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Where Eagles Dare: A Message For Senator McCain

Straight to the point: There's reason to doubt that oft-repeated pledge of 'supporting the troops' when you've worked for a man who tried to kill the troops.

So said Jim Geraghty, who hit the nail on the head. I borrow his words and embrace them as if they were my own. If only our candidate would do so and stop affording a hard core leftist plausible deniability through avoidance. The time has come.

It is time for John McCain to bring up Barack Obama's ties to - friendship with - William Ayers. Not through Sarah Palin, not on a campaign stop, but directly, in debate on national television. Obama is daring him to, expecting John lacks the fortitude. John seems the only one who is hesitant to do so.

It is time for a direct, open and national look at The Plot to Bomb Fort Dix, hatched, planned and botched by William Ayers' minions during the Vietnam War.

In such absence of direct challenge, Obama is afforded the deception of wiggle room, which affords those who would wish to see nothing in the Obama-Ayers inconvenient truth to see vast amounts of nothingness. After all, as The One says, seemingly in a dare, McCain 'has not said anything to his face' and instead is just scoring cheap political points.

A new television ad is welcomed but will not suffice alone, Senator McCain.

He is a friend and colleague of William Ayers, whose group sought to bomb our own troops at a dance with their wives and girlfriends at Fort Dix, New Jersey. The One, who consistently tries to champion us veterans as some distorted sort of new victim class, is aligned and friends with a man who tried to literally make us victims - by killing us.

Do not, Senator McCain, leave it to us to do. Yes, we veterans are more than able; willing, passionate, and intelligent enough to engage decisively. But it must come directly from you, face to face, eye to eye. He is daring you.

Please, Senator McCain. This cannot stand. And it is time for you to embrace this fight. We are, as we should be, behind you. For the moment. We are ready and able to be in front of you. But this is a charge that you need to lead.

We are veterans. Proud, honor-driven patriots. This is a bond you share with us. And we took an oath years ago to defend our Nation against all enemies, foreign and domestic. William Ayers - friend and political ally of Barack Obama - is the latter by his own definition and statements. We did not relieve ourselves of that duty when our active duty in uniformed service came to a close. It lives in us - you, me and all veterans. And we are with you, but we need you in front.

It is time, Senator. Enough is enough.

UPDATE: Wizbang commenters remind that Senator McCain almost certainly has a plan, and one unfolding. And they are correct. In a way, I regret the initial tone of this post, a tone that suggests John McCain may somehow be avoiding direct contact. Its presence here is more reflective of passion and a raw nerve routinely treaded upon un-lightly by Barack Obama than a belief that Senator McCain is sidestepping the issue. I am a passionate man, and my passions run deep with regard to service, veterans, honor and our collective sense of duty.

The overriding tone that should be taken from the raw display above is one of anger and contempt for a man and his alliances and friendships that run counter to what we veterans have spent our adult lives defending through many means and in many forms. A friendship with William Ayers is unacceptable in a Commander in Chief. For Ayers' deeds and words are, in fact, precisely what we have defended against: All enemies, foreign and domestic. We are partisan. We love our nation and wish it preserved for our children to inherit, not morphed into a misery-laden socialist system where aspirations, opportunity and ceilings are capped and the floor shared.

We veterans, who "air raid villages and kill civilians," will apparently either embrace our new victim status or be discarded and brushed aside. No, sir. Senator Obama can dismiss our challenge as veterans. He cannot dismiss such from Senator McCain.


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Comments (104)

Obvously Obama is ready wit... (Below threshold)

Obvously Obama is ready with a come back should McCain decide to bring the subject up in a debate.

Obviously, right or wrong, McCain has a strategy for defining who Obama is according to the current plan I see unfolding. His current tactic is to do it with ads instead of during the debate.

I haven't a clue why. But I would bet he does.

I have been through many pr... (Below threshold)

I have been through many presidential elections. October Surprises is not a catch phrase. It is based in reality where sometime in October before the election, something devistating comes up for one of the two candidates that almost tanks the campaingn of said candidate.

Now that being said, I agree with Larry. McCain is not stupid when it comes to elections. After all, he was all but dismissed when he started to run for the nomination. Now look.

Anytime this month, maybe at the next and last debate, something will be revealed that will give independents and undecided voters pause as far as their leaning towards Obama. Actually, it is the only thing that makes sense. ww

This is an interesting arti... (Below threshold)

This is an interesting article from Zogby that supports what Larry and I are saying. ww


Hopefully McCain is getting... (Below threshold)
Mark Author Profile Page:

Hopefully McCain is getting this advice. I also hope he's ready for how low Obama and his tools will go though. See the last comment left at my blog for an example:


Note to Mark:Natur... (Below threshold)

Note to Mark:

Natural Skeptic has a free mind. Free of the fetters of logic, unbiased introspections and true skepticism, only self-assured elitist blarney. Only too typical a product of the current American university and secondary school system supported by Bill Ayers and his cronies. A sad product of the attempt to defeat America from within.

Mark, it doesn't matter wha... (Below threshold)

Mark, it doesn't matter what someone said, it is if that someone is believable. Most people believe McCain. He is a known. Obama, not so much.

Although the democrats do stick to the same script very well, it can be penetrated. The link above has a good example of the 1980 election, which Zogby thinks is being repeated. ww

Another thought:"B... (Below threshold)

Another thought:

"But, but, but, McCain doesn't know how to use the internet!"

If his strategy does work, it would be an even more resounding criticism of Obama and his campaign. We can only HOPE. ;-)

I do not know how you can w... (Below threshold)

I do not know how you can write this crap,when you know Obama was 8 years old at the time.

If you had a pedophile friend in your childhood, better yet, Obama I think didnt even know Ayers at the time, would it be right for you to be put in jail for that?

Clearly you are not thinking right.

You MUST go back to ... (Below threshold)

You MUST go back to 1976 and the Carter/Ford campaign that Carter won. At one point, Carter was 15 points ahead. That is a fifteen point DIFFERENCE between Ford and Carter. It is now a THREE to FOUR point difference that peaked at eight points.

This was without the Bradley effect, which is real. Ford had Nixon hanging around his neck. He had Carter as a smooth talking, church going, unknown. It is factual that Americans tend to vote for those they do not know very well. Sadly, it is often the devil we don't know rather than the one we do. Just take a look at JFK/Nixon for the real deal.

An analysis of Obama's campaign is easy. You just have to look at Axelrod's prior campaigns, especially Deval Patrick's, who ran with the same rhetoric as Obama is using today.

The reason Obama is the candidate instead of Hillary is that she made a mistake. She discounted the caucus states. Obama took advantage of that with his prior community organization stuff; he knew that popularity wasn't worth a bucket of spit, it was who you could drag to the meeting that counted.

Then he rode his momentum to the nomination thanks in part to his better organization skills and the rules of the Democratic Party, plus the media is in his pocket.

Take a look at what media people watched Palin/Biden on. I have posted this before. When it is 55 million for mainstream media versus Fox at 15 million, the influence of mainstream, traditional media cannot be underestimated.

For the Democrats to start the tune of "Obama has already won," like they did on Hillary, they know something they don't like. There is a solid reason why campaigns run their own polls, they don't trust the ones that are public. Some observers have calculated that Obama MUST go into the election with at least a six to eight point lead by the last week or he is in for a very narrow defeat.

Obama is playing it safe. I have said that the election is Obama's to lose and McCain's to win or lose. So far, this is playing out exactly as stated. Obama is playing it safe so he doesn't make a mistake. He has packaged a counter for everything he can think of (or Axelrod has) that McCain can come up with.

McCain has a plan. I dunno what it is, just that he has a plan. Like Rush says, now is not the time to panic. He will tell us when that time comes. I saw this on his web site yesterday.

Add to McCain with a plan, you add that the Obama camp is running scared, and that leads me to believe it ain't over yet, the fat lady has NOT sung.

George:You might w... (Below threshold)


You might want to clarify your thoughts a bit more before you post. I couldn't figure out what the heck you were talking about.

the Klan hasn't burned cros... (Below threshold)

the Klan hasn't burned crosses on lawns for years, George...would you vote for a candidate who was hanging around with and politically supported by an avowed, unrepentent, though EX-cross burner?

Apparently you would.

George read what we are say... (Below threshold)

George read what we are saying. An UNREPENTENT domestic terroist, who said in 2001 that he did not do enough is a political friend of Obama's. Helped him start his career. Obama's friend set out to damage and kill people. Fire bombing a judges house with their family inside. For a democrat, that might be cool to you, but it is disgusting to me. ww

I do not know how you ca... (Below threshold)

I do not know how you can write this crap,when you know Obama was 8 years old at the time.

It doesn't matter how old Obama was at the time. What matters is who he chose as his friends once he became an adult. What matter is that he chose to associate with Bill Ayers.

To apply this same principle to a different context consider the following...

Eric Rudolph is Bill Ayers modern counterpart. Rudolph committed his bombings the 90's and Ayer's in the 60's. Assume Rudolph managed to get off on a technicality and was free (Ayers stated - "guilty as hell, free as a bird"). Fast forward 30 years, Eric Rudolph public states his only regret is that he didn't commit more acts of terror.

If someone who was born in 1988 had befriended Eric Rudolph knowing well who he was and what he still believed, would that indicate something about that person ? Surely. You can tell a lot about someone by the company the keep.

So spare us the "he was 8 years old at the time" nonsense. It's not about how old Obama was at the time. It's about who Obama chooses to associate with as an adult.

Besides the obvious charact... (Below threshold)

Besides the obvious character flaws associating with an unrepentant terrorist and continually changing denials point out in "The One" or rather "That One". The voting public needs to have a connection made of Ayers being an ultra liberal and finding Obama liberal enough for his tastes to launch his political career. My gosh how many politicians has Ayers launched careers for?

I posted this the other day... (Below threshold)

I posted this the other day...it fits better on this thread.

During the debate the other night McCain had a PERFECT opportunity, when the Navy Chief asked him a National Defense question, to say THIS:

"When I went into the military I raised my right hand and swore to defend America from all enemies, foreign and DOMESTIC! It stands to reason that I could never associate with or work for a despicable cowardly DOMESTIC terrorist like William Ayers. A man who HATES this country, wants to see it destroyed, and regrets he didn't do more destruction when he had the chance. This is the man who launched Senator Obama's political career...and I am appalled by that FACT!"

How dare you! How dare you ... (Below threshold)

How dare you! How dare you suggest McCain bring up facts about the past of a Marxist bigot. Why, that might offend the all important "moderate" voter. And we certainly can't have that. Asking people like that to take a stand, make up their minds, support the nation rather than the latest CNN report from Amanpour! Don't be silly.

FlashMichelle Malk... (Below threshold)


Michelle Malkin just discovered Obama link to the New Party. Or at least she is just getting aound to waving it at us. Good show Michelle.

A simple search of <a href=... (Below threshold)

A simple search of ERIC would uncover some interesting articles written recently by Dr. Ayers:
Hearts and Minds: Military Recruitment and the High School Battlefield
Private Management of Chicago Schools Is a Long Way from Mecca
Chicago's Renaissance 2010: The Small Schools Movement Meets the Ownership Society
Dr. Ayers' past is not the only thing to worry about in this association.

Didn't figure you for <a hr... (Below threshold)

Didn't figure you for a Misfits fan, Steve.

If Obama becomes Commander ... (Below threshold)
Mac Lorry:

If Obama becomes Commander in Chief I wouldn't be surprised if he appoints William Ayers as secretary of defense. Obama wants to greatly increase domestic spending and no one would be a better ally in axing the defense budget than Ayers. Liberal thinking is that the best way to defend the U.S. is to turn it into a powerless third world nation.

So Obama was 8. How old wa... (Below threshold)
Steve Schippert:

So Obama was 8. How old was Obama when Bill Ayers disavowed his bombings? How old was he when Ayers apologized to the American people?

He never has, genius.

How old was Obama when he befriended Bill Ayers? How old was he when he began accepting money from him, speaking with him, co-chairing organizations with him, and holding political fund raisers at Bill Ayers' home?

Get out of my face.

When I joined the United States Marine Corps, I took a solemn oath to defend this Nation - its Constitution - against all enemies, Foreign and Domestic. I am still an active defender of both through different means.

Before I joined the Corps, Bill Ayers declared war on the United States of America. He prosecuted a domestic war against the United States of America. A significant part of that war was a kinetic war of bombings. He has not rescinded his statements and actions. He is still at war with the United States of America through different means.

That he is afforded deceptive and fraudulent cover of credibility through the University of Illinois is a disgrace, not an exoneration. That Obama has maintained a friendship and partnership with this man is a disgrace and an affront to the very Oath of Office he will potentially utter when sworn into the office of the presidency.

This cannot stand unchallenged. I do not care what your political persuasion is. We are Americans first, and we have a right - no, a charge - to demand that the Oath of the Office of the Presidency is solemn, not a mockery and a mere formality.

Got that?

Great idea for a comparison... (Below threshold)
ed davis:

Great idea for a comparison, George!

Pedophiles are probaly more likely to rehabilitate and never ever hurt a child again (yeah, right) than Obama is to change his CORE BELIEF SYSTEM.

If I associate with a guy I KNOW is a convicted pedophile and say "well, I was only eight years old when he did that", FUCKING SHOOT ME.

Obama is an asshole.

The President must swear an... (Below threshold)
Steve Schippert:

The President must swear an oath as follows:

"I do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will faithfully execute the Office of President of the United States, and will to the best of my Ability, preserve, protect and defend the Constitution of the United States."

He is the Commander in Chief of the United States Military Forces, established under that Constitution, and each member as such must swear an oath.

"I, _____, do solemnly swear (or affirm) that I will support and defend the Constitution of the United States against all enemies, foreign and domestic; that I will bear true faith and allegiance to the same; and that I will obey the orders of the President of the United States and the orders of the officers appointed over me, according to regulations and the Uniform Code of Military Justice. So help me God."

These are not just words, reduced to mere formality and pomp & circumstance afforded a televised celebration.

Is the President, as Commander in Chief, exempted from such defense against all enemies foreign and domestic? Does the befriending and professional and political allegiance with such not present a conflict of interest between the holder of the Office and the people and Constitution which said Office serves?

Have we lost our minds?

Steve, as a veteran also, I... (Below threshold)

Steve, as a veteran also, I agree and am firmly in your corner. ww

100% negative = the McCain ... (Below threshold)

100% negative = the McCain camp and their rabid followers like Steve.

Ill informed and disgusting piece.

Stand fast and maintain Ste... (Below threshold)

Stand fast and maintain Steve.
You are beyond the pale, and you are

Semper Fi Steve - du... (Below threshold)

Semper Fi Steve - duty, honor, country.

I served in the late 50's with a security clearance that Obama likely couldn't get due to his associations. I was trained to recognise both "Willing dupes," and dialetic materialism.

I consider the employment of William Ayers by the University of Chicago as a disgrace.

But the reason is simple. I posted a list of things that Obama has done on another thread.

And I gave a hint why Ayers has his job.

Think daddy's money. The senior Ayers was the CEO of Commonwealth Edison and at one time was the President of the Chicago School Board.

Do a google on Thomas Ayers. Cold chills will go up your leg, to paraphrase Matthews. Among other things, Thomas was Chair of the Board of Regents of Nortwestern University, where Bernardine Dohrn is employed (since 1991) as a Professor of Law without a license to practice.

Until his death last year, Thomas Ayers ran Chicago. Anyone who thinks Daley did is wrong.

So why the disgrace? Easy answer.

As an vet, I also agree wit... (Below threshold)

As an vet, I also agree with Steve. I don't know if McCain is looking for a masterful coup-de-gras from out of the blue. And if he is, I think it's a STUPID plan. There is enough dirt on Obama ALL OVER THE FRICKEN PLACE that this shouldn't even be close. We're in the presidential debate season... that means all this stuff can get out to the public at large WITHOUT A MEDIA FILTER!!!

Stop toying with him, and finish it. October surprises can backfire too, ya know *coughRathergatecough*.

It seems at this point, to me, that it's 1 of 2 things. He's keeping it close for NO REASON... or he's not really playing to win. Both don't speak well to me of his judgement.

jp2 And Other Obama Apologi... (Below threshold)

jp2 And Other Obama Apologists,

If John McCain launched his political coming out party at Timothy McVeigh's house (assuming that was possible), would you have issues with that? As my dear mother always used to say, "You are who you hang with."

Steve,Exactly.... (Below threshold)
ed davis:



He swore an oath as Senator too. So did Murtha and the rest of the seditious fucking traitors.

And when we sign up, we are reminded OVER AND OVER that it is not too late to say no. It is an oath dammit. And no one but fucking NO ONE will ever force you into it. It is a PRIVILEGE to make that oath and even more so to LIVE UP TO IT.

I think about that sometimes and get so pissed. Especially when I think about the globally aired comments made by these fucking assholes.

Obama is an anti-American traitorous asshole. And people who support him in this day and age of an all out attack from so many fronts against America have lost their fucking minds.

I took an oath as a juror l... (Below threshold)

I took an oath as a juror last week, and though I'd heard the words a thousand times on TV, they took on special meaning for me that day. As a matter of fact, when the trial was over, the Judge's sincere thanks for upholding that oath honorably almost moved me to tears.

When Steve speaks passionately about the oath he took and with such sincerity, I am again emotionally affected -

and forever grateful.

Ed, please try and tone dow... (Below threshold)

Ed, please try and tone down the language. I understand your sincerity, but there are better words.

McCain has a plan? When do... (Below threshold)

McCain has a plan? When does he plan on rolling it out - Thanksgiving? We're waiting for something better than a Bob Dole pitch off a stage during a campaign stop, but we keep getting delicate jabs and little-seen internet ads. Whoopee.

Okay, here it is. F... (Below threshold)

Okay, here it is. From friends in Chicago, I have know for some time that Bill Ayers daddy was the reason for why Ayers has the clout he has in Chicago. But I didn't know the whole story. One friend simply told me it was "Daddy's money." and left it at that. Another one said that "Ayers' dad ran a lot things up here."

Then the conversations went on to other matters
like elections and who Obama really is.

I had no frigging idea.

After posting to Steve, I started looking around more. And here is a web site that is a must read for those who want to understand William Ayers, Thomas Ayers and who is running Obama:

Click me for the web site::

Ordinarily I don't fall in love with a long winded analysis by either a conservative or liberal (especially liberal) blog post unless and this is a big unless, I know enough to validate at least 50% of the analysis.

The link I am providing here passes my smell test. It is well worth the time it will take for you to read it.

Man, there is no level of s... (Below threshold)

Man, there is no level of sleeze you people won't sink to ,in your desperate attempt to hold on to power. I think Barack should bring up McCain's ties to Nazi sympathizers and death squads in the central America since we are doing guilt by association. You people have no class at all.

Hi Oyster.Not in m... (Below threshold)
ed davis:

Hi Oyster.

Not in my book there aren't. Well, yeah, maybe there are. Better cuss words.

I sure ain't gonna call him or anyone associated with him (including the lemmings voting for him) "my friends"... which is what I think the point of this post is. McCain's campaign needs to take the gloves off already. Get pissed. Obama, Murtha, and Kerry have said things that warranted a hanging only 60 years ago.

Peanutbuttersnickersbars. Nah, that really doesn't convey the emotion. But I tried.

I'll take a pill now and try not to comment for a while. if i do, I won't cuss so much. Okay?

I think Barack sho... (Below threshold)
I think Barack should bring up McCain's ties to Nazi sympathizers and death squads in the central America since we are doing guilt by association.

Why wait for Barack, jmc? Sources and links, please. Post it with details for us to read.

jp2~100% ... (Below threshold)


100% negative = the McCain camp and their rabid followers like Steve.

Ill informed and disgusting piece.

Nothing to back up your comment. It never ceases to amaze me why you are still commenting here.

"The link I am providing he... (Below threshold)

"The link I am providing here passes my smell test. It is well worth the time it will take for you to read it."

Pathetic, Larry. Noquarter, from the people who brought you the Michelle Obama whitey video. If that passes your smell test, you need an ENT specialist.

There's a reason McCain isn... (Below threshold)

There's a reason McCain isn't mentioning Ayers. It's not playing well in Peoria. The public sees the attempt to portray them as "friends" or "palling around" as gross distortions. Whatever tenuous shared experiences they had in the past, Obama has denounced him, and they haven't had any contact for 6 years.

Plus, it's just a dishonest attempt to play party politics. If you want to have "anger and contempt for a person and [their] alliances and friendships", how about Palin "palling around" with secessionists? If that weren't enough, they were secessionists sponsored by Iran! McCain just released a list of prominent supporters; number 2 on the list? Leonore Annenberg, president of the foundation on whose board Obama and Ayers served together. And hmm, McCain was on the advisory board of "the U.S. chapter of the World Anti-Communist League, an international organization linked to former Nazi collaborators and ultra-right-wing death squads in Central America". Did he "pal around" with its chairman? Palin just held a fundraiser at the home of John Donahue, founder and chair of an investment firm fined by the SEC for unethical practices (an association deemed "questionable" when it was Obama and Penny Pritzker). And don't forget about "palling around" with Charles Keating.

But enough about the tit-for-tat character attacks. If you think McCain has some magic "plan" to turn Ayers into a successful campaign strategy, you're fantasizing. McCain already took that path, and it backfired bigtime. The advice he's getting is to drop it. He won't be going there again, unless he attempts some sort of doomsday/anything goes policy on his way out.

jp2I didn't provid... (Below threshold)


I didn't provide the link to discuss Michelle Obama's whitey video, I provided it because it attempts to detail all of Thomas Ayers' associations and how he exercised power. This is how his son got his job, his wife got her job, after they were terrorists or maybe they still are in a different way.

Obviously bombing a Judge's house while the family was home didn't turn out well for them.

If you choose to believe none of what is provided, that is your problem, not mine. If there is anything in the article about which you dispute, by all means provide an counter.

Page 11 jp2, page 11. Did you read it yet? He is talking about YOU.

>100% negative = the McC... (Below threshold)

>100% negative = the McCain camp
Nothing to back up your comment. It never ceases to amaze me why you are still commenting here.

Maybe because he's right.

Last week, only 34 percent of [Obama's] ads attacked McCain directly while virtually all of McCain's ads attacked Obama
Contrary to our lefty frien... (Below threshold)

Contrary to our lefty friends, this is getting traction. Obama discussed it on the MSM National broadcast yesterday. Our lefty friends are all a twitter about this. All signs of the hook sinking in. I say, attack, attack and then attack more. This guy needs to be exposed. ww

Last week, ... (Below threshold)
Last week, only 34 percent of [Obama's] ads attacked McCain directly while virtually all of McCain's ads attacked Obama

Pff! At least you live in the moment, Brian.

/sarc off

"If you choose to believe n... (Below threshold)

"If you choose to believe none of what is provided"

I choose not to read noquarter, period. If you want to rely on them for sources, be my guest. A step lower than Wizbang.

And everyone, please keep talking about Ayers. Working wonders.
notiz=Since Wizbang is so low, here's some help.

Contrary to our lefty fr... (Below threshold)

Contrary to our lefty friends, this is getting traction.

Think what you like. It's people like you, who spend all your time trying to make a brick fly rather than find something more airworthy, who will be responsible for McCain's defeat.

Here's more from one of your "lefty friends":

This, McCain and his female Sancho Panza say, is demonstrated by bad associations Obama had in Chicago, such as with William Ayers, the unrepentant terrorist. But the McCain-Palin charges have come just as the Obama campaign is benefiting from a mass mailing it is not paying for. Many millions of American households are gingerly opening envelopes containing reports of the third-quarter losses in their 401(k) and other retirement accounts -- telling each household its portion of the nearly $2 trillion that Americans' accounts have recently shed. In this context, the McCain-Palin campaign's attempt to get Americans to focus on Obama's Chicago associations seems surreal -- or, as a British politician once said about criticism he was receiving, "like being savaged by a dead sheep."

I encourage you to focus on the dead sheep, in the single-minded delusion that you can revive it. And one month from now, you'll still be wondering why all of your effort bore no results.

I choose not to re... (Below threshold)
I choose not to read noquarter, period. A step lower than Wizbang.

Then why are you still reading and commenting here? The readership would not change if you were gone, so contribute to another blog where everyone will cheer at your Obama "yes-men" attitude. Your decision not to think outside your ego will not change the outcome of the election, either.

Pff! At least you live i... (Below threshold)

Pff! At least you live in the moment, Brian.

Yep, that's where the facts are. Facts you can't brush away with a "pff".

Brian:Here's two f... (Below threshold)


Here's two for you and they're not bricks.
Frank and Dobbs.

jp2 - "And everyone, pl... (Below threshold)

jp2 - "And everyone, please keep talking about Ayers. Working wonders."

Gee, glad you noticed, it could possibly be working.

Brian~ "Facts" that change... (Below threshold)

Brian~ "Facts" that change all the time, depends on what day it is and which way the wind blows:

The WAP says "56 percent of the McCain campaign ads were negative, while 77 percent of Obama's ads were negative" between Sept. 6-13.
The full-color glossy mailo... (Below threshold)

The full-color glossy mailouts I get regularly from the DNC and from the RNC are glaringly different than any videos out there. Here in Florida every single mailout I've gotten from the DNC is about McCain. Every single one I've gotten from the RNC is about McCain.

Go figure.

John McCain sat on the boar... (Below threshold)

John McCain sat on the board of the U.S. Council For World Freedom.

from the article:"WASHINGTON (AP) -- Republican Sen. John McCain served on the advisory board to the U.S. chapter of an international group linked to ultra-right-wing death squads in Central America in the 1980s."


Your turn. Show from a non conservative site that Obama has a real link to Ayers beyond mccain's link to this nazi group.

Sleezy! You guys will do anyhting to hold power.

Sleezy! You guys w... (Below threshold)
Sleezy! You guys will do anyhting to hold power.


What power are you talking about? Congress?
Haven't you heard? The democrats have had
control for the past two years.

jmc - "Show from a non ... (Below threshold)

jmc - "Show from a non conservative site that Obama has a real link to Ayers beyond mccain's link to this nazi group."

Would the latest data dump (last week) by the University Illinois (Chicago) pass your smell test as a "non-conservative" site?

If so I suggest your go over there post haste, read and head, and you will actually learn how closely associated obama and ayres were.

Here's a teaser scenario for you: If you were heading an organization or committee with the resources to fund some project to the tune of 50 million dollars per year would YOU hire someone and NOT keep a close watch on where and how the money was spent?

If so, you're a complete and utter fool. Ayers isn't he knew exactly who obama was and what they could do together.

The fact 150 mil was wasted is another matter altogether and falls under the category of obama's failed executive experience. His ONLY executive experience in a 20 plus year career.

jmc:Glad you asked... (Below threshold)


Glad you asked.

See, I went to every site I could find to validate as follows:

1. How was William Ayers about to integrate into his job along with his wife considering his history? Only a complete moron, or spaced out loon would challenge what he admitted he did in years past.

2. I found the answer, and it was Daddy's money. More than that, it was Daddy's power.

3. Next, what was the link between Ayers and Obama; was it credible?

I believe it is number three you are challenging, right? How about #1 and #2 - did I do ok there? I really don't want to waste my time unless you agree that Ayers is an unrepentant terrorist and that daddy's money and power took care of things.

Let me know.

Oh come on oyster - you kno... (Below threshold)

Oh come on oyster - you know the game. Joseph Goebbels did it very well. . . :-)

Oh, by the way jmc, have yo... (Below threshold)

Oh, by the way jmc, have you read page 11 yet?

Did you find your name there :-)

Ya know, I have asked this and posted this many, many times and to date, not one single Obama supporter has seen fit to respond.

I took Page 11 right out of Audacity.

jmc: What power... (Below threshold)


What power are you talking about? Congress?
Haven't you heard? The democrats have had
control for the past two years.

Well gosh maggie, I would be talking about the presidency, you may not have been keeping up on current events but this guy named George Bush has been president for eight years he is a republican. Well this Guy named John Mccain (also a republican) really really wants George's job. So Republicans are spreading vile awful attacks on mccain's opponet because of a man he knows in chicago. and they ignore Mccain's nazi pals. Sleezy you see. anyhting for republicans to stay in power. if you have any questions on congress i will gladly explain that to you as well.

Show from a non conserva... (Below threshold)

Show from a non conservative site that Obama has a real link to Ayers

Try CNN, scroll down a bit for the video.

(Oh, I can hear it now - CNN is in the tank for John McCain, etc etc so they don't count...)

max:Does this mean... (Below threshold)


Does this mean Obama will have the same kind
all compassing and divine powers as Bush if
he's elected? He'll just bypass the controls
of Congress?
Well well.

By the way, you're invited to my crusade.

Say Larry, maybe I... (Below threshold)

Say Larry,

maybe I missed it, I only scanned through this thread. but I don't seem to see a link from you from a non right wing source. Have you posted that? I;d be happy to read page 11.

What are your thoughts on death squads btw? Classy of McCain to pal around with such people huh?


Ok jmc, here you go. Even t... (Below threshold)

Ok jmc, here you go. Even though you haven't answered my question, I am gonna give you part of the answer then see if you have the courage to ask for the rest.

I am serously tired of having to spoon feed factual information to those who are emotionally bonded. It reminds me of trying to talk a teenage girl out of her crush on the big man on campus.

This is from another thread which I guess didn't get looked at as well as this one. There is another post over there I can get here as well.

jmc and the others who are getting excited.

And especially for Oberman watchers.

I did not make up any of what I posted. All of it is public record. And I didn't get a single one of my facts from Olberman or Rush. I read the reports. I analyzed the data for myself.

I did use public record; news reports that have never been refuted by Obama such as the endorsement by the New Party.

Obama may have been eight years old when Ayers did what he did THEN, but he wasn't eight years old when he started his elected office campaigns in Ayers living room.

He wasn't eight years old when he served as Ayers hand picked Chairman for the Chicago Annenberg Challenge.

He wasn't eight years old when he sought and received the New Party endorsement.

Obama wasn't eight years old when he got a million dollar earmark grant for the same medical hospital where his wife got a $200,000 a year raise. She was in control of the program to dump the indigent to other medical facilities. And Axelrod was the PR guy for that stunt.

Obama wasn't eight years old when he:

1992 - runs "Project Vote" registration drive in Chicago for ACORN.

1993 - Serves on the board of Woods Foundation with Ayers.

1995 - Gest his first political donation from Tony Rezko.

1997 - Gets a thousand dollar donation from Rezko, who says at the time he couldn't afford to turn on the heat in his public housing projects.

1998 - Sponsors a bill that creates affordable local housing funds to subsidize private developers (like Rezko).

1998 - Sponsors a bill to facilitate privately built, subsidized low income tenements. Care to know the condition of those today?

1998 - Writes state and city officials to give Rezko 14.6 million for a low income housing project.

1999 - announces for congress and names Pfleger as a supporter.

2000 - announces large state granst for Pfleger.

I could go on for days.

Obama wasn't eight years old when he wrote Audacity of Hope. Have any of you guys read it?

Go read Page 11. You are there.

Now for the final. As an old time politician from Illinois said, "Money is the mother's milk of politics." This mantra has been repeated over and over and over. If anyone doesn't understand that, you are naive.

I have a test for the Obama supporters who have lately showed up here or who have long time posting records.

And I have telegraphed the answer. It really isn't a hard question.

Here it is:

Why would Barack Obama risk his political career associating with a known terrorist no matter how much energy had been spent on cleaning up the guy?

Should I make this multiple choice to help out?

Now you could answer, I suppose, that he didn't have an association with Ayers. That would be a dishonest reply considering that certain facts cannot be challenged; he started his political career in William Ayers' living room is indisputable, right?

So how about an answer, please.

Hint: Daddy's money.

I found some interesting cu... (Below threshold)

I found some interesting current events about Chicago that I really wasn't aware of.

CHICAGO -- As Gov. Rod Blagojevich on Wednesday signed a new law that will put in place tougher penalties for selling guns to minors, he also announced he's got a new idea to help combat the violence that Chicago is experiencing: he's talking to the Illinois State Police and the National Guard to see if they could help.

The Chicago Sun-Times depicted Blagojevich as the "new sheriff in town" Thursday morning in its coverage of the governor's plan to form an "elite tactical team" to help the city fight crime.

"Violent crime in the city of Chicago is out of control," Blagojevich said at the bill signing ceremony. "I'm offering resources of the state to the city to work in a constructive way with Mayor Daley to do everything we can possibly do to help stop this violence," said the governor.

The summer of 2008 will be remembered as especially violent. Blagojevich said there's been a child shot nearly every day since June 26, with 29 Chicago Public School students shot since last fall.

The National Guard?! I hope the new governor keeps his head to the grindstone on this. I was really dismayed to read that his predecessor was a Rebub who was Nationally known for raising the debate on capital punishment. Jeez! The "elite tactical team" sounds like a great idea. Of course, don't expect Obama to have the same initiative because we "have become Global."

Steve:A f... (Below threshold)


A friendship with William Ayers is unacceptable in a Commander in Chief. For Ayers' deeds and words are, in fact, precisely what we have defended against: All enemies, foreign and domestic.

Unfortunately not everyone agrees with you. I posted the link to support william ayers on another thread.

I agree with you. This is why I have pursued the association with every ability I have to track it down. I have been days on the subject. And it all came together today.

It basically boils down to Daddy's money. BHP sold out to get it.

jmcBy all means, I... (Below threshold)


By all means, I am waiting to see what you think after reading it. Page 11 that is.



Here is the Chicago Annenberg Foundation three year report. This is the foundation that Ayers and a couple of his friends started with Annenberg's money. Ken Rollings was the first executive director. Barack Obama was the Chairman.

Three year report:

William Ayers is described as a political organizer and a local education professor. I wasn't willing to pay for the final report.

Then there is:


Over 1,700 educators have signed a petition of support for Ayers.

I am not making this up.

The final report on the near 150 million spent boiled down to two words: nothing changed. I have not found the list of those who got the money, but if I understand Chicago politics, what really changed was the size of the wallets of an assortment of connected characters, "Activists" and "Reformers," all code words for those who elect to stress entitlement instead of hard work.

Oh, and finally, if you go read the contract between the Chicago Teacher's Union and the Chicago School District, high school teachers are required to work a back breaking 6 and a half hours a day. Elementary teachers do 5 hours and 15 minutes.

Here is the contract:


Go there and click on agreement.

THEN, I went to many of those links in the one I posted earlier on noquarter, I didn't just read the rhetoric. Many of the links I had already read.

THEN, I went to MSM to read what I could find on the subject. There are too many links to list, but they boil down to:

Obfuscation at first. Axelrod dodging. There were reports of various functions where Obama and Ayers crossed paths. For one thing, their kids go to this elite school together. But one thing was crystal clear, Obama has never stated WHEN he found out Ayers was a terrorist and he has been asked.

Here is a truth: When a politician doesn't want to answer a question, it is either because he doesn't know or he doesn't want someone else to know.

How hard is this jmc. Obama went to Ayers for the money. And Ayers arranged it for him. This is the way it works, get it?

Now for McCain. I will dig around and give you and honest answer when I have done enough research to come to a conclusion.

Interesting conversa... (Below threshold)

Interesting conversation:

I went to the bank today. It is a small branch with three employees. The subject came when I asked if the three of them knew who William Ayers was. Two said yes, one said no. The one who said no is a minority.

I then said, well do you think him being a professor at the UofC is a disgrace? Answer yes from two, no from one. The two then explained to the one who Ayers is. She changed her mind and said she agreed. I believe her.

I then asked - does anyone know how he got his job at UofC considering his record - or how his wife, who in some ways was worse than Ayers got her job at Northwestern. The three of them, how?

I told them about Thomas Ayers and his money. The heads shook up and down, including the minority, who said, "Daddy's money, why am I not surprised."

So then I said, "Obama went to Ayers and became his buddy because he wanted and needed the money to kick off his political career."

The minority said, "I thought Obama was a good guy. Guess he is just like all the rest of them."

I dunno if any votes were changed and as I live in Texas it doesn't matter anyway. The point is that Obama/Ayers is poison and should be administered at every opportunity. And Daddy's money rings a lot of bells.

jmc @ 52~You have ... (Below threshold)

jmc @ 52~

You have to read the whole article you post, not just the title and first paragraph:

"I don't recall talking to McCain at all on the work of the group," Singlaub said.

McCain has said he resigned from the council in 1984 and asked in 1986 to have his name removed from the group's letterhead.

"I didn't know whether (the group's activity) was legal or illegal, but I didn't think I wanted to be associated with them," McCain said in a 1986 newspaper interview.

Singlaub does not recall any McCain resignation in 1984 or May 1986. Nor does Joyce Downey, who oversaw the group's day-to-day activities.

"That's a surprise to me," Singlaub said. "This is the first time I've ever heard that. There may have been someone in his office communicating with our office."

Not only does he recall talking to McCain about the work of the group, he doesn't recall McCain's resignation or request to be removed from their letterhead. Probably, the only eay to leave this type of group is with disgression. Thanks for the tabloid moment, though. Details, details...

Correction: *not only does ... (Below threshold)

Correction: *not only does he not recall...

heh, I can't spell today, e... (Below threshold)

heh, I can't spell today, either. *discretion.

You're confused maggie. You... (Below threshold)

You're confused maggie. You've been talking to jmc, not me. You and I had our conversation yesterday. Before Kim started removing my posts. No doubt to keep you and oyster from looking too silly.
notiz=You mean like this? There's no confusion

No, not like that. That's d... (Below threshold)

No, not like that. That's disemvowelment. She just dissappeared them.

McCain's association with G... (Below threshold)

McCain's association with George W. Bush Jr. is more politically damaging than Obama's association with Ayers, Wright, and Rezko.

Your country's financial system is in danger of crumbling, the stock market is taking a shit-kicking on a daily basis, and this is what you think speaks to undecided and convertible voters?

This from the link that jmc... (Below threshold)

This from the link that jmc was hawking:
"McCain has said he resigned from the council in 1984 and asked in 1986 to have his name removed from the group's letterhead.

"I didn't know whether (the group's activity) was legal or illegal, but I didn't think I wanted to be associated with them," McCain said in a 1986 newspaper interview.

"Singlaub does not recall any McCain resignation in 1984 or May 1986. Nor does Joyce Downey, who oversaw the group's day-to-day activities.

"That's a surprise to me," Singlaub said. "This is the first time I've ever heard that. There may have been someone in his office communicating with our office."

"I don't ever remember hearing about his resigning, but I really wasn't worried about that part of our activities, a housekeeping thing," said Singlaub. "If he didn't want to be on the board that's OK. It wasn't as if he had been active participant and we were going to miss his help. He had no active interest. He certainly supported us."
So what we have is the most tenuous of links to a group which is linked to another group.

It was 22 years ago. Show me where he had an active role in the organization.

What's so UNsurprising is the headline: McCain linked to group in Iran-Contra affair then they go on to explain that McCain is linked to a group that's linked to another group...and jmc reads all this (probably gleefully rubbing his hands together) ready and willing to take the word of someone he knows NOTHING about other than some death squad allegations over a US Senator.

In the meantime, not once, not one single time has Obama ever said he "didn't think he wanted to be associated with Ayers". Instead, he engages in the same level of lying a seven year old child would.

And do you know why? I'll tell you why - because to Obama, Ayers was a normal guy. It wasn't until people started asking why he would associate with Ayers that he began to think maybe Ayers ain't so normal - but HE CAN'T ADMIT IT.

max:No, ... (Below threshold)


No, not like that. That's disemvowelment. She just dissappeared them.

Never assume anything you can't verify,
it could be fatal.

Crap, Medusa already found ... (Below threshold)

Crap, Medusa already found it. I hate you, LM!

Y... (Below threshold)

Your country's financial system is in danger of crumbling, the stock market is taking a shit-kicking on a daily basis, and this is what you think speaks to undecided and convertible voters?

There you go again hyperbolist. By the way,
don't look behind you, your market might
fall on your head while you're looking.

The New York Times article,... (Below threshold)

The New York Times article, which prompted Palin's remarks, actually concluded that "the two men do not appear to have been close. Nor has Mr. Obama ever expressed sympathy for the radical views and actions of Mr. Ayers."

One pictures oyster gleefully rubbing his hands together ready to beleive any nonsense in a vile and sleezy attempt to hold on to power for his party at all costs.

hahaha!A "New Y... (Below threshold)


A "New York Times article" says "it doesn't appear...."

Whatever, jmc. And it's not "HIS party". SHE (meaning me) does not claim membership to any party.

Oyster ain't a dude, jmc.</... (Below threshold)

Oyster ain't a dude, jmc.



While I pity those with assets in the stock market, we're in good shape, with our heavily regulated financial system. #1 in the world! I assume, though, that you're fine with the #40 ranking insofar as it's free of the taint of socialism.

Well jmc, it doesn't appear... (Below threshold)

Well jmc, it doesn't appear that McCain and Singlaub were close or that they EVER did anything together at all.

Sleazy what you're trying to do.

hyperbolist:You're... (Below threshold)


You're right, it's a good thing cows don't
I'll let you figure that one out.

Canadians are always lookin... (Below threshold)

Canadians are always looking down their long noses at the acrimonious election process in the US. They choose up sides and wish they could vote, or at least influence the vote.

Yet in many ways, Canada has it own history of flamboyant politicians and leaders and the first that comes to mind is Pierre Trudeau. Now that guy knew how to light up a controversy, or two, or three. In many ways, Trudeau made progress on behalf of his vision for Canada and on the other hand, he pissed people off so bad, they turned in to Trudeau haters that remind me now of Bush haters.

jmcObama may be sl... (Below threshold)


Obama may be sleazy in the true Chicago political tradition, but he isn't stupid. Of course he isn't going to announce that he has signed up for the latter day Weathermen.

Try thinking before you post.

I am still waiting for your page 11 analysis.

"Never assume anything you ... (Below threshold)

"Never assume anything you can't verify,
it could be fatal."

What the hell does that mean?

I hate you, LM!I k... (Below threshold)

I hate you, LM!

I know, hon, but you gotta love the dolts that try to refute the reverse evidence in their own links. In this case, jmc didn't even do that because it was too much for him to process.

max:See what I mea... (Below threshold)


See what I mean?

maggie: some people are rea... (Below threshold)

maggie: some people are really good at being cryptic (anybody remember kim?), and some people seem to prefer being obscurantists for the sake of appearing intelligent. There are easier ways to show people you're clever.

Larry: Trudeau was amazing! The greatest liberal politician in North American history. He karate kicked a reporter who had been badgering him constantly. KICKED the guy! Bad ass. Trudeau knew how to deal with terrorists: he instituted the War Measures Act during the October Cris in 1970 (despite resistance from the further-left-of-centre opposition) and all of the FLQ pukes responsible went to jail. "How far will you go to stop the terrorists?" "Just watch me." Cajones. There's also a rumour that he picked up Lyndon B. Johnson by the throat and threatened to kick his ass if he ever talked down to a Canadian again. (Johnson had bullied his predecessor.) I like to think it's true, but he denied it (with a giant smirk). A JFK with real accomplishments, he was...

hyperbolist:Someda... (Below threshold)


Someday,if you survive long enough, you'll
get over the smug assumptions, and understand
what I posted.
As to Trudeau, you keep on bragging about him.
He's your kind of guy. But JFK he never was.

I happen to be a big... (Below threshold)

I happen to be a big fan of Trudeau and not at all of LBJ. Johnson started a bunch of what we are reaping today. I hope it is true that Trudeau dominated him. That would have been a rare event for LBJ.

I have seen a somewhat similarity between Bushes pursuit of terrorists and the way Trudeau went about it. Trudeau caught a ration of crap over the way he went about it. So has Bush.

Oh no LaMedusa,I d... (Below threshold)

Oh no LaMedusa,

I didn't respond to you because I am busy with other things. If you notice I posted as much as you have today. Didn't have time to go beyond it and deal with the incredibly stupid points you made. but I'll take a minute or two to point out your blunders.

don't recall talking to McCain at all on the work of the group," Singlaub said.

And your point is? MccAin is still on a board with links to nazi's and death groups.

McCain has said he resigned from the council in 1984 and asked in 1986 to have his name removed from the group's letterhead.

Well Gosh And barack has denounced what Ayers did. I guess the fact McCain served with these guys for over a year means nothing to you.

"I didn't know whether (the group's activity) was legal or illegal, but I didn't think I wanted to be associated with them," McCain said in a 1986 newspaper interview.

Except he was involved with them for some time.

Singlaub does not recall any McCain resignation in 1984 or May 1986. Nor does Joyce Downey, who oversaw the group's day-to-day activities.

Wow so they thought McCain was still with them. Nice point.

"That's a surprise to me," Singlaub said. "This is the first time I've ever heard that. There may have been someone in his office communicating with our office."

See above.

So basically we have have palin paling around with People who want to commit treason and secede from the USA and McCain Pals around with Nazis and death squad goons. Getting in the mud is fun.

I think it is time for Obama to take off the gloves with the slime being pedeled by the right.

So what we have is the m... (Below threshold)

So what we have is the most tenuous of links to a group which is linked to another group.

It was 22 years ago. Show me where he had an active role in the organization.

Oyster this is why I wonder about the grasp some of you seem to have on reality.

So the fact that McCain did this 22 years ago should matter? Might I point out that Ayers did what he did almost 40 years ago. When Barack was 8!

Larry your challenge was to... (Below threshold)

Larry your challenge was to provide a non partisan link. no Quarter looks extreme right to me.

Well, I want to thank you g... (Below threshold)

Well, I want to thank you guys for teaching me something about human behavior. What I learned is that you can only shame people with scruples to begin with.

Your canidate is running into some pretty sleazy terrority in a desperate attempt to talk about anything but the economy, in the hopes that we will elect him to deal with our economic troubles. You encourage him to guilt by association which is beyond stupid, but you hope by smearing barack you might some how avoid a distaterous defeat come November. Pretty desperate.

I have always wondered how so many people could stand by and even encourage despicable acts in the world. I realize now some people will delude themselves into thinking any amoral behavior is acceptable.

McCain's unfavorability rankings are going through the roof. So smear on. Smear your way to defeat.

JMC:If only Goebbe... (Below threshold)
Thomas Jackson:


If only Goebbels and Stalin could have attained the levels of double speak you use so fluently. Never have I seen such a mendacious candidate, plumb the cesspools of filth so effectively as Obama and his team of trolls.

As a good member of the communist party since 1996, oops I mean its front, New Socialist Party, all Americans can expect the annointed one to follow in the same footsteps that all good members of the politburo are expected to folow.

There is a sucker born every minute. Res ipsa loquitur.

Trudeau enjoyed the legacy ... (Below threshold)

Trudeau enjoyed the legacy that JFK was denied, maggie. He's the Jesus/Gandhi/MLK of 20th century mainstream liberalism.

Larry, I'll buy you a beer if ever you're in Toronto (though it'll likely be a Dogfish Head IPA, an American brew with an unparalleled balance of hops and crispness). It's nice that some conservative Americans can recognize a true hero in the war against terrorism when they see/read about them. If the leader of every single nation on this planet were a clone of Pierre Elliot Trudeau, we'd all be rich, drunk, happy, and good at martial arts right now.

Stephen Harper? George W. Bush? North America deserves better--at least Americans agree. Canadians seem too satisfied with status quo mediocrity. Sucks.

Trudeau enjoyed t... (Below threshold)
Trudeau enjoyed the legacy that JFK was denied, maggie. He's the Jesus/Gandhi/MLK of 20th century mainstream liberalism.

Now that there is really funny.

hyperbolist:I have... (Below threshold)


I have studied politics most of my adult life, that and something called "Cultural Psychology."

Trudeau was who JFK wished he was. At the end of the day, JFK made a ton of naive mistakes that ended up costing us lives by the many thousands. I heard a story one time that Trudeau blew up when he heard that JFK had Diem killed. Trudeau had a temper. And he was a very, very smart man.

hyperbolist, I think the way I think because I recognise one very large rot that has infested our society: victim mentality. I don't see your guy buying that at all. He was too smart and he knew people better than that.

I do not support Democrats for one main reason. They help promote victim mentality.

Now I would support (and I have) a battered spouse shelter, a suicide hotline and a legal aid society that caters to the low end. I do not support outfits like Acorn who promote victim mentality because it makes the organizers a ton of money.

I also took an oath to defend the US from all enemies, foreign or domestic. And way too many Democrats act like enemies. I understand the strategic reason for Iraq. And I think that anyone who wants to be President of the United States and can't figure out why we are there without it being written on their hand, isn't qualified. Although in Obama's case, he was told to oppose the war, so he does. I have no clue what he really thinks.

Thanks for the beer offer. And I accept should I find myself in your neck of the woods.

At the rate the markets and... (Below threshold)
krkrjak Author Profile Page:

At the rate the markets and economy are going in the tank, I don't know why anyone would want the job. My guess is that the next POTUS is going to be a one term-er, if he can even last that long before being tossed out of office. Can anyone say "Herbert Hoover"?

Oh no LaMedusa,<... (Below threshold)
Oh no LaMedusa,

I didn't respond to you because I am busy with other things.

jmc, it's better that you didn't take up all that bandwidth. Your whole rebuttal consisted of "Oh yeah?", "Well what about this?" and "Still on a board linked with nazis" and blahblahblah...oh, and you know how to bold the print for emphasis. No real proof. You got nuthin'.

McCain Pals around with Nazis and death squad goons.

Awesome. How much you wanna bet the National Enquirer laughs in your face? Yeah, you are a more long, drawn-out version of jp2.

jmc, one more time:<p... (Below threshold)

jmc, one more time:

You answered to the fact it was 22 years ago by wondering about my grasp on reality and completely ignored the very next sentence.

Show me where he had an active role in the organization.


Odd, Hyper, I don't think A... (Below threshold)

Odd, Hyper, I don't think Alberta remembers Trudeau as fondly as you do. Or Saskatchewan, with his famous "it's your wheat" line. Raising the national debt by 80+% is certainly "bad ass", as you put it. So was instituting policies that more than doubled Alberta's unemployment.

In other news, if you like Dogfish (best party favor to come out of Delaware since George Thorogood, and unlike Joe Biden I can stomach very large doses of it!), I highly recommend you try Flying Fish from NJ, if you can find it. I think it is one of the few things we can agree upon ;)

yeah?", "Well what abou... (Below threshold)

yeah?", "Well what about this?" and "Still on a board linked with nazis" and blahblahblah...oh, and you know how to bold the print for emphasis. No real proof. You got nuthin'.

Typicall most rebutalls contain an "Oh yea what about this" "this" being logic or facts. I used logic which is why you didn't understand it.

Typicall most rebu... (Below threshold)
Typicall most rebutalls contain an "Oh yea what about this" "this" being logic or facts. I used logic which is why you didn't understand it.

So, you just wanted to get the last word in to prove your reading comprehension and spelling skills are non-existent. Whatever.






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