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Malignant Islam III: Prognosis

OK, I've gone to great lengths to discuss the problems with Islam, using a medical metaphor. First, I went over the diagnosis, then the treatment. That leaves me with the third phase: prognosis.

How well will my prescribed treatment work? What are the odds that it will take, and the tumor that is Islamism be contained -- if not destroyed?

How the hell should I know? I'm not a doctor.

I'm not an expert on anything, and I make no professions to be so. Indeed, I have developed my blogging style to reflect that -- I try to never just make pronouncements, but to show what I think and why I think it. It's a legacy of two very influential teachers in my past. The first was a high-school math teacher, who -- over and over -- told us to "show our work." It wasn't enough to give the right answer, we had to prove to her that we had arrived at it correctly and not just guessed or copied it from someone who had done the work. And even if we got the wrong answer, she would give us partial credit if we had followed the process correctly, but made a careless error along the way.

The second was my college writing teacher, who pounded into our heads three simple words: "show, don't tell." He stressed the importance of using details and descriptions in writing, to draw the reader into not just seeing words on a page, but living the experience the writer was laying out on the page. To him, it was almost obscene to write out "he looked sad." He wanted us to not tell the reader what to visualize, but guide the reader into seeing what we wanted him to see: "He frowned at the floor and let out a soft sigh. His shoulders sagged, and he wouldn't lift his eyes to meet mine -- but I could still see the redness of his eyes, the remnants of tears now past."

Anyway, here -- in several thousand words -- I have tried to show not only how I see Islam, and the problem it has with the radicals in its midst, but why I see it that way. I have also shown how I think we can best address that problem, and why I think that is the best way to do so.

Am I right or wrong? Naturally, I think I'm right. I wouldn't spend over 3,000 words (and almost two solid hours of composing and typing) if I thought I was wrong. But the only way I would know, definitively, if I was right would be if my ideas were put into practice, and I don't see that happening any time soon.

But maybe -- just maybe -- some portion of what I've thought out will provoke enough people to actually address the issues I've laid out, and maybe even consider the solutions I've proposed. Maybe some actual good might come from all this.

Stranger things have happened, after all.


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Comments (30)

JT, first I want to thank y... (Below threshold)
WildWillie:

JT, first I want to thank you for very thought provoking work. I looked forward to the next two installments after I read the first. I guess I am an official JT groupie. I don't agree with everything you have written, but I am very sure of where you stand when I finish reading your post.

I do believe that unless our country works as one, republican and democrat alike to combat islamoism, we are doomed. I think the terrorists knew how to divide us and are now smiling at the success of their work. I am afraid they know us better then we know ourselves.

In regards to islamoism, I think this is one case where a broad brush of condemnation and distrust works. I cannot trust a religion that advocates lying as long as you are lying to your enemy. Lose-Lose situation for americans. We have to not only keep striking at islamoism, but we have to turn a deaf ear to the shreikers that will state "what about their rights?" I am an american. They want to kill be because I am an american. I cannot change being an american or their mindset. So, one of us has to go. It aint going to be me if I have a say in it. ww

So if you were me, would yo... (Below threshold)
hyperbolist:

So if you were me, would you beat up/spy on/ridicule/interrogate the Muslim guy who delivers the mail in my office, Willie? Far as I know, he just wants to feed his kids.

It's not as simple as that, dude.

So if you were me, would... (Below threshold)
Clay:

So if you were me, would you beat up/spy on/ridicule/interrogate the Muslim guy who delivers the mail in my office, Willie?

Well, no. But, you don't understand that that is his prescription for you. Why? Because you have more freedom than he. He is repulsed by your freedoms and pot-smoking gay friends. He wants that to end...now. His religion cannot abide your freedom and something must give. For him it is a matter of death that it not be the honor of Allah. Unfortunately, you have already demonstrated that your freedom has a price, so your recovery ain't looking too promising.

So, you have asked the question all day, "What will you do?" I'm turning the tables on you. What will you prescribe for the patient? What nice things will you say to him to abandon his quest for your right to live?

What? It really is that simple for you, dude.

"... people like me are too... (Below threshold)
Mike G in Corvallis:

"... people like me are too stupid and naive to contribute anything to any serious discussion." -- hyperbolist

By Jove, he's right!

Well, my Muslim friends hav... (Below threshold)
hyperbolist:

Well, my Muslim friends have no problem with pot or alcohol or fornication; and they have no more problem with gay people than my Catholic aunts and uncles. They live in Canada. They're Canadians. I'm sure many Muslims here resent our liberties, but screw 'em. Many of them wanted Shari'a law, and it got shot down as it's incompatible with the values of our society. A few imbeciles (18 of them, I believe) were plotting to murder a bunch of people, but they were arrested and ridiculed for being incompetent and having no actual ties to terrorist organizations despite their leader's claims to the contrary. So what exactly are you talking about, Clay? What is it I'm supposed to be terrified of?

I want to be clear, if I ha... (Below threshold)
Clay:

I want to be clear, if I haven't been already today. Darkness is powerless to resist the light, just as tyranny is defenseless against freedom. But, neither can light coexist with the absence of light. A is A. Our best and only defense against oppression is more freedom. That is why we live in very precarious days. There is an almost imperceptible movement away from freedom - both here and abroad. Here, it can be observed in the subtle shift of an interpretation of the Constitution as the guardian of collective rights, as opposed to those of individuals. Abroad, it can be seen in the abdicating of self-evident freedoms to appease the little tin god of Islam.

The Greeks, in their war with the Persians, demonstrated that the true unity that comes from common adherence to individual freedom is more powerful than the appearance of unity that comes from common submission to centralized tyranny.

Mark Steyn is right. It is America alone.

What is it I'm supposed ... (Below threshold)
Clay:

What is it I'm supposed to be terrified of?

Shhhhhh...It's nothing. Go back to sleep.

Then start building a wall ... (Below threshold)
hyperbolist:

Then start building a wall around your country and let everybody else get on with not being terrified of violent ignoramuses in central Asia.

You say my head is in the sand; I say you're more afraid of something that, statistically speaking, is less dangerous than driving to work.

Well written, Jay. I had s... (Below threshold)
DJ Drummond:

Well written, Jay. I had some thoughts, but could not decide how to phrase them in the comments section. I apologize in advance for posting on the same topic, though in my defense I can claim to have originally published them back in 2006.

Many of them wanted Shar... (Below threshold)
Clay:

Many of them wanted Shari'a law, and it got shot down as it's incompatible with the values of our society.

Well good. You showed them. They won't try that again...will they?
Honestly. I wouldn't worry about it anymore. You've got it all covered.
Go back to sleep and the chance to dream. Really.

Well, my Muslim friends have no problem with pot or alcohol or fornication;

Yeah. I've got a Mormon friend that likes to drink my beer when he comes over to my house. Sometimes he'll even smoke one of my cigars. I'm sure that when he's at his church he's rigidly consistent and preaches the benefits of alcohol and tobacco to the other Mormons.

Yeah yeah...whatch out for ... (Below threshold)
Rawhide Rex:

Yeah yeah...whatch out for the evil Muslims. They are everywhere. LOOK! There's one hiding under the couch! Look out!! He's gonna gethca!!!

I just love fear mongering. Dam..what a sad existance to live in fear like that.

What is it I'm supposed ... (Below threshold)
ODA315:

What is it I'm supposed to be terrified of?

I believe the people in the WTC towers could answer that question as could the crewman on the DDG Cole, or the embassey workers in africa, or Leon Kilnghofer, or the '72 Israeli olymipians, or the US Embassey workers in Tehran, or the US Marines in the Beirut barracks, or the GIs in the Kobar towers, or (fill in the blank).

What do they all have in common?

I'd guess a belief that "nothing terrifying" was going to happen to them.

"I'm sure many Muslims here... (Below threshold)

"I'm sure many Muslims here resent our liberties, but screw 'em." - hyperbolist

Tell that to Mark Steyn and Ezra Levant and a bunch of others.

You say my head is in the s... (Below threshold)
LoveAmerica, Immigrant:

You say my head is in the sand; I say you're more afraid of something that, statistically speaking, is less dangerous than driving to work.
-------------------------------------
When will he move to Iran or Syria? We may use his superior intellect to turn the terrorists into charity workers. AT least we try to protect the freedom of the people who spout this non-sense. Bush must have done great job to give these people such a great sense of security. That 's quite an accomplishment.

When will he move to Ira... (Below threshold)
Clay:

When will he move to Iran or Syria?

Well, the physical move hasn't taken place...but, the ideological move is complete.

I would look on muslims wit... (Below threshold)
WildWillie:

I would look on muslims with suspicion. I am not afraid of them. I am untrusting of them. They alone can gain my trust back. Let's see some of Hyperbolist Muslim friends demonstrate in the streets to show their disdain for Islamoism. That has not and will not happen because they either agree with the terrorists that we should die unless you are Muslim or they are afraid of their own brothers and sisters. Either way, it is a very evil religion. Defend away hyperbolist, but your stripes have been revealed. Please do as Clay suggests and move to Syria for a year or two and see if you came back, alive. Make sure to tell the Syrians about your gay, pot smoking buddies too. After all, you have nothing to fear. Right? ww

What is it I'm supposed ... (Below threshold)
Clay:

What is it I'm supposed to be terrified of?

I'm merely advocating an abundant jealousy for one's liberty. My plan is to be more active defending my liberty than others who wish to limit my freedom. You seem to feel that the restrictions on your right to speak is in accordance with a civilized society. I see it as another step towards despotism. See, I may be free to say whatever I wish, but I impose my own limits because I wish to have friends, for instance. But, I am free to weigh my social standing against my beliefs in the free market of ideas. It's my choice, not my government's.

"It is the common fate of the indolent to see their rights become a prey to the active. The condition upon which God hath given liberty to man is eternal vigilance; which condition if he break, servitude is at once the consequence of his crime and the punishment of his guilt." -- John Philpot Curran

By the way, Jay, this was a... (Below threshold)
Clay:

By the way, Jay, this was an excellent series. I still differ with your diagnosis, but you recovered well.

I really hate it when folks... (Below threshold)
epador:

I really hate it when folks want you to prognosticate (this is separate from making an informed decision as to what chice you want to make for therapy). I usually procrastinate as much as possible. Then I say something to the effect of "Well, overall, X% of folks in this state are still alive at 2 (or 5 or 10) years if we do A and Y% are alive at the same time interval if we do nothing. It'll be 100% one way or the other for you, and there's no way to say for certain in advance what is going to happen to you. Right now you look like you are getting [better or worse]. No matter what choice you make, you may get hit by a bus on the way out of the office and die there. I recommend you X and Y in mind, but keep your eyes open for buses."

Historically, movements like Islam have some past experience to teach us, and we may get a hint of what is to come if we do A or do nothing, but I think besides proceeding with A, we better keep our eyes open for fast moving buses made in China and India.

I, too, would like to comme... (Below threshold)

I, too, would like to commend JT for an excellent series and for everyone for the civility of the discussion in these comment threads.

It has suddenly occurred to me that the argument presented herein mainly by hyberbolist can be equally applied to vaccination, to wit: the chances my children contracting diphteria, polio, and tetanus is almost infinitesimally small (in fact, much smaller than getting into an automobile accident) so there really is no point in going through with their DPT shots, right? And, isn't my insistence that my children get their shots just some sort of psychological problem on my part?

Isn't this hyberbolist's argument in a nutshell?

Well, the physical move has... (Below threshold)
LoveAmerica, Immigrant:

Well, the physical move hasn't taken place...but, the ideological move is complete.
------------------------------------
That 's probably why Canada is now trying to silence people like Mark Steyn. What a sad country it has become! Maybe we can send the people from Gitmo to live in Canada and build a wall to make sure they don't come down here. Since Canada is trying to kick foreign workers with cancer out of the country, they can make room for the jihadists to show their "tolerance" towards radical Islam (and their intolerance for free speech). Maybe they are so secure (or so scare depending on your perspective) that they will make Sharia the official law of the land.

Excellent continuation of t... (Below threshold)
epador:

Excellent continuation of the health metaphor OM.

Canada disrepects freedoms ... (Below threshold)
WildWillie:

Canada disrepects freedoms so much that Fox News, by law, could not be accessed through any means. Only recently that changed. Why is that? What do Canadians fear? ww

Umm, shitty news? We have o... (Below threshold)
hyperbolist:

Umm, shitty news? We have our own conservative news anchors that drop race cards and spend ten minutes rehashing silly gaffes as though they're policy disasters. Fox News is now available here because, if we were to allow Al-Jazeera to be broadcast, as we do, then we have to allow Fox, because it's the opposite side of the same coin.

I know you don't agree, but I still laugh about the remarks on Barack and Michelle's "terrorist fist-bump". 'Cause that's what terrorists do to express delight with one another, right? They're one and the same with the New York Yankees! Also, they referred to Michelle as Barack's "baby mama", which is a reference to black single mothers who have been abandoned by their child's fathers. Classy. But fret not, Willie, we can now indulge in America's worst export (apart from Bud Light).

LAI, is my government really trying to deport foreign workers with cancer? Source, please? I could see it if somebody with cancer moved here with the expectation that they would receive treatment instantly, as our system is drastically under-funded and over-burdened as it is. (There are solutions to this that don't involve raising taxes, such as allowing doctors from Pakistan and India to practice here, rather than bowing to the implicitly racist edicts of whichever professional associations that insist on obstructing this common-sense step forward.)

Not the worst metaphor, OregonMuse, except that vaccinating your kid doesn't cost very much and doesn't involve other people dying. Also, vaccinations do not cause other diseases, whereas it seems trying to play geopolitical whack-a-mole in Afghanistan and Iraq has incited a great deal more violence in the region than was taking place prior to the invasion.

LAI, is my government reall... (Below threshold)
LoveAmerica, Immigrant:

LAI, is my government really trying to deport foreign workers with cancer? Source, please?
-------------------------------------
Hyperbolist, your country is really broken and becoming a heartless socialist "utopia". I found your posts usually fact-free and I am amused by your logic. Yup, the allies attacked Germany in Europe did inspire more violence from Hitler. What a surprise! (Note that Pearl Harbor was attacked by Japan). According to your logic, appeasement and surrender to become slaves will not inspire more violence. Is that why Canada trying to nuke free speech now? I think if you make Sharia the official law of the land, it will reduce violence against Canadians. Better be submitted to Jihadism soon to help stop violence.

http://hotair.com/archives/2008/06/10/canada-deports-cancer-patient-to-save-costs/

Got that? They wanted Juana to come to Canada so she could serve Canadians who needed home health care. When Juana got sick, the same health care service for which she worked couldn't be bothered to foot the bill for her treatments. Juana worked and paid into that system for three years before they discovered that she would "cause excessive demand" for her treatment.
Now, let's imagine that a private health insurer pulled that kind of stunt. It would make headlines, and political candidates across the spectrum would start including Juana as the victim of the corporate, profit-centered mentality of the American health care system. Except, of course, it doesn't happen. Insurers can't kick people off their rolls for getting cancer after their coverage starts, and the US government doesn't deport legal immigrants for dying before they've serviced enough Americans to make them worthwhile.
Government-run health care rations treatment. It sets limits and conditions on access to health care, and generates irrational solutions such as this. And only the power of the government could have resulted in the deportation of a low-wage recruit into that system because she needed the very services she supported.

Yeah, my friend is a lawyer... (Below threshold)
hyperbolist:

Yeah, my friend is a lawyer who decides based on projected costs and prognoses who gets treatment here; who gets subsidized to fly to Buffalo (or wherever); and who gets denied treatment and funding. He has the worst job of anyone I know. The Romanow Report, published a few years ago, explained what we need to fix our health care system. Note, though, that even for the Conservative Party, privatizing health care is not an option. It's still cheaper per patient here than it is in the United States, we just don't have enough funds in the system. We also have a huge budget surplus and very, very low corporate tax rates, so it's not like we aren't in a position to address it. I'm optimistic. If it's worse in five years, and not better as it could and should be, then I'll reevaluate. But I agree, deporting someone who was imported to provide health care is a disgusting gaffe in a long series of them committed under the supervision of Stephen Harper's Conservative government. He's incompetent and unlikeable, and an incredibly bad judge of character when it comes to who he surrounds himself with, and he needs to go back to his oil money think-tank in North Texas (Alberta).

As for Sharia law, we've already addressed it, and told the people who want to impose it upon themselves that it's illiberal and un-Canadian. The issue might be reopened, but so should it be: I'm all for examining and re-examining ideas, for keeping our society in a state of reflexive equilibrium, regardless of how bad the other ideas might be.

I acknowledge that I can be a dick, as I have a temper and not enough time to proofread everything (especially while at work). I have to say, though, that your tone is consistently that of an asshole--you're smarmy, smug, and always triumphant when you sling your broken record of criticisms at people who have intractable ideological differences with you. You never ask questions, but only make assumptions based on your uncharitable caricature of liberals. I'm not pouting--I'm saying that if you took a more measured tone, and tried to demonstrate an iota of empathy with those whom you disagree with, you would be taken more seriously. I read this blog because I like arguing with intelligent conservatives (whatever happened to kim?), but you rarely show yourself to be one of them.

Hyperbolist, I gues... (Below threshold)
LoveAmerica, Immigrant:

Hyperbolist,
I guess you are upset when the facts are shown to you so you resort to the typical liberal distraction. Unfortunately, Canada is fast becoming a heartless socialist utopia. And according to your logic, you need to turn Canada into an Islamic country soon to help stop the violence. I am just following your logic here and try to give you the facts. If you don't like facts and logic, then not much I can do for you. Whine and use ad-hominen attack if you like, but that is not intelligent at all!

BTW, even when Canada can p... (Below threshold)
LoveAmerica, Immigrant:

BTW, even when Canada can parasitically take advantage of the research spending in the US, it cannot even take care of its own citizens, much less the foreign workers. That 's another unpleasant fact. Socialism will bankrupt any country in the end. Unfortunately, liberals don't want to learn from history. That 's just the fact. I know people would rather live in their dreamworld in general.

Thanks for making my point.... (Below threshold)
hyperbolist:

Thanks for making my point. Have a nice weekend.

Thanks for making my point.... (Below threshold)
LoveAmerica, Immigrant:

Thanks for making my point. Have a nice weekend.
-----------------------------------
You are welcomed. Let us know how things are really going in Canda.




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