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Showdown at the UM Corral

Well, it's almost 9, and time for Bush and Kerry to square off. The expectations game has been played pretty thoroughly; both campaigns have been running down the expectations for their own guy, while praising their opponents. It's actually a refreshing change of pace from them beating up each other.

I think I'm gonna watch it on C-SPAN. I gave them my attention during the RNC, and they did a pretty good job then. Ah, the joys of cable... so many choices.

(Updated as the spirit moves me)


9:00: OK, just about to start. Popcorn's almost ready and Elmo, my cat, is standing by to assist as needed. I had to repeatedly promise him there would be no dancing Republicans, unlike at the Republican National Convention. I just hope he can withstand Orange Crush...

9:08: Opening: Kerry dawdles to come onstage, then leans in to loom over the shorter Bush. Cheap theatrics, but sometimes works.

Opening question: Kerry wastes a bit of time sucking up to the audience and Lehrer. Bush on the split screen looks a cross between bored and mildly miffed. Jotting notes. And here come the lights... ending on the red light. Perfectly timed.

Bush also does the token sucking up, but much more concisely.

Ick, Kerry sticks out his tongue when he drinks. Yuck... Elmo looks up to say "even I drink more gracefully than that, and I lack opposablt thumbs." His skin tone's considerably more natural. Ironically, Bush looks redder.

Bush is outlining just what he did, and how. Good summation, no response to Kerry.

9:14: Bush is focusing relentlessly on the war on terror. He's tying together 9/11, Iraq, Beslan... it's all part of one big thing. No, Saddam had nothing to do with 9/11. But 9/11 didn't happen in a vacuum.

Kerry's reactions are also appropriate. Thoughtful, attentive, taking notes. But Bush's timing is better. Kerry ended on the red light; Bush on the blinking.

"Bush outsourced the hunt for Bin Laden." Not a bad effort, but no barn-burner.

I'm not expecting any major bombshells in this. I can think of only a few instances of major upsets in big debates: Ford declaring there was no Soviet domination of Eastern Europe; Reagan's "there you go again;" Dukakis fumbling the capital punishment question; "You're no Jack Kennedy" devastating Dan Quayle. And in the fourth case, Quayle's ticket still won.

Bush is using Kerry's own words on him. He had those quotes memorized, and a bunch more, too, I bet.

Bush kicking the useless UN... now maybe he'll kick France and Russia for being bought off.

"Pre-September 10th mentality." That's a phrase that I think came from the blogosphere... I think it's become a big thing. I like it.

9:19: Bush keeps repeating his one main theme: terrorists are bad. He's said it over and over, and he will repeat it again and again. It's his mantra, his panacea. And it works because it's true.

More great timing on the lights from Bush.

Kerry: Bush shouldn't have gone into Iraq. Shoulda stayed in Afghanistan. Iraq wasn't "the center" of terrorism -- perhaps not operationally, but certainly geographically -- Iran, Afghanistan, Syria, Saudi Arabia, all surround Iraq.

Kerry just said "weapons of mass destruction are crossing the borders every day." HUH? I mean, HUH?

9:22: Kerry on homeland security: Bush is doing badly. Funny, I thought the question was what YOU'D do, Senator...

Yes, we know it's not so great. But what the hell will YOU do, specifically? Christ, this guy's SUCH an asshat...

Bush just oughta give Kerry his 90 seconds to actually ANSWER THE FRIGGING QUESTION, instead of just kicking Bush.

No, he's instead pointing out that "the best defense is a good offense." Don't just plan for being attacked; plan for hitting THEM BEFORE they hit us. Kerry just can't seem to grasp that...

9:27: Kerry is making the same mistake a LOT of his supporters are making. They're so busy giving us reasons to vote AGAINST Bush, and not bothering to give us reasons to vote FOR Kerry. There is a certain element that that reasoning (to use the term loosely) appeals to, but they're already in Kerry's pocket -- Kerry needs to get people who are leaning towards Bush, but not committed. The most that tactic will achieve will be to drive down the Bush support -- not build his own.

9:31: Kerry is using Bush's father to attack Bush; Bush is using Kerry himself to attack Kerry. I think Bush has the better weapon...

Bush is keeping up on the followups. I think he wants to keep Kerry off balance. Dunno if it's working, but it's a good effort. And the "voted for it before I voted against it." Kerry's trying to nullify it, but it's a killer sound bite.

Kerry managed to make it to 9:29 before mentioning Vietnam, and now Lehrer's asking about Kerry's anti-Vietnam stance. I'm impressed he lasted this long... guess those advisors telling him to leave it be finally stuck.

9:37: Kerry apparently thinks Chirac and Annan are more valuable than England, Australia, Poland, and all the rest of our coalition. Great move, Kerry. And Bush has the names and places to put the lie to Kerry's loads of crap.

Both candidates are speaking more about the past than the future. But one major difference: Bush is spelling out just what he did and why, while Kerry focuses on what he thinks Bush did wrong without offering tangible alternatives. This, in a nutshell, is why Kerry is losing. He's promising to not be Bush. All we can tell about Kerry is that it will be "different" and "better" without saying how or why. I'm not willing to take that chance, and neither will a lot of other people.

Kerry is full of platitudes, notably lacking in particulars. He doesn't seem to have any.

9:42: Lehrer just gave Kerry a softball, and Kerry missed it. He basically invited Kerry to attack Bush, and Kerry is going for it. He shoulda taken the high road and laid out some of the things he would do, and not just pile on more BS platitudes.

The saddest part is this palooka has been a Senator for 20 years, while I'm a nobody in East Bumf*ck, Cow Hampshire. I can see this, and he can't.

Bush is again using Kerry's own words to bolster his own positions. That's devastating, and Kerry doesn't even know just how badly he's being chopped up.

9:44: Here's another nutshell difference: Kerry defends himself by getting forceful and attacking Bush. Bush defends by citing Kerry's own words and his own achievements. More points for Bush.

9:48: Bush just got all glurgy by quoting a widow of the fighting in Afghanistan. Now let's see how Kerry comes back...

Another swing and a miss. Another Vietnam reference, nothing specific. And "separating the war from the warriors?" Is this the same John Kerry who called himself and his fellow veterans "war criminals?"

His first response to fixing the problem: a summit? More talk? Sheesh... and a plug for his web site.

Sheesh, what time Kerry doesn't spend attacking Bush is spent with vague platitudes and promises. He doesn't seem to have a single concrete proposal.

And Elmo thinks that Bush looks more orange than Kerry tonight. He's grossed out, but not as badly as he was by the dancing Republicans. I think I'm safe from having to clean up cat puke.

Now Bush is reminding people that Kerry called Allawi a "puppet." Way to win friends and influence people on the international stage...

Kerry seems to think it's a bad thing that terrorists are pouring into Iraq. I disagree -- let's get them all together in one place, far from the US, and then kill 'em all. And if they're stupid enough to do it, great.

9:58: Commenter Joey says he's counted 6 Vietnam references by Kerry, and predicts it'll hit 15. I think that's a bit high -- 8 at the most.

Now Bush is reminding us that Libya had their "come to Jesus" moment on terrorism and WMDs and gave it up, after about 30 years. That's a hell of a thing...

And Kerry is harping again on the "outsourcing the hunt for Bin Laden." Hello, Senator, it's called "the war on Terror," not "the war on Bin Laden" or "the war on Al Qaeda."

Bush seems to be getting a mite testy. I think Kerry's getting to him a little, but Bush does OK under pressure. "Don't make me angry. You wouldn't like me when I'm angry."

Kerry, you probably shouldn't keep mentioning North Korea. Your buddy Bill Clinton gave them the opportunity to do so...

10:00: Kerry says it's solely Bush's fault that presidential credibility around the world, especially with France? I guess Johnson, Nixon, and Clinton really didn't have much to do with that...

10:04: Bush on North Korea: In favor of negotiations and sanctions with North Korea, but kicking them for not keeping their agreements. There's progress there, but it's tough going. And he's still saying "nuculer." Sigh...

God, I hope Kerry doesn't follow up on the "nuculer." That would be so juvenile...

10:06: Hello, Senator Kerry. Give nuclear fuel to Iraq, and see what they do with them? Just how stoned are you?

OK, let's see... Bush the unilateralist is fighting to have more nations involved in the talks with North Korea; Kerry the internationalist wants to start up one-on-one talks. Lehrer was right to pick up on this; it sneaked past me.

10:08: Darfur. I've written about this before; it's ugly, but there's not a hell of a lot we can do. Let's see what these two say...

Kerry is mentioning a couple of the main arguments I used, but is citing them as "challenges" he would overcome. And here's a mention of the draft... wow, he held that one in for over an hour.

Geez, these guys can't let Iran go, even to talk about Darfur. But they're right, in a sense -- Iran is, globally speaking, a much more important element than Darfur. It's an ugly truth, but indisputable.

10:13: Bush spots the loaded question on Kerry's fitness, and starts off praising Kerry. Man has class. "If you're going to kill a man, it costs you nothing to be polite." I'm betting Kerry won't show the same level of class. He'll say one or two kind things, but they'll be minor. And maybe he'll make a hair joke.

10:15: Yeah, I was right. Kind words about his wife and daughters, passing, recognition of Bush's service, then it's right into the attacks -- carefully prepared ones, too. Most people don't construct such carefully-crafted attacks on the fly -- parallel construction, alliteration, other rhetorical devices.

And now Kerry is on the defensive again. Bush is scoring point after point, and Kerry doesn't even see it.

10:19: Bush keeps coming up with solid refutations and citations. Kerry stays largely to the abstract. That's not the way to win, Senator...

I'm glad they both agree that proliferation of WMDs is the greatest threat. No argument there...

10:22: Bush sees a weakness in Kerry, and keeps hammering on it. Kerry keeps saying we need to work with other nations in coalitions, but wants to go along with North Korea's demands and exclude other nations from talks. Bush keeps bringing up the other nations' support.

10:24: Kerry just lost points with me for mentioning New Hampshire's former Republican senator, Bob Smith. Buffalo Bob was one of the biggest embarassments for me, personally...

10:26: Closing statements. More platitudes from Kerry, more generalities, and one final Vietnam allusion. Bush again cites his record and promises to expand on them. The choice is clear, to me: What Bush has done vs. Kerry's vague promises. Why can't Kerry run on his achievements? Oh, yeah, over the last 30-odd years, he HASN'T HAD HARDLY ANY WORTH MENTIONING.

10:35: OK, that's over. I'm gonna dump all the updates to the extended edition and call it a night. But did anyone else that Laura Bush and Theresa Heinz Kerry wore such similar outfits? Wonder if there was any unpleasantness about that...

Good night, people, and thanks for reading along. Extra thanks for those who commented. That's a big reason I enjoy doing this, and I truly appreciate them.



Listed below are links to weblogs that reference Showdown at the UM Corral:

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» Mind of Mog linked with Debating

» :: Political Musings :: linked with Debate Live Blog

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» Southern Watch linked with The Big Debate (III And Final)

Comments (39)

I'm busy so you're flying s... (Below threshold)

I'm busy so you're flying solo

Darn CSPAN online is worthe... (Below threshold)

Darn CSPAN online is worthelss. Audio breaking up.

So, Kerry is saying there WERE WMDs in Irag? Or there now are? Interesting assertion in any case, and dangerous for him to be making unless he knows there's something about to break in the news, and he's trying to get ahead of it.

Agent Orange is still tryin... (Below threshold)

Agent Orange is still trying to to make Homeland security a police and fire department job, his emphasis on trying to make it that scares me. I don't want to see his vaunted "first reponders" utilized, at least not here. I guess his plans are banking heavily on needing their services.

yo dude extended entry!... (Below threshold)

yo dude extended entry!

Paul, you said you were sit... (Below threshold)
Jay Tea:

Paul, you said you were sitting this one out. No back-seat blogging! Go find some more journalistic institutions to destroy, will ya?

Seriously... once it's over, I'll move ALL the updates to the extended section. I'm typing as fast as I can here...


At 9:51 eastern I have coun... (Below threshold)

At 9:51 eastern I have counted 6 references to Vietnam. I estimated he'd go 15 for the night.

I hope Kerry does comment o... (Below threshold)
Dan S:

I hope Kerry does comment on "nukular." A lot of Americans in the heart say it that way. My dad said it that way as much as I tried to correct him, and he had two advanced degrees.

Bush is not looking good he... (Below threshold)

Bush is not looking good here. i love the man, but Kerry has his words down better and Bush keeps thinking of what he is going to say. Regardless of right, perception is reality.

Bush needs to pull it together; he is on the defense here. Too many ums and looking like he is lost for words to articulate his position.


Dont commit Hairy Kerry; Vote Responsibly!

I'm voting Bush, and he's a... (Below threshold)

I'm voting Bush, and he's ahead on substance, but Kerry's ahead on technique. His delivery is better, he has more specifics, and he's quicker. Bush is sincere, but he's repeating the same 4 generalities over and over.

Bush nailed the "I admire Kerry personally, but . . ." question.

[10:12]If I hear o... (Below threshold)


If I hear one more time about mixed messages I will just loose it. We need to move on to new and fresh and less rhetoric.


Dont commit Hairy Kerry; Vote Responsibly!

We Appreciate the Play By P... (Below threshold)

We Appreciate the Play By Play! Well done!!

[10:26]Kerry is sm... (Below threshold)


Kerry is smooth. Will this be what turns some people away from Bush? Will the nation see past Bushs inability to speak and see his strength?

With this nation built on style, Bush does not do well. Bush did much better at the convention, but then again, he got to read off the prompter. We all know Bush does less well on free speaking when he tries to recite, which is why I was hoping he was just talking.

Good closing argument from Kerry.

Bush asked for the vote, excellent. But I am left with mixed feelings as if Bush spent most of his time defending his position which is what you dont want to get into when debating.


Dont commit Hairy Kerry; Vote Responsibly!

Kerry all the way.... (Below threshold)

Kerry all the way.

Bush looked lost as hell at times.

And what's up with that weird face twitch when Kerry said something he didn't like.

Kerry Handed him his ass.<b... (Below threshold)

Kerry Handed him his ass.

Bush substance? Bah... he t... (Below threshold)

Bush substance? Bah... he totally had nothing else to say in the last 20 minutes or so. Kerry schooled Bush by simply having a better grasp of info.

Thanks J for keeping this b... (Below threshold)

Thanks J for keeping this by the minutes.

I'm just sorry Bush was not relying on his strengths and seemed to stumble. Kerry was very articulate and we knowledge on his points. Bush failed to give reasons from the point of 9/11.

There were many times Ive would have blown Kerry out of the water talking on 9/11, the terrorist in Iraq, and the tax cuts. One moment Kerry said Bush under spent, then later saying he is spending too much at the expense of home issues.

Bush needs for the next debate to be more prepared to answer the questions quickly and decisively. Plus Bush handed Kerry some real openings that anyone who has debated before knew Kerry would have been prepared for.

But Im off to bed myself now,

Thanks again Jay


Dont commit Hairy Kerry; Vote Responsibly!

the President's repeting hi... (Below threshold)

the President's repeting himself was a tad annoying. How many times was he going to repeat Kerry's tag line? (wrong war... yadda yadda) And so was his beating on the podium. He just came off as somewhat loose and rough around the edges. sharp contrast to Kerry's smoothness. Also, I see why the networks wanted to do the splitscreening, and the Bush team didn't. He was clearly annoyed with Kerry. (not that I blame him, I mean, you only have a few seconds to refute the rediculous claims Kerry was making, where would you even begin?)

I like the few times that Bush pointed out Kerry's flip-flopping, but it seems to me he didn't point out nearly as many flip flops as he could have.

Kerry had Bush on the defensive most of the night. I wish, I just *wish* that Bush would have at some time pointed out Kerry's hypocracy. That he really has *no* plan for the future, and only plans on doing what ever is most popular. (after all, we can't decide if the war was a good idea yet or not, because it's not over yet.)

On the other hand, Kerry was very negative. And people don't want to hear negative, they want a message of hope, they want a leader who has positive things to say about the future, and Kerry didn't offer that. Bush is obviously confident about his leadership, it showed.

Kerry all the way? Wow, you... (Below threshold)

Kerry all the way? Wow, you must have some TV set. I think Kerry came off as the flim-flam man. All flash and no substance. Americans already knew that about Kerry. Why do you think the more he's in the news, the lower his poll numbers go? But, Ronny, I think you do bring the MSM perspective to this blog. They'll all probably say Kerry was excellent and spelled out his position(although in reality not one newsperson will be able to articulate Kerry's position).

Very Good, Jay!! My arms ar... (Below threshold)

Very Good, Jay!! My arms are killing me from trying to type it word for word but I've always liked your insights, as well as your cat, glad you brought him in......good job, just had to say so.

The incumbent will almost a... (Below threshold)

The incumbent will almost always be on the defensive, by definition, especially during a contentious election.

JimI agree that if... (Below threshold)


I agree that if you were to have followed along the way, you would have taken from this that Kerry said nothing but spent many words. However those very same people who are swing points dont follow as close and they can only see their candidates in a forum such as this.

Bush had better things to say, but Kerry said things better. This matters to those who watch reality tv and think its great!

One have to give credit where it is due and Kerry came off very well. Bush is stronger and Kerry is slicker, but one has to acknowledge that slick works. If not, Hollywood and the music industry would not be as popular as it is.


Dont commit Hairy Kerry; Vote Responsibly!

Ah, NBC is interviewing six... (Below threshold)

Ah, NBC is interviewing six undecided voters. I've always wondered what six idiots look like.

So, from what I've read her... (Below threshold)

So, from what I've read here, the consensus is that Kerry won the debate. Oh well. It was nice to think he was going to continue to implode and go home a defeated man to one of his mansions on November 3rd. I guess not. And it's a shame. Americans will be putting a dishonest, egotistical traitor in the White House. The bright side is that next terrorist attack -- and there will be one with Kerry at the helm -- I won't donate a penny to the families of victims. The American people will be partially responsible for any such attack.

David Anderson, I truly dis... (Below threshold)

David Anderson, I truly disagree with you completely - and some others.

Osama is isolated? Is that... (Below threshold)

Osama is isolated? Is that winning?

Even William Kristol is giving it to Kerry!!

I thought that G W actually... (Below threshold)
Stephen Walker:

I thought that G W actually came out of that quite well. Kerry didn't manage to make the Bush is a liar thing stick because G W made Kerry agree that he had made the same conclusions from the same intelligence. Kerry lost points on his position on North Korea. How can you insist that Bush didn't have enough nations in the alliance in Iraq, and then insist on unilateral action in North Korea? G W hammered that one home. Watch the editorial writers make the pick up. It also seems that research is not Kerry's strong point. He wasn't aware of the members of the Alliance against Iran's weapons or the government that had imposed the sanctions. (Carter) Kerry also didn't know what nations were in the Iraq alliance. The editorial writers should pick that up. All in all a G W Bush win in the morning papers.
Stephen Walker

Cindy, thats okay. Differen... (Below threshold)

Cindy, thats okay. Differences of opinion are cool. But I think in this case your partisanship is affecting your ability to be openminded. The consensus is pretty broad even among republicans, he got spanked.
He looked confussed and on the defensive all night. I think he would have done better if Rove or Cheney had been able to sit and hold his hand. LOL. Sortta like the 9/11 commission hearings ya know what I mean?

Who won the debate polls:</... (Below threshold) Well, here are my 2c and I ... (Below threshold)

Well, here are my 2c and I think you all know where I stand at this point in terms of my bias.

First of all to GWB, great negotiating on the debate rules especially the camera angles did not give a height advantage to Kerry. I think the warning lights thing actually backfired on the GWB negotiating team. It actually prevented JFK from being too long winded and forced him to keep it brief.

John Kerry looked well... Presidential and GWB looked like a C student a Yale who did not prepare for his class and showed up repeating the professor's talking points (many times). I am sure Karl was impressed with his memorization of the talking points.

Dave (the other one)

I just love how the people ... (Below threshold)

I just love how the people who comment that Kerry won the debate just can't help but throw in a couple cheap shots of their own on Bush. You guys should do a better job of hiding your true feelings, and maybe others would take your comments more seriously.

Having said that, Kerry did a better job of being a formal debater, but he didn't have many specifics, and when he did, most of them will be rejected by many swing voters and will definitely not move anyone away from Bush.

It's also easier to criticize and be a Monday Morning Quarterback, which is where Kerry was best. He's great at that, but what is his plan - do what Bush is doing in Iraq but add a summit? Ignore other countries and talk bilaterally with N. Korea? Give Iran nuclear fuel? Get rid of missile defense? No thank you.

And note that the debate was essentially all about Bush - there were no questions about Kerry's time in the Senate, right?

Bush was less formal in his style, to be sure. If he was trying to talk to "regular folks," then I suppose he succeeded in that. He could have criticized Kerry more, but didn't. I don't know if that was a screw up or the plan.

Bottom line - enough of a good Kerry performance to get the Dems and the MSM excited, but he didn't knock out Bush. And note that Kerry's gaffes will be brought up - apparently he has called Bush a "liar" even though tonight he said he hadn't used that word. And expect the Swiftees to have more to say.

What specifics did Bush giv... (Below threshold)

What specifics did Bush give other than "don't send mixed messages" and "trust me"?

KEEP THIS IN MIND (now and ... (Below threshold)

KEEP THIS IN MIND (now and later):

WhenEVER the Democrat spokespeople -- whatever their titles -- come on discussion meets following ANY Presidential debate and say, repeatedly, "let me finish, will you let me finish, are you going to let me finish here, you're asking the questions, I'm the guest, I'm supposed to be able to answer your questions, will you let me speak here, are you going to let me answer, am I going to be able to finish my answers here, or..."

THAT MEANS THAT THEY ARE AVOIDING SAYING ANYTHING. It's a performance thing by which they believe they "seize power before the audience" and such...but it's still a power play and IT INDICATES A LOSING POSITION.

Keep that in mind. Because, already tonight, I've heard that from various Democrat spokespersons of one title or another, on several network after-debate-discussion shows, and the Democrats, although clearly gloating over Kerry's improved performance early, are revealing their hand. THEY'RE ACTING.

As was Kerry. Polished, well performed: ACTING.

But, the Presidency isn't about acting, it's about thinking on your feet, making the moment's decisions and often when the, umm, audience throws tomatoes at you.

Bush offered a clear indication of his emotional process earlier. Kerry offered a good performance. I like Bush's transparency better.

The more I think about it, ... (Below threshold)

The more I think about it, the I honestly believe that if I were an undecided voter, this debate would go a long way to pushing me towards the Bush camp.

Kerry, who came off "physically powerful" and who kept the pressure on Bush throughout the debate failed to score a single point that I can see. His basic message is "I'm not Bush, I would do things differently" but fails to explain on a single point how he would do those things. He also didn't really address the issue of him being a "flip-flopper" (in all fairness to Kerry, I will admit that its mostly his sound bites that make him sound like he's switching issues and not his substantive policies), as a matter of fact his stance on Iraq vs. Korea re-enforced that in my mind. He wants a multinational force in Iraq (and makes no mention of how he's going to accomplish that), but feels that a "bilateral stance" is what is best for North Korea.

The biggest thing that would have pushed me towards the Bush camp however, is his "The Global Test" comment. Mr. Kerry, I cannot elect a person to the highest office in the nation, who is not willing to take unilateral preemptive action to protect me. Its not a sound military strategy, and neither is it a wise move politically. We as a nation cannot, and should not be expected to go hat in hand begging to the United Nations to protect ourselves.

"let me finish, will you... (Below threshold)

"let me finish, will you let me finish, are you going to let me finish here, you're asking the questions, I'm the guest, I'm supposed to be able to answer your questions, will you let me speak here, are you going to let me answer, am I going to be able to finish my answers here, or..."

Bush actually said "let me finish" during the debate. He said it right after his little green light went on, not sure why though.

No, David, by friend, I don... (Below threshold)

No, David, by friend, I don't know. I think he handed Kerry his own flat ass. I typed the whole damn thing up as they were talking and let me tell you what came out of Bush's mouth was a lot smarter, classier, better and all around smoother than anything Kerry had to say - which wasn't much. Hope you're over 30, if he becomes President - if he serves his country as a President as he did as a young man, we are in a lot of trouble. I only became partisan, dear, when I learned as much as I did since 9/11 and I still thank God that it was Bush who was in Office and rose to the occasion when that event struck us. Kerry couldn't win tonight and he will not win in any of the next two debates. Bush has a quiet, easy way about him; Kerry is grating as hell and he never stops to think but says I, I, I, I, I. The Presidency is not based on "I." All his name dropping and other bullshit is not going to get him the office and I pray for you, your family and your daughter that this man never makes it into the Presidency. I love you, David, but really, think about it.

Fox & Friends says online p... (Below threshold)

Fox & Friends says online polls show Kerry winning the debate, but Bush still beating Kerry in the election. They mentioned the poll on CBS's website.

"The bright side is t... (Below threshold)

"The bright side is that next terrorist attack -- and there will be one with Kerry at the helm -- I won't donate a penny to the families of victims. The American people will be partially responsible for any such attack."

No matter whom is president there WILL be another terrorist attack in the U.S. It's not a question of if but when, no matter who is leading this country. Consider that before making cold statements.

And for the record, I too thought that it was a clear Kerry win. It may not be fair, but ever since the Kennedy/Nixon debate the standard has been that who ever presents himself better wins in the public eye. Like him or not Kerry simply presented himself better.

Couple of things, I didn't ... (Below threshold)

Couple of things, I didn't actually watch it, I listened to it on the radio, when I got home I watched a replay of it.

Now then, one of the interesting things that I noticed was when Kerry was talking about a backdoor draft and stop actions keeping people in the military... This directly contradicts his statements later in the debate saying that he is going to ADD 2 more active duty whatever it was he called it.

I like the debate, it was a Bush Victory, but just marginally. I think the following debates when we start talking about domestic issues, The President will really spank clown boy but good. Especially when we get to the tax issue.

Kerry: Bush's tax cuts let the rich get richer!

I say, I got 1400 bucks in my tax return instead of 700! I don't know about you, but the Tax cut gave me fistfuls of money instead of pinchfuls.

That I think is the greatest deception of the Democrats: Republicans let the rich get richer.

What the hell man, Doesn't matter if they get richer or not, They're ALREADY RICH! Tax cuts let the little guy keep MORE of HIS money and lets the POORGUY get RICHER.

This is the Democrats deception. This is why I vote Republican... When I manage to get out there and vote.

Kerry handed Bush his ass? ... (Below threshold)

Kerry handed Bush his ass? I guess that's to Bush's credit as he saves it for real enemies like terrorists. That's something the draft dodger from the previous administration didn't do. It looks like Kerry is willing to follow in sick willie's footsteps.

Kerry isn't guaranteeing that he can fight REAL enemies by his past voting record. Not being Bush isn't a solution. did anyone hear anything about what Kerry would do different? hmmm... He will always be an appeaser. My question is if Kerry gets elected who's going to hand him HIS ASS? I'm sure he wouldn't have the courage to fight terrorists.

I'm sticking with the REAL thing.







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