics" is a sales pitch and an excuse.
I've actually stopped to help in a case similar to this (injuries were nowhere as severe, thank goodness), and afterwards I was thanked by the police captain at the scene.
I'm more thankful @ the time another driver ran into me in my car (she ran a stop sign), and I was assisted by others within seconds.

Funny part was, that was in gun owning, religious, and (we're told) bitter West Virginia..

J

Sad state of affairs.

Many of the people who watched the accident actually knew the guy that got hit.

Where did you get that information from? I didn't see that in any of the news releases. I did find this however "four people dialed 911 within a minute of the accident"

Or could it be that these folks are just indifferent to the situation cuz this sh!t happens all the time in Mexico...

I'm more thankful @ the time another driver ran into me in my car (she ran a stop sign), and I was assisted by others within seconds.

That's not the same thing for two reasons. First, a car accident is obvious even if a person doesn't see it happen. Second, in your case those who helped you within seconds had to have seen and/or heard the accident.

Two words.

Blue. State.

People are rightly appalled by the behavior they see in this video, and I know that telling them they would likely do the same thing doesn't win me any points, but it's true.

Put yourself in this position. You come across this scene of a man sprawled out in the middle of the road with people looking at him, but no one helping him. Your expectation is that if this were a real accident people would be helping the victim, but because they are not, this can't be a real accident. And so you wait to get more information; adding to the number of onlookers taking no action to help, which just sets up the same dynamic in the next person who happens upon this scene.

It takes one or more of the following three attributes for a person to go against the crowd's behavior. Authority, special training, or specific knowledge.

A cop has authority and special training, so he's either going to help the guy or arrest him for endangering the public. A doctor, nurse, paramedic, or firefighter all have special training and would go to this guy's aid. Anyone who saw the accident or knew the man would have specific knowledge and would go to this guy's aid.

Someone how has one or more of the needed attributes, but doesn't give aid fails on moral grounds. Those you should be appalled at, but the rest are acting like most people would act. Sorry if that offends some.

I live in CT, I watch the evening news (usually wfsb)and get the Hartford Courant and other CT papers. It was a byline on much of the news. Actually this came after a prominent citizen had the crap bet out of him because he could only give the robbers 8 bucks. Carbonne may have to undergo brain surgery.

"What in the hell is wrong with those people?!"

"Eloi"

FWIW there were several people that called 911, but other than that they were *all* just onlookers. They have been sufficiently trained to be dependent on others to solve any problems that arise in life for them.

There were no independent thinkers that were willing to step forward and give aid.

Yeah Calixto Torres, city polititian said there were four calls, the 911 center is aware of none. Well we know what famous liars 911 centers are.

Mac,
You're so incorrect - on a number of levels.
It was rural - only one other person witnessed the collision (and how is a person sprawled across a street not "obvious"?),
and two - I can give you specific instances in which "civilians" did exactly what you claim they won't do, and one case where I did the same, and that's fact, not anecdote.
The very least one of these "people" (and I use the term very loosly) could have done was to stop their car and block the scene from others.

J

It was rural - only one other person witnessed the collision

And yet you said "I was assisted by others within seconds". So if the person who witnessed the collision assisted you then that's expected because they had specific knowledge (see post 21). If "others" means more than one, then how did they assist you within seconds without being on the scene? They would have at least heard this collision

and how is a person sprawled across a street not "obvious"?

Well it's obvious that a person is sprawled across the street, but it's not obvious why they are there or that they need help. Maybe it's a drunk passed out in the street and someone has already checked them out. Or maybe the guy is dead and someone has already called 911.

Even if someone drives up to a car crash after the fact, it's obvious it's an accident. Fluids are leaking, smoke or steam may be coming from the vehicles, parts may still be spinning. It's not the same thing.

I can give you specific instances in which "civilians" did exactly what you claim they won't do, and one case where I did the same, and that's fact, not anecdote.

But can you confirm that none of these "civilians" had one or the three attributes I listed in post 21? It only takes one person to break the crowd's behavior, but it does take that one person.

The very least one of these "people" (and I use the term very loosly) could have done was to stop their car and block the scene from others.

Well at least one person did stop their car in the same lane the guy was laying in. They sat in their vehicle, but they did stop. It was either that or run over him.

I linked to a crowd dynamics web site in post 10. They have a very good white paper on crowd dynamics. Go read that and then tell me I'm wrong.

Mac,
"Seconds" means just that - have you never driven on rural roads?? Events can be well out of sight & sound within a very short timeframe.

Yes, I can fully and reliably confirm that each of the civilians I referred to (myself included) do indeed exclude those criteria.

I did read that sales web site.

You are making an assertion. I can provide specific evidence to refute that assertion.

J

That there's some correlation with liberalism is a stupid suggestion and blatantly insulting to me. My mother and I were driving on the 401 (largest highway in Ontario) between Toronto and Windsor, when a motorcycle ahead of us wiped out. At least five cars pulled over immediately. This was fifteen years ago at least, so nobody had a cell phone, so a guy set up road flares and flagged down a tractor trailer to use its radio. My mother, a nurse, held the dying girl for twenty minutes until an ambulance showed up. When she got back in the car, she was covered in blood, and refused help from the paramedics. We sat there for an hour until she could drive again, though she probably shouldn't have. (The girl died that night. My mother had to take a week off work.) The driver, the girl's boyfriend, was decapitated.

All these liberal Ontarioans were so anxious to help that there were almost several accidents as cars hit the shoulder. My mother is as liberal as I am. So fuck anybody who says liberals are not sympathetic to distress, and do not act for the sake of others.

"Seconds" means just that - have you never driven on rural roads?? Events can be well out of sight & sound within a very short timeframe.

I've driven lots of miles on rural roads. If the witness was there and giving aid that changes the dynamic, same as if witnesses of this accident had given aid. In addition, a car accident is obviously an accident. That's not clear if you see someone laying on the ground in a city with many other people around, but no one giving aid.

Yes, I can fully and reliably confirm that each of the civilians I referred to (myself included) do indeed exclude those criteria.

Well you're very familiar with those civilians to know that none of them met any of the attributes needed to break with the crowd. What, are they your family members or relatives? No one would know this detail about people they didn't know very well. Even if you're accurate, we are dealing with human behavior; it's not 100% predictable.

I did read that sales web site

How about the white paper I mentioned? It's a doctoral thesis of 9 chapters.

You are making an assertion. I can provide specific evidence to refute that assertion.

Yes I am. Crowds act in predictable ways and that behavior can be broken by individuals with certain known attributes. This is the science of crowd dynamics. A specific case would be considered anecdotal evidence and you would need a lot more than that to negate the large body of research backing what I have been saying.

On the other hand what evidence do you have that these people are all morally lacking? Or are you offering another explanation?

Maybe the liberal are differenct in rich liberal land of Conn? Maybe a more selfish breed? More callous? Less caring? ww

Mac,
Yes, as I said, I'm familiar with them - and these are not anecdotes, but evidence.

A white paper is neither a thesis nor a dissertation, and you are staggeringly innacurate in asserting that I made any comment addressing anyone as "morally lacking" or similar.

What's funny is that you're willing to say that human behaviour isn't 100% predictable, and then say that crowds' (of humans) behaviour is predictable.

BTW, the "science" of crowd dynamics refers to the movement of groups, generally in confined or well defined areas (such as a stadium audience, or the circulation of participants in a specific event), NOT the willingness of a given (or number of) participant(s) to provide aid.

J

Jess, 100% predictable and predictable are wildly different things, and without a proper handle on this distinction, you cannot properly comprehend any tenets of contemporary theories on human psychology, economics, and sociology. You know that, though, so quit trying to make Mac Lorry look like he's contradicting himself.

If you haven't asserted (implied) that anyone is morally lacking, then what exactly are you disagreeing about?

#28 hyperbolist:
>That there's some correlation with liberalism is a stupid suggestion and blatantly insulting to me.
So fuck anybody who says liberals are not sympathetic to distress, and do not act for the sake of others.

Just because you're too stupid to understand that most liberals wont stop to help while most conservatives will is no reason to post your insulting comment.

Having grown up in rural Oregon and now living in the great socialist state of California, I've seen plenty of instances where people living in the rural areas (generally conservatives) stop to help other people, while in more populated areas (generally liberal), people just look but don't help.

I think it may come from the conservatives belief in personal responsibility, and the liberals rejection of responsibility.

So go fuck yourself, asswipe. Maybe grow up a bit and engage your brain for a change.

hyper,
read the posts! Or is that too difficult for you to understand?

J
(if that's too difficult, I'm disagreeing with the assertion that such behaviours are either a)typical, or b)a deference to some expertise or authority.

Kenny, what the fuck has personal responsibility got to do with helping someone else in need? if you want to trade stupid caricatures of one another's political stripes, how about this:

Us evil collectivists take one another's well-being seriously, as the Machine works better with all of the cogs functioning properly (e.g., not disrupting traffic by lying in the street); and

You ruggedly individualistic conservatarians believe that when hit by a car, one ought to drag oneself up by one's own bootstraps and show up on time at the coal mine.

Pretty fucking stupid making inferences about someone's character based on how they vote, is the point. I never met one patchouli-stinking Marxist in university who didn't care very deeply about humanity as a whole, regardless of how back-asswards their politics were (are).

Liberals care about people. Conservatives care about people. As you're not intelligent enough to engage with the ideas that Jess and Mac Lorry are discussing (namely, that in crowded environments, people's behaviour is radically different than on, say, a country road), maybe you should find something else to be indignant about--meaning, other than my indignation at the notion that people who share my political outlook do not care about other people. Retard.