Cindy Sheehan's Opinion Column

Rob Port August 12, 2005 War On Terror 141 Comments

Cindy Sheehan, the mother of a U.S. soldier killed in action in Iraq, has written a column for The Huffington Post that’s getting some attention in the mainstream media.

I thought I’d respond to some of the statements she makes.

This is George Bush’s accountability moment. That’s why I’m here. The mainstream media aren’t holding him accountable. Neither is Congress. So I’m not leaving Crawford until he’s held accountable.

Why is this the President’s “accountability moment?” Because Cindy Sheehan and the anti-war activists tell us it is? It seems to this observer that the President’s “accountability moment” happened back on November 2nd, when he was put back in office by a majority of electoral votes after receiving a significant majority of the popular vote. The President has been held accountable for Iraq by the American people, and those people put in back in office for another 4 years.

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It’s ironic, given the attacks leveled at me recently, how some in the media are so quick to scrutinize — and distort — the words and actions of a grieving mother but not the words and actions of the president of the United States.

Wait a minute…the President is never attacked or scrutinized in the media? His words are never distorted? That’s news to me.

As for what’s being said about Sheehan, some of it is no-doubt regrettable. I’m very sorry for her loss, but when she makes the decision to use that loss in politics she’s going to have to withstand some criticism. She’s making some fairly serious charges against the President and his administration. She is blaming the President, personally, for her son’s death. She is calling him a murderer. Hyperbole like that is going to rankle some feathers. As much as we’d all like to spare grieving mothers they must be held accountable for their words and actions just like the rest of us.

But now it’s time for him to level with me and with the American people. I think that’s why there’s been such an outpouring of support. This is giving the 61 percent of Americans who feel that the war is wrong something to do — something that allows their voices to be heard. It’s a way for them to stand up and show that they DO want our troops home, and that they know this war IS a mistake… a mistake they want to see corrected. It’s too late to bring back the people who are already dead, but there are tens of thousands of people still in harm’s way.

Whoa, back the truck up. Where is she getting the 61 percent figure? Is it from a poll like this one by the Associated Press? One that was manipulated to show a negative result for the President and/or the war in Iraq? I’m not willing to take Sheehan’s word on this number. If she wants to throw a number like that around I’m going to need to know some facts about how it came into existence.

As far as I’m concerned, though, the most telling figure about America’s approval of the President’s handling of Iraq came to us on November 2nd. In an election that was very much about the war in Iraq the President won. Handily. Not much has changed about the President’s handling of Iraq since then.

There is too much at stake to worry about our own egos. When my son was killed, I had to face the fact that I was somehow also responsible for what happened. Every American that allows this to continue has, to some extent, blood on their hands. Some of us have a little bit, and some of us are soaked in it.

Cindy Sheehan is not responsible for her son’s death, nor is the President or anyone who supports the war. Some terrorist bastard over in Iraq is. Had Cindy’s son not gone to Iraq he would probably be with us today, but it was his decision to go there. He re-enlisted, in fact, after the war had began knowing full well that he’d likely be headed to Iraq. He was an adult and made a decision. His decision was to continue his service in the military. He clearly believed in the mission, even is his mother does not.

People have asked what it is I want to say to President Bush. Well, my message is a simple one. He’s said that my son — and the other children we’ve lost — died for a noble cause. I want to find out what that noble cause is. And I want to ask him: “If it’s such a noble cause, have you asked your daughters to enlist? Have you encouraged them to go take the place of soldiers who are on their third tour of duty?” I also want him to stop using my son’s name to justify the war. The idea that we have to “complete the mission” in Iraq to honor Casey’s sacrifice is, to me, a sacrilege to my son’s name. Besides, does the president any longer even know what “the mission” really is over there?

First of all, no parents can force their children to enlist. The reason this is true is because children don’t serve in the military. Adults do. Full-grown men and women, capable of making the conscious decision to join the military, do.

The mission in Iraq was to remove a terror-sponsoring tyrant from power. We’ve done that. The mission now is to leave Iraq under the control of a democratically-elected government that is capable of keeping that nation secure from terrorist insurgents who would like to see the place turned back into a safe-haven for their training and operations bases.

Casey knew that the war was wrong from the beginning. But he felt it was his duty to go, that his buddies were going, and that he had no choice.

No choice? He most certainly had a choice. He didn’t have to re-enlist, but he did. As for him thinking the war was wrong, signing up to fight in said war seems to me like a funny way of showing that.

The people who send our young, honorable, brave soldiers to die in this war, have no skin in the game. They don’t have any loved ones in harm’s way.

It seems rather ridiculous for us to require that our leaders have children in the military before we allow them to make decisions about international policy. Not to mention the fact that it is not in any of our leader’s power to force their children into the military.

As for people like O’Reilly and Hannity and Michelle Malkin and Rush Limbaugh and all the others who are attacking me and parroting the administration line that we must complete the mission there — they don’t have one thing at stake. They don’t suffer through sleepless nights worrying about their loved ones.

I haven’t heard what O’Reilly, Hannity or Limbaugh have said about Cindy Sheehan. I certainly wouldn’t label anything Michelle Malkin as said as an “attack.” A strong response, yes, but when you call the President a “murderer” a strong response is to be expected. As for them not having anything at stake, I still think its ridiculous to make having loved ones involved in the conflict a prerequisite for having an opinion about said conflict.

Before this all started, I used to think that one person couldn’t make a difference… but now I see that one person who has the backing and support of millions of people can make a huge difference.

Yes. One person, manipulated by anti-war activists (who are anti-semitic, if their website tells us anything) to politicize the death of her son, having their words trumpeted by a media establishment highly interested in even the most hyperbolic accusations against the current administration can make a large difference indeed.

That’s why I’m going to be out here until one of three things happens: It’s August 31st and the president’s vacation ends and he leaves Crawford. They take me away in a squad car. Or he finally agrees to speak with me.

Seems to me like Cindy Sheehan already got to talk to the President once. On that visit she thought he was “sincere.” Why should the President now take time to expose himself to accusations of murder? He knows what she’s saying about him. Sheehan knows his reasons for the war. Neither are going to accept the other’s stance. It’d be a colossal waste of everybody’s time, but it would allow for an opportunity to garner some bad press for the President, which is really probably the point here.

My guess: She goes away in a squad car.

If he does, he’d better be prepared for me to hold his feet to the fire. If he starts talking about freedom and democracy — or about how the war in Iraq is protecting America — I’m not going to let him get away with it.

Right. Don’t let facts get in the way of your anger. You let him have it Cindy. After all, he murdered your son, right? It wasn’t the homicidal monsters we’re fighting in Iraq, it was George W. Bush.

Like I said, this is George Bush’s accountability moment.

If you say so, Cindy.

Update:

Drudge is claiming to have an email from some other members of the Sheehan family:

The following email was received by the DRUDGE REPORT from Casey’s aunt and godmother:

Our family has been so distressed by the recent activities of Cindy we are breaking our silence and we have collectively written a statement for release. Feel free to distribute it as you wish.

Thanks, Cherie

In response to questions regarding the Cindy Sheehan/Crawford Texas issue: Sheehan Family Statement:

The Sheehan Family lost our beloved Casey in the Iraq War and we have been silently, respectfully grieving. We do not agree with the political motivations and publicity tactics of Cindy Sheehan. She now appears to be promoting her own personal agenda and notoriety at the the expense of her son’s good name and reputation. The rest of the Sheehan Family supports the troops, our country, and our President, silently, with prayer and respect.

Sincerely,

Casey Sheehan’s grandparents, aunts, uncles and numerous cousins.

By Rob Port of Say Anything.

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About The Author

Rob Port

141 Comments

BR August 12, 2005

I see we have a new pet troll, or is it an oldie coming out as its true self – cuckoo lulu. Here’s one to chew on for Mr. Pavlov’s doggie:
BR August 12, 2005

Recently, ConfederateYankee observed that the moonbats at DU were flipping out because Sheehan was having trouble with her cell phone outside Pres. Bush’s Crawford ranch, while trying to conduct an interview with Thom Hartmann on Air America, reportedly standing in for Air America regular Randi Rhodes – the broadcaster who brought on a Federal review last April 05 for inciting violence against Pres. Bush.

One radio station attempting such incitement + one lone incitable moonbat called Sheehan camped out in close proximity to POTUS, worries me. Her family would be wise to get her home.
Dan Bernitt August 12, 2005

Is it unfair and/or irresponsible to ask Bush why his daughters are not in the military if this is a just and good war? They are certainly well qualified.
JJ August 12, 2005

79% of Repubs approve of what’s going on in Iraq, down from last week’s 83%. Still solid support but we remain a nation divided…

This is George Bush’s war. He chose it. This is the point Mrs. Sheehan is making.

Should Bush choose to meet with her – and he probably won’t – the “movement” created by Mrs. Sheehan’s vigil will diminish.

It will be interesting to see what the media will do if she moves her political action to DC at the end of the Crawford vacation.
Peter F. August 12, 2005

With all due respect to Ms. Sheehan, she’s already met with the President.

http://en.wikinews.org/wiki/U.S._war_protest_mom_met_Bush_in_2004

The fact that he sent out aides to talk to her once more, is a sign of compassion. She may not like the answer, and sorry to be so harsh and seemingly cold, but she had her chance last year.

And, no, Ms. Sheehan, Mr. Bush didn’t kill your son. Islmaofascists killed your son. Be mad at them. Ask them why they started this. Ask them why they continue they take trucks into neighborhoods and slaughter children.

http://news.ft.com/cms/s/56f7cd8a-f3b7-11d9-af32-00000e2511c8.html

You want justifiable anger, Lefties? There it is. Right in your g**damn face and you can’t even see it. Children cut to pieces. What is the matter with you? Who raised you to think that this is right, just or defendable? How can you accept this? How can not see and fight the evil in all this? What IS the matter with your moral compass?

I’m glad I hold my faith in God, because my faith in humanity is being sorely tested by those who profess to care.

I’m done for the week. It’s been too long. *sigh*
zeppo1 August 12, 2005

I don’t understand any of this.

“pet troll” “moonbat” “cuckoo lulu”

These are all fun pharses for children.

People are dying in Iraq as we type these pharses.

They are dying.

We don’t see it. We don’t see the blood or destruction. We see missing teens in Aruba. I just witnessed some man on O’reily s show who was a “reputation expert” speaking about how this mother speaking out is “hurting her, making her look bad”. No news form Iraq. Imagine being a soilder there and coming back thinking Iraq would be all over the news and finding hours of coverage on a teacher who had sex with her students.

I honestly do not understand this. People are dying.

It’s time to wake up.
lulu August 12, 2005

Wow, BR. “Cuckoo Lulu?” What is this, 7th grade? How ’bout next time you say, “Nanner, nanner, nanner?” That’s also popular amongst the jr. high kids. Well, no that’s probably more of an elementary school thing but I guess that also suits your mentality. Oh, and Moonbat? Wow, that’s original. Don’t spend much time out of the conservative echo chamber, do you? Although you don’t appear to be very intelligent you are, by God, entertaining! Thanks for the laughs!
not_a_chimpy_fan August 12, 2005

Peter F. wrote “And, no, Ms. Sheehan, Mr. Bush didn’t kill your son. Islmaofascists killed your son.”

BULLSHIT. Bush decided to take out Saddam and didn’t have a plan after the initial onslaught. You’d think these warmongers, with as many years of experience that they have, could have been careful with our soldiers’ lives.

Bush is responsible for all of the soldiers’ deaths. President Chimpy is (regrettably) the Commander in Chief.
darren Benson August 12, 2005

What news do you watch? Your information is all wrong. This is an illegal war. CIA documents were illegaly altered to promote it. And information known AT THE TIME to be false were spoken by BUSH to YOU as true. He lied to you. That’s a fact. He is using young men and women to die why they are building PERMANANT bases in Iraq. He doesn’t want this war to end. He NEEDS it to continue. Do you not know this? Is that still debatable or something? If so I’d like to hear what yo have to say. I don’t know why you are defending Bush. Is it because he says he’s a Christian? Is it because he’s conservative? Look at the country right now. This is a terrible terrible White House. Is this not clear to you?
Toby928 August 12, 2005

“Toby, as I said, “It’s coming and you know it.””

Lulu, I would ask whats coming but I’m sure its just more babble against ‘The most ethical administration in modern times’. 😉

1994,1996,1998,2000,2002,2004…and the hits just keep coming.

/ignore=on

Tob
-S- August 12, 2005

lulu…I usually don’t find responding to sarcastic barbs such as yours worthwhile, but calling O’Reilly’s broadcast a ‘show’ is hardly rare, much less not even approaching inaccurate.

I hope that you and your other personalities will be alright and that you don’t organize to any extent to make good on any of those harms you write about as to the rest of society.

What is your specific affiliation with Ms. Sheehan? As in, what motivates you to believe you have some sort of relationship/affiliation with this woman? Her suffering? Just curious.
-S- August 12, 2005

Having now read farther, what I conclude is that few among the left on this thread have any other objective other than to harass. No amount of information is ever going to seep through, if it hasn’t already.

It’s not about information for some here, it’s about using a venue and trying to generate disorder. Just look at the nonsense and by whom.

The Clinton W.H. identified and was even closely aware of Atta prior to 09/11 and yet, liberals want to talk about a disturbed woman driven, from the look of things, to mental and emotional chaos and certain Left chaotics all too eager to “help” her stay there.
Capt. Turang August 12, 2005

Hey All!

It’s GREAT to see so many AMERICANS who support OUR TROOPS!

Now you can REALLY SUPPORT THIS WAR!

Please visit army.com to sign up!

We really need you to stop typing and pitch in!

Capt. Turang
United States Army
Toby928 August 12, 2005

“Capt. Turang United States Army”

ROFLMAO

Tob

1994,1996,1998,2000,2002,2004…Read ’em and weep.
zeppo1 August 12, 2005

“Having now read farther, what I conclude is that few among the left on this thread have any other objective other than to harass. No amount of information is ever going to seep through, if it hasn’t already.

It’s not about information for some here, it’s about using a venue and trying to generate disorder. Just look at the nonsense and by whom.”

Please identify such nonsense.
I am trying to find out two things
A) Why everyone is on this woman who wants to talk to the president, (where all this hate comes from, why you called her “disturbed”)
B) Just how she is being used.

Extra points if you can post without mentioning Clinton. Let’s try to stick to topic.

Sincerely,
zeppo1
JcGehee August 12, 2005

Isn’t there a Godwin corollary for the “chickenhawk” reference? ‘Cause the ol’ “probability approaches zero” prediction sure does apply these days.

And judging from the unflagging condescension in Lulu’s comments, I’m thinkin’ “she” is a 13-year-old boy. I guess the kid got banned from the chat rooms for posing as a lonely exotic dancer.
BR August 12, 2005

“Fun pharses” ? Is that like jokes in Persian, Zeppo1?

Glad you had a good laugh with me, Cuckoo Lulu.

Every now and then I create a universe I call the music universe – it only lasts for a microsecond – so you were lucky to enter it at just the right moment. It goes like this: an entire universe consisting only of music, nothing else, no solid matter, no time, only music of all kinds, no dichotomies of good or bad… and when someone sings off-key, everybody collapses in spasms of laughter!

On the day we can all laugh together, there’ll be peace and lots of good-humored fun.
Capt. Turang August 12, 2005

Hey JcGehee!

Thanks for being a TRUE AMERICAN and for showing your interest in enlisting in the United States Army!

You will be contacted by a recruiter your e-mail address to set up an appointment in the Coweta County, GA area!

Thanks Again!
Capt. Turang
United States Army
Toby928 August 12, 2005

“Capt. Turang United States Army”

Did you get demoted? Weren’t you a Lt Colonel the last time you posted?

Tob

1994,1996,1998,2000,2002,2004…and 2006 ain’t lookin’ good either, Chomsky.
zeppo1 August 12, 2005

“Fun pharses” ? Is that like jokes in Persian, Zeppo1?

No, it’s more like this…

Imagine being in a place where you don’t know if you will be alive five minutes from now. A place where your best friend just got his head blown off, and you have no new shirt, so you wear his blood for the next week. Imagine the smell of the dead bodies after the most recent car bomb. Imagine trying to give “democracy” to a people you can’t wait for you to leave, so they can install the most repressive goverment possible.

Hope I didn’t have any typos.
zeppo1
BR August 12, 2005

Zeppo1, if you can’t lighten up, I’ll have to say, “My universe is prettier than your universe, naa naa ne naa na…” 🙂
AnonymousDrivel August 12, 2005

RE: Dan Bernitt’s postt (August 12, 2005 08:00 PM)

Is it unfair and/or irresponsible to ask Bush why his daughters are not in the military if this is a just and good war? They are certainly well qualified.

Chelsea Victoria Clinton – born February 27, 1980 (Little Rock, Arkansas); “First Daughter” 1992-2000; enlistment-capable date 2/27/1998;

Clinton Administration Bosnian War – Dayton Accords NATO peace enforcement mission and Dayton Peace Accords on Bosnia: December 14, 1995

American troops are still stationed in Bosnia.

Number of military duty days served by Ms. Clinton: 0

Number of times requested by Liberals that Ms. Clinton enlist to fulfill military duties under the guise of “prevention of a wider war”: 0

Number of times requested by Bill and Hillary Clinton that Ms. Clinton enlist to fulfill military duties… ever: 0?

Number of times requested by Liberals that Ms. Clinton enlist to fulfill military duties… ever: Still 0?

Are you, Mr. Bernitt, “unfair and/or irresponsible” regarding the Clinton Administration’s conflicts and the insistence of familial participation in them? Were you? Or are you blowing smoke?
Toby928 August 12, 2005

“Imagine being …”

Okay Zepplin, I imagine it? So? Do you have a plan? An answer? An idea? Lets hear them.

You just can’t beat something with nothing, and your holding a busted flush.

Tob

1994,1996,1998,2000,2002,2004…and Condi2008, that has a nice ring to it doesn’t it Chomsky?
Toby928 August 12, 2005

Hey 1of12. Its an invasion of featherweight trolls toniht. I think they should call for reinforcements. Maybe JoeMama is available.

Tob

Nixon08
Death is no excuse!
BR August 12, 2005

Rumsfeld/Cheney 2008 🙂
Toby928 August 12, 2005

Ford08
Tanned, rested, and ready for that 2nd term!

Tob
zeppo1 August 12, 2005

“Zeppo1, if you can’t lighten up, I’ll have to say, “My universe is prettier than your universe, naa naa ne naa na…” :)”

Sorry BR, can’t do it.

See, recently, to me it’s not about calling people silly names or saying “well but YOU guys did this”. It’s not a football game and it stopped being amusing a long time ago.

Mostly EVERYONE has disconnected themselves from reality, and the simple plain reality is that a lot of people are dying.

Dying. Dead. No more. Real. Not Billy O’Reilly nattering about something or some silly ass commerical about a judge. But our fellow citizens are dying. Really. Nobody disputes almost 2000 Americans (and god only knows how many Iraqi)have died.

And

For

What?
Toby928 August 12, 2005

Your really getting off on those death images aren’t you Z? Got that piddly all stirred up.

Come up with any ideas yet?

Busted flush, I’m tellin’ ya.

Tob

1994,1996,1998,2000,2002,2004…Demographics and economics are aggin’ ya boy.
BR August 12, 2005

Hee hee, Toby – we should ask Paul to make a provocative cameo appearance here – then we’ll soon see his fan club of Pavlovian doggies.
zeppo1 August 12, 2005

“Come up with any ideas yet?

Busted flush, I’m tellin’ ya.

Tob”

Tob,
I always feel a little weird at the question of “what now”?

It reminds me of a friend asking me if he should go and murder someone (who for the sake of metaphor, has WMD and links to Al Queda), me advising him what a bad idea that would be, him commiting the murder anyway, getting in all kinds of trouble and then coming back to me to ask

“any Ideas”?

I have no ideas – except for us to get out as quickly as possible.

I have no idea what “busted flush” is.
Toby928 August 12, 2005

“Dying. Dead. No more.”

Zep, you must be an unbeliever. We don’t take kindly to no godless commies round here, boy.

Tob

Yeah BR, I read that email from the grammatically- challenged fellow. This thread’s pretty good. Loads of laughs just pottin’ varmints when they pop up from their holes. It passes the time anyway. 😉
Toby928 August 12, 2005

“I have no ideas…” zeppo1 at August 12, 2005 11:18 PM

Google will preserve that admission for all eternity. 😉

A busted flush is what you got. Nothing. Google for it. You’re just a handful of want and mouthful of gimme. Nobody has ever been convinced by someone with nothing. And you can’t MauMau me or my kind. We’ve been guilted by the best and I’m still just happy to be alive, unlike an ever-increasing number of jihadies. 😉

Tob
zeppo1 August 12, 2005

“Zep, you must be an unbeliever. We don’t take kindly to no godless commies round here, boy.”

Funny.

I wonder if you do truly believe in this war, or if it’s more of an entertainment to you – posting on blogs spouting outdating phrases. I wonder if you did think we should really be there, if Iraq was a real threat, why you would not go yourself?

I think if the American people actually beleived their country was ever in danger, recruitment levels would be through the roof.

You are absoultely right. It’s a question of belief.
Toby928 August 12, 2005

Weak. Like I said, I’ve been MauMau’ed by the best.

Tob

Outdating (sic) are my speciality.
Toby928 August 12, 2005

oops.

Outdating(sic) phrases are my speciality.

Tob
zeppo1 August 12, 2005

“I have no ideas…” zeppo1 at August 12, 2005 11:18 PM

Google will preserve that admission for all eternity. 😉

A busted flush is what you got. Nothing. Google for it. You’re just a handful of want and mouthful of gimme. Nobody has ever been convinced by someone with nothing. And you can’t MauMau me or my kind. We’ve been guilted by the best and I’m still just happy to be alive, unlike an ever-increasing number of jihadies. 😉

Tob

Once again a great bunch of phrases that would make for really cool bumper stickers.

I’m not trying to guilt anyone. I’m very happy that you’re happy to be alive. I’m just trying to get across the point that this is real, not a bunch of silly bastards calling each other names on the internet. That people just like me and you are dying for this, and when people are confronted with the reality, when we strip away all the bullshit, they are dying for no reason.

Please don’t let anyone label you or tell you what to think. Don’t reduce your brain to sloganeering. Think for yourself. For yourself, your own thoughts, not some labels the media foists upon us.

Then we can talk.
zeppo1 August 12, 2005

Tob,

Just curious. If you do beleive (and it seems you do passionatley), then why are you not there?

I know this will be taken as smart-assy, but I do really want to know.
Toby928 August 12, 2005

“I’m just trying to get across the point that this is real”

Only a child could make such a condescending statement as that. Just like my youngest saying, “You just don’t understand!” I’ve got blood enough, thank you very much, to be guilty about, so the reality of this world has not escaped me. If I had a dollar for every troll that exhorted me to free my mind I’d never have to work again. Like I said, weak.

Come back when you got hair down thar.

Tob
BR August 12, 2005

Toby, I know – this thread has given me more laughs than I’ve had in days! But damn, I don’t enjoy stepping on ants – no crunch. I’m impatient for the big game hunting – guess there’ll be a weekend lull before the next level of developments in the 9/11-Commission-suppressed-Able Danger-intell matter. (I’ve been reading over at MacsMind – interesting posts and knowledgeable commenters there both on the Plame affair and 9/11 matter.)
Toby928 August 12, 2005

Lights out. Slap you around tommorrow if you want.

Tob out.
zeppo1 August 13, 2005

Um…yeah.

Then maybye you can answer:

“Tob,

Just curious. If you do beleive (and it seems you do passionatley), then why are you not there?

I know this will be taken as smart-assy, but I do really want to know.”

..or you can go back to your self-delusions that you’re slapping someone around.

But it is really cute you have so many of these great slogans like “Come back when you got hair down thar” It’s like a funny Jeff Foxworthy.

Meanwhile, I’m still open to talk about reality
zeppo1 August 13, 2005

Um…yeah.

Then maybye you can answer:

“Tob,

Just curious. If you do beleive (and it seems you do passionatley), then why are you not there?

I know this will be taken as smart-assy, but I do really want to know.”

..or you can go back to your self-delusions that you’re slapping someone around.

But it is really cute you have so many of these great slogans like “Come back when you got hair down thar” It’s like a funny Jeff Foxworthy.

Meanwhile, I’m still open to talk about reality
BR August 13, 2005

Hm, synchronicity! We both posted at 11:51 PM 🙂

Telepathic too – I was just thinking about the Mau Mau in Kenya when Zeppo1 was describing all that blood, death and destruction, then you used the phrase. I don’t know what connotation it has for you, but for me it was the thing the grownups discussed behind closed doors when I was a little girl growing up in Africa. I gathered there were some horrible atrocities committed there, and wondered if Zeppo1 is stuck in some such incident in his distant past.
AnonymousDrivel August 13, 2005

RE: Toby928 post (August 12, 2005 11:03 PM)

Sorry about the delay, 8-of-378879. I had to check the rolls to see if we may still collaborate. Turns out you’ve progressed nicely and the end-zone seats for the upcoming season are looking doable. No doubt the 50-yd line primos will come in short order, Rove be praised!

I’ve found it reckless to conjure the unmentionables since they have this uncanny ability to arise from the ashes given the slightest invocation and choice psalm. fatman passed this wisdom to me and I pass it on to you, McChimpybushiltenron be praised!
AnonymousDrivel August 13, 2005

RE: Toby928’s post (August 12, 2005 11:28 PM)

“a handful of want and mouthful of gimme”

Now that one’s a keeper.
zeppo1 August 13, 2005

“”a handful of want and mouthful of gimme”

Now that one’s a keeper.”

“…at least 34 National Guard and Reserve troops were killed in the first 10 days of August, according to Pentagon figures, making it one of the worst periods of casualties for part-time troops since the war began more than two years ago. “

Now that’s a keeper.

Still open to talking about reality. Now back to all the cute bumper stickers….
snowballs August 13, 2005

-S-,

I’m going to bookmark this thread ( http://wizbangblog.com/archives/006730.php ) and put it in the keepers category. While I’ll admit that sometimes I don’t read your entire comment, because you can type faster than I can read – this collection from you is the most succinct, well stated and from-the-gut words that I have ever read regarding the price that we all pay. I’m disappointed that you watched O’Reilly but I’ll give you a pass on that one.

lulu,

No shit we’re frightened – you don’t seem to be too frightened to say “you’re just scared” in order to mark everyone else as ignorant…

…and, “so you don’t look like a total DoucheTard” does, in fact, come off as very in-the-8th-gradish. Otherwise, very nice posts on your part minus the insults to strangers on the Internet who will quietly dismiss them anyway. This is a very, very difficult war topic that gets into some deep feelings. I can feel the emotion, and understand the ‘position’ that people take on a political level. I don’t own any stickers stating that I’m “supporting the troops” on my SUV as many would claim, but I know – I know that what others have done, do now, and continue to do for me – can’t be put into words.

I’d buy all of them a beer if I could, but there’s probably not enough beer, enough thanks, enough anything – ?

lulu, I wish you continued success in a tough argument – very, very tough for both sides now.

I wrote a letter last September to one of the Mothers from the group ‘Military Families Speak Out’ ( http://www.mfso.org ), who had given everyone a piece of her mind at a press conference. My comments were short and sweet, hopefully non-abrasive and in a condensed message – thankful. I hope that they actually read it – because I meant it.

I also hope that they realize that America doesn’t really mobilize it’s ‘production’ for war anymore. As a citizen, a person commenting on a blog, minimally, I can only just mobilize the appreciation for the sacrifices that have been made – for me.

God bless our fallen.
r August 13, 2005

people who feel they can be supportive of the troops while simultaneously oppose the war really irritate me. some are on the right, however most (85% imo) are on the left.
lulu August 13, 2005

Wow, I go to see a movie and look what hilarity awaits! BR, would you like to share some of whatever it is you’re smoking? No, JcGehee, I am not a 13 year old boy. But if that’s the kind of fantasy you enjoy, hey, knock yourself out. Toby, what is coming is the investigation comes to a close in October. Surely I don’t have to tell you what investigation? Try and keep up. Capt. Turang, if anyone really wants to find out how to support the troops (and they’re not of an age to enlist) then visit operationtruth.org for plenty of suggestions. Snowballs, “DoucheTard” is the new “Wingnut.” Blogosphere lingo. Yes, I agree this is a tough argument. Thank you for your reasonable, non-hysterical comments.

Clearly Mrs. Sheehan has touched a nerve. It is glaringly apparent that everyone is frustrated (I count myself in that group), some are angry, others are downright hostile. It’s tough because things are not ever black and white. There is always going to be a substantial amount of grey. But this doesn’t have as much to do with Cindy Sheehan as it does the rift between conservatives and liberals that existed long before Mrs. Sheehan began her vigil in Crawford a week ago. Will that rift ever be mended? I’m beginning to have my doubts. Although it isn’t apparent by my previous posts, I am not a cynical individual. No, far from it. I have made heartfelt attempts in the past to “reach across the aisle” as they say and know that petty bickering doesn’t solve a damn thing. I just began to feel like I was pounding nails in the floor with my head because nobody, I mean nobody cared to discuss anything rationally with me. But as soon as I get good and snarky, well HELLS BELLS, everyone responds to that! Why? It makes no sense. Yea, being snarky is fun. It comes easily when one is frustrated. But certainly, it solves nothing. This volley of “I know how to be more sarcastic and condescending than you” is simply the human equivalent of flinging poo. It can be entertaining, but right now, it’s wearing thin and has lost it’s considerable power to charm me. I’d enjoy nothing more than sitting down with a group of individuals with whom I disagree on the issue of the war in Iraq and the incompetence (or success) of this administration and actually discuss it in a rational, civilized manner. Good conversation can be as stimulating as a Red Bull/Espresso cocktail – and keep you awake like one too. I’ve said this very thing to conservatives on other sites and been completely dismissed. Okay, so maybe these boards are merely convenient places to vent. Perhaps that is their sole raison d’être. But (and this is where I’m going to sound incredibly optimistic – even pollyanna) I’d like to think it could be a forum in which people on both sides of an issue could connect with one another and try to come to some understanding. Find some common ground. But that kind of thinking, I’m told is incredibly naïve. Well, fine. If that’s naïve then we might as well accept that one day – not next year, maybe not in our grandchildren’s lifetime, but one day – the United States of America will be a blip in history; just another failed society. That is where we are headed. None of us wants that and yet are any of us willing to do the work it would require to prevent that from happening? In the dealings I’ve had with conservatives thus far, the answer is no because they are not willing to compromise. See, Dems ARE willing to and that’s been their downfall (one of many) from their inception. (BTW, I’m not a Democrat. I am not affiliated with any particular party.) There’s an old story about it that goes, if you tell a Republican he’s wrong he’ll say, “No, I’m not, YOU are!” with complete conviction – end of conversation. If you tell a Democrat he’s wrong he’ll say, “No I’m not but tell me why you think so and we’ll discuss it. And then he proceeds to agree with the Republican with a, “I see your point.” And that is considered a weak position. Compromise is weak? Well if that’s the case, let’s turn out the lights now and haul it all in because that is the only way out of this quagmire. And I’m not talking about the quagmire in Iraq. I’m talking about he quagmire right here at home. It’s frustrating, disheartening and depressing. There was a time in the history of our nation that we weren’t so polarized. When the two sides, although not always in agreement, could agree to disagree without hate-speech. Can’t we all stop and ask ourselves, when did we begin vilifying anyone who disagreed with our opinions and when did it become okay? Whatever DID happen to civility? When did we begin to accept that flinging poo was justifiable and an acceptable mode of behavior? And more importantly, why? Was it really our own thought processes that brought us here or have we been unwittingly pitted one citizen against another purely to suit the purposes of a political game? We have to stop letting politicians use marketing techniques to brainwash U.S. citizens into hating one another simply because it gets them what they want in the short term. We are doomed if we buy into their little seeds of hate full of wild accusations that pit right against left, conservative against liberal, old against young and even men against women. As a society, we must begin thinking for ourselves. We must stay informed and make certain that our education as human beings is a lifelong pursuit. Good God, we have to study and understand history – ours and other nations as well. There is too much at stake, in the long run, if we let politicians tell us, not only what to believe, but how we believe. While they are thinking only in terms of the next election, We the People must think in terms of a future for which we may not be present, but in which future U.S. citizens will thrive.

I’ve come clean and made myself vulnerable to attack. So go ahead. Knock yourself out. I’m all prepared to hear, “What a pretty speech.” Etc., etc. Let the poo fly. Or not.
AnonymousDrivel August 13, 2005

RE: zeppo1’s post, casualty count, sloganeering, and reality (August 13, 2005 12:38 AM)

Still open to talking about reality. Now back to all the cute bumper stickers…

A turn of a phrase can be a powerful thing, and I appreciate powerful things trite as they may superficially appear. Spoken in the proper venue, they can motivate superhuman effort. While not quite Churchillian, I found the phrase socially insightful and one applicable to other debates. I did not attribute the phrase to you, but since you’ve apparently adopted it, it must have struck home. That’s unfortunate that you’ve assumed the implication and confirmed that it may be true.

Now about that “reality” thing, what is your specific concern? I lost track of where you wanted to debate part way through the thread, and don’t know which reality concerns you at the moment.

You mention the patriots and fallen heroes. Now what, specifically, is your point? From your zeppo1 post (August 13, 2005 12:01 AM), you pose and subsequently repeat the following:

“Just curious. If you do beleive (and it seems you do passionatley), then why are you not there [in Iraq? – ed]?

“I know this will be taken as smart-assy, but I do really want to know.

Taken in context of your appended casualty count to my “bumper sticker” redux, I gather you are presenting, once again, the “chickenhawk” meme.

Please see I’d rather be a chickenhawk than a chickensh*t and Moonbat Democrats Against the War for starters.

I take it that if my correlation between your posts to this point are accurate, then you are wearing a pink t-shirt, marching/standing on a sandy street near Falluja, and posting from your laptop. That would be a fair assumption, right?

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Rob Port

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