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This won't be the first unintended consequence of DADT

But it's likely to be one of the first:

As Congressional Democrats pushed for repeal of "Don't Ask, Don't Tell,"--clearing the way for gays to serve openly in the U.S. military--allied forces were encountering problems with homosexual conduct among members of the Afghan security forces.

...

A source at Army Special Operations command tells In From the Cold that Afghan women, emboldened by the presence of U.S. troops. have complained about beatings they've suffered at the hands of their husbands. The domestic violence reportedly stemmed from the inability of the women to become pregnant and produce sons, highly valued in Afghan society.

When U.S. civil affairs teams (and other special forces units) quietly investigated the problem, they quickly discovered a common denominator. Virtually all of the younger men who beat their wives (over their inability to become pregnant) had been former "apprentices" of older Afghan men, who used them for their sexual pleasure. Upon entering marriage, whatever the men knew of sex had been learned during their "apprenticeship," at the hands of the older man. To put it bluntly, some of the younger Afghans were unfamiliar with the desired (and required) mechanics for contraception.

To remedy this situation, the Army called in its psychological operations teams, which developed information campaigns in Pashtun areas, explaining the basics of heterosexual relations and their benefits, in terms of producing male offspring. It may be the only time in the history of warfare that an army has been required to explain sex to the native population, to curb the abuse of women and young boys--and retain U.S. influence in key geographic areas.

Army psy op specialists declined to discuss their efforts in great detail. But one of the "preferred sex" campaigns was (reportedly) a direct result of the 2009 survey, and the problems encountered by NATO troops working with their Afghan counterparts.

While no one in Kabul (or the Pentagon) will admit it, the recent repeal of DADT may complicate the "sex ed" mission in Afghanistan. From the western perspective, there is a difference between relations among consenting, adult members of the same military, and young boys being traded into sexual bondage with older men. But the Afghans don't see it that way--and that may lead to problems down the road.

Inculcating the  notion that homosexuality is normal and simply yet another way of living out one's sexuality in the military is going to be problematic in a variety of ways as others will attest but here you have one very tactical and real issue that we will now have to counter... and doing so has just been made quite complicated.

There's a price to be paid when the moral fences of society are taken down. 

H/T to Dennis Sevakis via email.


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Comments (29)

On the other hand, it might... (Below threshold)
epador:

On the other hand, it might make it easier for our forces to deal with them.

Virtually all of the you... (Below threshold)
Jay Guevara:

Virtually all of the younger men who beat their wives (over their inability to become pregnant) had been former "apprentices" of older Afghan men, who used them for their sexual pleasure. Upon entering marriage, whatever the men knew of sex had been learned during their "apprenticeship," at the hands of the older man. To put it bluntly, some of the younger Afghans were unfamiliar with the desired (and required) mechanics for contraception.

Sounds like prime territory for new Democrat voters.

Do we really want them to m... (Below threshold)
JDL:

Do we really want them to make more little Islam soldiers to kill us someday?

Or maybe, we could send ove... (Below threshold)
Steve Crickmore:

Or maybe, we could send over gay military chaplans to marry them.... Just kidding.

I sincerely doubt there wil... (Below threshold)

I sincerely doubt there will be any problems, despite all the wailing and gnashing of teeth by the supporters of the ban on Gay Americans in the military. All of our allies have successfully and uneventfully integrated Lesbians and Gay men into their militaries without problems. And most American military personnel already say they serve or have served with Gay soldiers without any problems.

I think it's also important to note that when young men age 18-25 register for Selective Service, they are not asked about their sexual orientation. And I suspect that if the United States ever finds itself in a major military conflict that requires reinstatement of the draft, the issue of Gays in the military is going to be the LEAST of our worries.

For what it's worth, I really don't care if any soldier, Gay OR Straight, is disciplined or booted out of the military because of inappropriate conduct when on-duty.

That's not what's at issue here. A qualified soldier should not be at risk for losing his career simply because of who he's dating on his own time. Under DADT, if Sgt. Mike is dating another man off-base, and his commanding officer is informed of this and asks him about it, Sgt. Mike can either lie or tell the truth. Either way he is jeopardizing his military career.

Hold all soldiers to the same standards of professional behavior, regardless of their sexual orientation, and the military will be able to do its job just fine.

The homophobic Christian ha... (Below threshold)
Woop Dere It Its:

The homophobic Christian haters on the right are busily stirring up shit over DADT.

It's your tax dollars at work, Rick. The rich got their tax cut and the Dem got START and DADT (and a few other things) in return.

Sour grapes? It's your party making these trades... you've only yourselves to blame.

Uh, should "mechanics of co... (Below threshold)
jim2:

Uh, should "mechanics of contraception" have been "mechanics of conception"?

Comparing our military to a... (Below threshold)
WildWillie:

Comparing our military to any of our allies is just crazy. No comparison. The military numbers numbers are that of a small country. So, find another analogy. ww

"All of our allies have suc... (Below threshold)
GarandFan:

"All of our allies have successfully and uneventfully integrated Lesbians and Gay men into their militaries without problems."

ALL?

Since when?

And who determined "without problems"?

Or maybe, we could send ... (Below threshold)
Jay Guevara:

Or maybe, we could send over gay military chaplans to marry them.... Just kidding.

Or at least help them look fabulous!

If men shouldn't worry abou... (Below threshold)
YaHump:

If men shouldn't worry about showering with gay men, then military women shouldn't worry either about showering with men.

Barney Frank <a href="http:... (Below threshold)
Steve Crickmore:

Barney Frank answers that convincingly.

How prevalent is AIDS among... (Below threshold)
Jay Guevara:

How prevalent is AIDS among Afghans? Now, I mean?

The homophobic Christian... (Below threshold)
TexBob:

The homophobic Christian haters on the right are busily stirring up shit over DADT.

Actually Whoopieshit, it's pro homos like you stirring the shit with shoving the homo lifestyle in everyone's face from kindergarten to prime time TV in the effort to convince folks that using alimentary canals for sexual release is normal and good.

Sorry, you don't have to hateful to NOT agree with this behavior. Only the hateful and intolerant homo activists (like yourself?) think anyone who disagrees with it is wrong.

I don't have to tolerate it or agree with with it when it is shoved in my face.

It's truly a shame folks can't keep their personal sex life in the bedroom where it belongs and assholes like you can stick to HuffPo or Dem Underground.

Hey TexBob - the rich got t... (Below threshold)
Woop dere It Is:

Hey TexBob - the rich got their tax cut and your Republican leaders gave the Dems DADT passage (and a few other things) in return.

Looks like the rich get richer and the homophobes hicks like you get the shaft....again.

How does it feel to be worthless and unwanted?

Wait... So the Afghans are ... (Below threshold)
jim m:

Wait... So the Afghans are having anal sex with their wives because they are too stupid to figure it out? These people are trying to kill us and we are helping them reproduce?

Maybe we do need some homosexual soldiers over there.

How does it feel to be w... (Below threshold)
Jay Guevara:

How does it feel to be worthless and unwanted?

It feels like ... leftism.

Chuck,Required to ... (Below threshold)
hcddbz:

Chuck,

Required to register is not the same as serving.
Before DADT you were asked if you were Homosexual and or engaged in gay sex. If you said no and then were found out to be you were kicked out of the military for fraudulent enlistment. In other word you lied.
Being gay was one of a number of reason that you would be disqualified to serve. DADT was because Clinton stated no one asked these people and then kicked them out. Which was a lie so he created DADT to cover up his misstatements.

I was in before and after DADT went into affect. It was done for two reasons. 1 because the Gay lobby backed Clinton. The Gay lobby did not care about Gay service members they carried about Gay marriage period point blank. Military members have dependents once Gays are recognized then the next suit will be to allow their life partner;s the same status as as wives. Also for states that allowed gay marriage the Federal government will also do so. This will make national gay marriage a fete accompli.

2. it was a response to all the hand ringing over Tail Hook. If there was less male swagger in the military women would be afford more respect. Though there was some very legitimate complaints and responsible should have been punished it because witch hunt and Navy core values like Tradition were tossed out. Only a few years later the IG admitted that exaggerated the findings to embarrass the Navy and the rest of the military. The reason i bring this up was that the probation on Gay in the military dates back to George Washington.

The repeal will just cost the country lots of law suits. The lower enlisted ranks will start to demand private accommodations such as showers and rooms. There be a break down as no loads who are gay will complain they are being picked and bring up supervisors on every slight. You'll have parents saying there son were killed or sent in harms way because they were gay.

The Military will of course deal with it.


Maybe teaching the Pastun's... (Below threshold)
Matt:

Maybe teaching the Pastun's to breed is not in our best long-term interest?

what I'm going to wr... (Below threshold)
inge:


what I'm going to write may offends the 'pro-homosexuals'; they appear to be offended quite often, although they are the last people gving me MY right not to agree, labeling me with all kinds of offensive names!

Let's call a spade a spade:
Homosexuality = sodomy; which is not only immoral, but also dangerous healthwise.
God condems sodomy!

Now, recently the drugs which would help breastcancer women are being denied to the same because of cost!

What about the coctails, and cure of drugs for Aids/HIV within the homosexual community, who are most afflicted by this disease due to lifestyle choices,incl the STD's.

Will they be denied due to cost, remember these drugs are more expensive then the breast cancer drugs? Since being in the Armed Forces, drugcosts are carried by taxpayers, would that be fair, by supporting a lifestyle which is unhealthy, and immoral? Why we deny breastcancer drugs to woman, who are NOT by choice ill with this disease?

I would like to know the answer to that!

Is it our business to help ... (Below threshold)
mag:

Is it our business to help them breed? Good God, what is this country about....let's start worry about America, her people and her interest and the hell with the rest of the world.

I don't think we should be in any country...let them fight their own battles...and if the comes here then we all fight. Not one of those countries are worth 1 American life (gay or straight).

hcddbz said it well. Just b... (Below threshold)
WildWillie:

hcddbz said it well. Just because I think homosexuality is a depraved, sexually deviant behavior doesn't mean I hate anyone. In fact I have more pity for these souls then anything else. God's law, is God's law. Just because our leaders embrace the lifestyle doesn't change God's law and condemnation of the act one bit. The poor soul's are not asking for forgiveness, they are mocking. ww

Just because I think hom... (Below threshold)
Jay Guevara:

Just because I think homosexuality is a depraved, sexually deviant behavior doesn't mean I hate anyone. In fact I have more pity for these souls then anything else.

Same here. My repugnance isn't based on religious principle, but rather on public health grounds. (Male) homosexuality spreads disease - not just AIDS, but syphilis, gonorrhea, and hepatitis B, this last the disease that epidemiologists initially used to model AIDS, because it is transmitted in the same way and affects the same populations).

Male homosexuals are apparently the major reservoirs of STDs in the population, i.e., without them, the STD incidence would be considerably lower than it is at present.

Note that this explains why male homosexuality is more disparaged than female, which presents no such public health hazard. I suspect that Biblical injunctions against (male) homosexuality, like those against incest, and eating pork and shellfish, originated from public health considerations.

Not well thought out. Tons ... (Below threshold)
john doeskii:

Not well thought out. Tons of unintended consequences and major disruption. For instance. This repeal will open the door for "Trans Gendered" soldiers. What barracks will they be assigned? Also, what about the partially trans gendered? Women who have had their breast removed and take hormones to be male but still have female genitial? Or men who take hormones and have breast implants but still have male genitial? Keep in mind that poor hormone maintenance dictates that when the artificial hormones wear off the previous chacracteristics return. Where will these creatures shower? Will female solders stay in the same baracks as "Chaz Bono"? Or would he/she shower with the men? I don't believe Chaz has the full male toolset. He/she could claim discrimination. This will eventually end up at the supreme court.

Congress says that gays hav... (Below threshold)
Greta:

Congress says that gays have a right to serve openly. Being gay means you are attracted to people of the same sex. Last time I looked, there have been about a zillion movies about guys trying to or actually finding a way to see into womens showers or dressing rooms because they are sexually attracted to women, especially naked. Some supporters of these new rights that your sexual attraction is OK when gay try to say that gay men are not aroused by the sight of naked men. Does gay porn not show naked men to attract a gay audience? Are gays that different from hetro's that they are not attracted to the naked body of those they say they are sexually attracted to? If a guy sees a picture of a naked women, does he not stop to look? Not being gay, I may be wrong on how gay sexual attraction works. I do know that when a guy is looking at another guy in a certain way, he might be soon walking around with a broken nose or a few less teeth. I do know that there is a natural revulsion that most people feel when they see two guys kissing for the majority of Americans. So how does anyone honestly say that suddenly, guys, especially soldiers with high levels of testoserone are not going to have a problem being naked around OPENLY GAY soldiers? Confused on this point.

Second, if there is a new right to access to those we are sexually attracted to by the federal government which this repeal seems to be saying, how does the government now deny the hetrosexual soldier equal access to shower with those they are sexually attracted to? Just look at this from a pure legal standpoint. It appears that the congress has created this new sexual attraction access right, forget the terms gay or hetro and just use sexual attraction access, has it not?

Third, if they now have this new sexual attraction right, are they going to lay out an acceptable response to those who are confronted by the openly sexually attracted soldier? Is putting his nose back about 2 feet OK? OK, no violence. If reported will the open sexually attracted person be punished or discharged or handled in the same way as a hetro male going to aggessively after a woman?

What is going to be the policy about spouses in the military to the new openly sexually attracted person?

But hell, this is only a few of the issues that this policy has started because the gay person simply cannot control their sexual attraction. Of course this will have no impact on the military during the time of war. Seems like if the gay community cared at all about the country and its military during this crisis of war, they could have told congress to wait so as to not force the issue now. But they care little about anything but their single agenda of forcing people to say this perverted lifestyle is normal

The connection to DADT is t... (Below threshold)
Howie:

The connection to DADT is truly stupid. Thank the original writer of the article for dropping my IQ 5 points for reading it.

“In her report, Ms. Cardina... (Below threshold)
pa:

“In her report, Ms. Cardinalli observed that prevailing sexual attitudes in some parts of Afghanistan are creating a cycle damaging to boys and young men:
“There is frequently the risk that Pashtun boys will face a set of experiences that mold their beliefs regarding sexuality as adults in ways that are ultimately damaging, both to themselves and to Afghan society,” the report concludes. “It appears that this set of experiences becomes cyclical, affecting generations, and that this cycle that has existed long enough to affect the underpinnings of Afghan culture itself.”
Isn’t it politically incorrect to make a statement like this? People who pointed out similar consequences for gays in modern societies were shouted down mercilessly and made out to be haters and worse. American laws seek to punish people who make critical observations about gays. American schools endorse homosexuality with lessons tailored for even the youngest students. Seems to me that the widespread and well-accepted gay lifestyle in evidence in Afghanistan is pretty much the desired objective of gay activists in the Western world. If homosexuality in Afghanistan produces a “cycle that has existed long enough to affect the underpinnings of Afghan culture itself,” then isn’t it reasonable to conclude that the same result will occur in American and Western culture?

the repeal of don't ask don... (Below threshold)
joe:

the repeal of don't ask don't tell (cuz I really don't care to know what you do sexually)
or stop advertising, T.M.I. (too much information)

Not well thought out. Tons of unintended consequences and major disruption. For instance. This repeal will open the door for "Trans Gendered" soldiers. What barracks will they be assigned? Also, what about the partially trans gendered? Women who have had their breast removed and take hormones to be male but still have female genitalia? Or men who take hormones and have breast implants but still have male genitalia? Keep in mind that poor hormone maintenance dictates that when the artificial hormones wear off the previous characteristics return. Where will these creatures shower? Will female solders stay in the same barracks as "Chaz Bono"? Or would he/she shower with the men? I don't believe Chaz has the full male toolset. He/she could claim discrimination. This will eventually end up at the supreme court.

"Tons of unintended cons... (Below threshold)
Woop dere It Is:

"Tons of unintended consequences and major disruption."

The same kind of right wing bullshit was spewed when blacks troops were allowed to bunk with the white troops.




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