I'd point to Freedom Works and Dick Armey as fueling the Tea Party movement, but that's beside the point.

Of the two groups, I'm philosophically aligned with the Coffee crowd. But the Tea faction is far more necessary to American democracy.

It's Projection.

Liberals always accuse others of the very things they're guilty of. Always!

The left has always pursued Orwellian arguments and slogans. They project their own shortcomings upon everyone else.

Of course you don't attack the media for their treatment of the "birthers" who have legitimate questions about the BC (who takes the word of an unsworn, biased website, and the progressively carefully parsed words of a "health director"), and or Natural Born Citizen eligibilty because of his alien father. You participate w/ the media whole hog on that issue! I don't know your situation, but I suspect it may be personal. You recently sided with an Obmama operative and propagandist right here on your own blog (smrstrauss exposed as OBOT operative)
http://jeffersonsrebels.blogspot.com/2010/03/smrstrauss-total-reveal-their-tangled.html
Right, you want to concentrate on the "real issue". Meanwhile you whine and cry about the injustice, the socialism, the dirty Chicago politics, to no avail, yet you have the Kyptonite of Obama directly in front of you. You have the platform to put the pressure on him to answer questions that no one will ask (no one in the media has asked the question, "Since Obama admits to being a dual citizen at birth, how can he be a Natural Born Citizen?"). You instead berate those who ask this legitimate Constitutional question and side with OBOT propagandists in ridiculing them.
Well they still may pass the HC bill despite the fact that 55% of the public doesn't want it and they get a 10% approval, despite all the whining. He has still taken over private business despite all the whining. He still has chained our great grandchildren to debt despite all the whining.
Here is a practical example of the Natural Born citizen requirement. 12,000 children since 2003 have been born in the US to Turkish citizen parents who come here for "birth tourism" (to have their babies in the US). These children are born of alien parents who have no ties to this country. They can take them back to Turkey and when they are 21 they can come back here, and at 35 (since they will have resided in the US for 14 years) they can, by your screwy belief, become POTUS. Do you really believe that these children are Natural Born Citizens, with the attachment and allegiance to this country, to be POTUS? How about the 50% (yes that's correct) of babies born in L.A. to illegal aliens?
http://www.hurriyetdailynews.com/n.php?n=birth-tourism-to-the-usa-explodes-2010-03-12
You may ban me for this post, but that just makes you as bad as the media that you harrangue in your article.

Mick, the media treats birthers like raving loons.

And I wholeheartedly approve of that. The birthers ARE raving loons who are so wrapped up in their quixotic quest to achieve the impossible that they ignore the serious fights that can be fought and won.

What I don't approve of is how the birthers' looniness lets the rest of the anti-Obama people be lumped in with the raving loons.

Go be a raving loon somewhere else, Mick. We already have more than our Recommended Daily Allowance of raving loons.

Oh, and take your stratified concept of citizenship (the "mostly Americans" and the "real Americans") and shove it up your ass.

Sideways.

J.

You still fail to understand the national security aspect of the requirement. It doesn't give any more rights to any class of citizens. People born here of alien parents are certainly subject to the jurisdiction of a foreign country, and are certainly not eligible to be POTUS, no matter if that applies to you or not (and I believe it does, as evidenced by your common reaction). I don't particularly care if the Leftist media, with the help of the uninformed and easily scared "right" media, ridicules it or not. The truth sets me free. No one here on this blog, or any blog for that matter has proven me wrong, despite their best attempts. One guy here even dug so deep to prove that there was ONE exception by accessing a handwritten census worker entry for Spiro Agnew's father(which was clearly an error). Obmama is marching along with his agenda while you whine and complain and refuse to use the weapon to stop him, because you are scared of ridicule by the propagandists??!!??

Green, your streak is unbroken.

Mick's is just starting.

Mick, if you pried your head out of your ass for a minute, you'd see that Steve Green is doing exactly what I said would happen -- using the birther nuts (you, in this case) to broad-brush everyone else.

It's not the ridicule that I'm afraid of. It's that the ridicule is entirely justified -- and I cheerfully take part in it.

"The truth sets you free?" Let me help you with that. I hereby set you free from this blog.

The "birther" bullshit had its full airing here a couple of weeks ago. It is NOT coming back on this thread.

And if that makes me sound like Charles Johnson a little... so be it. I cite the broken clock argument -- he can't be wrong ALL the time.

J.

"It's not beside the point that Jay attempted to make, as he denies that the Tea Party has its roots in a planned astroturf campaign funded by...who knows?"

Green just proved the point handily.

"People born here of alien parents are certainly subject to the jurisdiction of a foreign country...."

How so? Being born here automatically confers US citizenship; unlike many other countries where you are still considered a citizen of your parents home country. You MAY have dual citizenship, but upon reaching majority (18) will have to state to which country you will claim citizenship.

Seems to me mainstream Republicans, have been nearly as loathing in their attacks on the idiocy and delightful ignorance of Sarah Palin, as any Democrat has, if not more so.

This, from a 60 minutes story with Steve Schmidt, whose desperate 'hail mary' idea, was to nominate Palin, in the first place:

even after crash-course tutorials by campaign aides following the convention, Palin was still woefully uninformed about basic policy issues.

"[S]he still didn't really understand why there was a North Korea and a South Korea," Heilemann told the program's Anderson Cooper. "She was still regularly saying that Saddam Hussein had been behind 9/11."

And the left supporters are disappointed with Obama because he has turned out to be a pragmatic center-left politician, perhaps too pragmatic and too much a politician. I really don't think Obama is remotely like Palin.

But, for all the experience and wisdom of Wizbang, I remember by, a huge majority, including Jay, nearly all the commentators on this page, in a straw vote voted for Fred Thompson as the GOP nominee, before he dropped out. There's 'a hard working guy '; wouldn't you have been disappointed too?

At it's core, the left understands (since JFK) the power of the good looking candidate (Obama even came complete with attacked halos, pillars, rainbows,and a forever upwards lifted chin(just like Moussalini) Theye sold us shots of him in swim trunks for the ladies to drool over etc. His ability to speak "clean English" was the kicker for them to dumb an ever ;less attractive Hillary.

Then the right decides it will run with Sarah and the panic was immediate -plus she not oon looked good but could give a dymnamic audience rousing speech (without robotic looking back and forth at twin teleprompters) and she had to be stopped. All the rest is nonsense and nuance -It's her attractiveness and they know and fear it. The American people vote for it and experience and economic savy can be faked (look at Obama)So let's crank up the Photoshop software and begin the next election.

They fear Sarah bec

Steve:

In Fred Thompson's case, that lack of fire in the belly wasn't a bug, it was a feature. It was a healthy part of why I liked the guy -- he wasn't all-consumed with a need for the job. He saw it as a duty.

As far as that book you cite... I don't give it any credibility. Sorry.

But if you'd like me to recap the incredibly stupid things said AND DONE by Obama and Biden, Steve, I'll be glad to poke through my own personal archives here...

Feel free to argue that Biden is smarter than Palin. It's obvious that Biden thinks he's smarter than pretty much anyone. It's even more obvious that the guy has one of the most severe cases of "honestly believing his own bullshit" ever recorded in history.

And, you might recall, Palin was up against Biden, not Obama.

J.

So Steve, even the thought of Sarah Palin still gets your knickers in a twist doesn't it? And Obama center left??? Wow! You'll not only take the unsubstantiated word of a couple of jealous hacks regarding Palin but you will also ignore actual recorded words and documented actions of Obama just to be sure your "reality" fits your preconceptions. You really hold tight to your prejudices don't you?

Reading this thread gives me a flash of Nightmare at 20,000 feet in reverse: everyone else can see SG out on the wing making comments except for me. I kind of like it that way.

Sorry, Obama's nominations and appointemnts for the important positions in his cabinet team, have not been to the left: Biden, Hillary Clinton, Gates, Bernanke and Geithner are all close to the center and or, because they have beeen close to the ways and power of Washington for some time.

Personally, I find the personality of Sarah palin very refreshing. It is just that she doesn't have any academic or historical knowledge or has developed any interest, up until now, in world affairs, and this after all would be for the most important position in the world.

Crickmore, don't use the word "mainstream" when you mean Establishment. There is a difference -- especially now that you guys are the Establishment.

"Sorry, Obama's nominations and appointemnts for the important positions in his cabinet team, have not been to the left"

Ok I can respond to this now. It took me a while to stop laughing at how myopic it is. Biden is a cypher and an idiot. He is a centrist only in the respect that Obama is so far left of everyone else that they all appear to be centrists.

Clinton is not her husband, who could have been argued o be a centrist. She was always regarded as significantly to the left of Bill and she has been given to the same socialist/authoritarian moves that Obama has tried. Go look up Hillarycare to see what I mean.

Gates and Bernanke are carry overs. These did not take imagination or guts. Like Clinto before him, Obama is stuck trying to find a moderate Republican to fill the Sec. of Defense position because there isn't a single dem who could fill that position with any credibility.

Geitner is an abject failure. He is not centrist, unless by centrist you mean that he actually held a job. I suppose that in dem circles holding a job and actually working for a living is only something a conservative would do. I suppose by that estimate I can understand your viewpoint.

As to Palin lacking in academic knowledge, I suppose that you would cite Obama's references to the 57-60 states as being demonstrative of his learning? Or perhaps you would prefer to cite his confusing the Declaration of Independence with the Preamble to the Constitution?

Obama is a historical idiot. He knows little or nothing of US history. He presents himself to be a constitutional scholar until he gets called on it and then his lackeys come forth pleading that he really isn't.

Steve Crickmore, I agree with you on this- "I really don't think Obama is remotely like Palin." although I am sure don't mean it like you do. Obummer couldn't carry Saracuda's socks.

Palin Derangement Syndrome as a displacement for criticism of Obama is a bit of a stretch.

PDS stems from the fear that she will defeat them. A fear born of the truth that yes, she will defeat them.

"People born here of alien parents are certainly subject to the jurisdiction of a foreign country...."

Birthers ar the nuttiest of all nuts.

I was first apalled, now I'm just kind of amused at the rage the lefties have against Palin. Case in point - browse around in the Amazon discussion forum for her book. Let's see... she stole her baby (or swapped it, not sure which...), shot wolves (evil, since wolves are just dogs, right? And who'd go around shooting puppies?) It's actually gotten a lot better lately - but go back a page or two and the leftists are utterly rabid in their dislike.

And they feel so justified in being so...

A common enemy will unite people and keep them united more readily than anything else. Without a common enemy the various factions of a political union will fracture and split because of conflicting goals and individual aspirations. If a common enemy does not exist one will be created.

The thread is getting late, so I'm just including a few links to support my opinions. As to Obama's center-left description, whether it is accurate, here is David Brooks on Obama,
"The fact is, Obama is as he always has been, a center-left pragmatic reformer"

and as to Palin's rather idiosyncratic vertigo academic record, if you can call it that? see 'Sarah Palin's College Daze'
Why did she attend five different colleges?Not surprising, it kind of foreshadows her political career. Has she ever finished anything?

In my opinion this is what the small portions of the republican party of "birthers, baggers and blowhards" have brought you. They are good at "Follow the Leader" of their dullard leaders, they listen to Beck, Hedgecock, Hannity, O'Reilly, Rush and Savage and the rest of the Blowhards. Are you surprise at what they do when you know what they think? The world is complicated and most republicans (Hamiliton, Lincoln, Roosevelt) believe that we should use government a little to increase social mobility, now its about dancing around the claim of government is the problem. Although most republicans are trying to distant themselves from this fringe they have a long way to go.