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Sauce for the goose is another man's poison

The latest tactic from the far left whackoes, the "outing" of allegedly gay Republicans (both officials and staffers), has me thinking again. A while ago I wondered what the hell was the point; it seems to be a political "temper tantrum" more than anything else.

But since it seems here to stay, I'm starting to wonder what would be an appropriate counter-tactic for Republicans to use against the Democrats. And as he so often does, Ted Kennedy has come to me in my hour of need and presented me with a shining example of hypocrisy.

One of the hardy perennial battle cries of the Democrats is that the Republicans are the party of the rich, that they are always giving tax cuts to the rich and helping their wealthy buddies avoid paying their "fair share" of taxes. So, one would think that Ted Kennedy, as one of the wealthiest Democrats in the US Senate, is always exceptionally careful to pay all the taxes he is obligated to pay, right?

Nah. You see, he's the patriarch of the Kennedy family, the Senior Senator from Massachusetts, the Lion of the Democratic Party. He's ABOVE such concerns.

Several years ago, the Massachusetts legislature tried to jack up the state income tax. A rather crafty anti-tax lawmaker sneaked in a provision making the higher tax rate "optional," meaning that taxpayers would continue paying the 5.3% rate unless they chose to pay the higher 5.8% rate. Since its inception, less than one one-hundredth of one percent (0.01%) of taxpayers have chosen to give more money to the state than they absolutely had to -- and that tiny percentage has NEVER included the state's two Senators, Ted Kennedy and John Kerrey.

Last year, Ted Kennedy found he had run afoul of the law in a scandal that -- technically -- could have cost him his Senate seat. In order to exploit a property tax break, he declared his Washington home his "primary residence." The problem was that if that was his primary residence, he was no longer legally a resident of Massachusetts, and could not represent them in the Senate. He ended up paying the back taxes.

Finally, when his mother, Rose Fitzgerald Kennedy, died in 1995, he had her will probated in Florida, which has no inheritance tax. While it is true the family owns a compound (that, I believe, is a step up from a "mansion") there, Mrs. Kennedy died a registered voter in Hyannis Port, Massachusetts and had not left the state in about a dozen years. Nonetheless, her estate was able to avoid paying Massachusetts' "Paris Hilton tax," and not one official said a word.

Ted Kennedy: the drunken sot has never seen a tax hike he didnt' like, never saw a tax cut he didn't fiercely oppose, but over the years has done everything he can to avoid paying his "fair share" of money to the government for him to spend.

Nah. That's not comparable to "outing" gay Republicans. Paying taxes is a public obligation, while one's sex life is private. It's too relevant to be a fair countermeasure.

So, if that won't work, what would be an appropriate tactic?


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Comments (58)

Of course, as far as we kno... (Below threshold)

Of course, as far as we know, no gay republicans have killed campaign workers either...

Didnt Pelosi just announce ... (Below threshold)

Didnt Pelosi just announce she is a closet pro-lifer? Or how about outing Democrats who oppose gay marriage?

Well Jay, how about outing ... (Below threshold)

Well Jay, how about outing personal finances, which is just a step away? Technically personal finances are exactly that, personal. Democrats who claim to be the "party of the people" and who seem to have the poor consistently vote for them (hell, if I didn't do shit all day long, I'd want free money too). The Republican party is the "party of the corporation", so maybe outing Democrats who either have stock in evil corporate dollars, or who have served as boards of evil corps?

Sadly, you can out all of t... (Below threshold)

Sadly, you can out all of the Democrats you want, for anything you want, and the democrats that keep voting to put them in office will not care.

Lying, cheating, double-dealing seems to be an accepted part (required?)of the democratic creed. Their only loyalty is to themselves.

If you can find something to out them for that would embarass the democratic party to their loyalists, that might work.

So, now you just have to find a a moral, conservative, pro-family, pro-life, married (hetero), low-tax, small government democrat and out them.

Then, if the republicans could find them in their own party, we'd all be better off.

I don't think there is anyw... (Below threshold)
jim b:

I don't think there is anyway to do something similiar to Democrats. Republicans who do something "bad" are held accountable and there are consequences.

Democrats can do anything and not fear consequences. Just how it is friends.

Which is of course why as a Democrat, I vote for Republicans. Because I know if they screw up .... they will get sacked.

When a Democrat screws up ........ you're still stuck with the pervert.

Has anyone really traced th... (Below threshold)

Has anyone really traced the "outing" of gay Republicans to the "left", or is this just another Republican smear tactic? You know -- a lie?

I'd love to see a link to a credible report.

I really don't like Ted Ken... (Below threshold)

I really don't like Ted Kennedy, but it is really hard for me to work up a good rant about him doing what I would, if I were able (okay, let's be honest, if I had enough money to make it worthwhile).

"What," if "anything," is "... (Below threshold)

"What," if "anything," is "meant" by your "overuse" of "quotes," Lee?

Lee, the outing of Foley an... (Below threshold)

Lee, the outing of Foley and other Republicans has been traced back to several people on the "left", including John Avirosis and the Human Rights Campaign.

I've always felt that any p... (Below threshold)
steve sturm:

I've always felt that any politician wanting to raise taxes ought to be kicking in themselves at a higher rate on a voluntary basis before they mandate the rest of us pay a higher rate.

Does anyone remember the "B... (Below threshold)
Robb H:

Does anyone remember the "Barney Fag" scandal of the mid 90s? I thought democrats were tolerant and some such rubbish. I'm pretty sure Bill Clinton felt their pain too.

I love it. This is the year where the nutroots are taking back their party, and conservatives are taking back ours. It just so happens that conservatism isn't extremist, unlike the nutroots.

We may have to take 3 steps back to take 10 forward this year, but I hope for a democratic house. A quick 2 year reminder is all we need for 2008 energy. Whatever seats we lose, we'll gain, and a couple more. We'll have a TRUE fiscal conservative presidential candidate (any other form won't survive the primary, sorry again John McCain), and all will be right in the world.

Call me cocky, but remember, it's not the choices of the RNC, it's how the RNC can appeal to the US Public, and the US Public is ready for non-religous-socialist fiscal conservativism.

what goes around comes arou... (Below threshold)
Idol Hanz:

what goes around comes around!

The best way to out them is... (Below threshold)

The best way to out them is to expose their voting records to their constituents.

Personally, I've always wan... (Below threshold)

Personally, I've always wanted to ask a very specific question of politicials like Bill Clinton and John Kerry who lament that Bush gave people like them, who needed it least, a tax cut when it should have gone to pay for schools, social programs, or to help "the poor" or "working families", etc.: Now that you have that choice with your own money, which social programs, schools, or charities have you helped with your tax cut? But I like your post better. It really is shocking that it doesn't get more attention. Do weathly republicans go similarly out of their way to avoid paying their taxes?

Robb H = Moby."We ... (Below threshold)

Robb H = Moby.

"We may have to take 3 steps back to take 10 forward this year, but I hope for a democratic house. "

A Democratic House will be the end of the line for the Republican Party. It will rubberstamp another 10-20 million new voters for the socialist party.

I disagree. The only way th... (Below threshold)
Robb H:

I disagree. The only way that people will turn socialist in 2 years is if te vast majority of american's agreed with the democratic message (if they had one), and since that's not the case (Hate to tell you Dems, but REPUBLICANS cause hurting Bush polls, he left his conservative roots), We'll resurge when the change people tried turns out to taste bitter.

Why don't we open up everyb... (Below threshold)

Why don't we open up everybody's records in Washington and see just how many of these sleazebags on both sides of the aisle are going out of their way to help out the people they represent and how many are just collecting checks from corporations. I don't see any oversight in congress or the executive branch.

We need to realize that this is not a Republican/Democrat issue, this is the Rich and powerful vs. everybody else. I believe that the outings are a result of the political right because it distracts people from what is really important. The issue with the Foley thing isn't that he's gay, it's that he abused his power to take advantage of kids and, more importantly, that the party covered up his dealings to protect the party. The problem is corrupt people in power who feel they don't have to be responible to anybody. The Democrats were the same in 1994.

The Rich and powerful are twisting the system to make the poor and Middle class pay for everything so that the rich can establish their dynasties and enjoy themselves on their great grandparents gains. The middle class is too busy working to fight back.

It is breathtaking that politicians can scare people living in trailer parks about the Death Tax. Sorry America but it just doesn't apply to most of you. Don't worry about fighting it because you will never be rich enough to have to worry about it. And even if you did, it still leaves your heirs with a couple million to start off life, even if you don't do any estate planning. How many of us working stiffs had 2 million to play with when we got started. I can't stand the Kennedys the Bushes or the Hiltons.

Shorter Jay:Wah.<b... (Below threshold)

Shorter Jay:


"Lee, the outing of Fole... (Below threshold)

"Lee, the outing of Foley and other Republicans has been traced back to several people on the "left", including John Avirosis and the Human Rights Campaign."

I checked, and couldn't find any reports to that effect. Anyone have a link?

OT to JohnAnnArbor - Jay had "outing" in quotes and I carried that over. Jay's statement that it is the doing of the "left" is as yet unproven. Jay didn't back that up with any credible eveidence, and so far no one else has either.

I don't know where the alle... (Below threshold)
Robb H:

I don't know where the allegations came from, nor can I justify them If it came from a news outlet, the confidence behind truth is then, by default, already shakey.

State run media forces propoganda

Independent media is all bias and selfish incompetance.

I'm just going to stick to tabloids. I quit.

Didya ever notice most of t... (Below threshold)

Didya ever notice most of the dems campaign ad BS says what dems will do, or, what GOP did, or, what GOP will do.

Can dems ever run on what they HAVE done??

Dems can't run on what they... (Below threshold)

Dems can't run on what they have done because they haven't had any power in 6 years. Our voters decided that an unchecked monopoly on power would work better.

"The latest tactic from the... (Below threshold)

"The latest tactic from the far left whackoes, the "outing" of allegedly gay Republicans (both officials and staffers), has me thinking again."

Umm...this is ludicriously off base. Do you have a braille keyboard? You must have been blind to the last several decades of politics. It's not the far right that has been outing people for the last 20 years. It's the mainstream right.

Like Wizbang's pal (and plugger) Rush Limbaugh, who has hinted that Hilary is gay for years. Or Ann Coulter, who speaks at Republican conventions, who hinted that Bill Clinton was gay. Or Sean Hannity, official GOP stenographer, who has used base rumors to imply certain politicians are gay. Or Vernon Robinson, a GOP candidate who implies his challenger is gay. Or Blackwell, another GOP candidate who has implied his challenger is gay.

These are not the "far-right." These are mainstream, officially endorsed and sanctioned GOP members who use outing and homosexuality as weapons against their opponents. This is offensively bad writing, Jay Tea. Ignoring blatant truth seems to be your thing, as of late.

So, if that won't ... (Below threshold)
So, if that won't work, what would be an appropriate tactic?

Public flogging?

jp2, please don't be more o... (Below threshold)

jp2, please don't be more of a moron than absolutely necessary.

I'm not a Republican. I don't care for Rush Limbaugh, Bill O'Reilly, Sean Hannity, Newt Gingrich, Oliver North, and a host of other icons of the right. Trying to link me or my positions to any of them is dumber even than I've come to expect from you.

Who is the group right now with the "list" of gay Republicans and staffers? Here's a hint -- you won't find them posting at sites like Free Republic or other right-wing pages.


Lee,Unproven to yo... (Below threshold)
Sheik Yur Bouty:


Unproven to you is not the same thing as unproven to everyone else. Are you seriously going to pretend you haven't been paying attention to the Foley scandal for the last 3 weeks? If you've followed it at all, then you would not need any more "proving" as to where the "outing" is coming from.

The trail back to the source can start right here on Wizbang, and since the Foley scandal is less than a month old, you can easily do your own homework. I made it back to the original source in less than 3 minutes.


As your pal Leelee would say, "I'd love to see a link to a credible report." Otherwise, its just hearsay (or "lies" as Leelee would call them).

Lee is such a brain, why do... (Below threshold)

Lee is such a brain, why don't he do the trackback himself. He know the outing of gays will lead streight to the democrats socialist hit squads funded by Soros. A few days ago the guy was even bragging what damage he would do if the republicans didn't submit to his blackmail. Seems not many submitted so he shut down one web site but he's still there.

Lee, Do your own d... (Below threshold)


Do your own damn research. Like Sheik, I only took about 3 minutes to find a boatload of supporting links. And I'm a web dummy...

WHY does it matter who is o... (Below threshold)

WHY does it matter who is outing whom?

The issue is not who is gay and who is straight, the issue is that this congress is covering up its crimes and that the media and the public are too easily distracted.

Why are the Foley hearings behind closed doors. Clinton's nonsense was a matter of public record every day. Why don't we do it like that again? Why is either side allowing this government to do anything in secret?

James,Spoken like ... (Below threshold)
Sheik Yur Bouty:


Spoken like a true leftist Dimocrat.

If the issue isn't "who is gay and who is straight", then why do you lefties go to so much trouble to "out" Republicans?

I frankly don't care who is gay and who is straight. What I care about is that these people are being "outed" against their will. It essentially amounts to a form of blackmail.

Sorry,I am not a l... (Below threshold)


I am not a leftist. I don't trust my government at all. Neither side and what I would like to see is people like you stop thinking of this as a game where your team needs to win. Why do people "support" Bush. This is not a team game, we are hiring these guys for jobs.

I am voting mostly for Dems this time because the Republicans are drunk on power. I care only about checks and balances in government

James,OK, I'll hav... (Below threshold)
Sheik Yur Bouty:


OK, I'll have to take you at your word that you are not a leftist, but that comment sure sounded like it was right from their playbook.

I don't trust government either, James, and this is clearly not a game. I'm an American first, and a conservative after that. I generally support Republicans because their platform and stated vision are far more in line with what I see as good for American than anything in the Democrat platform. I just wish that their actions were always in line with their platform. That said, I don't trust ANY politicians. I'd like it if we could throw out darn near every one of them and elect all new people. Problem is, that won't work either, because of all the [email protected]#$ lobbyists and career bureaucrats.

At the very least then shou... (Below threshold)

At the very least then shouldn't we require the lobbyists to work harder and meet new politicians from time to time?

How do you feel about all of this secrecy?

Is our government pretending that the Foley scandal is somehow related to national security?

This reminds me of John J. ... (Below threshold)

This reminds me of John J. Geoghan, the Boston priest who was allowed for three decades to fondle boys and no one did anything out of fear and fear alone. Once fear was no longer an obstacle the dam broke and the damage cost the Catholic Church half a billion dollars in lawsuits, a barrage of attacks on all priests in general, a great mistrust in the clergy, and dozens of scarred children and family. All because this crap was ignored in hopes of the problem going away.

And here we are with Foley. Warnings were given years in advance, but it was decided to stay the course and hope to God nothing was going to happen. I'm not blaming this on just Republicans, but anyone who was involved and did nothing.

I'm kind of confused by the subject of this thread. The idea is to counter one attack with a completely unrelated one? Why not just start a new subject with your point instead of bringing up the Foley thing yet again?

Wibble. Jay's just upset th... (Below threshold)

Wibble. Jay's just upset that he can't go around outing any sober Kennedys.

I believe that this is stil... (Below threshold)

I believe that this is still relevant because I believe the reason that we are outing gays is to distract people from the Foley scandal and any of the hundred other scandals that are rocking congress. At least the gay thing can't get anybody convicted. The press is just a stooge for the current class of Billionaires.

But where would you find a ... (Below threshold)

But where would you find a sober Kennedy? Or one that doesn't sound like he is crying when he speaks. (hint-he "hugs" alot of trees)

You would find a sober Kenn... (Below threshold)

You would find a sober Kennedy next to a sober Bush. They are both imaginary creatures like unicorns.

The rich and powerful are all the same no matter what label they give themselves. The only thing we can count on is that they hate each other and it is that hate that keeps our government working.

We must keep our government filled with people who hate each other and have different agendas. Only then can we have the deadlock we truly need.

So this supposed "outing" b... (Below threshold)

So this supposed "outing" by the left is all just another desperate lie - no surprise.

James, the current round of... (Below threshold)

James, the current round of outing is coming from the left, who are hardly doing it to distact people from the Foley mess. If there's any outing by the right since the Foley scandal started, I haven't seen any of it. And no one else seems to have seen it either.

Finding a sober Kennedy? Uhhh, right here. I just thank the big guy upstairs that my branch of the family went their own way during the potato famine....

JamesYou keep insi... (Below threshold)


You keep insinuating that there was some sort of Congressional coverup of some sort of wrong doing.

So far there is zero evidence that Foley did anything wrong, let alone that Congress covered anything up.

The question for you to answer is why your people are going around outing gay Repblicans.

LeeThe Human Right... (Below threshold)


The Human Rights Campaign a "gay rights" group, has admitted that it was behind the outing of Foley.

Even you should be able to understand that.

suhnami Is there a... (Below threshold)


Is there any reason why you are attempting to conflate the child-sex scandal in the Catholic church with Foley IMing pages? There is no comparison between the two. The first was a crime, the second was not.

"The question for you to an... (Below threshold)

"The question for you to answer is why your people are going around outing gay Repblicans."

AND, why have they been doing it since AT LEAST July 04, with the start of blogactive.com.

Damn those 3 minute web searches!! DAMN THEM!!!

Patrick, I'd respectfully amend your post slightly to say that there's no evidence that Foley did anything illegal. I'm pretty sure that that's what you were trying to say.

IllTemperedI thoug... (Below threshold)


I thought thats what I did say, but if it was unclear - yes, there is no evidence so far that Foley has done anything illegal. And, so far, there is no evidence that he has done anything wrong either. Unless you consider exchanging off-color IM's with willing people to be wrong.

If we lived in a society th... (Below threshold)

If we lived in a society that recognized and embraced those who are born with same sex attractions, there would be no reason to "out" anyone.

In the manly-man world of sports there have been, are, will be men who are gay..but they remain hidden because of our social attitudes.

A Republican elected male who is gay not only has to hide deep but visibly take a harsh position toward persons like themselves to maintain their cover. Just as Foley pursued strict web sex laws.

The problem is theirs...the solution is ours..

Patrick, I think t... (Below threshold)


I think that maybe I wasn't being quite clear. No offense was intended. I'm actually very much in agreement with you, including being okay with off-color IMs between willing people. Gonna have to be more careful about how I phrase things....

There is a coverup as long ... (Below threshold)

There is a coverup as long as Washington is doing anything behind closed doors. Let the media into every single one of these hearings.

What kind of employer would let accountability hearings be held behind closed doors.

Foley admitted he sent off-color emails to pages. This is wrong and even if it isn't illegal would get most people fired from their jobs. If any boss covered for an employee who did it they would be fired from their jobs.
So fire Hastert, Foley already resigned and then hid in rehab.

Since we are their bosses it is up to us to fire them. Why are we picking at straws to help exhonerate these people. They are scum who have power. We should fire without hesitation anybody who fails in a major public trust. We don't owe them a break any more than we owed them a job. Remember this is a job where they get 180k to come to work for about an average of 90 days. I see no reason not to hold these jerks to a VERY high standard.

Now it seems someone (name ... (Below threshold)

Now it seems someone (name top secret) has been fired by one of the Soros funded left wing outfits for 'posting' the emails that were used to out Foley. Seems a lot of left wing democratic outfits had access to these emails for months and no one in democratic circles was concerned with protecting the 'children' sold into the sex slave trade as pages. Give it up, democrats and their underground operatives are guilty of purposely endangering children. "Sarcasm on"

By the way, what happened to the coup Peloshi and her group were planning with the retired generals last month? Is it still on if they lose in Nov?

You're full of shit, as usu... (Below threshold)

You're full of shit, as usual, Scrappy.

"The email exchanges in question between former Congressman Mark Foley and a House page have been in the possession of bloggers and media outlets for some time now. Yesterday, it came to our attention that an HRC employee, hired just last month to work for us in Michigan, was responsible for initially posting these emails on his blog. We investigated the matter, determined that HRC resources had been inappropriately used, and let him go. No one at the Human Rights Campaign, other than this individual, had any knowledge of his activities," said Brad Luna, Spokesman for the Human Rights Campaign.

There's nothing current that indicates that HRC is outing gays. An HRC staffer was apparently involved in the Foley postings (according to this source), but that person did not represent the HRC and did it in secret.

And Scrappy's crap is just crap. Ask him to link to a credible source - he can't. He's too busy modeling his new hat.

That's why you can't trust this blog as a source. People just make crap up out of whole cloth.

And it was also a staffer, ... (Below threshold)

And it was also a staffer, not her, who hid those billing records in her private library.

And was it a staffer, not her, who hired the WH security guy who ordered up all those FBI files on Republicans?

And it was a staffer, not her, who fired all those WH travel guys.

And it was family, not her, who did all those pardons.

And it was a staffer, not her, in charge of bimbo eruptions and the following intimidation.

HRC is an honorable, heroic moderate. It is all those people around her that are bonzo, whacked out ultra-lib slimeballs.

What unfortunate bad luck she has had hiring staff.

What is the magnitude of th... (Below threshold)

What is the magnitude of the Kennedy tax fraud? If the bulk of the Kennedy family fortune was held by Rose Kennedy, then the $ 1 billion (rough estimate) estate should have generated almost $100 million in MA estate taxes. A $100 million fraud is not chicken feed.


I stand in awe of Jay Tea's... (Below threshold)

I stand in awe of Jay Tea's ability to mix metaphors.

It's a gift.


I stand in awe of Jay Te... (Below threshold)

I stand in awe of Jay Tea's ability to mix metaphors.

Jay could mix a two by four.

Seems a lot of left wing... (Below threshold)

Seems a lot of left wing democratic outfits had access to these emails for months and no one in democratic circles was concerned with protecting the 'children'

And let's not forget the right wing Republicans who had access to these emails for years, and no one in Republican circles was concerned with protecting the "children".

Oh, and the Dems promptly turned the emails over to the FBI. When did the Republicans call the FBI?

Hmm, seems I was off by a f... (Below threshold)

Hmm, seems I was off by a few years. The Repubs knew they had members being inappropriate with children for 10 years and kept it quiet.

I find it wildly entertaini... (Below threshold)

I find it wildly entertaining that the party who's now crying about "the children!" is the same party who wants children to be able to get abortions without their parents' consent or notification.

They're mature enough to make medical decisions about sex, but they're not mature enough to determine who they want to have sex with. Amazing.

Oh, and the age of consent in DC is 16. Foley's boys were 17 and up. Cry over the "icky" factor if you want to, but then you're just being a homophobe :-)

Whether tragic events touch... (Below threshold)

Whether tragic events touch your family personally or are brought into your home via newspapers and television, you can help children cope with the anxiety that violence, death, and disasters can cause.

Listening and talking to children about their concerns can reassure them that they will be safe. Start by encouraging them to discuss how they have been affected by what is happening around them. Even young children may have specific questions about tragedies. Children react to stress at their own developmental level.

The Caring for Every Child's Mental Health Campaign offers these pointers for parents and other caregivers:

* Encourage children to ask questions. Listen to what they say. Provide comfort and assurance that address their specific fears. It's okay to admit you can't answer all of their questions.
* Talk on their level. Communicate with your children in a way they can understand. Don't get too technical or complicated.
* Find out what frightens them. Encourage your children to talk about fears they may have. They may worry that someone will harm them at school or that someone will try to hurt you.
* Focus on the positive. Reinforce the fact that most people are kind and caring. Remind your child of the heroic actions taken by ordinary people to help victims of tragedy.
* Pay attention. Your children's play and drawings may give you a glimpse into their questions or concerns. Ask them to tell you what is going on in the game or the picture. It's an opportunity to clarify any misconceptions, answer questions, and give reassurance.
* Develop a plan. Establish a family emergency plan for the future, such as a meeting place where everyone should gather if something unexpected happens in your family or neighborhood. It can help you and your children feel safer.

If you are concerned about your child's reaction to stress or trauma, call your physician or a community mental health center.






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