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NY Times on the Case

Now the NY Times moves it:

An Ex-Officer Now Believes Guard Memo Isn't Genuine

HOUSTON, Sept. 11 - A former National Guard commander who CBS News said had helped convince it of the authenticity of documents raising new questions about President Bush's military service said on Saturday that he did not believe they were genuine.

The commander, Bobby Hodges, said in a telephone interview that network producers had never showed him the documents but had only read them to him over the phone days before they were featured Wednesday in a "60 Minutes" broadcast. After seeing the documents on Friday, Mr. Hodges said, he concluded that they were falsified.

Mr. Hodges, a former general who spoke to several news organizations this weekend, was just the latest person to challenge the authenticity of the documents, which CBS reported came from the personal files of Mr. Bush's former squadron commander at the Texas Air National Guard, Lt. Col. Jerry B. Killian, who died 20 years ago.

I'm not sure which is the news story here...

That the NY Times is running a story that might help Bush, that CBS authenticates pieces of paper over the phone or that yet another person with far more information than CBS about the topic comes out against them? All of them are pretty impressive in their own right.

I thought it rather odd (ok pun intended) when I saw the 60 Minutes II piece that much of the authentication of the documents was based on the fact that people vouched for the fact that the contents were true. Being a fan of logic that seemed like a very poor argument. Apparently after watching CBS defend this story for a few days that is increasingly their only line of defense.

As I put before... "The documents are authentic because George Bush sucks."

Such an odd argument. I also noted that in their first broadcast CBS said they had people who had seen the documents back in the 1970's. As ABC news reported, they have never repeated that claim.


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Comments (51)

My comment started to becom... (Below threshold)

My comment started to become a post. I'll take it over to my blog.

This is a clear case of peo... (Below threshold)

This is a clear case of people who are "traveling the universe in their minds." I can't believe these people are still on TV questioning the president's time in the National Guard, insisting people believe these blatant lies. It's embarrassing already. I guess for this bunch it doesn't get any better. What a great country.

Just when you think democrats can't sink any lower... ????

Another reason why Bush will win!


Everybody needs to push thi... (Below threshold)

Everybody needs to push this until they simply retract the story. Sometimes you just have to plunge the silver dagger through the heart. I am considering filing a lawsuit over it if I can get a little research help and some good ideas on how the average person is damaged by fraud like Rather's.

Oh geez! Where the FCC whe... (Below threshold)

Oh geez! Where the FCC when you need them? CBS is still standing by the outlandish lies they told about those forged documents.

In addition to Hodges, the news reports are saying that The colonel (Studds I think) who supposedly wrote that memo retired months before the date on that memo.


I believe that's the same N... (Below threshold)
D Carter:

I believe that's the same NY Times article that was carried in my local paper, The Richmond Times-Dispatch. Note, however, that the NYT is focusing on the comments provided by the participants (Killian's family, Hodges, etc.); the paper is still avoiding the issues surrounding the physical, documentary evidence, essentially implying that there's some kind of raging debate among doc experts as to the memos' authenticity, when, on the contrary, no certified expert, to my knowledge, has opined that the documents are "probably" genuine.

Maybe one of Bush's surrogates (Cheney or, even better, Zell Miller), ought to publicly challenge CBS to submit the documents for review to a panel of real experts. CBS won't agree, of course, but I think such a move would further isolate the network from its erstwhile MSM allies. Surely, someone at the WaPo or elsewhere ought to be smelling Pulitzer Prize about now.

Anyone have a transcript fo... (Below threshold)

Anyone have a transcript for the Saturday, Sept. 11th edition of FOX News Watch? Regarding the “Memogate” scandal, Neal Gabler (liberal media writer) was advancing the theory that CBS/Boston Globe/NYT were only balancing out the “shameful reporting” of the Swiftboat Vets for Truth claims (and by “shameful” I think he meant giving them any airtime at all) by having news organizations pretend that the fake Killian memos were authentic. He used the analogy of a sports umpire/official making a bad call against one team, and then realizing his error and subsequently balancing out the bad call for one team with a bad call for another team. Fair and balanced (WTF?)

J***s H. C***!Who ... (Below threshold)

J***s H. C***!

Who gives a flying F**K!!

Unless it can be proven that GWB was AWOL from the guard because he was too busy drowning kittens, the whole pile of crap is not going to change one vote.

Wouldn't you rather be hearing about how we're going to pay for the "War on Terror", and the new improved No Child Left Behind initiatives, and how the prez wants to overhaul the tax system? I sure as hell would.

Don't forget the competitio... (Below threshold)

Don't forget the competition factor... althought the NY Slimes is a liberal mouthpiece they smell blood in the water...

they're doing their best to bring down CBS and Dan Blather while NOT helping the the Bush campaign.

they'll be a smug 'see what they did to destroy the pres., we wouldn't do that you can trust us to report only the facts' in the days to come. then back to business as usual.

I actually voted for the me... (Below threshold)

I actually voted for the memo's...but that was before I voted against them...

If Cee BS 's erstwhile "spoiled boy" candidate was as "absolutely convinced of the authemticity" of just one of his endless positions on every side of every issue they would'nt have to resort to this kind of "neck in the nose" desperation.

FOX at least just did a very direct shot across CBS's bow. The Hodges and retired guy things.

Stated that they interviewed Hodges and he said that CBS misrepresented the nature of the memo's etc...That he's convinced their fakes...

Then they stated that CBS has twice refused to back off of their position. I think CBS is going to ride this puppy into the ground. I get flash backs of Slim pickens riding that A-Bomb like a bucking bronco as it plunges toward Moscow in "Dr. Stranglove"...

At this point its down to CBS and Matley against the rest of the world...

Oh...and the CBS froggies a... (Below threshold)

Oh...and the CBS froggies are edging toward the door setting up their eventual "excuse" by in effect calling their one and only witness to the whole thing, Col. Hodges, a lier, insisting they believe his first account. So let me see if I get this. They stand by the authenticity on the basis that the one witness they had is a lier. Erm...but...oh never mind...

Look for them to claim "...Who knew"....

That might be a tongue in c... (Below threshold)

That might be a tongue in cheek way for them to bail but for one thing. If they go that way..."CBS has learned that the witnesses and the experts they depended on and trusted for authenticity in this report have since shown themselves to be unreliable blah blah blah...." the first thing everyone will demand is the sources for the fake memo's. So they'er trapped... The know this isn't going to end well no matter what.... Remember the pipeline info from the DNC insider who claimed days ago that these memo's were given to the Kerry people who had a real doubt because the giver could'nt confirm the source...After a lot of internal hand wringing the Kerry Kops gave them to CBS anyway. Anyway you cut it McAuliffe blindsided CBS....

The one thing CBS cannot no... (Below threshold)
Mrs. Davis:

The one thing CBS cannot now nor ever will do is betray the confidnece of an anonymous source. They would never get another story if they did. Likewise, if they made it up themselves, or were in collusion with someone who did, they will not admit it. So CBS, having failed to impeach its source when doubt first arose is now condemned to riding with the source to the end. In all likelyhood, no one will every prove they are forgeries in the sense of establishing who created them, but everyone will know they are forgeries. I did not hear of the story being discussed on the talking head shows, so outside the internet, I bet the story is over.

Time Magazine's latest poll... (Below threshold)

Time Magazine's latest poll still shows Bush up by 11 points, while Newsweek reported a slight decrease: Bush up by only 6 points. However, neither poll shows Kerry getting any increase in points. CBS shot themselves in the foot -- a malady that affects most Liberals. They never could shoot straight.

BTW, CBS maintains that they still can prove Bush lies about his record. The slugs just won't give up.

Take heart... FOX isn't goi... (Below threshold)

Take heart... FOX isn't going to let this die... To much opportunity to drive in the last spike...even if its just making CBS/Rather go on camera time after time to further shred their credibility...

Newsweek and several blog sites are speculating that Bill Bekett is the original source of the documents...

Other lawyer bloggers have mentioned the possibility of fund raising so the Killian family can file an "Illegal possession claim" against CBS on the documents. (They were not given over by the Military or the family with approval for commercial use.)

This would force "discovery" for proof of authenticity and aside from a remote possible way to force revelation of the source would continue the embarrassment in public arena and media as the case progressed.....

Hunter,I'd be inte... (Below threshold)
Mrs. Davis:


I'd be interested in reading about the Illegal posession claims. Do you have links? Thanks.

Nordic Girl, I saw... (Below threshold)

Nordic Girl,

I saw Neal Gabler advancing that BS on Newswatch. I wrote to Newswatch asking them why they have a media critic who's the most rabid Bush-hater on TV. I've heard him say, "Halliburton," more times than I can remember. I told Fox News he's also a liar. The Media Research Center caught him lying and wrote to him for evidence of some of his assertions, but Gabler had no evidence. I guess Gabler feels his statement are correct because, as Paul writes, "George Bush sucks."

There's a suggestion on Pow... (Below threshold)

There's a suggestion on Power Line (http://powerlineblog.com/archives/007801.php) that a good way to pressure CBS News into conducting an internal investigation is through the local affiliates. I've personally e-mailed my local CBS affiliate and suggest Wizbang readers to do the same. Pass the word along.

Wouldn't it be great to have all the CBS affiliate station managers check their e-mail inbox Monday morning and spill the day's first coffee when they find a few thousand viewer requests for an independent investigation into "Cover Your AssGate".

Mrs. Davis ... The blogger ... (Below threshold)

Mrs. Davis ... The blogger was a contributor on INDC...a comment on maybe one or two main posts back...posts are flying so fat its been hard to even keep up...impossible to cover them all....

Accredidation of the blogosphere in general and the various chief Ed's Mr's Jay Tea, Paul, the Johnsons, ect., has been a little stingy by the MSM...but...The more iridite among them have long since figured out what a valuable "research" source the brave new open journalism "pajama pundits" represent...

Look for more and more reliance on the blogger guys as time goes by... One area of disscussion will be "exclusivity"...another will be legal indemnification... all of which will be workable...As for me I'm lovin it.... "The liberal press monopoly is dead...Long live the Blogosphere"

Yeah, Hunter says it! Grea... (Below threshold)

Yeah, Hunter says it! Great! I particularly like the "Pajama Pundits" tag...

Check out Michelle Malkins ... (Below threshold)

Check out Michelle Malkins take on "next steps" at http://www.michellemalkin.com/....

This thing is far far from over...

Heh...heh...If the indomina... (Below threshold)

Heh...heh...If the indominable Rove is behind this the picture of a grinning Road Runner handing Willey Coyote a lit stick of dynamite as he goes over the cliff comes to mind...

All through this election cycle as we've watched the mangled mechanizations of the McAuliffe camp of young turk pinheads work their bumbling magic, fielding a candidate that is awash in a countinueous "bowel movement of the mouth" I keep thinking "With supporters like this who needs an opponent".... double and triple heh....

When, exactly, did this blo... (Below threshold)

When, exactly, did this blog degenerate for being "a unique mix of news, politics, and entertainment." and "one of the most popular conservative weblogs on the Internet." to the "DanRather/BostonGlobe/NYTimes Sucks" blog 24/7. I went back to the beginning of September, and the last thing posted about the president and his programs/promises was the posting of the text of the acceptance speech.

Can somebody please point me to a site where they are actually discussing the issues he put forth?

Rance -- that would be nice... (Below threshold)

Rance -- that would be nice BUT, Kerry has not given an on camera interview in 43 days. He can't talk about his Senate record because, well, its to complex for us commoners. He can't talk about his anti-war record because we're at war with the Islamists. All he's left is his 4.5 months of of leadership(?) in Veitnam. Remember he is a genuwiiine Wuur heeero! I still can't figure out what the hell the Dems were thinking putting him up as a candidate. Then we have a media that just can't let this go, and the blogs are destroying them

Ever notice how the Liberal... (Below threshold)

Ever notice how the Liberal attack dogs suddenly want to "discuss the issues" every time they step in their own doodoo...

In the interests of "Know thy opponent" the Washington post has a very comprehensive piece on Bob Shrum... "Loss Leader"...Kerry's close comfidant and speech writer.....

Who needs an on-camera inte... (Below threshold)

Who needs an on-camera interview? Has Kerry put forth a tax plan? Has Bush? How do they compare? What's your bottom like going to be on April 15th if either of them succeed? Kerry has said he wants to roll back the Bush tax cuts on the high end brackets? Bush says he wants to simplify the tax code (no details yet). So who needs an on camera interview?

Rance-- until Kerry answers... (Below threshold)

Rance-- until Kerry answers on camera, I don't believe a word that Kerry says. He's on more sides of an issue than a hexagon. BTW, Bush may be a disappointment to us libertarians, but do you really have to ask who is going to cost you more on Dec. 15th. If you do, then you haven't really been paying attention anyway.

I have been paying attentio... (Below threshold)

I have been paying attention, that's exactly it. In his convention speech, the prez said he want's to rewrite the tax code. He said if you want more details, go to GeorgeWBush.com. Well, there are no details there. I know that Hastert says he wants to kill the IRS and put in a national sales tax. Is that what the president wants? He says he wants to give us back control of our retirement money. Well I already took control. I've got money saved, the taxes are paid on it, its mine to spend as I please. But Hastert wants to tax be again on it when I spend it. Is Bush for this, or against it. I've read he's for it but won't come out with his position until after the election. Sound just like Kerry.

A pox on both their houses.

I would love to see the 'fa... (Below threshold)

I would love to see the 'fair tax' implemented, but I don't believe Bush will do this. He is going to make tax cuts permanent. I'm glad to see that you have taken care of business, but even if the fair tax does come about its not going to cost you any more, in fact you will keep all of your income. The overall cost of tax compliance now should roughly equal the consumption tax if used in the future. Personally, I just don't see the Dems allowing this to happen.

Well Wilky.... apparently K... (Below threshold)

Well Wilky.... apparently Kerry's fun bunch read your blog...He just did an interview with Karen Tumulty at Time online...

Same general Bush bashing and statements that he intends to be "Crystal clear" while never saying anything specific...

btw he claims he did not see any of the RNC...if you believe that you need to check yourself in for drug testing immediately....I wonder if his "advisors" really understand how dissrespectful that seems of the electorates intelligence...

From his responses to the questions it doesn't look like he's taking anyones advice and changing campaign tactics...

...Drudge was piling up so many lead lines on Rathergate he was running out of sidebar space......

Hunter: yes, I notice and ... (Below threshold)

Hunter: yes, I notice and all the time...the day that it's palpable as to a Dem flimsy balloon being deflated, "critical" comments start appearing on most conservative, even moderate sites, making "demands" to "discuss...issues" with a lot of criticism thrown in about, usually, religion and related prejudices. It's a predictable response by now, from the Left, about disproved Left brushfires that have sinec been put out.

I read that article earlier this morning about "Shrummy" (WashingtonPost), also. Who is being now brought down by certain Dems based on class criticisms, no less. What I think it actually is is that the Dems are scrambling to find a toe hold for their "people party" -- including Kerry's recent fearmonger thing about the GOP "probably" posing a block to black voters.

I can't help it, I just have to keep asking, what ELSE is Kerry/the DNC going to try to float?!? I mean, these are desperate statements by desperate voices, by Kerry, et al. Next we'll hear that the U.S. is ruled by giant lizards...wait, they've already tried to promote that and it was later made into a popular television series.

Watching Former Emb. Hollbr... (Below threshold)

Watching Former Emb. Hollbrook "not answer" any of the questions put to him on FOX News Sunday concerning Kerry's flipflopping or his specific differences with the Bush strategy in Iraq has gone beyond embarrassing to painful...

The FOX news group including Brent Hume, Bill Kristol, Juan Williams, and Mara Liasson of NPR are going through the Rathergate mess... Williams will of course try gamely to present a viable reason for the Liberal press duplicity.... Hume will eat everyones lunch in usual his concisive manner....

Should be interesting....

Hunter - As far as Kerry sa... (Below threshold)

Hunter - As far as Kerry saying he didn't watch any of the Republican convention, I remember Bush's people saying the same thing about Bush and the Democratic convention, then they sort of changed their story the next day:

TRENT DUFFY: Well, obviously, the President has a great stake in this election, a personal stake, and he has been keeping an eye on it.
He has been monitoring closely, as you might imagine, the events in Boston.
But he knows that the American League East won't be decided until September.

Q: You said he's "monitoring closely." Can you say whether he's actually watched any of the convention on TV?

MR. DUFFY: He has watched some of it from time to time.

Of course JM...Both sides l... (Below threshold)

Of course JM...Both sides look just plain foolish when they try this sort of nonsense...

Well Williams didn't dissapoint, immediately trying to drag the discussion back to the swiftboat bruhaha and then for the umpteenth time restating the "cast in concrete" Liberal talking point lie that [ all of the swiftboat contentions were proven false and lies] ... Its getting to the point where you have to simply accept that the Liberal camp has given up any remaining shred of objectivity...

Maybe if Kerry's "Christmas in Cambodia" battle exploits were tattooed on the insides of their eyelids the Libs would stop for a minute and try satient meaningful thought for a change...

Hume bitchslapped CBS/Rather directly in contrast - paraphrasing - [No respecting News organization should ever be caught pressing the issue for something so blattenly fradulent and partisan] ... amen

Amy Barnes just did yet ano... (Below threshold)

Amy Barnes just did yet another phone interview with Rita Cosby on FOX News live....very damning stuff....

Gotta hand it to FOX....they'er going after this like a dog with a bone...They'er hammering on it in every News segment....Gotta wonder what CBS will do....Try the "Who knew" defense or go down with the swiftboat...

Either way, who in their right mind will ever take Rather serious again...He's toast...

Toast roasted on "a sharp s... (Below threshold)

Toast roasted on "a sharp stick called truth."

OFF TOPIC...BUCKHEAD... (Below threshold)
Steve F:


As reported here and by the LA Times, "Buckhead" was one of the first freepers to notice the forged memos. See http://www.latimes.com/news/politics/la-na-blog12sep12,1,3703412.story?coll=la-home-politics

In a Wash Times article, it notes that Col. Walter Staudt's nickname is "Buck." See http://www.washingtontimes.com/national/20040912-125608-4609r.htm


...Maybe the "buck stops he... (Below threshold)

...Maybe the "buck stops here" ...huh Steve

Well, Fox News' Laurie Dhue... (Below threshold)

Well, Fox News' Laurie Dhue (yummy) just reported that US News & World Report has a new article claiming Bush did not fulfill his National Guard duties. I guess on the planet Libtron, only Honorable Discharges for Democrats are real, all others are undeserved. Is US News also owned my Viacom?

Hunter -I saw the Ri... (Below threshold)

Hunter -
I saw the Richard Holbrooke interview -- My jaw dropped (as did Chris Wallace's) when the Man-Who-Would-Be-Secretary of State Holbrooke said that Iraq was worse than Vietnam. The Dems/Libs seem to be of a mindset that stupidity is a virtue.

Also, Juan Williams is a dummy. Look who he works for -- NPR. I truly believe Fox News keeps him around for laughs.

Random independent thoughts... (Below threshold)

Random independent thoughts...

- The Republicans have to be right 100% of the time...Kerry only has to be consistant once...

- The left will finally stop reliving the Vietnamese war when we hold a "Ho Chi Min" victory parade in Manhatten with Kerry as Grand Marshall...

- Future medical science will note: "The "Giant dangling dimpled chads" epedimic, otherwise known as Goreneism, common to all members of the Democratic party, suddenly and mysteriously dissapeared in 2024 when Hillery's grand daughter won the Presidential Election"...

The Liberal Democrats will finally prove Ann Coulter wrong by proving she lied and they can be trusted all the way to age 7...

The Florida Election board will discover 2000 more dimpled ballots in a coke Macine in the lobby of the Fountain Blue Hotel and declare Nadar the final winner...

Oh....and - The De... (Below threshold)


- The Dem's will cleverly declare Kerry "exempt" from "Operation Fortunate Son" since while he may be rich and from the Boston upper chrust he's married to Teresa....

I just saw a news article o... (Below threshold)
1750 heritage:

I just saw a news article on Fox which indicated the main stream media channels are losing revenue to the advertisers. I'm guessing if the New York Times is changing positions its a capitalist move to realize a profit. Oh I forgot this is a liberal publication and truth should prevail over profit...but then I know they don't really believe in a capitalist world...I'm so confused. I dropped my subscription over two years ago.

I never thought I'd see the... (Below threshold)

I never thought I'd see the day when the U.S. News and World Report was labeled "liberal". On what political continuum would that be?

Follow-up on U.S. News and ... (Below threshold)

Follow-up on U.S. News and World Report, that lefty rag.
If you want to see how pinko they really are, you might start by reading some of the owners columns in the New York Daily News start start with the August 2002 column

Don't wait for Saddam to unleash terror, take him out now;

This is for Rance....... (Below threshold)

This is for Rance....

In case your wondering where the cause of "the politics of hate" came from, check out Kerry's latest attack on the GOP. THIS IS HIS CAMPAIGN OVERALL & WHY THE DNC WANTS TO DISTRACT AMERICANS FROM THE REAL ISSUES WE FACE. This is as bogus as the forged documents against Bush are. So if you want to know WHY we can't get to the real issues facing Americans, here's another glimpse. Bush has already stated his plan for America unlike the democrats who want to keep the status quo with all the divisiveness they can muster.

Kerry Hints GOP May Supress the Black Vote
Sep 12, 8:51 AM (ET)

WASHINGTON (AP) - John Kerry suggested Saturday night that Republicans may try to keep black voters from casting their ballots to help President Bush win in November. "We are not going to stand by and allow another million African American votes to go uncounted in this election," the Democratic presidential nominee told the Congressional Black Caucus.
"We are not going to stand by and allow acts of voter suppression, and we're hearing those things again in this election."
Kerry has a team of lawyers to examine possible voting problems to try to prevent a repeat of the 2000 election disputes. He also has said he has thousands of lawyers around the country prepared to monitor the polls on election day.
"What they did in Florida in 2000, some say they may be planning to do this year in battleground states all across this country," Kerry said. "Well, we are here to let them know that we will fight tooth and nail to make sure that this time, every vote is counted and every vote counts."


Branna:You might r... (Below threshold)


You might read this to see why he's concerned.


Rance,That was the... (Below threshold)


That was then & we are talking about the future for all Americans. From my POV, I see many depressed neighborhoods being revilatlized. I see many good things happening for people. This is not the same old giveaways of the past that left people poor, getting crumbs, & I must say ignorant; but a real chance for people who take the time to find out how the govt. is helping many people attain opportunity they never had before. Bush is definately got his eye on helping people to help themselves. I think it's gonna take radical changes in many govt. agencies & the way they deal with the changing world around us, & in what they offer people if the tax cuts can be permanent. I'm for less fed govt. & more for states rights anyway.

Why does everyone have to be or think the same way to be productive? That's the biggest thing I saw at the GOP convention that was sorely missing at the DNC convention. One thing all GOPers were united on regardless of social leanings was national security & it's about time the DNC was made accountable. Even the libs in NY & CA voted for GOPers because they needed someone to bail them out of the fiscal & crime problems facing those areas due to the lib democrats they voted for. It's true that the platform does stand by the right to life but that is important for all of humanity & not just for the secular humanists who play politics with our rights. I wish there were more democrats who would also speak out like Zel Miller did, as well as those republicans who spoke at the convention did. Don't you? I wonder how long Americans will continue to believe the liberal lies on issues of national defense.

OMT, I believe that GWB does what he says he's gonna do. I also see Kerry's voting record & it doesn't jive with the image he's trying to portray as a strong presidential leader ready to defend our country. Yes, I can see another vietnam happening with Kerry, not Bush. Don't you?

All these attacks we are seeing is to scare people into crying uncle. Are you gonna let terrorists have their way? How can that help you keep your freedoms? Look what bin laden turned afghanistan & the sudan into? Horrible tierney, brutality & genocide for those people. That includes places like Iraq & Iran not to mention No. Korea. Where muslim radicals infultrate every dissenting group around the world. Is this what you want?

There are many contrasts between the 2 partys. You do have a choice in this next election & I wish people would take the person for their actions & vote accordingly. Yu think?

Branna - I guess we didn't ... (Below threshold)

Branna - I guess we didn't read the same article. I was refering to the fact that the AG has turned the focus of his department from assuring that no qualified voter was denied the right to vote, to stopping unqualified voters from voting, and changing the makeup of the enforcement staff from apolitical appointees to political appointees in the process.

I don't think Osama, Zell, or the Goverator have a whole lot to do with that.

Think logically CBS. If yo... (Below threshold)

Think logically CBS. If your experts say that they cannot difinitively say that the memos are fake because they are X generation copies, then doesn't it also mean you can't definitively say they are real? And just because there was one typewriter in existence that might have been able to create the memo, can you prove that it did?

Rance,I did read t... (Below threshold)


I did read the article. As I said before, that was then but we are talking about today. EVERYONE has the right to register to vote. EVERYONE. That's something that can't be taken away.

The way I see it, abuse has been used on both sides of the fence...to busing in people to various places to vote then crying discrimination & having dead people voting. It's not discrimination to make sure there's one person one vote. Voter registration has become too lax but it's not just a republican problem & dems need accountability too. Don't you agree?

As far as redistricting fights that's a different issue. You want to talk about election stealing & voter suppression all you have to do is look at Gore... then Torricelli/Lauthberg.... now McGreevey. Yu think?

BTW, Rance...You w... (Below threshold)

BTW, Rance...

You wanted to hear about some of the issues...well I just gave you some issues that I thought were significant & worthy to discuss. It's out there.

If you want, you can got to this site which is a political BBS.


God bless~~~






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