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The "Birther" Issue Gets Trumped

Well, at 9:45, President Obama is to publicly drive a stake through the whole "birther" issue -- at least for all but the most resolute crazies. And this means one thing, and one thing only:

Donald Trump was starting to score points.

For some time, I've said that the whole "Birther" BS only served Obama and his cronies, and it was in their interests to keep the whole mess at a steady simmer -- never boiling over, but never cooling off. It let them tar all Obama critics with the "birther" tag and dismiss them.

No, I don't think they started it, or even pushed it very hard, but they certainly reveled in it and kept it from dying for their own political gain.

What Trump did was to crank up the heat, and start to make the Obamoids sweat a bit. So now, almost three years since it first arose, Obama himself is finally getting around to putting it to rest.

No, this won't please all the nutjob birthers, and they are legion. But it will take a lot of wind out of their sails, relegating them to the same corner of Crazyville as the 9/11 Truthers and the Trig Birthers. (Say "Hi!" to Andrew Sullivan for me, folks!)

This might be the single greatest service Trump has ever done his nation, and we owe him our thanks.

For myself, I'm going to watch Obama (it's my day off from my ever-less-accurately-named "day job") and try not to giggle too much as he loses one of his most useful tools.

Now, if he'd only get an effing clue...

Update: And now here's Trump, here in NH, saying pretty much the same thing, but in his own blowhard fashion...

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Comments (152)

Now if Trump can pressure T... (Below threshold)
Mark L:

Now if Trump can pressure The Won into releasing his college records . . .

Shit, I just finished a com... (Below threshold)
Chico:

Shit, I just finished a comment to retired military saying I thought Obama was just stringing the birthers along to tar the Republicans by association, and would release something in October 2012.

I guess the polling indicated it was better to do it now.

So Barry Soetoro takes year... (Below threshold)
TexBob:

So Barry Soetoro takes years to photoshop a jpeg of his birth certificate and finally releases it.

The picture on CNN looks pretty crisp to me and the ink has not even faded.

Too little too late, but it's behind us.

Now, on to the college transcripts, thesis, papers, and how he paid for it.

Come now, Obama is the firs... (Below threshold)
John:

Come now, Obama is the first post partisan president he would never play some political game with his birth certificate would he?

I think this makes Obama lo... (Below threshold)
Carol:

I think this makes Obama look like an incompetent fool.

He has been refusing to release this; even spending hundreds of thousand of dollars in order to not release it. For what?

It's no wonder he cannot make informed, rational decisions about foreign and domestic policy when he cannot even make a decision to release his birth certificate when there are questions about it.

Well, we finally see that h... (Below threshold)
ExSubNuke:

Well, we finally see that he is indeed "qualified" (ie... eligable) for the job of President. If only he were ACTUALLY qualified. *sigh*

It's a fake. It has to be.<... (Below threshold)
Sky Captain:

It's a fake. It has to be.
IIRC, a Hawaiian official (or former official, I can't remember that much detail) a couple of weeks ago tah individual could not get a copy of their long form berth certifiacte from the state of Hawaii,. Some blather about the birth certificates being "state documents" or "sate secrets" or something.
Either that person was lying, or this is a fake. Take your pick.

For the record, I did not believe the offical from Hawaii. I think you could get them whenever one wished to request and pay a fee.

Now, on to the school records. All of them.

I'm not convinced it's real... (Below threshold)

I'm not convinced it's real, since "African" wasn't a race designation used by Hawaii in 1961. But that's okay, I'll take it.

Now on to the Social Security number, the college transcripts, the passport records. Obama thought he was defusing the situation, but instead he took the cork out of the bottle. There's going to be no stopping the flood now.

No person except a natural ... (Below threshold)
Ernie Ball:

No person except a natural born citizen may be president!
The real question is what is Natural Born?
Can a person who has parents from two different countries be Natural Born?

"Donald Trump was starti... (Below threshold)
PBunyan:

"Donald Trump was starting to score points."

I heard Laura Ingraham say the same thing on her radio show this morning. I think you're both wrong. I'd bet this has more to do with Jerome Corsi's new, soon to be released, book.

I am in the string it along... (Below threshold)
mpw280:

I am in the string it along camp. I like that the dems brought this issue up with McCain because he was born on a military base while his father was stationed in Panama, then they refuse to release Obama's docs for three years. Time for a national law concerning birth certs and running for president. mpw

Plus, doesn't this make a l... (Below threshold)
PBunyan:

Plus, doesn't this make a liar out of the Governor oh Hawaii, who said it does not exist?

As usual when dealing with a con artist like Obama, this will only create many more questions than answers.

Here's a pdf of it:<p... (Below threshold)
Chico:

Here's a pdf of it:

http://msnbcmedia.msn.com/i/MSNBC/Sections/NEWS/A_Politics/longformbirthcertificate.pdf

Former Lt. Colonel Terry Lakin must be crying bitter tears in his stockade cell.

You threw away an honorable retirement and a pension for birther nonsense, you fool.

Sky Captain, the Obama admi... (Below threshold)

Sky Captain, the Obama administration said they got several Hawaiian officials to waive the rules in this case -- the concerned parties are all dead except the most concerned, who was asking it, and it was a matter of national interest. (As in, "interesting to much of the nation.")

There was no one with any standing to say "no," and everyone else saying "yes," so they released it.

J.

That is not a birth certifi... (Below threshold)
Eph:

That is not a birth certificate. That’s a cert of live birth. There is no state or county seal on the form. The two are not the same.

"Plus, doesn't this make a ... (Below threshold)
Eph:

"Plus, doesn't this make a liar out of the Governor oh Hawaii, who said it does not exist?"

He's was right, there is no birth certificate

Obama went to all this trou... (Below threshold)
Hank:

Obama went to all this trouble and expense to hide.......nothing????

Or is this a feint to discourage those wanting the release of his college transcripts?

Look at the photoshopped ba... (Below threshold)
bg:

Look at the photoshopped background which the same as the background around the "scanned cert". Look at the tiny "M" on the time P.M. Look at the lack of background behind many typed words. The word "NONE" is much larger than the rest of the words. "East Africa"? The "stamped date" on the left side is straight however the same date stamp on the right side "AUG" is straight however the rest is tilted down. Why is the "file number" so perfectly straight with a rubber stamp look?

Obama called this silly. He was correct and this is a silly photoshop created document and the media is lapping it up.

Jay Tea,You... (Below threshold)
Eph:

Jay Tea,


You're right though, the WH wanted to save this for next year;s election. Oh well.


P.S. Are you still hanging out at OTB with the nut-roots ??

Regardless of what anyone s... (Below threshold)
jim m:

Regardless of what anyone says this does not put the birther thing to rest. Already they are going on about the name of the document and the lack of a seal.

This just shows that they know the issue is gaining traction and is hurting him. Now the question is why not release his college transcripts?

Just wondering....if the BC... (Below threshold)
Hank:

Just wondering....if the BC shows his name as
Barack Hussein Obama II, when and why did he ever use the name Barry Soetoro?

OK, so we got Eph here to c... (Below threshold)

OK, so we got Eph here to carry water for the birther nuts.

Eph, the document has "birth" and "certificate" in the title, and lists a place of birth. That oughta be good enough for anyone who's not a "certified" nutjob.

Hey, my driver's license doesn't have either of the words "driver" or "license" on it! It just says "OPERATOR" in big letters! I bet that's a forgery, too!

And yes, Eph, I still occasionally smack around the Nutroots over at OTB. But if you need me to smack around you and your fellow Birther nuts, I can multitask quite easily.

J.

Maybe Donald is useful afte... (Below threshold)
GarandFan:

Maybe Donald is useful after all. Now he can start hammering on Barry's 'scholastic record' and 'achievements' at Harvard Law.

Jay,Where's the st... (Below threshold)
Eph:

Jay,

Where's the state seal ????

I had to provide a birth ce... (Below threshold)
recovered liberal democrat:

I had to provide a birth certificate with a raised seal to get a passport.

Jay Tea,Understood... (Below threshold)
Sky Captain:

Jay Tea,

Understood.
"It's good to be king..."

Whyinthehell did Obama wait ~3 years to release THIS?
It just makes him look more incompetent.

... My BCert has a state se... (Below threshold)
Eph:

... My BCert has a state seal

"I had to provide a birth c... (Below threshold)
Eph:

"I had to provide a birth certificate with a raised seal to get a passport. "

Exactly.


Where's the BIRTH CERTIFICATE ?????

P.S. Did Bush ever have to ... (Below threshold)
Eph:

P.S. Did Bush ever have to release documents rebuking the "Truthers" ?????


hmmmmmmmmmmmmmm

"Where's the state seal?"</... (Below threshold)

"Where's the state seal?"

Off a pier in Pearl Harbor, balancing a ball on its nose.

J.

I had to provide a... (Below threshold)
James H:
I had to provide a birth certificate with a raised seal to get a passport.

Did you raise the seal yourself? Does it do that little thing where it honks horns with its nose?

It's a certified "True Copy... (Below threshold)
TexBob:

It's a certified "True Copy or Abstract of the Record on File" in the Hawaii State Department of Health. The copy was singed by Alvein T Onaka, PhD and dated two days ago.

That document wa... (Below threshold)
irongrampa:

That document was released, imho, for 2 reasons.

1, The Donald was gaining traction playing pony for Obama, this wasn't intended.

2, It was determined that all the political capital possible had been wrung from the issue.

On a related note, Trump is by no means a conservative--check his back story, and it becomes evident. If one were conspiracy-minded one could think that Trump was engaged in a bit of misdirection, with the now revealed ending. IOW, the right is perceived as nutty.

I submit that such is NOT beyond the malformed brains currently occupying the WH.

I'm guessing that Jerome Co... (Below threshold)
iwogisdead:

I'm guessing that Jerome Corsi's publisher is feeling a little nervous this morning. I think the timing of the release of the BC has more to do with Corsi's book that anything Trump was saying.

Jay Tea""Where's t... (Below threshold)
retired military:

Jay Tea

""Where's the state seal?"

Off a pier in Pearl Harbor, balancing a ball on its nose.

"

YOU OWE ME A NEW MONITOR. AND ONE WITHOUT COFFEE SPIT ALL OVER IT.

Note the shadow running the... (Below threshold)
BW_Idaho:

Note the shadow running the length of the left side. Note the small black triangle at the top left corner. Note the continuation of lines in shadowed area and the number "2" jotted opposite line 7a.

All these artifacts indicate an image taken from an open book placed on the flat screen of a copy machine, not that of the single document.

Jay Tea, you pre-empted my ... (Below threshold)
James H:

Jay Tea, you pre-empted my seal joke. Bad Jay Tea. Bad Jay Tea.

Yeah, I did, James, but you... (Below threshold)

Yeah, I did, James, but you took the "raised seal" and ran with that even better. So I'd call us even.

J.

All Republican politicians ... (Below threshold)
Baggi:

All Republican politicians need to take notes from The Donald. This is how you do it.

I find myself in disagreement with The Donald on several issues. More so than any other possible candidate running for office. Yet I really like the guy. Why? He's a fighter. He doesn't take the spin that the MSM throws at him and he doesn't apologize for what he thinks and believes. He attacks and attacks and attacks and plows right over there nonesense.

This caused a lot of traction to be gained on the birther issue. I havn't for a moment believed that Obama was born anywhere other than the United States. But Trump got me wondering, why hasn't this guy released his birth certificate? What's the point in keeping it hidden?

And these doubt gnawed at me, when normally, I wouldn't think about it.

It seemed to work on a lot of American's.

Contrast that with someone I find much to agree on with, Michelle Bachmann.

Here is a great woman who makes me turn my television off. She sits in these interviews and typical of the left, they attack her with weasle words. She was asked something like, "Do you think what Trump is doing is making Trump look silly?"

And playing into their weasel worded game, she shot back with weasel words of her own. "Trump has to answer for Trump."

Run away!

Don't run away, attack! These weasel worded answers from politicians drive me crazy. This is why Chris Christie, Allen West and Donald Trump get so much traction. They don't play that stupid game the media likes to play of painting politicians into a corner.

Politicians and the media believe that if politicians speak their mind, each time they do it another person will disagree with them, therefore, they have to thread the needle.

Trump understands that we forgive a lot out here in fly over America. We want some honest to God straight talk out of people.

And if someone asks you, "What do you think about what Trump is doing?" answer the damn question! It doesn't matter if the answer is, "I think he's an ass." or "God Bless Donald Trump." we just want a straight answer.

"Note the shadow running... (Below threshold)
JLawson:

"Note the shadow running the length of the left side. Note the small black triangle at the top left corner. Note the continuation of lines in shadowed area and the number "2" jotted opposite line 7a.

All these artifacts indicate an image taken from an open book placed on the flat screen of a copy machine, not that of the single document.

And the problem with that is?

I don't see any, myself. It's a pain in the ass to deal with a lot of separate birth certs (or land plots, or whatever document that you take and for whatever reason don't want to microfilm and store that way) so you make the cert with a margin on the left that allows binding in a record book. Stamp the record number in the upper left (like 61 10641 is here) and you can reference it easily from a central index. (As in, Barak Obama = Book 151, 61 10641)

The other stuff? Who knows? Looks like someone penciled in something - perhaps they were doing a tally of something, or putting in codes for data entry. (As in 2 meaning non-plantation, 9=African, 9=University (for that particular code) and 1 = Caucasian.) Computer databases tend to do things like that - makes the record a lot smaller, and likely when they were doing data entry they penciled things in.

Or not. I'm not going to worry about it.

But now? On to the transcripts!

Whats with the "white backg... (Below threshold)
G.:

Whats with the "white background" behind the typed information? You know this shit looks fake look at the PDF file and blow it up all the typed stuff has white background. If you blow it up the "Green" background looks like it was cut in around a typed on white background. Maybe its just something with the PDF file. Why the green background photo shopped around the document?

http://www.whitehouse.gov/sites/default/files/rss_viewer/birth-certificate-long-form.pdf

It continues:<a hr... (Below threshold)
Eph:
"But Trump got me wondering... (Below threshold)
Eph:

"But Trump got me wondering, why hasn't this guy released his birth certificate? "

Or college transcripts

Or college thesis

Question: wasn't his last ... (Below threshold)
cathymv:

Question: wasn't his last name Sotero?

PDFs aren't the original do... (Below threshold)
JLawson:

PDFs aren't the original document. They don't have the resolution of the originals, and depending on how much compression is picked can lead to artifacts on the PDF.

What you're seeing is a Xerox onto the official green-pattern paper, and THEN turned into a PDF. Blow it up enough, and you lose resolution. Expand things to 1600% and you'll see all sorts of artifacts and blocky shit around the letters - but that's a product of the scanning process. You will NEVER, I repeat NEVER get the same resolution out of a PDF as you do the original.

G. and EPH, I'm satisfied that this is the real thing. Or, to be more precise, a PDF of the real thing.

"I'm satisfied that this is... (Below threshold)
Eph:

"I'm satisfied that this is the real thing. Or, to be more precise, a PDF of the real thing. "

I'm not.

Only b/c this pisses off the left to no end.

"Question: wasn't his last ... (Below threshold)
Eph:

"Question: wasn't his last name Sotero?"

I thought his last name was Streisand ???

Why do you suppose they too... (Below threshold)
G.:

Why do you suppose they took so much care to line up the out side border with the copy of the certificate? Smoking gun has an Adobe illustrator view that has some clipped sections. I'm not a birther, I just want to examine Barry's "proof". I leave the final judgement to Photoshop experts.

It's a doctored PDF file. ... (Below threshold)
TexBob:

It's a doctored PDF file. Load it in Illustrator and see the layers. A flat scanned copy would not have any edits.

Obama=FRAUD=YOU LIE as usual.

<a href="http://www.realcle... (Below threshold)
Eph:
Maybe Dan blather can clear... (Below threshold)
914:

Maybe Dan blather can clear this whole thing up?

(Shrug.)Well, I've... (Below threshold)
JLawson:

(Shrug.)

Well, I've had my say on this. Feel free to jerk yourselves into a messy frenzy on this. Just mop up afterwards, okay?

(Shakes head, walks away.)

Wake me up when Mitt or ... (Below threshold)
Baggi:

Wake me up when Mitt or Huck grow a pair like Trump

Exactly. Or Pawlenty, or any of the would be challengers to our President.

I think this is why McCain mistakenly was given the opportunity to carry the Republican banner last cycle. Because he's a war hero who couldn't be called a pansy. But he's a political pansy.

And we're tired of pansies.

American's are crying out for a touch candidate. A Chris Christie (Even though we disagree on many, many issues), or a Donald Trump.

We're so tired of these weak kneed, speak out of both sides of your mouth, politicians.

I hope we have a clear choice this time. Really, I do.

Having a laggy computer sho... (Below threshold)
TexBob:

Having a laggy computer shows interesting things sometimes. When I scroll on that certificate, the white shows first, then the numbers/letters pop up after. Here is a screenshot of my scrolling down and how the picture comes up in layers.

http://i1012.photobucket.com/albums/af242/mysty3/obama.jpg

Interesting layers. Wait till folks load it up in Illustrator or CS

Baggi,I am not a f... (Below threshold)
Eph:

Baggi,

I am not a fan of Trump's politics. His REAL politics that is. BUT he aint afraid to rub dog sh#t in Hussein's face, and that shows me a lot. That's why the media is sooo scared of Palin and/or Bachmann. They will do the same as Trump. Kick Hussein in the face.

RUSH is awesome today folks... (Below threshold)
Eph:

RUSH is awesome today folks!

LOL

Well, if affirmative action... (Below threshold)
914:

Well, if affirmative action says Barry was an ok student it's good enough for those who vote for him.

Any guesses on where Hussei... (Below threshold)
Eph:

Any guesses on where Hussein went after his “serious” presser today?

Orca Winfrey

To me the issue is that he ... (Below threshold)
Greta:

To me the issue is that he has let this issue on the table for over two years while the country is going though in his words the worst economy since the great deperession, wars, gas prices and other prices through the roof, exploding natinal debt, and countless other major issues.
Imagine if you were the leader of a company or country facing very tough issues and their was some side issue you could easily end and you simply let it lay out there for two years. Would that be called leadership. Note his attorney sent this letter on April 21st and we have the document now to present. If he had done so in the best interest of the country two years ago or more, he could have made the statement he made almost cynically today as if he was doing us a favor. He should have said two years ago, if there is any doubt at all to my eligibility, I want to put that to rest completely today rather than have a single American doubt it in these tough times. I as a leader owe that to all the people of America.

So I give him zero credit for this act today, it simply shows what he thinks of America and our problems that he has made some kind of game of it.

"Any guesses on where Husse... (Below threshold)
914:

"Any guesses on where Hussein went after his “serious” presser today?

Orca Winfrey"


What? No golf?

Now on to the Social Sec... (Below threshold)
Jay Guevara:

Now on to the Social Security number, the college transcripts, the passport records. Obama thought he was defusing the situation, but instead he took the cork out of the bottle. There's going to be no stopping the flood now.

Yep. Cue l'affair Watergate, for those old enough to remember it. Each disclosure, each relevation only led to baying for more.

Of course, that baying was done by the Red-infested MSM, which obviously will cover for Obama and the Party, but now we have the internet.

Oh, and Donald Trump. A buffoon he may be, but he (and Corsi) have done yeoman's work on extracting this little nugget from Obama's lockbox. May it be the first of many ...

Look folks. This issue can... (Below threshold)
retired military:

Look folks. This issue can be looked at 2 ways.

A. Obama was born in Hawaii. Issue settled,resolved, end of story.

B. Obama was not born in Hawaii.

Okay lets explore this one a bit.

IMO It is a NONWINNER and has not been a winner since Obama won the nomination in 2008. Why?

Because the dems learned from the Bush NG documents that if you are going to forge something for public consumption nowadays you need to do a WORLD CLASS JOB of FORGING IT. They will leave no chance for error and they have the resources of the DNC, Soros and their backers to (blindly if not willingly) supply the resources to ensure that people will have a copy so believeable that the common American will believe Elvis is alive before they believe this is faked.

Unless Michelle, Holderer, Pelosi and Reid go to a press conference with videotaped footage of the forgery taking place the fact and they swear that it is a forgery that Obama has presented then this will settle the issue in 95% of the population's mind. The other 5% wouldnt believe it was a real birth certificate if Moses got resurrected on the 50 yard line during the opening kick off of the Super Bowl and said it was.

In short, on the birther issue it is a LOSING proposition to continue this (and IMO has been since Obama got nominated).

In the military (I believe moreso than civilian life) you learn to pick the battles you want to fight and those that you are willing to fall on your sword on. For me personally this is not an issue for me to fall on my sword on not because of its importance but because of the winnability factor and the factors that show Obama most likely was born in the US. You can have the greatest cause in the world but if you are (figuratively) dead when the fight is over and your sacrifice is meaningless than you have basically wasted your life instead of choosing to fight another day over a battle that is winnable. IN MY MIND this battle is NOT winnable and hasnt been in a long time.

Others will say "I will fight the good fight" and I wont hold it against them but at the same time I have to wonder if their fight is the good fight after all. Again not because of its importance but because of the evidence against this being the good fight.

I believe that IF Obama was born in the US than he willingly didnt supply the birth certificate for political reasons. Rightly or wrongly most agree on this.

I remember the line that Leonitas gave in 300. "People will remember that free men fought against slaves...". IMO this battle doesnt equate to that one due to the factors in Obama's favor.

On one hand, I'm relieved t... (Below threshold)
Peter F.:

On one hand, I'm relieved that this nonsense is finally settled. However, I'm still of the thought that this is a strategically poor move for Obama in terms of his re-election. Why not the crazies twist in the wind or let Chris Matthews, Maddow, Euegene Robinson keep the "crazy birther GOPers" narrative going in the media right up through next year's election. Now what? Run on Barry's economic or foreign record? Pfft, good luck with that. Oh well, I guess this proves that Barry is the gift that keeps on giving.

Drudge:"OBAMA: ‘We... (Below threshold)
Eph:

Drudge:

"OBAMA: ‘We do not have time for this kind of silliness’…

…Heads to Chicago for Oprah, NYC to raise campaign cash"

Yes, Barry was born in Hawa... (Below threshold)
Elvis Presley:

Yes, Barry was born in Hawaii in a manger. I saw the whole thing inbetween filming 'Blue Hawaii'.

According to one of the par... (Below threshold)
Shamspade:

According to one of the participants on a Fox Biz panel this am, only 38% of the electorate were sure that Obama was born in the USA, with fully 62% having their doubts, and it was getting worse. The first mover of the birther issue is Philip Berg, former Asst DA for Pennsylvania and a lifelong liberal Dem. I saw another poll where 12% of DEMS were not sure of Obi Wanna's birth specifics.

He had to put this issue to rest. He wasn't being smart, or Machiavellian. Jay gives him too much credit. The guy was stupid, plain and simple, to let the use of this issue cloud his legitimacy. Now people want to see his college transcripts and his medical records, and the passport he used to visit Pakistan when it was off-limits to American citizens.

He is in the middle of a spinning maelstrom of his own making. Cry me a river.

Am I 100% sure that Obama w... (Below threshold)
retired military:

Am I 100% sure that Obama was born in Hawaii. Nope. At the same time I realize that he has the resources at his disposal to do one helluva forgery and as such this issue wont ever be completely resolved (at least in my eyes). That being said there are plenty of other issues going against Obama.

The (P)resident had the cha... (Below threshold)
Gmac:

The (P)resident had the chance to remove this as an issue over 2 years ago when the Clinton camp first made the allegation and he didn't.

Now that Trump forced his hand there *might* be a continued effort to get more background information released.

I find it ironically funny that no one has looked for arrest records, considering his admitted drug use.

"I saw it too!! Burning lo... (Below threshold)
Tom Jones:

"I saw it too!! Burning love baby!"

Yes, now the birth... (Below threshold)
irongrampa:


Yes, now the birth BC issue has been resolved, we must see his college transcripts, that we may fully bathe in His glowing effulgence.

Nothing less can suffice.


Or the entire sorry mess can collapse.

Most people that I know nev... (Below threshold)
GarandFan:

Most people that I know never gave a rat's ass about Barry's birth certificate.

Perhaps Barry will spend time explaining his policies that have led to higher gas and food prices. I'm sure The One can put some proper spin on it.

Perhaps Michelle can do a follow-on show on Saturdays - exercise and diet.

They can call it "Living on Dog and Cat food for $20 week!"

Don't knock the cat food. I... (Below threshold)
James H:

Don't knock the cat food. I think mine eats better than I do.

So, here's how it looks to ... (Below threshold)

So, here's how it looks to me.

1. Obama is challenged to produce a birth certificate - and he produces one. Of the same sort that any other US citizen uses to get a driver's license, passport, or any other official document.

He does this IN 2008. To nonpartisan sources, who actually get to physically touch and photograph the frickin' thing. And which is also verified by every single official in the State of Hawaii, both Democratic and Republican.

2. This has absolutely no effect on birthers. Instead, they continue coming up with further outlandish reasons. They start to make a career out of it.

3. The Obama administration concludes that giving this matter more oxygen by going even further - further in fact than **any President has EVER HAD TO GO** - will be a further distraction.

So, they leave it to the crazies who won't accept any amount of evidence, and attempt to move on with their policies.

4. Trump, who is laughably unqualified in both temperament and business experience - the man started off with an inheritance of $400 million and since then has bankrupted four businesses - and who honestly should be disqualified purely on the poor decision-making shown by his HAIR - grabs this issue as the only issue he can run with.

5. Weary of further distraction from actual policy issues, the Obama administration finally goes the extra steps - once again, further than ANY PRESIDENT IN US HISTORY HAS HAD TO GO - to attempt to resolve this.

6. For ONCE AGAIN resolving this issue with actual facts, the Obama Administration is accused of playing politics.

This has been another edition of "You can't win."

Tabloid newspaper issues li... (Below threshold)
Paul Hooson:

Tabloid newspaper issues like usually only impress a tiny minority of crackpots, such as the tabloid stories claiming that the Moon landing never existed, or an alien spaceship landing on the White House lawn with the president shaking hands with an alien stories, etc.

Trump totally ignored the hard fact that the live birth of Obama had been reported in the HONOLULU STAR based on the hospital's release of information to the newspaper. To believe in Trump's line of nonsense would require a person to believe that at birth Obama's parents conspired to falsify his birth so he could be elected president someday in the future. That's an incredible leap of stupidity from Trump. However, he's lost billions in business since his divorce from Ivana Trump, with business failure after business failure, so stupidity from Trump isn't really anything new.

Trump was a damn fool yesterday, he's a bigger fool today.

VITAL STATISTICS OF THE UNI... (Below threshold)
Mighty Mouse:

VITAL STATISTICS OF THE UNITED STATES 1961 at

http://www.nber.org/vital-statistics/historical/nat61_1.CV.pdf

says on page 231 under the section "Race and color" the following:

"Births in the United States in 1961 are classified for vital statistics into white, Negro, American Indian, Chinese, Japanese, Aleut, Eskimo, Hawaiian and Part-Hawaiian (combined), and "other nonwhite."

"The category "white" includes, in addition to persons reported as "white," those reported as Mexican or Puerto Rican. With one exception, a reported mixture of Negro with any other race is included in the Negro group; other mixed parentage is classified according to the race of the nonwhite parent and mixtures of nonwhite races to the race of the father. The exception refers to a mixture of Hawaiian and any other race, which is classified as Part-Hawaiian. In most tables a less detailed classification of "white" and "nonwhite" is used."

Obama's "Certification of Live Birth" shows father's race as "African". That word was not used in 1961 to describe race.

#75Thats right. Th... (Below threshold)
914:

#75

Thats right. That is a more politically correct term used much later on. In the late 7o's I believe? Hell, when I was in grade school there was no Kwanza until say 1974?

Very good catch on the fraud that is being perpetuated as Obama.

"Don't knock the cat food. ... (Below threshold)
914:

"Don't knock the cat food. I think mine eats better than I do."


I think mine do too.

Look close at block 18a his... (Below threshold)
Mighty Mouse:

Look close at block 18a his mothers signature, when you sign something don't you start with your first name? Looks like it had to be added.
There is no seal, only one signature from state registrar, where is the Dir of Health's signature? Where is "This certifies that the above is a true and correct of the original record on file in the research and planning and statistics office. Hawaii state department of health."?

Oh what a tangled web we we... (Below threshold)
914:

Oh what a tangled web we weave when first we practice to deceive.

Right Barry.

I noticed that mother signa... (Below threshold)
914:

I noticed that mother signature backfilled also.

There could be a simple explanation for all of this? It could be that all of this was filled in just recently?


Hahahahahahahahhahahahahahaha

"Trump was a damn fool yest... (Below threshold)
914:

"Trump was a damn fool yesterday, he's a bigger fool today."


I would trade 50 Obama's for 1 Trump any old day. Trump loves America. Barry loves Barry!

Jim XRef post 73.<... (Below threshold)
retired military:

Jim X

Ref post 73.

Maybe Barry should have remembered War Games.

"You can't lose if you dont play" (paraphrase) Obama brought it on himself. It is like Clinton lying about Lewinsky. Be upfront and honest from the start and get it all out in the open and the issue will then go away. Try to hide it and then every little discrepancy gets blown up.


-----

Great Woop goes away and we get Paul Hasoon back. The issue of the newspaper listing has been addressed a 1000 times. THat is a fact that Paul Hasoon completely ignores while claiming that Trump ignored it.


---------

Mighty mouse

Just because that source cited it doesnt mean some clerk in Hawaii ever read it. Find me another birth certificate filled out by the same clerk that mentions Negro or African American or Black for a person whose father was born in Kenya.

Also as I stated previously. After the Bush NG paper fiasco do you think they would actually put out an amatuerish fake when they have the resources at hand that they do. It doesnt pass the common sense test.

I think with this bozo (Oba... (Below threshold)
WildWillie:

I think with this bozo (Obama) in the WH, the country going broke, lie after lie spoken by the bozo and Jim X says Trump is not qualified.

I am not a supporter of Trumps because I am a conservative but compared to Obama, Trump would be the greatest president ever. Jim X., what you be smoking? ww

Give Jim X a break. He just... (Below threshold)
Sep14:

Give Jim X a break. He just got trounced in November and hasn't fully recovered yet.

"compared to Obama, Trump w... (Below threshold)
retired military:

"compared to Obama, Trump would be the greatest president ever"

Bozo the clown would do a better job than Obama.

Next year I am voting for ABO.

The fallout from this is ju... (Below threshold)
Shamspade:

The fallout from this is just beginning. Now his academic records and transcripts, his medical records, etc. are all fair game:

http://dailycaller.com/2011/04/27/tea-partiers-conservatives-to-obama-we-want-more-now-that-you-gave-us-the-birth-certificate/

This morning was the beginning, not the end, of the matter of presidential transparency, or the promise of presidential transparency.

Where is the raised seal?<b... (Below threshold)
sablegsd:

Where is the raised seal?
Since when does a state get involved in birth certificates? If you need a certified copy, you go to the county you were born in.
Why is it curved around? What's on the other side?
He's a vicious prick for letting that military man go to jail over this.

First presser by the fed bank, ever = red herring.

Why is he campaigning relentlessly on our dime? Didn't the lying clump of smegma say there was plenty of time to campaign in 2012?

Retired Military, Thanks fo... (Below threshold)
Mighty Mouse:

Retired Military, Thanks for your service from one ret to another. Then explain his mothers signature, and this please.
A close examination of the birth certificates issued by Kapi'olani to the Nordyke twins shows the registration number precedes the number given Obama, even though the future president was born a day earlier.

Susan Nordyke was born at 2:12 p.m. Hawaii time and was given No. 151 – 61 – 10637, which was filed with the Hawaii registrar Aug. 11, 1961.

Gretchen Nordyke followed at 2:17 p.m. and was given No. 151 – 61 – 10638, which was also filed with the Hawaii registrar Aug. 11, 1961.

Read more: Unveiled! Hawaii's 1961 long-form birth certificates http://www.wnd.com/?pageId=105347#ixzz1Kkx0eF1S

Still does not explain race African, is that not a nation?, or Does Teresa Heinz Kerry have African on her BC? She was born in Africa, or will it read Caucasian?
African was just being used in the 1970's, African-American in the 1980's
Prior to the 70's Negro and Colored, Caucasian was used for race.

"You can't lose if... (Below threshold)
"You can't lose if you dont play" (paraphrase) Obama brought it on himself. It is like Clinton lying about Lewinsky. Be upfront and honest from the start and get it all out in the open and the issue will then go away. Try to hide it and then every little discrepancy gets blown up.

Retired military, here's the problem with your theory:

Obama DID not play. He SHOWED his birth certificate IN 2008. I don't see how it's Obama's fault that this wasn't enough for a bunch of crazy people.

I mean, whatever. We'll see if this level of proof will be sufficient, or if the birthers will next demand a color-sound film of the birth shot by Barry Goldwater. In any case, if the birthers don't want to move on then they want.

And # 83, wildwillie - plea... (Below threshold)

And # 83, wildwillie - please point out one lie that I've said.

Otherwise - hello, liar.

"Obama DID not play. He SHO... (Below threshold)
Sep14:

"Obama DID not play. He SHOWED his birth certificate IN 2008. I don't see how it's Obama's fault that this wasn't enough for a bunch of crazy people."


22 trillion in debt later and were the crazy people? Stick your head back up your ass where it belongs.

Here's a plausible explanat... (Below threshold)

Here's a plausible explanation for the mother's name signature:

She didn't like her first name, and she went by her middle name. So she was, for all intents and purposes, "Ann Dunham Obama." But after she signed it, she was told "you gotta use your full legal name" and added the "Stanley."

I've known several people who didn't like their given first names and went by their middle name. Hell, I despise my middle name, and use the initial almost exclusively.

When I saw the "(Stanley)," that's the very first thing I thought of.

J.

This has been Trumps plan a... (Below threshold)
Jeff:

This has been Trumps plan all along ...

Mr. Trump has been dealing with lawyers longer than most of us have been alive and he knows you don't ask a question that you don't know the answer to ... he knew Obama could produce this document ...

The point of the exercise was to MAKE Obama produce the document ... it was never to catch Obama in a lie, it was to make him react ...

Trump will now have a mic pushed in his face for the next 30 days and he will continue to push Obama on many other issues ... again, he gets facetime every night in the news cycle and for a man like Trump that is gold ...

I believe Trump started this this whole battle for 2 reasons ... 1) he doesn't want Obama re-elected and 2) he can make money off it at the same time ...

Every time Obama responds Trump wins in this fight ... he has made Obama blink and now there is blood in the water ...

The Donald will milk this for as long as he can and now that he has gotten a response which he will claim credit for and 90% of America will give him the credit for he will press the college transcripts issue for several reasons ...

1) it will be tough to call him crazy for asking for them ...
2) its tough to make it a racial thing ... although plenty will try ...
3) he can ask every day for the next month and it will be in every news cycle ...
4) the refusal to release will soon be seen as hiding something, even though it doesn't matter to most Americans what the transcripts say ... its not the crime its the coverup that paints you in a bad light ...

Jim X"Obama DID no... (Below threshold)
retired military:

Jim X

"Obama DID not play. He SHOWED his birth certificate IN 2008."

A document which can be forged even more easily or have different meaning than the original.

When asked about his long form he should have shown it then.

When asked about grades and academic reports he should have shown them.

Why do that? Because eventually the people who are being provided the proof will a. go away satisfied or b. so alienate everyone else that they are inconsequential.

Remember that Obama was doing a job interview. He said he wanted the job. We didnt pick him off the street and say "Hey we want you to be President". He wanted it. As a consequence there are things that are required to come along with the job.

When you got hired at your present job did you have to show your birth certificate or at least proof of citizenshp? Chances are you did. I have to show mine and I work for the govt. Not only did I have to show my birth certificate (Raised seal and all (no joke)) but I have so show my original DD214. I could have refused and then would have been told well your services are not needed.

Obama is the one who let this become a distraction, he is the one who drug this out for 3 or 4 years. He is the one that said he wanted to be President. As such, the job requirements are in the constitution.

When you go to buy cigarettes do you show ID?

Same principal. Or you can refuse and throw a hissy fit until someone calls the cops. Again, who caused the ruckus? not the person doing their job of ensuring the laws are followed but the person to whom the request was made.

Obama brought his on himself.

If I was applying for a job and I was told they need my first grade report card I would assume it was a bit of a nutty request but IF I WANTED THAT JOB I would be contacting the school district where I went to first grade and either get a copy of my report card or a statement from them saying "Hey sorry, not able to comply".

Now you can also argue that Obama tried the 2nd part of the above but look at all the inconsistencies that were out there. And dont you think that if the PRESIDENT OF THE US or major nominee showed up at the records office in their state of birth that someone there would make a command decision and comply with the request? Common sense says yes.

Common sense also says Obama was trying to use this a tool to make people who oppose him look like frothing idiots.

How do all you 52%'s feel n... (Below threshold)
TexBob:

How do all you 52%'s feel now? Any buyers remorse or is pride getting in the way?

According to certain websit... (Below threshold)
Sky Captain:

According to certain website posting out there in the Innernet, if you import the pdf of the WH-released document into Adobe Illustrator, you can see the "layers", and the "cuts".

This means NOTHING to me, so I asked my daughter, a high school Junior in Digital Media.
She is appalled at the sheer amateur attempt at work on this document. Apparently, the "cuts" are the edits done to the document.
To her, it means this document has been edited, and is thus a hoax.

Nice try, Homer J. Obama.
Thanks for playing.

Word has it the real baby H... (Below threshold)
Sep14:

Word has it the real baby Hussein skeletal remains are buried in an unmarked grave in Cervet.

Here's the link to the Illu... (Below threshold)
Sky Captain:

Here's the link to the Illustrator claim:

http://market-ticker.org/post=185094

OK. now we need a name (i.e, "Watergate")

Illustratorgate?
Layergate?
ForgedBirthCertificategate?
Amateur-Hour-at-the-White-House-gate?

A document which c... (Below threshold)
A document which can be forged even more easily or have different meaning than the original.

OK - in which case, the authorities go and confirm it or deny it. And again, as noted back in # 73, it was confirmed by every single relevant authority in the State of Hawaii, both Democratic and Republican.

Oh, and of course let alone our National Security apparatus.

How is it Obama's fault that some people are too crazy to believe the facts?

Why should Obama have to do more than any other President in history, to prove what every sane person knows to be the case?

I believe people are responsible for their own issues. Flat-earthers can't be convinced either. That's not the fault of the mapmakers. And the mapmakers shouldn't have to interrupt their work to try to placate crazy people with facts they won't accept.

You know, that whole accountability and personal responsibility thing, where sane people aren't responsible for the degree to which other people cling to their crazy.

Sky Captain,... (Below threshold)
Sep14:

Sky Captain,


Yeah your right. Rathergate fits but is used. ?


Kenyangate?

Pinnochiogate?

Fraudgate?

O'scamagate?

Affirmativeactiongate?

The possibilities are intriguing..


Sep14, if you won't accept ... (Below threshold)

Sep14, if you won't accept facts because you don't want to, that's the definition of crazy.

Obama was born in Hawaii at the same place, time and circumstances that he has always said he has.

Every fact that has been found backs this up, and every theory that disagrees has been thoroughly disproven by completely impartial and nonpartisan authorities.

If you still choose to disagree, that's your right. It's also my right to call it what it is: crazy in crazy sauce served in a bowler-hat made out of high-performance crazy.

As a side note, it's intere... (Below threshold)

As a side note, it's interesting to me that my request for Wildwillie to back his claim that I'm a liar is voted down.

Do you guys not believe in facts or something? I mean, how is it not rude for WW to accuse me of being a liar with no facts - but it is rude of me to ask him FOR facts to back up his accusation?

This is kind of revealing towards a general attitude towards facts here. As in, a lot of you guys don't seem to like them at all, to the point where even asking for them makes you mad.

Why is that?

Here's an interesting read:... (Below threshold)
Baggi:

Here's an interesting read:

http://market-ticker.org/akcs-www?post=185094

I don't know anything about Adobe or Illustrator. Maybe someone at Wizbang does and can tell us if this is more "birtherism" or if they have a legitimate beef with the document released by the White House?

Facts Jim X?... (Below threshold)
Sep14:

Facts Jim X?

How about 12% funemployment for over a year and still going?

How about more debt created in 2 short years the the previous 200?

How about hyper inflation of food and energy prices?

You mean those kind of facts Jim X?

Have some more unicorn piss you kook!

"104. Posted by Sep14 | Apr... (Below threshold)
Sep14:

"104. Posted by Sep14 | April 27, 2011 6:55 PM | Score: -1 (1 votes cast)"


Good answer Jim x

Fake and Familiar ... (Below threshold)
Hawk:

Fake and Familiar

It is easy to tell that this document is not an original birth certificate, because it says it on it. At the bottom it reads “ I certify this a true copy or ABSTRACT of the record on file in the Hawaii state department of health” and then it is signed by Alvin T. Onaka the current State Registrar of Hawaii and is dated APR. 25, 2011.

An abstract is a brief statement that contains the most important points of a long legal document or of several related legal papers. So this is a birth certificate created by Mr. Onaka to convey what another or perhaps several other documents contained. This is why the document has a security background, and is made of many layers. This is also why it lacks the state seal, and why it lacks the signature of the Director of Health, and the Registrar General.

This is in contrast to the certificates of the Nordyke twins born at Kapi'olani Maternity and Gynecological Hospital on Aug. 5, 1961. At the bottom of there birth certificates it reads “This certifies that the above is a true and correct copy of the original record on file in the research, planning and statistics office. Hawaii State Department of Health”. Then it is signed by the Director of Health and the Registrar General and is dated.

This is no more evidence than the easy to acquire short form that was released before. It is even possible that this form was generated from the short form.

Jim X"Why should Oba... (Below threshold)
retired military:

Jim X
"Why should Obama have to do more than any other President in history, to prove what every sane person knows to be the case?"

a. Obama isnt like any other president in history. His childhood is obscured by most of it being spent overseas along with his father not even being a US citizen which is a first. THen there is his childhood overseas, the seeming inconsistencies of spending time in Indonesia(?) when US citizens werent allowed there, his social security # starting with 042 (given to people in CT), his missing academic records from harvard, and all his writings at school). In short it appears that someone tried to remove all traces of Obama having been in place X except for certain facts IE he went to school there and taught a class there. Name ONE other US president where there has been so much secrecy surrounding the time from their early childhood to his college years.

2. Lets look at the confusing and contradictory statemenets from officials on this matter. "I was there when he was born. I knew his family" morphed into "I was in the state at the same time of his birth". "There is no birth certificate, there is a birth certificate" etc etc Can you get a certified copy of your birth certificate? I know I can. Takes about $10.

If Obama wanted to end this, AS PRESIDENT he could have marched into the Hawaii state records office building with a gaggle of reporters, the state Governor (a lifelong democrat) and had the clerk open up the book and let the reporters look at it all day long. Instead we have a LTC (Silly MFer) who went to jail because he refused to obey an order when Obama supposedly couldnt provide a copy of his long form birth certificate.

then we have Obama saying "It's the law, I cant get a copy of my long form certificate" meanwhile the US GOVT is OPENLY NOT enforcing border laws and refusing a judges order not to implement Obamacare.

b. There was never any question about previous Presidents being born in the US or their eligibility. We had a few contenders with questions. McCain being one of them. That was handled rather swiftly. Obama's only took 3 years.

c. I am quite sure with the splintering of American families that this situation will arise again. Let's hope the next president that has to deal with it does so quicker than Obama and doesnt milk it for every political morsel he can. As I said the only way to win is not to play the game.

If you say that Obama wasnt playing a game int his matter than you are either a moron or a liar. You pick


Also JimBefore you... (Below threshold)
retired military:

Also Jim

Before you go start calling people out on "facts" maybe you shouldnt throw stones when you live in glass houses.


"Do you guys not believe in facts or something?"

Yeah Jim start with the facts in post 107 if you need some FACTS to chew on.

Meanwhile go ahead and throw out the race card since Woop and Lee Ward are gone someone needs to take their place as the official democrat race card dealer.


Here's a question I have ab... (Below threshold)
Baggi:

Here's a question I have about the two birth certificates.

Obamas released today:
http://i2.cdn.turner.com/cnn/2011/images/04/27/birth-certificate-long-form.pdf

Someone born the day after Obama:

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/-euXQTzf2tKE/TbNvBw0FKZI/AAAAAAAACyc/S5Hp6Wcm2EA/s1600/%2521AANordykeBirthCertificate.jpg

I have a problem with these two documents, comparing them.

I'm sure there is a plausible explanation, so what is it?

Here's the problem. Look at the bottom left and right corners where it says "Date Accepted". Looks like a stamp in both corners.

For Obama's it clearly says, "1961". But look at the other document. It doesn't look like "1961" at all. It looks like a time, like "1351" military time.

Look closely at both of those numbers.

They don't look the same to me at all.

Why would this be?

BTW Jim X""Why sho... (Below threshold)
retired military:

BTW Jim X

""Why should Obama have to do more than any other President in history, to prove what every sane person knows to be the case?"

Gee Why did Sara Palin have to prove that Trig was her son when the left was running around saying she was covering up the product of incest between her husband and daughter.

Shall I go on with another dozen or so things Palin went through as a candidate at the hands of the left?

Compared to crap like that having to show a fucking birth certificate is small shit.

Facts Jim X?</bloc... (Below threshold)
Facts Jim X?

Jesus. Why do I even bother?

Do I have to even specify, facts that show I'm a liar - by

1. pointing at something I said
2. proving that something I said was wrong

I guess I do have to point it out. Well, I just did.

One more thing, the AUG is ... (Below threshold)
Baggi:

One more thing, the AUG is different also in those two documents.

Maybe differently made stamps? The G in AUG is very different. Obama's G is looped, with soft edges, the G in the Nordyke document is mechanical, and very straight edged.

Would be interesting to get about 15 or 20 birth certificates from that hospital around that time and see how widely they differ.

jim x,Yes, I agree... (Below threshold)
Sky Captain:

jim x,

Yes, I agree - all evidence points to 0bama having been born in Hawaii.

So why would such a "transparent" Presidency wait 3 years to release an edited document?

BTW Jim XWhere are... (Below threshold)
retired military:

BTW Jim X

Where are the faked Obama documents faxed from a Kinkos in Tx which the mainstream media failed to provide a hint of research on prior to running the story 2 weeks before the election but ran with the stories for days on 60 minutes, front page NY TIMES, ABC, NBC, CNN. etc

Well Jim, where are they?

Poor baby Obama, he has to put up with so much. Yes he does. he just wants to stop this being a distractor. yes he does. That is why he let it drag on for 3 fucking years. yes.



Want to talk facts Jim? Ta... (Below threshold)
retired military:

Want to talk facts Jim? Take those facts, Obama's birth certificate, and Bush's faked NG papers and shove them in the pipe and smoke them.

a. Obama isnt like... (Below threshold)
a. Obama isnt like any other president in history.

NO president is like any other President in history.

But we have had other Presidentsial candidates who were born in other countries. John McCain as well as Al Gore. And we have had previous presidents with at least one and even both parents who were foreign citizens. Six of them, in fact. It doesn't appear they went through this scrutiny.

As for his foreign education, the majority of voters didn't give a whit about that. And there's nothing anywhere in the Constitution about "if he's a natural born citizen who had some school overseas".

And of course the final kicker is, EVEN IF Obama WAS born overseas, he would still be a US citizen anyway - because his MOTHER is. That's how it works. SHe coulda had him in Antarctic or Mars. In US law, no matter what else is going on, if one parent is a US citizen then the kid is a US citizen.

Which is of course the real insanity of this whole foo-foo-raw.

So I don't see how you can think those are strong enough reasons, since they aren't constitutionally valid in any way.

Which takes us back to the final point you refuse to recognize - Obama DID deal with this DURING THE CAMPAIGN.

So I don't see how you can blame Obama for the refusal of crazy people to accept facts - especially since Obama's citizenship was good enough for US Top Secret clearance.

But you do. Hey, that's your privilege. It's still sad nonsense.

BaggiThey could ha... (Below threshold)
retired military:

Baggi

They could have had 10 stamps they used. Maybe they couldnt find the same stamp that day so used a different one. maybe they had more than one clerk doing birth certificates and therefore different stamps. That would explain why in the state section one says Oahu and one says Hawaii. It would also explain why AUG is spelled out on one and abbreviated on the other.

I've never understood the o... (Below threshold)
SCSIwuzzy:

I've never understood the obsession for his BC, though I've found it odd that BHO has gone out of his way to keep the mystery of it and his college records alive.
I don't have an official birth certificate either. It was lost when a fire hit the county seat in Woodbury NJ back in the 1970s. And it has been a a bitch a few times to get the state issued copy accpeted... most often by NJ state agencies!

So why would such ... (Below threshold)
So why would such a "transparent" Presidency wait 3 years to release an edited document?

Because he was apparently hoping all the crazy people would return to their senses and get back to the actual issues. Which hope was apparently in vain, because in the same statement above you claim this was an "edited document". Which boggles the mind on so many levels that I leave them to you to wonder among.

Where are the fake... (Below threshold)
Where are the faked Obama documents faxed from a Kinkos in Tx

Um, I have no idea what you're talking about?

So I presume the Lizard People have them somewhere.

Baggi-"For Obama's... (Below threshold)
Mary Mapes:

Baggi-

"For Obama's it clearly says, "1961". But look at the other document. It doesn't look like "1961" at all. It looks like a time, like "1351" military time.

Look closely at both of those numbers.

They don't look the same to me at all.

Why would this be?"


A slight oversight on My part...Sorry..

Looking at 0bama's birth ce... (Below threshold)
Sky Captain:

Looking at 0bama's birth certificate (from the link provided by Baggi in 109), I just noticed something.

The lines on the document's left-hand side are curved, as it was most likely reproduced from a bound book.The Nordyke certificate has the same effect.

However, in 0bama's the green security paper bars ARE NOT CURVED. They are completely undistorted by the bend of the paper.

So, jim x, would you like to discuss the FACT that this document has been edited? And does this sort of editing bring into question what else may have been edited?

Gee Why did Sara P... (Below threshold)
Gee Why did Sara Palin have to prove that Trig was her son when the left was running around saying she was covering up the product of incest between her husband and daughter.

Which Democratic Presidential candidate even suggested that Palin wasn't Trig's actual mother?

Hell, which Democratic candidate for ANY office even suggested this was a "question that should be looked into"?

I expect no answer to this question, because the only answer is "none" - and that might force you to accept just how ridiculous all this birther nonsense really is.

Sky Captain, when an actual... (Below threshold)

Sky Captain, when an actual nonpartisan expert in graphic reproduction and artifacts produced from the compression of a printed document > scanner > PDF > Internet website says this document is somehow a forgery, then I'll be interested.

In the meantime, it sounds exactly like the same complaints I heard of the scan of Obama's birth certificate in 2008 - which then led to Obama actually letting the nonpartisan Factcheck.org photograph and touch the document itself - which was then ignored by all birthers because it wasn't what they wanted to believe.

Which I'm sure you all know on some level is exactly what's going on now. And it's freaking embarassing for our country. But that's how it is.

Thanks for ignoring all log... (Below threshold)
914:

Thanks for ignoring all logic and facts on your way to the kool aid pitcher Jim x.


Barry's goose is cooked for the good of the country.

Jim Lets see Obama... (Below threshold)
retired military:

Jim

Lets see Obama gets a clearance because he got elected YOU DUMBASS. What are they gonna do? "Sorry mr President you cant see this because you dont qualify for a clearance?"
Being elected means you get it no matter what.

Nice straw man there Jimbo but hey you have to hang your hat on to something. "But you do. Hey, that's your privilege. It's still sad nonsense."

I have to admit my knowledge of the laws regarding birth of children overseas to ONE parent that is a citizen is not quite up to date. However, I have a feeling that if it was this simple then this matter would not have even come up. Common sense says it is not that simple. I dont know specifics on Gore I am assume his father was either in the service or in service to the US GOVT. McCain's father was in the service. IN either case they were covered.

I must have missed your comment there on the Bush NG papers. Please repeat what you said.
After all no other President has had to deal with shit like that so Why Bush?

As far as Palin, here is the answer you didnt expect.

a. I dont know if any democrat candidates made the statements but I will see what I can find out and get back to you.

b. The crap was in all the papers and the press werent exactly doing due dilligence as far as trying to dispell the rumors. Want to name another candidate that had an equal experience?

Can I paraphrase you here?

"I expect no answer to this question, because the only answer is "none" - and that might force you to accept just how ridiculous all the Palin is the republican antichrist nonsense really is (and I say IS BECAUSE we have more crap that is STILL GOING ON and she isnt even a candidate right now).


You want to claim Obama is put through crap that noone else has been put through yet you dont want to admit that the dems are more guilty of crap than the so called birthers are.

jim x,I note you d... (Below threshold)
Sky Captain:

jim x,

I note you did not actually address my question - that the document has obviously been edited in some fashion. Even I, with zero experience in working with digital media can see it. Apparently, you are incapable of this, but HAVE to have a "non-partisan expert".

Try to admit this document as evidence in a court and see what happens.

Yes, this is embarrassing for the country. You'd think the WH staff wouldn't be this politically tone-deaf, but they have been quite amateurish for quite some time. About 2 1/2 years, to be more exact.

Lets see Obama get... (Below threshold)
Lets see Obama gets a clearance because he got elected YOU DUMBASS. What are they gonna do? "Sorry mr President you cant see this because you dont qualify for a clearance?" Being elected means you get it no matter what.

I guess I must be getting through, because you're starting to get angry.

How's this, for what they're going to say? EXACTLY THAT because THAT'S THEIR JOBS, and he's just a freaking **CANDIDATE** at that point. What power does he have???

This question came up **during the campaign**, and he released his birth certificate **during the campaign**, as you'll remember.

And you should know from memory how close his candidacy was with Hillary Clinton's. How many of that narrow sliver of voters would have stayed with him, if there was even a chance he wasn't a US citizen?

And you should also remember how badly Hillary wanted that candidacy, thought she had it in the bag, and then lost to this unknown guy. Why, for one second, would she hesitate to question him directly on something so juicy as him lying about being a US citizen??

I do in fact apprecaite you're acknowledging my question. Thank you. It was unfair of me to automatically lump you in with others here who do not answer hard questions.

As for this,

You want to claim Obama is put through crap that noone else has been put through yet you dont want to admit that the dems are more guilty of crap than the so called birthers are.

I am not only claiming but am in fact asserting that Obama has been put through more ridiculous crap than Democrats have put any Republican candidates through, for at least the past 40 years.

I think it's pretty clear the facts bear this out. See if you can find even one Democrat to say anything even acknowledging the Trig nonsense, just as a starter. Then we can work from there.

Yeah, 'Birthers'. ... (Below threshold)
914:

Yeah, 'Birthers'.

Not to be confused with 'The Earth is flat" Kooks or 'the moon is made of cheese' Loons. Or even the 'Global warming day after tomorrow ice age is coming' Weirdo's who are given a lot more credence with a lot less evidence then a photo shopped copy with politically correct overtones filling in the necessary blanks.


Jinx-

"Which I'm sure you all know on some level is exactly what's going on now. And it's freaking embarassing for our country."


Yes Barry certainly is..

I think they intentionally ... (Below threshold)
PBunyan:

I think they intentionally put just enough weirdness in the document to keep the nuttier types going on this while satisfying the people who aren't quite so nutty, but were starting to doubt thanks to all the recent chatter. Win-win for team Marx.

JimLets try this a... (Below threshold)
retired military:

Jim

Lets try this again

"How's this, for what they're going to say? EXACTLY THAT because THAT'S THEIR JOBS, and he's just a freaking **CANDIDATE** at that point. What power does he have???"

What exactly are they going to do? Deny him the clearance? As the first African American candidate with a chance at winning with a hated republican in the WH do you honestly think that they were going to deny him a clearnace of make it public.

Talk about a shitstorm waiting to happen. Again you are fighting a straw man with the security clearance issue. You know it and everyone else does as well.

Also I dont know how familiar you are with political appointees and major candidates getting security clearances. I give you more credence than to be blind about it. Appointees and candidates for major (presidential elections) are given clearances. Yeah the clearance is one thing. THe need to know is the 2nd and hardest lock on the door. You might be suprised at some of the stuff that is classified TS (thinks like phone numbers of high ranking personnel).


Next the whole birth certificate fiasco. I havent been following it to be honest so I really dont know what he released during the campaign. I always have and always will see the birth certificate as a dead issue. My responses above show that. So dont assume I rememmber anything about the birth certificate during the campaign.

"How many of that narrow sliver of voters would have stayed with him, if there was even a chance he wasn't a US citizen'

Actually I dont know because of the fact that racism card was alive and very much in play during the election. I do know that Lee Ward Never mentioned the BC when he was on his Hillary kick and before he started his "Everyone is a racist who says something bad about Obama kick". Again I saw it as a nonissue because it wasnt one that could be win. In case you havent noticed above I have been shooting down the "IT's a fake" Theories.

"I think it's pretty clear the facts bear this out. See if you can find even one Democrat to say anything even acknowledging the Trig nonsense, just as a starter"

Hmm By one democrat do you mean candidate or newsworthy democrat?

How about

http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/sliming_palin.html

http://www.audacityofhypocrisy.com/2008/09/07/sarah-palin-rumors-debunked/

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/washington/2008/09/sarah-palin-m-2.html ** La times writer seems disappointed with fact check

http://www.reuters.com/article/2008/09/01/us-usa-politics-palin-idUSN2944356420080901
and
Dailykos is a pretty prominent Dem

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/lee-stranahan/why-dailykos-embraced-the_b_122790.html

Nice story on Wizbang
http://wizbangblog.com/content/2008/09/02/barrack-obamas-link-to-the-palin-baby-lies.php


So now as to your statement. Could I find a statement by someone from Obama/Hillary campaign ref this. Nope. Did you really expect me to. Nope. Did I really expect to> Not really especially given the limited amount of time I really didnt want to spend on it in the first place. They have the nice folks at Daily Kos and others to do their dirty work.

Again you didnt respond to Bush's NG records. The work of a lone dem faxed from Kinkos and yet given so much air time. Or didnt you ever hear of Dan Rather or John kerry.

The birth certificate thing... (Below threshold)

The birth certificate thing has never been a serious matter and I can only regard those who care about it as not being serious people.

There are substantive reasons to oppose Barack Obama's agenda and his re-election. Even if somehow someone can prove he wasn't born in Hawaii, it doesn't prove he wasn't eligible to be president. The fact is, he is president and this business about his place of birth can't change that -- there's no way that it can because there is no office with the authority to remove him, that also has the will to do it. The House could adopt articles of impeachment based on the suspicion that he wasn't eligible but the Democrat-controlled Senate wouldn't even bother to schedule a trial.

Instead of rehashing the outcome of the 2008 election and trying to "make it didn't happen," how about we focus on beating his skinny half-white ass in the 2012 election? He's vulnerable (granted, this business with Trump contributed to that) and he's not going to benefit from being a blank slate this time around.

That said, I've been looking into Bo the Dog's pedigree and I think we may have a real case...

Yes the integrity of the el... (Below threshold)
Sep14:

Yes the integrity of the electoral process is of course a trivial matter to be taken lightly.

Just as the constitution is to be molded and twisted to whatever is expedient to candidate and now President Obama.

Those who may disagree are non factors whistlin' past graveyard. Matter of fact they probably will not even vote in 2012.

Jim x and retired.... (Below threshold)
hcddbz:

Jim x and retired.


The question is what does Natural born mean?
There some indication that the intent was to ensure a President would not have dual allegiance.

So at the time of the signing of the Constitution one derived Citizenship from their Parents at birth. Now exemptions were provided for those person who were in the US at the time of the constitution. The first 7 president fell under this law.

All others with the exception of BHO and Chester A. Arthur had both parents as US Citizens at the time of their birth.

So some have argued in the past that natural born required that both parents be Citizen at the time of Birth. This method meant that no mater where you were born in the USA or on ship at sea you were a Citizen of the country. It also should be noted that under concept of natural law a women derived citizenship from her Husband at the time of marriage.

In recent times we have allowed that if one parent is citizen then the Child is born an American citizen at birth. Now their are some screwing things in regards to how Citizenship was award at the time of BHO birth which stated certain residency requirements.

The founders left it up to congress to define Immigration and Citizenship law. One also has to remember that the 14 amendment is purely an American invention at the time. In that no other country would award citizenship of a person of another country citizenship just by location of Birth unless they relinquished it.

So using current laws since NBC was left up to Congress to define BHO qualifies. If we use the 2 parents have to be Citizens at the time of his birth he does not. If we go by the concept of dual allegiance he does not. In the end location only matter if you consider 14th as sole criteria. So MCcain passes all test. Trump does also.

There were number of court cases and most refer to current immigration laws enacted at the time or to 14th, with exception of someone being in the country under diplomatic functions.

JIm XMy other comm... (Below threshold)
retired military:

JIm X

My other comment is waiting approval due to links.

Short answer. No democratic candidates said it that I coudl find in the time I felt like spending searching for it.

I still contend that Obama hasnt put up with near the crap that Palin has had to put up with or that Bush had to deal with (after all who else was guilty of being the cause of a future alien invasion, global warming, and single handedly destroying America).


"I think it's pretty clear the facts bear this out"

Obviously we will ahve to agree to disagree on this statement.

""Which I'm sure you all know on some level is exactly what's going on now. And it's freaking embarassing for our country.""

If you are referring to racism than I would say you are incorrect for at least 95 % of republicans. Cant say the same for the number of liberal loons out there in the rumors about Palin.

Now as to the BC stuff. Again I didnt follow the matter other than reading headlines. Can to show me a list of republican candidates who were saying that Obama wasnt born in the US. PS. Dont say Trump, where as he may be considered as a possible candidate, I see him as a bombthrower and not a serious contender and have stated so on this blog several times.


BTW Jim"And of cou... (Below threshold)
retired military:

BTW Jim

"And of course the final kicker is, EVEN IF Obama WAS born overseas, he would still be a US citizen anyway - because his MOTHER is. That's how it works. SHe coulda had him in Antarctic or Mars. In US law, no matter what else is going on, if one parent is a US citizen then the kid is a US citizen. '

Since you quote US law can you provide the one that was in effect in 1961 that covered this specific caswe?

No never mind. As I stated several (thousand) times already. IT DOESNT MATTER AND IT WONT CHANGE A THING NO MATTER WHO TRIES TO PROVE WHAt either ON THIS BOARD OR in the media outlets all over the world.

135 comments...wow...it's t... (Below threshold)
recovered liberal democrat:

135 comments...wow...it's the same at every blog. Wonder why.....

RMFYI. INA... (Below threshold)
hcddbz:

RM
FYI.

INA 1952


The following shall be nationals and citizens of the United States at birth:
(1) a person born in the United States and subject to jurisdiction thereof....

if born outside USA.

(7) a person born outside the geographical limits of the United States and its outlying possessions of parents one of whom is an alien, and the other a citizen of the United States who, prior to the birth of such persons, was physically present in the United states or its outlying possessions for a periods totaling not less than ten years least five of which of which were after attaining the age of fourteen years...


INA ACT 1952


Looking at 0bama's... (Below threshold)
JLawson:
Looking at 0bama's birth certificate (from the link provided by Baggi in 109), I just noticed something.

The lines on the document's left-hand side are curved, as it was most likely reproduced from a bound book.The Nordyke certificate has the same effect.

However, in 0bama's the green security paper bars ARE NOT CURVED. They are completely undistorted by the bend of the paper.
SkyCaptain - That's because the image you're seeing was photocopied onto the security paper. There wouldn't be any bending of the bars in that case.

And the Nordyke cert looks to me like it wasn't bound yet. There ARE some numbers next to various things, as on Obama's, which makes me think they were database codes.

Baggi - Nordyke's cert was photocopied in 1966. Obama's in 2011. It wouldn't surprise me at all (having dealt with military records over a 23-year span) that the boilerplate "This is a fer-real copy, you betcha - we gua-ran-tee!" statement has changed since 1966!

Guys, I think this is the real thing. You've got a scanned PDF, not a JPG. This is starting to remind me of the crap about Bush's ANG records - all sorts of speculations but nobody actually taking the time to talk to an Admin person who specialized in actual attendance recording in the Reserves and ANG who could have explained what THEY thought was so damning.

And now back to "Portal 2".... (Below threshold)
JLawson:

And now back to "Portal 2". One more core, and Wheatley's toast!

JLawson. I think probably ... (Below threshold)
retired military:

JLawson. I think probably 95% of the "discrepancies" which people are finding in the document released today can be pretty much attributed to a sound reasonable explanation.

This thing has drug on so long becuase the dems wanted it to. Plain and simple. Noone can make me beleive that if the Pres of the US asks for a certified long form copy of a birth certificate (be it theirs or anyone else's on file anywhere in the US) that the governor of the state or some lowly file clerk in the state records department is going to stand up and say "No. You cant have it because it is in violation of section XYZ of regulation 123)."

It isnt going to happen unless they can stand there and tell me with a straight face - oh wait the president can look at nuclear launch codes but not his birth certificate. .

If Obama wants to stand up and say that crap than he should be considered the laughingstock of the free world and every dictator on the planet.

However, in 0bama's the ... (Below threshold)

However, in 0bama's the green security paper bars ARE NOT CURVED. They are completely undistorted by the bend of the paper.

JLawson has it right -- this was copied on to the security paper. I sincerely doubt that that particular form of security paper even existed in 1961.

This was a dead issue. Now it's a really most sincerely dead issue.

Let's stop molesting this corpse, OK?

J.

Obama today in his speech</... (Below threshold)
retired military:

Obama today in his speech

"We are not going to be able to do the things that need to get done by villifying each other. "

2 sentences later

"We cant get done what we need to do if we are distracted by carnival barkers"

Gee Jim X. WOuldnt you say that you villify someone by calling them a carnival barker.


The Democrat party line.

"we arent going to go around calling these lousy lying cheating whoring SOBs names. We are going to be nice to these death dealing bastards who want to eat little babies and feed grandma dogfood and we will listen respectfully to what these dirty no good lying through their teeth bastards have to say. Above all we are going to be nice to each other"

Let's stop molesting thi... (Below threshold)
JLawson:

Let's stop molesting this corpse, OK?

EE-f'ing-W!

Works for me! Please, folks - enough's enough. This is starting to drift into tinfoil hat territory.

66, Shamspade says the guy ... (Below threshold)

66, Shamspade says the guy was stupid, plain and simple.

Well he's stupid alright. That's a New-York-City to-a-single-brick lay-down misère. And they don't come any simpler.

But "plain?"

That may just be a bit rough, for there are lots who say he's quite good looking.

(For such a stupid simpleton)

Yes the integri... (Below threshold)
Yes the integrity of the electoral process is of course a trivial matter to be taken lightly.
As opposed to what, time travel?

What's done is done. The proper response is to make sure it never happens again. That's why states are passing rules that call upon presidential candidates to prove their eligibility.

What more can be done, short of flagging down Doctor Who and taking a ride in the TARDIS?

<a href="http://www.comicsa... (Below threshold)
retired military:

http://www.comicsalliance.com/2011/04/27/superman-renounces-us-citizenship/

Well we dont have to worry about superman running for President now.

I fully expect DC comics to close up in a few years.

RM:I wouldn't nece... (Below threshold)
James H:

RM:

I wouldn't necessarily be that hostile to Supes renouncing US citizenship. There's a lot of storytelling potential there, particularly if it's handed to a competent writer.

James., DC is now run by a... (Below threshold)
retired military:

James., DC is now run by a ultraliberal woman.

Sorry but the comics they have now are just political correct pieces of crap (from what I have read).

BTW I have some 1950s Roy Rogers and Trigger, Bonanza and Kid Colt I am trying to sell.

RM: Honestly, I haven't pa... (Below threshold)
James H:

RM: Honestly, I haven't paid much attention to Superman on the DC side. I prefer the Green Lantern books these days.

But I would think there would be storytelling potential there. The trick would be to keep from being overly didactic and ensure you don't cover territory already trod by Captain America and Watchmen.

I am in the cord it forth c... (Below threshold)

I am in the cord it forth camp. I like that the deems brought this affair up with McCain because he was built-in on an aggressive abject while his ancestor was stationed in Panama, again they debris to absolution Obama docs for three years. Time for a civic law apropos bearing certs and active for president.

Oh, it's a fake! It's so ob... (Below threshold)

Oh, it's a fake! It's so obvious! LOL! It's as if they are oblivious to the fact that just a short time ago the establishment media was screaming from the rooftops when the original (receipt) "long-form" was released...the very same one that soft ball Matthews waved in front of the nation like it was a long lost treasure map...remember now? They were ALL calling that the "ORIGINAL LONG FORM" ...So, what happened? Why the short memories? How can you have two different originals, released at 2 different times? LOL
Then, on top of that, we have a new "original" that was actually submitted by the White House personally, yet was so obviously a fake that a third grader learning photo shop for the first time could have done it! LOL And it was just like a third grader's work to forget to flatten all the layers before submitting the final project to the masses! HAHAHA What a shame! And you fools swallow it all hook line and sinker! HAHAHA!!! ...at least the new fake actually looks like a long-form! LOL Find the truth here: http://www.infowars.com/new-obama-birth-certificate-is-a-forgery/




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