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Quote of the Day- Circular Logic Edition

On the crumbling Rove-Plame story....

The Left, before: "We demand an investigation because the Repubs are guilty of something!"

The Left, after: "The Repubs are guilty of something because there was an investigation!"

Nice, neat and circular.

Les Nessman sums it up in the comments below.


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Comments (15)

Les nailed that one, as usu... (Below threshold)

Les nailed that one, as usual.

You're the man, Les!! :-)<... (Below threshold)

You're the man, Les!! :-)

Dig that last paragraph, gu... (Below threshold)

Dig that last paragraph, guys. Who asked for the DOJ investigation? The CIA.

Los Angeles Times. Oct 1, 2003. pg. A.1:

"President Bush said Tuesday that he welcomed a Justice Department investigation into whether White House officials illegally disclosed the identity of a CIA agent in an effort to discredit or punish her husband, an administration critic.

Bush also dismissed calls by Democrats for the appointment of a special counsel to look into the matter. Administration critics argued that Atty. Gen. John Ashcroft is too partisan to preside over an impartial investigation ...

The remarks were the president's first on the burgeoning scandal, which burst into view over the weekend when it was disclosed that the CIA had asked the Justice Department to investigate whether senior administration officials deliberately unmasked a CIA agent married to former diplomat Joseph C. Wilson IV, a critic of Bush's handling of intelligence before the war in Iraq."

??????... (Below threshold)


Why is there even a continu... (Below threshold)

Why is there even a continuation of this special prosecutor investigation? No matter who leaked Valerie Plame's name, NO crime was committed. As far as ethics, what's wrong with exposing a liar like Joe Wilson hiding behind "confidentiality" to lie, spin and distort? This guy is a meglomanic. Oh wait. He's a Liberal. Aren't they all meglomaniacs whose every thought is a profound revelation?

You guys are crazy with the... (Below threshold)

You guys are crazy with the spin. Wilson, a liberal? He was appointed by Bush, Sr. to be ambassador to Iraq before the Gulf War. He gave money to Democrats and Republicans. He was gung ho about the threat that Hussein posed but disagreed about the neo-con policies in response to it. In his original op-ed Wilson said he went to Niger, reported what he found and forgot all about it until Bush used the African/uranium line in the State of the Union. He said in his original column that he has assumed, assumed mind you, that his report had travelled up channel to people like Cheney who was overseeing the gathering of intelligence on Iraq WMD. Not an unreasonable assumption. Wilson really only got pissed, like really pissed, at Republicans AFTER they outed his wife and started smearing him. Can you find a single unduly critical or partisan quote spoken by Wilson against Bush before his original op-ed?
You can't. But if you look around you can find stories like this:

Los Angeles Times Oct 16, 1990. pg. 2:
by Mark Fineman

"Dressed in faded jeans and a Hawaiian shirt, Joe Wilson settled into a deck chair beside his tiny swimming pool in suburban Baghdad the other night, fired up one of the fat cigars that have become his trademark, and reflected on yet another day as the cutting edge of U.S. policy in Iraq.

It was well after midnight, but his dinner of cold pizza and olives remained uneaten on the kitchen counter. Joseph C. Wilson IV, the highest-ranking U.S. diplomat in Iraq and the man President Bush officially designated as "his man" in Baghdad days after the current Persian Gulf crisis began, had been far too busy to eat.

Typically, he had spent hours this day haranguing low-level Iraqi officials about the plight of scores of ailing and aged American hostages, and hours more arranging the nightmarish logistics for a series of freedom flights taking American women and children out of occupied Kuwait city. Then, there were the press briefings, reports to Washington and the basic work of running an embassy that has been America's only official presence behind enemy lines since the Persian Gulf crisis erupted nearly 10 weeks ago.

When Iraqi President Saddam Hussein said in those early days he was ready to talk to Bush, the U.S. President responded that if Hussein had anything to say, he could say it to Joe Wilson.

I like Bush Sr. but he also... (Below threshold)

I like Bush Sr. but he also gave us Souter. As for Wilson please!! He has been totally discredited, and his wife should be investigated for some violation of the Hatch Act or something!!

Frameone he was part of the... (Below threshold)
Just Me:

Frameone he was part of the State Department, that doesnt mean much politically.

In May '03 he was already working for the Kerry campaign.

He donated money to Gore as did his wife, and he says he voted for Gore in 2000, but voted for Bush 41 in 1992.

Does frameone want everyone... (Below threshold)

Does frameone want everyone to perform his googlisms for him?

Go google (web and/or image) Joseph Wilson and you get a lot of history on the guy, including the salient points: that he says he was bypartisan but was not, was a part of the Kerry campaign for the Presidency, was named an Ambassador by Bill Clinton, spoke out about various forms of him as victim for many years, mostly became louder in early 2004, just as the DNC was ramping up the presidential campaign...

Here's Joseph Wilson speaking before a liberal group, among whom even some liberal media denounced him....

<a href="http://www.gop.com... (Below threshold)

10.) Wilson Claimed He Is A Non-Partisan “Centrist”:

Recently, Joe Wilson Refused To Admit He Is A Registered Democrat. NBC’s Jamie Gangel: “You are a Democrat?” Joe Wilson: “I exercise my rights as a citizen of this country to participate in the selection of my leaders and I am proud to do so. I did so in the election in 2000 by contributing not just to Al Gore's campaign, but also to the Bush-Cheney campaign.” (NBC’s “Today Show,” 7/14/05)

“[Wilson] Insist[s] He Remained A Centrist At Heart.” (Scott Shane, “Private Spy And Public Spouse Live At Center Of Leak Case,” The New York Times, 7/5/05)

Joe Wilson Is A Registered Democrat. (District Of Columbia Voter Registrations, Accessed 7/14/05)

Joseph Wilson Has Donated Over $8,000 To Democrats Including $2,000 To John Kerry For President In 2003, $1,000 To Hillary Clinton’s (D-NY) HILLPAC In 2002 And $3,000 To Al Gore In 1999. (The Center For Responsive Politics Website, www.opensecrets.org, Accessed 7/12/05)

Wilson Endorsed John Kerry For President In October 2003 And Advised The Kerry Campaign. (David Tirrell-Wysocki, “Former Ambassador Wilson Endorses Kerry In Presidential Race,” The Associated Press, 10/23/03)

“[Wilson] Admits ‘It Will Be A Cold Day In Hell Before I Vote For A Republican, Even For Dog Catcher.’” (Scott Shane, “Private Spy And Public Spouse Live At Center Of Leak Case,” The New York Times, 7/5/05)

S --It's nice that... (Below threshold)

S --

It's nice that the GOP talking points include the "cold day in hell" quote. That's a little like the logic parody by the original post:

Republicans then: Let's smear Joe Wilson and his wife.

Republicans now: Joe Wilson hates Republicans.

Your first link was also to a speech Wilson gave AFTER he got smeared and his wife outed.

As for the rest of it, Rustmann, Plame's first boss at the CIA quoted glowingly in the Washington Times today about Plame's covert status just said not to long ago on Hannity and Colmes that he didn't think there was anything political about Wilson's mission to Niger. Hannity probably shit himself.

I would also like to point you to the findings of the Iraqi Survey Group:

"ISG has not found evidence to show that Iraq sought uranium from abroad after 1991 or renewed indigenous production of such material—activities that we believe would have constituted an Iraqi effort to reconstitute a nuclear weapons program."

Or do we consider the ISG to be a partisan attack machine as well?

frameone: I just knew by p... (Below threshold)

frameone: I just knew by posting reference/link/copy to/from the GOP site that it would further turn you off from reality...which is why I did it! All part of the plot, you know.

Here's more!Friday... (Below threshold)

Here's more!

Friday, July 15, 2005 10:55 a.m. EDT

Thanks to the media's obsession with the Karl Rove pseudo-scandal, former Iraq ambassador Joseph Wilson is once again the toast of Washington, D.C. - appearing on dozens of TV and radio programs, airing his demand that President Bush "honor his word" to fire Rove.

It's almost as if last year's Senate Intelligence Committee investigation into Wilson's allegations never happened.

In fact, after probing Wilson's story, Intelligence Committee Chairman Pat Roberts publicly ripped the so-called "whistleblower" as a possible hoaxer and a fraud.
In a July 9, 2004 press release that's still available on Roberts' official Web site, the Kansas Republican said:

"The former Ambassador, either by design or through ignorance, gave the American people and, for that matter, the world a version of events that was inaccurate, unsubstantiated, and misleading. ...

"Time and again, Joe Wilson told anyone who would listen that the President had lied to the American people, that the Vice President had lied, and that he had 'debunked' the claim that Iraq was seeking uranium from Africa. As discussed in the Niger section of the [Committee's] report, not only did he NOT 'debunk' the claim, he actually gave some intelligence analysts even more reason to believe that it may be true."

Sen. Roberts continued:

"When asked how [Wilson] 'knew' that the Intelligence Community had rejected the possibility of a Niger-Iraq uranium deal, as he wrote in his book, he told Committee staff that his assertion may have involved 'a little literary flair.'"

The Intel Committee chair concluded:

"I believed very strongly that it was important for the Committee to conclude publicly that many of the statements made by Ambassador Wilson were not only incorrect, but had no basis in fact."

Unfortunately, for Democrat... (Below threshold)

Unfortunately, for Democrats, they think that anything that points out their, um, errors and falsehoods is a "smear."


There's also this...
Jim Wallis, author of "God's Politics: Why the Right Gets It Wrong and the Left Doesn't Get It" is planning to meet with Democratic Party chairman Howard Dean this week. Wallis has played advisor to many Democratic leaders and intends to tell Dean to quit talking about religion because Dean "doesn't understand it". The former presidential candidate is meeting with several religious leaders in an attempt to win over the churchgoing crowd.

The point being that Democrats craft a reality that accommodates themselves in their very special interests, and then waste time and energy of us all trying to prove why everyone else dares another understanding. At this point, what about Bolton's nomination? Nancy Pelosi still thinks God spoke when the federal government was allowed to take personal property by imminent domain, Barbara Boxer still thinks...oh, who cares what she thinks.

Republicans are going to so win over Hillary in 2008.

Because, that IS the point,... (Below threshold)

Because, that IS the point, yes?






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