« What the Wisconsin union uproar is really about | Main | Texting fun »

Death Wish

Two stories came out last week, two stories that paint a very, very ugly picture about the Obama administration and its notions of "border security."

The first: a report by an ATF agent that he was assigned to track stolen guns -- and when given the chance to seize them, was ordered to allow the guns to "walk" and continue right into the hands of Mexican drug cartels. The theory, he was told, was that the intelligence gained by following the guns and the trail of possession they passed through was more valuable than the risks of letting those guns get into the hands of the cartels.

The second: a report on the murder of Border Patrol Agent Brian Terry last December. Terry was part of a patrol along the Mexican border when they were confronted by Mexican drug cartel gunners. The Border Patrol agents were, on the specific orders of their superiors, armed with non-lethal weapons, and opened fire with shotguns firing beanbags. The Mexicans responded with real guns -- and Agent Terry was killed.

So, here we have two policies of the Obama administration: the first, to not only allow but assist the Mexican drug cartels to get guns; the second, to deny border patrol agents from using their own guns in a lethal fashion.

Together, they form a lethal setup: the drug cartels with heavy-duty weapons, border patrol agents with beanbags. It's a formulation with only one possible outcome: American agents getting killed.

This could just be incompetence. This could just be ignorance. This could just be a case of Obama's left hand not realizing what his right hand is doing, and no one connecting the dots. But that can't be; we've been told, repeatedly, that Obama is brilliant. That he's surrounded himself with the best and brightest, and they know just what they're doing.

So, the inescapable conclusion: the Obama administration is trying to get US agents killed. It's not clear why, what purpose their deaths will serve, but that's the only conclusion one can draw.

TrackBack

TrackBack URL for this entry:
/cgi-bin/mt-tb.cgi/41201.

Comments (56)

My suspicion is that Barry ... (Below threshold)
jim m:

My suspicion is that Barry has filled the White House with La Raza/Mecha sympathizers who have bought into his BS that we should surrender the American South West back to Mexico and that the US is perpetrating a crime by holding onto that land. If so then it isn't that they want the Border Patrol to die in these confrontations it's just that they want the Mexicans to win. Even if he are violent, criminal, drug-running Mexicans, the left want them to defeat the US and take back 1/3 of our nation.

Barry has no interest in defending America even from minor thugs from Mexico. He just doesn't care. He's more interested in protecting his union friends so they can keep stealing money from the American taxpayer.

Imagine for a moment that y... (Below threshold)
Carolyn:

Imagine for a moment that you are a "bad guy" and live in any country other than the USA and that you've just read this;
The Border Patrol agents were, on the specific orders of their superiors, armed with beanbags.
Our United States of America has become everybody's fool.

"This could just be incompe... (Below threshold)
GarandFan:

"This could just be incompetence. This could just be ignorance."

How about incompetence due to ignorance? Since Day One, this administration has shown that 'the best and brightest' ........ aren't.

Don't hold your breath waiting for 'higher ups' to be held accountable.

Jay it was all to setup the... (Below threshold)
hcddbz:

Jay it was all to setup the following narrative:
The Violence in Mexico is because of lax American Gun Laws. Setup below

Earlier this week, U.S. Attorney General Eric Holder said that in the wake of the shooting in Mexico this month, he's considering asking Mexican authorities to allow U.S. federal agents working there to be armed.

In another twist to the story, the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives found earlier this week that the weapon used in the fatal attack against the agents in Mexico -- an AK-47 rifle -- came from the United States. ATF agents arrested three men in a Dallas suburb in connection with the purchase of weapons that were smuggled into Mexico, the agency said in a news release. Ranferi Osorio, 27, and his brother Otilio Osorio, 22, were arrested as their home in Lancaster, Texas. Their next-door neighbor Kelvin Morrison, 25, was also arrested.

What do you expect from a b... (Below threshold)
jim m:

What do you expect from a bunch of Harvard grads? They come from a university famed or the grade inflation, where professors give you A's because they figure if you are smart enough to get in then you are smart enough to deserve the A.

These people have had everything handed to them and Barry especially has had a free pass. These people were taught by their past experience that by merely showing up all the problems will go away. Well, the harsh news for them is that success is a little bit more than just showing up.

Irony of ironies, Holder's ... (Below threshold)
jim m:

Irony of ironies, Holder's ATF is selling them the weapons they are using to kill our people. Remind me again, who is the enemy?

jim m,My ... (Below threshold)
ryan a:

jim m,

My suspicion is that Barry has filled the White House with La Raza/Mecha sympathizers who have bought into his BS that we should surrender the American South West back to Mexico and that the US is perpetrating a crime by holding onto that land.

Wait a second. When did Obama say that "we should surrender the American South West back to Mexico"? I must have missed that press release.

Even if [they] are violent, criminal, drug-running Mexicans, the left want them to defeat the US and take back 1/3 of our nation.

The left wants Mexican drug cartels to take over the US Southwest? Are you smoking some of the shit that's being smuggled over here, or what? Look jim, I can understand your disagreement with the political left here in the US...but this kind of claim is just insane. Sorry. You're just spouting complete nonsense here.

The drug violence in Mexico is a serious issue, and deserves actual attention from the US...not just political blame games. More than 30,000 people have been killed in the last several years, and things aren't getting much better. This is certainly NOT just some problem that is being imported into the US, since our consumers fuel the trade (which is in the billions of dollars per year), and plenty of Americans are involved in the distribution of the drugs and firearms that keep this whole cycle going.

Lastly, I know you can't stand Obama...that's more than clear. Fine. But don't pretend that this problem all of a sudden appeared in 2008. These issues were also taking place during the last administration, and they weren't doing much better with it. The problem is that the US just keeps pretending this is MEXICO'S ISSUE, when in fact it's our issue as well. We're the financial well that feeds the whole damn thing...and for some reason far too many people in the US are unwilling to think about that.

Jay Tea,"It's not ... (Below threshold)
Oldpuppymax:

Jay Tea,

"It's not clear why...?" Well it's quite clear to those of us who understand the leftist mind and agenda. As more American-sold guns are traced to Mexican drug cartels and crime, the "necessity" of new gun legislation becomes obvious. A long gun REGISTRY, a la the Canadian system was to go into effect in the 4 border states a short time ago. It was stopped at the last moment. But the left will do anything in its power to create situations making such unconstitutional actions "excusable." The goal has always been to overturn the 2nd amendment...incrementally if necessary. Project Gunwalker was designed to permit the ATF to demand ever increasing funding from congress. The fact that it can also lead to new gun-grabbing legislation is icing on the cake.

The (P)resident has 0 inter... (Below threshold)
Gmac:

The (P)resident has 0 interest in border security.

Project Gunwalker - Use Google, Bing , whatever... and avail yourselves of a story about a government agency that ACTIVELY enabled the illegal purchase and transfer of firearms to Mexico.

(Yes, the '0' is a double entendre)

Legalizing marijuana and co... (Below threshold)
hyperbolist:

Legalizing marijuana and cocaine would bankrupt these monsters, as well as narco-terrorist gangsters living within the United States, but of course that's never going to happen, because of the children etc.

Jay Tea:"This coul... (Below threshold)
ryan a:

Jay Tea:

"This could just be incompetence. This could just be ignorance. This could just be a case of Obama's left hand not realizing what his right hand is doing, and no one connecting the dots."

I think it's all those and more rolled into one. This move by ATF was just stupid--they willingly sat by and watched as high powered weapons were being bought and smuggled into Mexico. Also, having agents on the border armed with nonlethal weapons is completely insane, all things considered.

The US has been handling this issue with incredible incompetence for years--this didn't just start with Obama. But the Obama admin is doing a good job of maintaining the status quo, that's for sure.

Anyway, I'm not in complete agreement with your analysis, but I'm glad you posted something about this issue.

Oldpuppymax:"Well ... (Below threshold)
ryan a:

Oldpuppymax:

"Well it's quite clear to those of us who understand the leftist mind and agenda. As more American-sold guns are traced to Mexican drug cartels and crime, the "necessity" of new gun legislation becomes obvious."

So what's your plan? How do you suggest we deal with drug cartels that are using billions of dollars from US consumers to buy US guns to kill thousands of people in Mexico, wreak havoc in border cities, and bring in MORE high priced drugs? What do you think fuels the "spillover" violence that people are talking about in AZ?

What do you suggest? What should we do about people who knowingly sell weapons to cartels? Anything? Or should we just trust the invisible hand of the free market to take care of everything? Ya, that's working out real well.

Ryan A,You are cor... (Below threshold)
jim m:

Ryan A,

You are correct. That was a typo. It should have read "this BS' not "his BS". Otherwise I stand behind the comment.

jim,"You are corre... (Below threshold)
ryan a:

jim,

"You are correct. That was a typo. It should have read "this BS' not "his BS". Otherwise I stand behind the comment."

Well, that makes more sense. Typos happen.

So, you really think that "the left" wants Mexican drug cartels to take over the US Southwest? Where do you get that from? In my opinion, you're kind of conflating the issues here by mixing the whole "reconquista" conspiracy with the drug violence issue.

No I think that the left wa... (Below threshold)
jim m:

No I think that the left wants to cave to some BS counter historical crap that says that we should unilaterally surrender the South West to Mexico. These idiots don't think beyond the anti-American political cant to consider what the real world effects of their posturing is.

I don't think that they think at all.

I'm not trying to conflate ... (Below threshold)
jim m:

I'm not trying to conflate the two issues. I think that Barry is perfectly capable of pandering to that constituency without regard o what will happen to the border or the people that live there. I just think that the political left doesn't really give a damn about the people that live in this country. They don't see individuals that live in the border area, they see demographics and groups of voters. If the groups are happy it doesn't matter how many individuals get hurt.

"No I think that the left w... (Below threshold)
ryan a:

"No I think that the left wants to cave to some BS counter historical crap that says that we should unilaterally surrender the South West to Mexico."

Ok, so who is arguing that we need to surrender the southwest to Mexico? Undergrads at UC Berkeley?

I have heard this conspiracy theory before, but it doesn't really have any weight to it. It's pretty much nonsense. Why would Latino US citizens who are thoroughly entrenched in American life be trying to secede to Mexico? This whole reconquista narrative is pretty inane.

Oh' did BarryHolder Inc ove... (Below threshold)
914:

Oh' did BarryHolder Inc overlook this? Thats because he is busy learning to walk softly like an Libyan-Egyptian.

La Raza/Mecha does have a p... (Below threshold)
John S:

La Raza/Mecha does have a point: A U.S. without California would be a much better nation. First off, we wouldn't have one-quarter of the Electoral College voting for stupid incompetent shits like Obama. Also, we lose Los Angeles, Hollywood, San Francisco, along with Nancy Pelosi, Barbara Boxer, Dianne Feinstein, and a quite a few other wastes of oxygen.

jim,"I just think ... (Below threshold)
ryan a:

jim,

"I just think that the political left doesn't really give a damn about the people that live in this country. They don't see individuals that live in the border area, they see demographics and groups of voters. If the groups are happy it doesn't matter how many individuals get hurt."

Ya, I'd argue that there are lots of politicians who look the other way when it comes to this issue--and that's why it's been going on for years and years.

Barry triples down on Dumbo... (Below threshold)
914:

Barry triples down on Dumbo-ism..


No news here.

All of you are missing the ... (Below threshold)
Gmac:

All of you are missing the entire point...

There is a federal agency (BATF) actively allowing the transfer of firearms to Mexico.

Does the significance of this simply pass right over your heads?

Gmac,Yeah, I can't... (Below threshold)
jim m:

Gmac,

Yeah, I can't think what I must have been referring to in post 6.

<a href="http://www.csmonit... (Below threshold)
jim m:

http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Justice/2011/0304/Did-flawed-US-policies-play-role-in-death-of-a-border-patrol-agent

Time to shut down the BATF. It would save money and, apparently American lives.

Lastly, I know you... (Below threshold)
Lastly, I know you can't stand Obama...that's more than clear. Fine. But don't pretend that this problem all of a sudden appeared in 2008

This is a good point. I think Obama is turning out to be one the most incompetent presidents in modern history, but you're right, border security didn't suddenly start going to hell after he was elected. This news story is evidence of massive, long-term incompetency, the kind where politicians on both sides of the aisle are unwilling to make hard decisions, but are just kicking the can a little farther along down the road. Bush administration policies must be assigned their share of the blame as well.

Hyper - I agree with the le... (Below threshold)
epador:

Hyper - I agree with the legalizing the drugs in a manner to reasonably control demand in the US would be a great idea. I've always thought it should become a Native American business that would dwarf the casinos.

Guns are illegal in Mexico, so maybe if they legalize them there that would help their problem too? (I'm not being sarcastic - the drug cartels are the only ones armed there now. If the populace was, the cartels might have not all the free rein they now do.)

One of the reasons I did no... (Below threshold)
914:

One of the reasons I did not like McCain.

Gramnesty for illegals. Shows you where the priorities are. Pandering for votes instead of doing the job.

How hard is it to close/secure the border? Apparently the politicians cant get it done and fellow Americans are dying because of this.

Dereliction of duty yet again.

"So, you really think th... (Below threshold)
JLawson:

"So, you really think that "the left" wants Mexican drug cartels to take over the US Southwest? "

Hi, Ryan A! Long time no see! Kind of late to the discussion here... but my two cents.

The left doesn't much care, I think. First, there's a lingering guilt over simply being the 'privileged', but that doesn't impel them to action so much as it does simply render them unwilling to object to a gradual 'takeover'. Then there's the whole drug thing - some folks have argued it'd make more sense to simply make certain drugs legal, but I think if we've got problems with DUI and texting while driving, making pot and other stuff legal will simply increase the problems, not decrease them. The generic left doesn't see much of a problem, so why should they kick if the cartels move in?

So I'm likely wrong - but to me it just looks like indifference.

I know that this provides y... (Below threshold)
Rance:

I know that this provides you all with another excuse to vent against the current administration, but this type of conduct has existed in the federal law enforcement agencies for a long time.

The ATF, FBI, DEA, etc. all want the big score. They want to take down the top dogs, so they ignore the "petty" stuff while they build their case.

Look back and you'll see cases where the DEA setup and paid for drug deals or the FBI kept known hitmen on the street because they were informing on their business associates. It's not new.

"I know that this provides ... (Below threshold)
914:

"I know that this provides you all with another excuse to vent against the current administration, but this type of conduct has existed in the federal law enforcement agencies for a long time."


You are right Rance. We should not be concerned about it at all. Just like trillions of debt and a lousy stinking economy with gas and food price's going up,up,up.

Just keep burying Your head in the sand


914,Who said it wa... (Below threshold)
Rance:

914,

Who said it was OK? My point was that this is not new to the current administration.

What's up JLawson!... (Below threshold)
ryan a:

What's up JLawson!

Ya, it's been a while...this year has been a bit insane so far. So it goes.

"First, there's a lingering guilt over simply being the 'privileged', but that doesn't impel them to action so much as it does simply render them unwilling to object to a gradual 'takeover'"

A takeover by who? US citizens of Latino descent? Or are you arguing that the SW is being taken over by illegal/undoc'd immigrants? While there are certainly a lot of immigrants in the SW, I'm not sure I would argue that they are "taking over" the region. That's a bit of an exaggeration, IMO.

Plus, the SW has had a pretty high percentage of Latinos since day one (1848), so I'm not sure how this would qualify as a takeover. When the US acquired the territory, the Mexicans there were given the opportunity to become US citizens, and many did. So there are plenty of Latino families whose histories go way back in the region, and they are just as American as anyone.

"Then there's the whole drug thing - some folks have argued it'd make more sense to simply make certain drugs legal, but I think if we've got problems with DUI and texting while driving, making pot and other stuff legal will simply increase the problems, not decrease them."

Well, some people are going to do stupid shit no matter if it's legal or illegal--that's just the way things go. The primary motive behind some type of regulation/legalization is to drop the profit margins for the drug cartels. It's pretty incredible how much profit is in the business. The same kilo of coke that sells for 2,000 buck in Columbia sells for around 40,000 once it hits Chicago/Detroit. Quite a markup--and that's what's fueling all of this violence, arms dealing, corruption, etc.

I'll tell you one thing: there's no border fence that's going to stop an industry backed by 60 something billion dollars a year, that's for sure. Hell, the Mexican govt is basically being outgunned by the cartels. There has to be a way to cut off the financial power these guys have--but that won't be pretty either. The terrible part is that far too many people are getting caught in the crossfire, in the US and in Mex.

"The generic left doesn't see much of a problem, so why should they kick if the cartels move in?"

The cartels are already in. If people think that only *Mexicans* are part of this, they're blind. One of the big assassins who was caught last year was a US citizen (he took part in the killings in Acapulco, I believe). This is also NOT limited to just Latinos, despite all of the stereotypes. Plenty of US citizens are already part of this network--whether as dealers, distributors, or the buyers. It's a problem on all sides, and politicians keep sweeping things aside.

Then the other issue is that people conflate this issue with the immigration issue, which is related (in some cases) but not one and the same. There are migrants who come here to work, and there are the drug runners. The hardest part is to separate these types of people trying to cross...and it gets even harder when cartels take use migrants as mules (and they really don't give a damn what happens to the migrants, despite what they tell them).

ryan a.Ok... (Below threshold)
hcddbz :

ryan a.

Ok, so who is arguing that we need to surrender the southwest to Mexico? Undergrads at UC Berkeley?

I have heard this conspiracy theory before, but it doesn't really have any weight to it. It's pretty much nonsense. Why would Latino US citizens who are thoroughly entrenched in American life be trying to secede to Mexico? This whole reconquista narrative is pretty inane.


Actually some Latino undergrads do not view themselves as Americans.
The organization that they found state that to be the case. MEChA and LA Raza is goal is to free their Fantasy country from the grips of AmeriKKKa.
It is in their Name and Documents and actions.

Now many American Latino do not share this view. However just like the news cherry picks "Black Leaders" they have chosen to pick La Raza as the voice of all Latinos. This had lead to both Political parties courting them to the determent of all Americans.

MEChA = Chicano Student Movement of Aztlan."
There goal is to Liberate Aztlan.
La Raza is the Race of those from Aztlan,
What is Aztlan?
Well that is the South West United states including Texas, CA Arizona. This is the reason La Raza supports open Borders, because Mexicans are not really crossing the border into AmeriKKKa. They are coming into Aztlan.

MEChA Constitution

Philosophy of MEChA:

La Raza Plan


One more JLawson:"... (Below threshold)
ryan a:

One more JLawson:

"So I'm likely wrong - but to me it just looks like indifference."

I definitely agree with you that there's a lot of indifference out there. That's absolutely true. Hence the reason why this issue has lingered for years and years. But, I guess people in the US really need that expensive weekend cocaine, and politicians don't want to upset the current "order" that's basically decimating many parts of Mexico. The politicians in the US have done an amazing job of maintaining the status quo for years. Both sides, if you ask me. But that's my usual complaint!

Ryan,You hit the m... (Below threshold)
jim m:

Ryan,

You hit the mark about politicians really desiring to maintain the status quo. Dems have carried on about education, poverty etc for decades. Yet, despite investing billions of dollars each year education is, if anything, worse and not better. Inner city minority neighborhoods remain mired in poverty and crime. The dems have a vested interest in appearing concerned but doing nothing. That strategy maximizes the funding they can get for their campaigns.

I dare say that the GOP does the same with their constituencies, but falsely promising movement on social conservative issues seems a little less of an abuse than keeping people stuck in crime and drug infested neighborhoods.

hcddbz,Ya, I know ... (Below threshold)
ryan a:

hcddbz,

Ya, I know enough about MeChA. They are Chicanos, which basically means they are US citizens of Mexican descent. So why would they try to join Mexico? For many Mexican citizens, the Chicanos are basically a bunch of gringos.

The MeChA folks certainly do not speak for all Latinos, that's for sure. And they definitely do not have either the power or influence to do much about their supposed visions of a reconquista (whatever that's really supposed to entail). I mean, all of their talk about "Atzlan" has very little to do with the contemporary Mexican State. They are basically talking about some mythical Mexica past that never really took place. But hey, it sounds good in protests and stuff.

So ya, don't get too worked up about the MECha folks. I am from Socal, and while they have their audience, they are by no means some powerful force, that's for sure. Most Latinos in the SW, including places like LA, are quite thoroughly American, despite what some folks attempt to say.

jim,"You hit the m... (Below threshold)
ryan a:

jim,

"You hit the mark about politicians really desiring to maintain the status quo."

Damn right. Lots of pandering and nonsense from one side, and fear mongering about Latinos and immigrants from the other, and meanwhile the same busted system persists. I just happen to be skeptical about *both* parties, while you are more skeptical about one. So we agree 50%, which isn't bad all things considered.

Ryan a,The number ... (Below threshold)
Oldpuppymax:

Ryan a,

The number of US sold guns making their way to Mexican drug cartels--unless assisted by the ATF--is NOT large. The overwhelming majority of weapons in the hands of these crime groups are fully automatic, coming from China and other nations. Many belonged to Mexican Army personnel who simply took their guns and joined the other side. Don't be conned by that phony 90% figure floated by Bloomberg and the rest of the far left. You would apparently trample on the rights of the American people because thugs in Mexico wind up with a relatively small number of weapons coming from the US. Leftists have used such statistics to advance gun-grabbing legislation for decades.

Max:"The number of... (Below threshold)
ryan a:

Max:

"The number of US sold guns making their way to Mexican drug cartels--unless assisted by the ATF--is NOT large."

What do you base this on? Sources? First of all, the ATF didn't "assist" these people--they stood by and watched it happen. They didn't hand the guns over, they set up a stupid operation that filmed and monitored the sale and transport of these weapons, and then tracked them in Mexico. So get your facts straight. It's not like ATF set up a little AK-47 Faire and invited cartels to come pick up some weapons. They just stood by as the cartels did what they are doing every damn day, right here in the US.

Most of the sources I read argue that the cartels are buying these weapons from border states: Texas, New Mexico, and AZ. Hell, where do you think the ATF was when they were doing their operations? They were sitting there filming outside of gun stores on the US/Mex border.

"You would apparently trample on the rights of the American people because thugs in Mexico wind up with a relatively small number of weapons coming from the US. Leftists have used such statistics to advance gun-grabbing legislation for decades."

Whose rights am I trampling on? I asked you what you would do about the situation. The cartels are indeed buying guns here in the US and smuggling them back into Mexico--that's why the Mexican state has so many damn checkpoints all through the country stopping traffic heading SOUTH from the US. You think they're checking for porn or something?

I understand the fact that you are making an argument about the right to bear arms. Great. So what do we do about cartels who are using billions of American dollars to buy 50 caliber rifles and AK-47s? Nothing? Should we try to do anything about this, or just sit back and yammer on about the second amendment? I would guess that there might be some reasonable ways to address this without trampling upon your constitutional right to bear arms. Hmmm? For god's sake, don't just sidestep the issue because Charlton Heston's ghost told you to.

Ryan,Since the com... (Below threshold)
jim m:

Ryan,

Since the complaints are about fully automatic guns it follows as a necessity that they did not come from the US since such arms are not available here. One needs no statistics regarding where the guns came from if the guns are fully automatic.

By the way, Max, here is a ... (Below threshold)
ryan a:

By the way, Max, here is a short piece by Factcheck.org that talks about the debate over the 90% number that you mentioned:

http://www.factcheck.org/politics/counting_mexicos_guns.html

Pay close attention to conclusion:

An Elusive Number

Given the lack of hard data from Mexico, we can't calculate a precise figure for what portion of crime guns have been traced to the U.S. Based on the best evidence we can find so far, we conclude that the 90 percent claim made by the president and others in his administration lacks a basis in solid fact. But we also conclude that the number is at least double what Fox News has reported, based on its reporters' mistaken interpretation of ATF testimony.

Whether the number is 90 percent, or 36 percent, or something else, there's no dispute that thousands of guns are being illegalIy transported into Mexico by way of the United States each year.

No dispute: thousands of guns coming from the US each year. So now what, Max?

As for 50 cal, no one uses ... (Below threshold)
jim m:

As for 50 cal, no one uses those as a standard combat weapon. The kick back is too strong to use it unless you have it mounted. And you might already know that the AK47 is a soviet designed weapon and as such is readily available from many sources outside the US. Should people be talking about AR15's we might have a discussion, but then again they are still only semi-automatic.

The whole idea of gun running across the border in to Mexico is a fabrication of the Federal government and the ATF. Too bad they got caught doing the gun running themselves.

With guns being illegal in ... (Below threshold)
jim m:

With guns being illegal in Mexico that means the only people with them are the drug cartels and the government. Since large numbers of the military and police have been corrupted that means that the criminals and the government are one and the same in many cases.

Arming the public is highly likely to lead to a reduction in crime since those committing it and those charged with preventing it are often on the same side.

The 90%.could be true as t... (Below threshold)
Hcddbz:

The 90%.could be true as that number maybe guns which can be traced.
as far as how the Guns tighter borders would be a good thing.

The 90%.could be true as t... (Below threshold)
Hcddbz:

The 90%.could be true as that number maybe guns which can be traced.
as far as how the Guns tighter borders would be a good thing.

First of all jim, I never a... (Below threshold)
ryan a:

First of all jim, I never argued that all that we are dealing with is fully automatic weapons. That was Max's claim, not mine. From what I have heard many of the weapons include AR-15s and other semi-automatic guns.

Second, the cartels aren't just buying regular small arms, they have also been known to buy RPGs, grenades, and, yes, 50 caliber rifles:

http://www.mcclatchydc.com/2010/11/18/104010/mexican-cartels-amass-better-arsenals.html

"As for 50 cal, no one uses those as a standard combat weapon. The kick back is too strong to use it unless you have it mounted."

Who said they are just buying and using standard weapons? These damn guns are apparently mounted on trucks, etc.

"The whole idea of gun running across the border in to Mexico is a fabrication of the Federal government and the ATF. Too bad they got caught doing the gun running themselves."

Right. It's just another conspiracy, despite the videos above, and despite articles like this (which discusses various aspects of this issue):

http://www.stratfor.com/weekly/20110209-mexicos-gun-supply-and-90-percent-myth

Notice how that article discusses the same 90 percent number, but then ends on this note:

There has clearly been a long and well-documented history of arms smuggling across the U.S.-Mexico border, but it is important to recognize that, while the United States is a significant source of certain classes of weapons and ammunition, it is by no means the source of 90 percent of the weapons used by the Mexican cartels, as is commonly asserted.
As the article above indicates, the number may not be at 90 percent, but the number of weapons being smuggled from the US is certainly significant.
By the way, jim, if you hav... (Below threshold)
ryan a:

By the way, jim, if you have *any* sources to back this up:

The whole idea of gun running across the border in to Mexico is a fabrication of the Federal government and the ATF.

...I'd be interested to read them.

Ryan A -The proble... (Below threshold)
Jlawson:

Ryan A -

The problem is that we don't know what the 90% traced number is, out of the total number of guns siezed.

If they find 100 rifles, 10 of 'em old bolt- and semi-auto rifles and 90 of them fully auto AKs, it's a good bet that the 90 they find didn't come from the US and are therefore untraceable.

The other 10, if they came from the US or other sources, might be traceable. But until we know the actual quantities of each, it's hard to tell. "Thousands of rifles, and of the ones who could be traced 90% come from the US" leaves a lot of slack in the numbers. 90% of what? 100? 1000? 10,000?

Re "The same kilo of coke that sells for 2,000 buck in Columbia sells for around 40,000 once it hits Chicago/Detroit. Quite a markup--and that's what's fueling all of this violence, arms dealing, corruption, etc." - I may be looking at things wrong, but I'm just thinking that making drugs cheap and legal will be an unmitigated disaster for the addicted. Let's face it, self-control ain't gonna be a priority...

Re the takeover of the SW - it wouldn't be the first time an ethnic population changed, and likely won't be the last. You're already seeing some of that in France and England, with the Muslim territories/enclaves instead of assimilation. But that's the way of history - populations move, civilizations rise and fall.

Makes you wonder where we are on the rise-fall scale...

Re the year being insane - I know what you mean, and hope yours is less so than mine is. Trying to close out 6 credit card accounts for my parents - 5 went smoothly, one requires POA and death certificates. Faxed. And since we're still going through the legalities I can't do anything even though I'm the executor.

It's frustrating and aggraving. Hope you're doing better!

Hey JLawson,Sorry ... (Below threshold)
ryan a:

Hey JLawson,

Sorry to hear about you loss and what you're going through right now. The most frustrating part has to be dealing with credit card companies and other legalities.

I hope things get better for you.

As for me, it's just the same old stuff...just busy.

I'll get to your points in a bit. I gotta get back to work here for a while (you know the story)!

If you take the time to stu... (Below threshold)
jim m:

If you take the time to study the opium trade over 100 years ago you can see why legalization does not help. You only make it legal for people to spend their families into poverty and put themselves into early graves. The answer isn't as simple as "make it all legal and regulate it". Nor is it as simple as make it illegal either.

Whoa! I'll write this day i... (Below threshold)
WildWillie:

Whoa! I'll write this day in my journal. I agree with Hyper. De-criminalize drugs. We lost the war on drugs in the 70's. Who are we kidding. We are just making the gangs richer and the jails fuller. ww

WildWillie I do no... (Below threshold)
hcddbz:

WildWillie

I do not know what the answer is but legalization is not even close to a panacea. They did legalize drugs in Mexico but the violence has only increased there. In Amsterdam is concluding that legalization is problem and is looking at making the soft drugs illegal. Countries with harsh drug laws like the death penalty still have drug problems and violence.

Drugs were legal in the US until it was determined that it was taking too much of a negative toll on society.

Are drugs the issue in Mexico or is it combination of Mexican Government that dos not Care and a US government that will not enforce border security?

Ryan a,When someone ... (Below threshold)
Hcddbz:

Ryan a,
When someone tells you unapplogicly what they are you take them at their word. Who would of thought an American Officer would kill his fellow soldiers in the Name of Islam. Maybe someone who signs his cards as Warrior of Islam.

People who knew him dismissed what he was.

If these folks state their belief system we have to take them at their word. Therefore it not some made up conspiracy it just a reiteration of what they told us.

Nothing to see here folks. ... (Below threshold)
Olsoljer:

Nothing to see here folks. Korea, Vietnam, Iraq, Afghanistan the US/Mexican border. Send our troops and law enforcement personnel into harms way with one boot, hand tied behind their back, a muzzle loader, and a copy of Miranda. I bet if they sent a mech infantry division to the border, told them to stop the trafficing, and then left them the hell alone we wouldn't have near the problem in 30 days.

.... the Obama administrati... (Below threshold)

.... the Obama administration is trying to get US agents killed. It's not clear why, what purpose their deaths will serve, but that's the only conclusion one can draw ....

Spot on.

But way worse than whatever Buraq Hussayn bin Buraq Hussayn bin Hussayn's "administration" gets up to is that unless we win the Second American War of Independence, whose Wisconsin Battlefront is still hot, long after the O'Zero Gang has gone, the "Democratic" potty activists that have long owned operated and controlled the obscenely-corrupted machinery of the feral gummint, will still be in place and wielding their mobbed-up union power.

ICE - then INS - lest we forget - with the willing cooperation of every other necessary-to-the-massive migration-fraud federal government department, (including State) secretariat, bureau, office and/or agency - insidiously helped the Cli'ton Crime Family "legalize" as many as three million criminal aliens and/or others whose eligibility to even be in America - let alone to register to vote - was extremely doubtful.

The Buraq Hussayn Osama Gang hates America and is our deadly enemy and will soon be swept into History's garbage can. But the bureaucrats are forever and if we do not win the Second American War of Independence, now hot on the Wisconsin and other states' battlefronts, the permanent public service becomes supreme -- and America is lost.

Brian, put your money where... (Below threshold)
hyperbolist:

Brian, put your money where your mouth is and go murder some civil servants whydontcha.

Willie, we're in agreement--I assume the Four Horesemen of the Apocalypse will be riding into town at any moment. :)




Advertisements









rightads.gif

beltwaybloggers.gif

insiderslogo.jpg

mba_blue.gif

Follow Wizbang

Follow Wizbang on FacebookFollow Wizbang on TwitterSubscribe to Wizbang feedWizbang Mobile

Contact

Send e-mail tips to us:

[email protected]

Fresh Links

Credits

Section Editor: Maggie Whitton

Editors: Jay Tea, Lorie Byrd, Kim Priestap, DJ Drummond, Michael Laprarie, Baron Von Ottomatic, Shawn Mallow, Rick, Dan Karipides, Michael Avitablile, Charlie Quidnunc, Steve Schippert

Emeritus: Paul, Mary Katherine Ham, Jim Addison, Alexander K. McClure, Cassy Fiano, Bill Jempty, John Stansbury, Rob Port

In Memorium: HughS

All original content copyright © 2003-2010 by Wizbang®, LLC. All rights reserved. Wizbang® is a registered service mark.

Powered by Movable Type Pro 4.361

Hosting by ServInt

Ratings on this site are powered by the Ajax Ratings Pro plugin for Movable Type.

Search on this site is powered by the FastSearch plugin for Movable Type.

Blogrolls on this site are powered by the MT-Blogroll.

Temporary site design is based on Cutline and Cutline for MT. Graphics by Apothegm Designs.

Author Login



Terms Of Service

DCMA Compliance Notice

Privacy Policy